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China zooms ahead in education

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Look at all those dirty socialist countries above us. Them and their superior education and higher life expectancy. They must be cheating.
 
When you incentivise kids in k12 to be or at least act dumb ("I don't like math, but I'm good at sports"), you shouldn't be surprised to see these results.

As someone that came into the US mid-way though highschool, it is painfully obvious to me that the k12 system was designed to crank out blue collar workers.

Being smart gets your labeled as nerd and put into undesirable social clique, but focusing all your energy on some sort of "varsity" sports has nearly instant social upsides. Never seen anything like that in Europe; having good grades was seen as universal positive.
 
JSt0rm said:
But the quality is higher. Just because you dont value that doesn't make it not true. We need to focus on making higher quality items. We will lose in the race to the bottom.

Chinese are getting very good at making hard to make things.
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The problem is that jeans are an item that never really wear out. I had to replace my last pair of jeans because I washed them hot and they shrank. They were typical $20 crap jeans from Walmart and they lasted 3 years before I accidentally ruined them. For everyone else, they're more likely to either gain or lose (gain) weight to the point where the pants just don't fit anymore. Styles change too but that's not really a quality thing.

China is a strange place. I don't understand why they are incapable of making high quality products. $20 Chinese tool sets sold at Home Depot break if you look at them the wrong way. Equipment made in countries like USA or Germany last forever. How do they screw up something as simple as making tools?
 
JSt0rm said:
But the quality is higher. Just because you dont value that doesn't make it not true. We need to focus on making higher quality items. We will lose in the race to the bottom.

Chinese are getting very good at making hard to make things.
Click to expand...

IMO Raleigh jeans and Levi jeans are not competitors because they are not in the same market. A person shopping for $40 jeans is not going to be looking at $200 jeans. A more apt comparison would be $200 rock and republics made in China or. $276 Raleigh jeans made in America.
 
Ns1 said:
IMO Raleigh jeans and Levi jeans are not competitors because they are not in the same market. A person shopping for $40 jeans is not going to be looking at $200 jeans. A more apt comparison would be $200 rock and republics made in China or. $276 Raleigh jeans made in America.
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Yes and any true denim connoisseur will tell you rock n republic and true religion suck.
 
ShawnD1 said:
The problem is that jeans are an item that never really wear out. I had to replace my last pair of jeans because I washed them hot and they shrank. They were typical $20 crap jeans from Walmart and they lasted 3 years before I accidentally ruined them. For everyone else, they're more likely to either gain or lose (gain) weight to the point where the pants just don't fit anymore. Styles change too but that's not really a quality thing.
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quality never goes out of style. Selvedge denim is the style. you are right they never die either. I've had the pair I'm wearing right now repaired 2 times and they are 3 years old. I wore them every day for a year and a half. They look amazing worn in.


Anyways my point is you can spend money on something like this and feel good about it not only from a supporting American way but also in seeing the amazing workmanship and living with it.
 
Ns1 said:
Is the lesson here outsource your manufacturing to china and spend that money on marketing instead? Lol
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hmm? you cant outsource it to china and have it be the same thing. Because in the world of high end textiles what matters are the materials. You cant fake the materials.
 
JSt0rm said:
hmm? you cant outsource it to china and have it be the same thing. Because in the world of high end textiles what matters are the materials. You cant fake the materials.
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That wasn't quite what I was saying. Where does true religion make their jeans?
 
Ns1 said:
That wasn't quite what I was saying. Where does true religion make their jeans?
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They are sown in the usa but the denim is imported. the denim mentioned above source the denim from North Carolina. In fact all the materials to make the denim come from within 200 miles of their shop.

fc0b_2.JPG
 
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JSt0rm-

Next question: do you support the foreign company that makes products in the US, or the US company that makes products abroad?
 
halik said:
When you incentivise kids in k12 to be or at least act dumb ("I don't like math, but I'm good at sports"), you shouldn't be surprised to see these results.

As someone that came into the US mid-way though highschool, it is painfully obvious to me that the k12 system was designed to crank out blue collar workers.

Being smart gets your labeled as nerd and put into undesirable social clique, but focusing all your energy on some sort of "varsity" sports has nearly instant social upsides. Never seen anything like that in Europe; having good grades was seen as universal positive.
Click to expand...

Yep. Was a problem when I was in school as well. Luckily - there are programs that are working on fixing that.

www.usfirst.org

This year our team started 16 new teams and have a dozen lego-league teams.
 
