Catholocism = Christianity?

[DAGTA]

Originally posted by: Fritzo

Originally posted by: DAGTA

Originally posted by: Fritzo
Uhh, Catholics are the ORIGINAL form of Christiananity. They started the whole thing with the church headed by St. Peter. All other forms of Christianity are offshoots of Catholicism.

No. Catholicism is one of the oldest churches based off of Christianity but it was not the original. Read the book of Acts if you want to know more.

Again, you get a

The Catholic religion is based upon the celebration of the last supper, where Jesus says "Do this in memory of me." You can't get much earlier than that. I've studied this subject with our pastor (who also has a PhD in Theology) and he has confirmed this fact.

Here's a good link to back up this:

Wikipedia

Great, you've relied on the word of another human (your pastor) and an internet site that anyone can alter (wikipedia). Why don't you read the book of Acts and see if you still disagree with me?

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: Viper0329

Originally posted by: Nik

Catholics do not follow the teachings of Christ. They are not Christians.

Huh?

read this

and this

 

[DAGTA]

Originally posted by: Nik

Originally posted by: mchammer187
I would consider them christian

Catholicism is considered by many as the father of all christianity but I guess you can say that abou Judaism as well

Catholics call themselves christians

Right, and Osama BinLadin calls himself a Muslim, too. :roll:

Catholics do not follow the teachings of Christ. They are not Christians.

I'm not a fan of Catholicism, but I'm going to point out the obvious here:
No one fully follows the teachings of Jesus Christ. No one is perfect; we all fall short. Some get closer than others but the point is the intentions of the heart. God knows the heart.

 

[Forsythe]

Originally posted by: Nik

Originally posted by: Yaotl

Originally posted by: Nik

Originally posted by: mchammer187
I would consider them christian

Catholicism is considered by many as the father of all christianity but I guess you can say that abou Judaism as well

Catholics call themselves christians

Right, and Osama BinLadin calls himself a Muslim, too. :roll:

Catholics do not follow the teachings of Christ. They are not Christians.

...he is a Muslim.

So he's a Muslim because he says he follows the Muslim faith? Because we all know he doesn't.

He's a muslim because he believes in Muhammed as a profet from god, and the last profet. He follows the Quran, how he enterprets is the variable.

 

[Malak]

Originally posted by: SandGnome
Christian = follower of Christ.

Catholicism != follower of Christ

 

[Malak]

Originally posted by: DAGTA
I'm not a fan of Catholicism, but I'm going to point out the obvious here:
No one fully follows the teachings of Jesus Christ. No one is perfect; we all fall short. Some get closer than others but the point is the intentions of the heart. God knows the heart.

I half-agree. I should point out that the catholic religion follows many practices that are forbidden by Christianity. We aren't talking about people, we are talking about a religion. Christianity in and of itself does not fall short, the people do. Catholicism falls waaaay short. It tripped at the start line.

 

[Jzero]

Originally posted by: KruptosAngelos

Originally posted by: DAGTA
I'm not a fan of Catholicism, but I'm going to point out the obvious here:
No one fully follows the teachings of Jesus Christ. No one is perfect; we all fall short. Some get closer than others but the point is the intentions of the heart. God knows the heart.

I half-agree. I should point out that the catholic religion follows many practices that are forbidden by Christianity. We aren't talking about people, we are talking about a religion. Christianity in and of itself does not fall short, the people do. Catholicism falls waaaay short. It tripped at the start line.

Well, by *THAT* logic so has every Christian religion because they all start in one place - PEOPLE.

I guess there are no Christians.

 

[FoBoT]

Originally posted by: Viper0329

Originally posted by: Nik

Catholics do not follow the teachings of Christ. They are not Christians.

Huh?

somebody needs to play the "nazi" card and torpedo this thread, it is all down hill from here

 

[DAGTA]

Originally posted by: KruptosAngelos

Originally posted by: DAGTA
I'm not a fan of Catholicism, but I'm going to point out the obvious here:
No one fully follows the teachings of Jesus Christ. No one is perfect; we all fall short. Some get closer than others but the point is the intentions of the heart. God knows the heart.

I half-agree. I should point out that the catholic religion follows many practices that are forbidden by Christianity. We aren't talking about people, we are talking about a religion. Christianity in and of itself does not fall short, the people do. Catholicism falls waaaay short. It tripped at the start line.

I agree, but most people don't know it because most people are too lazy to actually read the Bible and will instead rely on someone else's heresay.

Catholicism does some rituals/practices that are strictly forbidden in the Bible. That is why some Christians, myself included, dislike Catholicism.

 

[Malak]

Originally posted by: FoBoT

Originally posted by: Viper0329

Originally posted by: Nik

Catholics do not follow the teachings of Christ. They are not Christians.

