Cap and Trade

[Wreckem]

Originally posted by: Drako
I just can't believe that this is going to pass through Congress.

You'd think that the politicians would understand how this is going to fuck over most of their constituents. Damn common sense to hell!

There is a reason why its going to be close on way or another. It looks like it could fail. Moderate dems in seats that were filled by moderate republicans are not WANTING to vote yes for fear of backlash in their districts. And yes there is alreadt a lot of backlash going on.

The GOP has a competing bill that is nearly identical, except it does not have cap and trade, and it furthers oil, gas, and nuclear development.

 

[Wreckem]

Originally posted by: GeezerMan
But Obama said this energy bill is a jobs bill too..........

Its just more misleading numbers. Claim you create, but dont talk about losses. Hes been doing that since he took office.

Studys show at best for every green job gained two others will be lost.

 

[nakedfrog]

Originally posted by: GeezerMan
But Obama said this energy bill is a jobs bill too..........

The interpretation I get of that is from construction of cleaner energy sources. Admittedly I haven't read the 1,200 page bill, but I don't think anybody else has either.

 

[Corn]

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
This is madness...all because of the myth called "global warming", even though we've been cooling for years...

You need to get with the program: Its called "climate change" now, this way whether it gets hotter or colder they'll always be right! Damn dirty humans!

 

[RyanPaulShaffer]

Originally posted by: Corn

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
This is madness...all because of the myth called "global warming", even though we've been cooling for years...

You need to get with the program: Its called "climate change" now, this way whether it gets hotter or colder they'll always be right! Damn dirty humans!

The AlGore doom and gloom fear-mongerers had to rebrand it "climate change" because "global warming" has been debunked and the people were growing doubtful.

The rest of the world is starting to doubt man-made climate change.

So the rest of the world is realizing that all this "climate change science" is little more than junk politics, and they are putting the brakes on their similar "cap and trade" plans. Yet, the US is rushing headlong into something the rest of the world is rapidly realizing is bunk.



The funny thing is, the liberals have already acknowledged and admitted that this is nothing more than a tax on everyone, since they've written into the bill a credit/rebate for "low-income families".

Who knows what else is contained within this 1,200+ page nightmare?

 

[cubeless]

Originally posted by: Beattie

Originally posted by: ElFenix
so does this include taxes on the manufacturing and shipping of goods from other countries into the US?

Yea, I believe there is some kind of a carbon import tariff thing in the waxman-markey bill.

and that's as good an answer as you'd get from any of the people voting on it... no one has read the whole thing... or has any idea what the effect is going to actually be...

 

[bamacre]

CSPAN is now officially more entertaining than Family Guy.

If you aren't watching, you should be.

 

[CPA]

Originally posted by: nakedfrog

Originally posted by: GeezerMan
But Obama said this energy bill is a jobs bill too..........

The interpretation I get of that is from construction of cleaner energy sources. Admittedly I haven't read the 1,200 page bill, but I don't think anybody else has either.

hard to read 1200 pages when 400 were delivered just 12 hours before the vote. Has anyone here ever read a 400 page book in 12 hours?

 

[bamacre]

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: nakedfrog

Originally posted by: GeezerMan
But Obama said this energy bill is a jobs bill too..........

The interpretation I get of that is from construction of cleaner energy sources. Admittedly I haven't read the 1,200 page bill, but I don't think anybody else has either.

hard to read 1200 pages when 400 were delivered just 12 hours before the vote. Has anyone here ever read a 400 page book in 12 hours?

Not only that, but they can't seem to find a copy. :laugh:

 

[GeezerMan]

Originally posted by: CPA

Originally posted by: nakedfrog

Originally posted by: GeezerMan
But Obama said this energy bill is a jobs bill too..........

The interpretation I get of that is from construction of cleaner energy sources. Admittedly I haven't read the 1,200 page bill, but I don't think anybody else has either.

hard to read 1200 pages when 400 were delivered just 12 hours before the vote. Has anyone here ever read a 400 page book in 12 hours?

Same crap they pulled with the Patriot Act. When will people wake up? When you have congress critters push these encyclopedic sized bills through without a human chance of reading and understanding it, then there is a good chance they are corrupt.

Anyone see the comments by Rep. Steve Scalise (R-LA)?

"The federal government can come in and inspect your house and send you the bill. And if they find that you?re out of compliance with this new federal code, 'The Secretary shall assess a civil penalty for violations of this section,'" Scalise said. "Now living in your home is considered unlawful under this bill. This is ludicrous."

Taking his argument a step further, Scalise called into question the very constitutionality of the measure. He reminded his fellow congressmen that the 10th Amendment to the Constitution says, ?The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to states respectively or to the people.?

