Barack Obama to speak about Rev. Wright, race Tuesday, March 18

[RightIsWrong]

Originally posted by: sirjonk

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: loki8481

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: Citrix
yip
yip
yip

i will be happy to have a rep Vs. dem discussion in another thread, this one is about Obama and his choice of preachers and personal spiritual adviser and im going to do my part on keeping it ON TOPIC.

Okay, whereupon I can easily point out that McCain's "spiritual advisers" are Robertson and the late Falwell, who said that 9/11 was God's punishment for be tolerant to gays.

really? McCain attended Robertson's church for 20 years? he named a book after one of Falwell's speeches and had him baptize his children?

Worse. Instead of having worked beside a man for many years helping him build up the community in spite of some views you don't agree with....he blasted their views for years as being destructive towards the community (GOP community) and then went begging for their support.

God this is beyond rich. Obama holding hands with a racist for 20 years is now superior to smacking down right wing zealots when it matters, and simply pandering to get elected which everyone does. Your moral compass needs serious readjustment. WrightIsWrong.

You act like the only thing that this man stood for was racial division. I personally have never met either man. I am going off of what I have read and heard from all parties (Obama, Wright, McCain and Falwell) and I can tell you that I would much prefer to have the former two over the latter two.

Let me try to explain this in a manner that even someone at your level might be able to understand (not sure if I can really go that low...but I will give it a shot).

Wright made comments that were controversial more because he criticized America than he showed racist views. Falwell's comments have been less controversial because he attacked a group of citizens that many deem subhuman (gays) but always draped himself in the flag while doing so.

I would absolutely prefer to have someone that chose to befriend someone that was able to be critical of his own race, community, leaders and country than someone that goes to drop to his knees to get an endorsement from someone that is hell bent on discriminating against a subsection of our population.

Maybe it is your moral compass that needs some adjustment.

You seem to think that it is okay to lie, cheat and pander to get ahead (which McCain clearly did if his previous statements were truly what he believed) while speaking out against someone's negative views while still standing by their good works is a bad thing (which is what Obama did).

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: sirjonk

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: rchiu
Well I guess we have no choice but to vote for Obama now. I mean now if we actually support anyone other then him, it would be a step back on the race issue and there will be no chance for change. Geez, if this is not a race card, I dunno what is.

First, Obama was dealt this "race card". I really don't think it was his choice. I'm pretty sure he'd rather the whole thing had never come up.

Second, and I haven't yet seen the speech, if he managed to artfully turn this thing into a uplifting reason to vote for him he's as smart and politically gifted as I've thought.

IMO, and this from a conservative, the more the guys in the spotlight - no matter the reason - the better he looks. THis is a welcome change from the likes of GWB or even HRC.

I wonder if the Hillary campaign is concerned about "irrelevannce"? Obama and his preacher seemed to have pushed her off the media stage lately.

Fern

Yes, I'm sure Hillary is scathing mad she doesn't have to spend a week convincing americans the racist rants of her closest spiritual advisor don't accurately reflect her views.

She should be mad. She's not in the news this week except for a recent Time (or Newsweek?) cover saying she can't win anymore. They may as well have printed her obituary.

 

[chowderhead]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: sirjonk

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: rchiu
Well I guess we have no choice but to vote for Obama now. I mean now if we actually support anyone other then him, it would be a step back on the race issue and there will be no chance for change. Geez, if this is not a race card, I dunno what is.

First, Obama was dealt this "race card". I really don't think it was his choice. I'm pretty sure he'd rather the whole thing had never come up.

Second, and I haven't yet seen the speech, if he managed to artfully turn this thing into a uplifting reason to vote for him he's as smart and politically gifted as I've thought.

IMO, and this from a conservative, the more the guys in the spotlight - no matter the reason - the better he looks. THis is a welcome change from the likes of GWB or even HRC.