Ns1 said:
JSt0rm-

Next question: do you support the foreign company that makes products in the US, or the US company that makes products abroad?
Click to expand...


I never said I only buy american made in america. I'm just saying here is an american item that could be bought if you so choose. You scoffed at that saying things are cheaper in china. No shit. Of course they are. I was responding to educate about the quality differences between the items. If you dont care you dont care. I'm wearing a old navy white t-shirt right now as well. I'm sure its not made in USA.
 
JSt0rm said:
I never said I only buy american made in america. I'm just saying here is an american item that could be bought if you so choose. You scoffed at that saying things are cheaper in china. No shit. Of course they are. I was responding to educate about the quality differences between the items. If you dont care you dont care. I'm wearing a old navy white t-shirt right now as well. I'm sure its not made in USA.
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I'm in an apple v pc debate in OT right now, so I'm more than aware of the paying for quality argument.
 
JSt0rm said:
I never said I only buy american made in america. I'm just saying here is an american item that could be bought if you so choose. You scoffed at that saying things are cheaper in china. No shit. Of course they are. I was responding to educate about the quality differences between the items. If you dont care you dont care. I'm wearing a old navy white t-shirt right now as well. I'm sure its not made in USA.
Click to expand...

To put things in perspective, would you purchase an American made t-shirt for $150, given that the American made t-shirt was made out of higher quality materials?

Or would you say, "who in their right mind would pay $150 for a t-shirt? NO t-shirt is worth $150." To which, the 90% of us who find $250 jeans ludicrous would say, "well, duh!"
 
DrPizza said:
To put things in perspective, would you purchase an American made t-shirt for $150, given that the American made t-shirt was made out of higher quality materials?

Or would you say, "who in their right mind would pay $150 for a t-shirt? NO t-shirt is worth $150." To which, the 90% of us who find $250 jeans ludicrous would say, "well, duh!"
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different articles of clothing. A good pair of denim will last virtually forever so I see value in it beyond just supporting the troops so to speak.
 
Ns1 said:
you never plan to change styles? That shit don't get ripped? You never get fat?

Also - I'm sure 9 pairs of jeans will last longer than your 1.


$270 jeans was a horrible, horrible example of buy american.
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No I dont plan on changing styles.
Dark true indigo ink denim will not go out of style.
If it gets ripped I have it repaired.
I work out 4x a week so no I dont intend on getting fat.

$270 denim is a poor buy for you. But soem people find value in these things. I like Screaming Eagle Cabernet as well. Thats made in America but I dont think you will buy it. Is that a horrible example of buying american? Something you see as unworthy? So we should create a panel of ns1 who will decide was is of value and what isnt? I think not.
 
JSt0rm said:
No I dont plan on changing styles.
Dark true indigo ink denim will not go out of style.
If it gets ripped I have it repaired.
I work out 4x a week so no I dont intend on getting fat.

$270 denim is a poor buy for you. But soem people find value in these things. I like Screaming Eagle Cabernet as well. Thats made in America but I dont think you will buy it. Is that a horrible example of buying american? Something you see as unworthy? So we should create a panel of ns1 who will decide was is of value and what isnt? I think not.
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I wouldn't recommend someone in the market for a 25k prius a 60k volt, and that's exactly what you did.

Fact: $270 jeans are not affordable for the majority of Americans.
 
Ns1 said:
I wouldn't recommend someone in the market for a 25k prius a 60k volt, and that's exactly what you did.

Fact: $270 jeans are not affordable for the majority of Americans.
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Your telling me that no one who reads politics and news makes over 100k a year? ok.
 
JSt0rm said:
Your telling me that no one who reads politics and news makes over 100k a year? ok.
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you're telling me that people on P&N are representative of a majority of Americans? ok.

Of those individuals with income who were older than 25 years of age, over 42% had incomes below $25,000 while the top 10% had incomes exceeding $82,500 a year. The distribution of income among individuals differs substantially from household incomes as 42% of all households had two or more income earners. As a result 20.5% of households have six figure incomes, even though only 6.24% of Americans had incomes exceeding $100,000. The following chart shows the income distribution among all 211,832,000 individuals aged 15 or higher as recorded by the United States Census Bureau. [8]
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No. Are you daft? I never told all of America to buy this denim. I told people reading this thread. jeezus.
 
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