This bill comes in and basically says throw out the 10th Amendment of the U.S. Constitution."
~ Rep. Steve Scalise (R-LA)


YOUTUBE LINK

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: GeezerMan

Same crap they pulled with the Patriot Act. When will people wake up? When you have congress critters push these encyclopedic sized bills through without a human chance of reading and understanding it, then there is a good chance they are corrupt.

Anyone see the comments by Rep. Steve Scalise (R-LA)?

"The federal government can come in and inspect your house and send you the bill. And if they find that you?re out of compliance with this new federal code, 'The Secretary shall assess a civil penalty for violations of this section,'" Scalise said. "Now living in your home is considered unlawful under this bill. This is ludicrous."

Taking his argument a step further, Scalise called into question the very constitutionality of the measure. He reminded his fellow congressmen that the 10th Amendment to the Constitution says, ?The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to states respectively or to the people.?

This bill comes in and basically says throw out the 10th Amendment of the U.S. Constitution."
~ Rep. Steve Scalise (R-LA)


YOUTUBE LINK

What the hell? This bill sounds even more diabolical than first thought.

 

[sandorski]

Carbon is ging to have a Cost. The only choice now is how to Price it. C&T is a Market based Pricing system. Reject that and you *will* have a Tax determined by some Politician. So choose wisely.

 

[Wreckem]

Wow Waxman is getting spanked over his paralimentary procedures inquiries. It doesnt MATTER what time remaining is. The Majority and the Minority leaders can talk for however long they want.

 

[Wreckem]

Originally posted by: sandorski
Carbon is ging to have a Cost. The only choice now is how to Price it. C&T is a Market based Pricing system. Reject that and you *will* have a Tax determined by some Politician. So choose wisely.

This already is a tax. Carbon credits and CAP and Trade are bogus.

 

[Drako]

Originally posted by: sandorski
Carbon is ging to have a Cost.

LOL - better stop breathing, pretty soon the gubments going to start charging you for your gaseous emissions.

 

[lupi]

Originally posted by: sandorski
Carbon is ging to have a Cost. The only choice now is how to Price it. C&T is a Market based Pricing system. Reject that and you *will* have a Tax determined by some Politician. So choose wisely.

Can you remind e of which article that's from cause I must have forgotten.

 

[Wreckem]

Not suprising, the Democrats added Franks Frannie and Freddie bill to the energy bill at that 3:09am amending of the bill(amended without voting on it).

Oh and now the Dems want the federal governmentto regulate pricing and restrictions of LOCAL building permits.

This lets Wall Street create carbon derivative markets. And they are repaling restrictions on certain derivatives...

 

[WhipperSnapper]

This bill would have just increased energy prices, adding another load to the economy. Instead I'd like to see them do something to encourage nuclear power. Why not just approve Yucca Mountain for waste storage and get it over with. I'm not all surprised that the Democrats are screwing things up. It's too bad that both of our political parties are rotten.

 

[Slew Foot]

This bill might be the biggest piece of shit ive seen come along in a long time.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: Slew Foot
This bill might be the biggest piece of shit ive seen come along in a long time.

Yeah, I've been looking into it more. It's requiring California "green" restrictions on homes and other building for the entire nation. They're voting right now and it should be VERY close. The whole thing is just downright scary that the gubment would control peoples lives to this extent. Some reps are calling it "pure tyranny".

WTF! One repub voted for it? Show yourself!

 

[b2386]

looking bad for the repubs so far...

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: spidey07
Remember who votes for this crap and make sure they are voted out of office. That includes the executive branch and the great Bastard.

Well he must be doing fantastic.

He has you in a snit. :thumbsup:

 

[spidey07]

It's going to be super close. Those 7 repubs that voted for it might have been the deal breaker, what the hell were they thinking.

210 yea
201 nay
23 votes remaining, 16-7 D-R.

-edit-
It's going to pass and it looks like the Rs who voted for it were the difference, otherwise it would not have passed. We need to find out who they are and tear them a new one.

We can only hope the senate kills it.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Wreckem

Originally posted by: sandorski
Carbon is ging to have a Cost. The only choice now is how to Price it. C&T is a Market based Pricing system. Reject that and you *will* have a Tax determined by some Politician. So choose wisely.

This already is a tax. Carbon credits and CAP and Trade are bogus.

Negative.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: lupi

Originally posted by: sandorski
Carbon is ging to have a Cost. The only choice now is how to Price it. C&T is a Market based Pricing system. Reject that and you *will* have a Tax determined by some Politician. So choose wisely.

Can you remind e of which article that's from cause I must have forgotten.

Science and Common Sense.