I wonder if the Hillary campaign is concerned about "irrelevannce"? Obama and his preacher seemed to have pushed her off the media stage lately.

Fern

Yes, I'm sure Hillary is scathing mad she doesn't have to spend a week convincing americans the racist rants of her closest spiritual advisor don't accurately reflect her views.

She should be mad. She's not in the news this week except for a recent Time (or Newsweek?) cover saying she can't win anymore. They may as well have printed her obituary.

people have written her off many times before. Until someone gets enough delegates, the race is not over. Obama had a couple of opportunities to close the deal and he hasn't. The Wright-Obama 20 year relationship may get some people to ask if there is anything else that Obama hasn't disclosed. Clinton actually is focused on getting positive press in Pennsylvania right now. There was lots of coverage in the local PA papers about her at the St. Patrick's day parades, getting the Pittsburgh mayor's endorsement, her Scranton roots, etc. Why rock the boat when your opponent is talking about whether he heard or did not hear his longtime pastor's inflammatory words?

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: chowderhead

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: sirjonk

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: rchiu
Well I guess we have no choice but to vote for Obama now. I mean now if we actually support anyone other then him, it would be a step back on the race issue and there will be no chance for change. Geez, if this is not a race card, I dunno what is.

First, Obama was dealt this "race card". I really don't think it was his choice. I'm pretty sure he'd rather the whole thing had never come up.

Second, and I haven't yet seen the speech, if he managed to artfully turn this thing into a uplifting reason to vote for him he's as smart and politically gifted as I've thought.

IMO, and this from a conservative, the more the guys in the spotlight - no matter the reason - the better he looks. THis is a welcome change from the likes of GWB or even HRC.

I wonder if the Hillary campaign is concerned about "irrelevannce"? Obama and his preacher seemed to have pushed her off the media stage lately.

Fern

Yes, I'm sure Hillary is scathing mad she doesn't have to spend a week convincing americans the racist rants of her closest spiritual advisor don't accurately reflect her views.

She should be mad. She's not in the news this week except for a recent Time (or Newsweek?) cover saying she can't win anymore. They may as well have printed her obituary.

people have written her off many times before. Until someone gets enough delegates, the race is not over. Obama had a couple of opportunities to close the deal and he hasn't. The Wright-Obama 20 year relationship may get some people to ask if there is anything else that Obama hasn't disclosed. Clinton actually is focused on getting positive press in Pennsylvania right now. There was lots of coverage in the local PA papers about her at the St. Patrick's day parades, getting the Pittsburgh mayor's endorsement, her Scranton roots, etc. Why rock the boat when your opponent is talking about whether he heard or did not hear his longtime pastor's inflammatory words?

Considering that this has been background noice for over a year now, I doubt there is anything else.

 

[cubeless]

*** quote
How about some critical reading friends. She said "adult life" and she turned 18 in 1982. I wasn't a history major but I think the nazis were way earlier, like in the 60s or something.[/quote]

She's probably not proud of her country for the reasons she stated here http://www.newyorker.com/repor..._collins?currentPage=3

Obama begins with a broad assessment of life in America in 2008, and life is not good: we?re a divided country, we?re a country that is ?just downright mean,? we are ?guided by fear,? we?re a nation of cynics, sloths, and complacents.

Some might see that as another strike but, this time, I'd probably have to agree...even though that's not a good thing for a First Lady to be saying about her country. Maybe it's just some tough love. [/quote]

*** quote...

it's because her views in those years were formed by her pastor and the other great black community leaders that have so improved the lot of the african american community...

the simple question to me is "if barak supposedly has a real chance to become president, then wtf are they all harping about?"... if they worked as hard as he does they'd all be prosperous... instead they sit and listen to their pastor explain why they are "just downright mean,? we are ?guided by fear,? we?re a nation of cynics, sloths, and complacents" - she's talking about "her people"...

i can't wait to hear the sermon when the superdelagates give hil the nod...