Huh?

somebody needs to play the "nazi" card and torpedo this thread, it is all down hill from here

If you think the discussion is bad here, try this on a catholic forum. You guys are Hello Kitty compared to them.

 

[SandGnome]

We're just talking about the numbers here... whether Catholicism falls under Christianity or not. Whether you believe Catholicism or Protestantism is the truth, they both go under the Christianity piece of pie. k?

 

[Malak]

Originally posted by: SandGnome
We're just talking about the numbers here... whether Catholicism falls under Christianity or not. Whether you believe Catholicism or Protestantism is the truth, they both go under the Christianity piece of pie. k?

That's the arguement though. Some here believe catholicism falls under it's own piece of the pie, being a seperate religion. They are way too different and believe completely opposite things as Christian churches, so it doesn't make sense to combine the pieces.

I have seen different kinds of statistics with different numbers. Some combine even mormonism into Christian numbers, and some don't. It really depends on the person who does the statistics. If you don't know anything about religion, you really don't have a clue who goes where.

 

[jyates]

Originally posted by: DAGTA

Originally posted by: Fritzo
Uhh, Catholics are the ORIGINAL form of Christiananity. They started the whole thing with the church headed by St. Peter. All other forms of Christianity are offshoots of Catholicism.

No. Catholicism is one of the oldest churches based off of Christianity but it was not the original. Read the book of Acts if you want to know more.

Good point......

 

[Ikonomi]

So wait, what are all these things that Catholicism endorses that are in opposition to Christian beliefs? Any examples?

 

[Jzero]

Originally posted by: KruptosAngelos

Originally posted by: SandGnome
They are way too different and believe completely opposite things as Christian churches, so it doesn't make sense to combine the pieces.

Completely opposite? Pass me some of whatever you've got. The fundamentals are all there.

Fine, you disagree with whether or not intercessory prayer constitutes worship of graven images. You disagree with the concept of transubstantiation. You disagree that the Pope answers directly to God.

I'll be honest - I disagree, too.

But that doesn't change the fundamental basis of Catholocism, which is Christian to the core, regardless of what has been lost in the last 1500 or so years of execution.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: KruptosAngelos

Originally posted by: SandGnome
Christian = follower of Christ.

Catholicism != follower of Christ

:beer:

 

[dornick]

Originally posted by: KruptosAngelos

Originally posted by: DAGTA
I'm not a fan of Catholicism, but I'm going to point out the obvious here:
No one fully follows the teachings of Jesus Christ. No one is perfect; we all fall short. Some get closer than others but the point is the intentions of the heart. God knows the heart.

I half-agree. I should point out that the catholic religion follows many practices that are forbidden by Christianity. We aren't talking about people, we are talking about a religion. Christianity in and of itself does not fall short, the people do. Catholicism falls waaaay short. It tripped at the start line.

If you don't mind, could you share these "forbidden practices" with us, because I honestly have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[dornick]

Originally posted by: Nik

Originally posted by: Viper0329

Originally posted by: Nik

Catholics do not follow the teachings of Christ. They are not Christians.

Huh?

read this

and this

As far as I can tell, neither of those books have anything to do with Catholicism.

 

[Fritzo]

Originally posted by: DAGTA

Originally posted by: Fritzo

Originally posted by: DAGTA

Originally posted by: Fritzo
Uhh, Catholics are the ORIGINAL form of Christiananity. They started the whole thing with the church headed by St. Peter. All other forms of Christianity are offshoots of Catholicism.

No. Catholicism is one of the oldest churches based off of Christianity but it was not the original. Read the book of Acts if you want to know more.

Again, you get a

The Catholic religion is based upon the celebration of the last supper, where Jesus says "Do this in memory of me." You can't get much earlier than that. I've studied this subject with our pastor (who also has a PhD in Theology) and he has confirmed this fact.

Here's a good link to back up this:

Wikipedia

Great, you've relied on the word of another human (your pastor) and an internet site that anyone can alter (wikipedia). Why don't you read the book of Acts and see if you still disagree with me?

The Acts of the Apostles chronicled the formation of the church. It basically went over the prototype of what we call Catholicism. Also, if I'm not supposed to get information from another human (one who studied the subject so much he can be called Dr.), then who am I supposed to get information from? Would I have given more weight to my argument if I said that an elephant told me?

 

[Malak]

Originally posted by: Jzero

Originally posted by: KruptosAngelos

Originally posted by: SandGnome
They are way too different and believe completely opposite things as Christian churches, so it doesn't make sense to combine the pieces.

Completely opposite? Pass me some of whatever you've got. The fundamentals are all there.

Fine, you disagree with whether or not intercessory prayer constitutes worship of graven images. You disagree with the concept of transubstantiation. You disagree that the Pope answers directly to God.

I'll be honest - I disagree, too.

But that doesn't change the fundamental basis of Catholocism, which is Christian to the core, regardless of what has been lost in the last 1500 or so years of execution.

Simplifying it straight down to believing in Jesus doesn't work, I'm afraid. If it were that way, then we wouldn't have catholics or protestants. There are some people that still fit as plain jane Christian and neither of those, people that keep it simple. But catholics don't keep it simple, so why should we simplify it for them? You can't just cut off the other things they believe to make it "ok".

 

[Malak]

Originally posted by: dornick

Originally posted by: KruptosAngelos

Originally posted by: DAGTA
I'm not a fan of Catholicism, but I'm going to point out the obvious here:
No one fully follows the teachings of Jesus Christ. No one is perfect; we all fall short. Some get closer than others but the point is the intentions of the heart. God knows the heart.

I half-agree. I should point out that the catholic religion follows many practices that are forbidden by Christianity. We aren't talking about people, we are talking about a religion. Christianity in and of itself does not fall short, the people do. Catholicism falls waaaay short. It tripped at the start line.

If you don't mind, could you share these "forbidden practices" with us, because I honestly have no idea what you're talking about.

Google is your friend.

 

[DAGTA]

Originally posted by: Fritzo
The Acts of the Apostles chronicled the formation of the church. It basically went over the prototype of what we call Catholicism. Also, if I'm not supposed to get information from another human (one who studied the subject so much he can be called Dr.), then who am I supposed to get information from? Would I have given more weight to my argument if I said that an elephant told me?

Get it from the closest source you can, the Bible. Read it and pray to God for guidance... that's the best recommendation I can give to anyone.

I'm not saying any Pastor would intentionally mislead a person. Most of them have good intentions, but it's still filtering the information through one more human. The Bible has been translated and altered over the years but it's still the closer to the source than listening to another person.

 

[dornick]

Originally posted by: DAGTA

Originally posted by: Fritzo
The Acts of the Apostles chronicled the formation of the church. It basically went over the prototype of what we call Catholicism. Also, if I'm not supposed to get information from another human (one who studied the subject so much he can be called Dr.), then who am I supposed to get information from? Would I have given more weight to my argument if I said that an elephant told me?

Get it from the closest source you can, the Bible. Read it and pray to God for guidance... that's the best recommendation I can give to anyone.

I'm not saying any Pastor would intentionally mislead a person. Most of them have good intentions, but it's still filtering the information through one more human. The Bible has been translated and altered over the years but it's still the closer to the source than listening to another person.

You do realize the Bible was rounded up and published by the Catholic Church, right? Even Luther admitted as much.

 

[Jzero]

Originally posted by: KruptosAngelos
Simplifying it straight down to believing in Jesus doesn't work, I'm afraid. If it were that way, then we wouldn't have catholics or protestants.

In fact that is EXACTLY why we have Catholics and Protestants. They ALL believe and follow the Christianity part, they just differ on how you get there.

But catholics don't keep it simple, so why should we simplify it for them? You can't just cut off the other things they believe to make it "ok".

Nobody is making anything "ok." You don't have to become a Catholic. You don't have to simplify anything for Catholics either. Protestant sects also vary on one thing or another. Would you also argue that the concept of predestination goes for or against the Bible and therefore various protestant sects also are not Christian because they either do or do not agree with your judgement of something that really doesn't change the outcome?

The definition of a Christian religion is already quite simple.

You can argue the particulars all days long, but as I have already said, that does not change the foundation in the least. You may *personally* feel that Catholics are not Christian. But they are as Christian as Buddha was Hindu.

 

[DAGTA]

Originally posted by: dornick
If you don't mind, could you share these "forbidden practices" with us, because I honestly have no idea what you're talking about.

From what I know:

Praying to another human being, even if it is asking for intercession, is wrong. Pray to God. Praying to a human is dangerously close to idol worship.

Believing the Pope is the go-between God and humans is a remnant of the Old Testament. Jesus did away with that. Jesus is the go-between God and humans. No human is closer to God than any other human.

Saints. I've seen some Catholics worship statues of saints and even plant statues of saints in the ground in their front yards. That's idol worship. Saints were humans, too, not God.

Personal complaints: I've seen some Catholics claim their churches/pastors told them not to read the Bible, as they weren't prepared to understand it correctly. If that really happened, that should send alarm bells ringing in anyone's head about that church.

Many churches, Catholic and Christian, bash homosexuality as if it's the worst sin. According to the Bible, all sins offend God. I don't recall a passage saying, "Homosexuality is the worst sin."

Now, I'm human and judgement is retained for God alone, so take this list with the grain of salt and all that. Like I said before, God knows our hearts. He knows who is seeking him and who is just putting on a show.