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: sirjonk
[How about some critical reading friends. She said "adult life" and she turned 18 in 1982. I wasn't a history major but I think the nazis were way earlier, like in the 60s or something.

Hahaha, that made me LOL and my sarcasm meter pegged out.

Fern

 

[Fern]

Interesting.

I had to run out and do some errands so I tuned in to a local talk radio program. It's amazing to hear the reactions to Obama's speech today. They range from "best speech I've ever heard, he won the Presidency today" all the way to "he's finished, terrible speech". Looking forward to hearing for myself this evening.

BTW: A lot of those who disliked his speech also voiced concernes about Obama being a Muslim. Ya know, going to a Muslim school, being raised in a Muslim household etc. The "stealth Muslim email" - the gift that keeps on giving.

Fern

 

[Arkaign]

Originally posted by: Fern
Interesting.

I had to run out and do some errands so I tuned in to a local talk radio program. It's amazing to hear the reactions to Obama's speech today. They range from "best speech I've ever heard, he won the Presidency today" all the way to "he's finished, terrible speech". Looking forward to hearing for myself this evening.

BTW: A lot of those who disliked his speech also voiced concernes about Obama being a Muslim. Ya know, going to a Muslim school, being raised in a Muslim household etc. The "stealth Muslim email" - the gift that keeps on giving.

Fern

That's sort of the point, I think. The people who are trying to flame this into some kind of major issue are the exact same people who were spamming our email boxes with the Muslim crap, for the most part.

Will be interesting to follow his polls over the next week or two, but I seriously doubt his numbers will go up or down to any unusual degree.

 

[EXman]

Originally posted by: Arkaign

Originally posted by: Fern
Interesting.

I had to run out and do some errands so I tuned in to a local talk radio program. It's amazing to hear the reactions to Obama's speech today. They range from "best speech I've ever heard, he won the Presidency today" all the way to "he's finished, terrible speech". Looking forward to hearing for myself this evening.

BTW: A lot of those who disliked his speech also voiced concernes about Obama being a Muslim. Ya know, going to a Muslim school, being raised in a Muslim household etc. The "stealth Muslim email" - the gift that keeps on giving.

Fern

That's sort of the point, I think. The people who are trying to flame this into some kind of major issue are the exact same people who were spamming our email boxes with the Muslim crap, for the most part.

Will be interesting to follow his polls over the next week or two, but I seriously doubt his numbers will go up or down to any unusual degree.

Like the way you never talk about his bad judgement you just want to blame it on kooks. Sticking your head in the sand?

Even Classy has got it right.

We are noticing who actually is to lazy to read the posts. Just give it a blanket statement Not important...

 

[Arkaign]

What bad judgment? I don't see Obama supporting any hate organization or supporting racism. He has a friend who's imperfect, but also a dedicated leader and supporter of his community. Obama flatly criticized him for the stupid remarks that were made. Sorry but this story is done. You know what's going to take over? How about :

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200...n_el_pr/clinton_papers

LITTLE ROCK, Ark. - Thousands of pages of Hillary Rodham Clinton's schedules as first lady are being released to the public after months of pressure and criticism that the Clintons were delaying the disclosure.
ADVERTISEMENT

The National Archives, which operates the former President Clinton's presidential library in Little Rock, announced Tuesday it would release 11,046 pages of Clinton's daily schedules at the Little Rock facility and online Wednesday morning.

Clinton has faced criticism from fellow Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama and Republicans over the number of White House documents from her husband's administration that have not been made public.

The documents to be released include schedules for 2,888 days and are the files from Patti Solis Doyle, who was the former first lady's scheduling director. Doyle served as Clinton's campaign manager but stepped down in February after a series of losses to Obama in the Democratic nomination battle.

The archives said 4,746 pages of documents have parts blacked out, mostly to protect the privacy of third parties, including their social security numbers, telephone numbers, and home addresses.

In addition, schedules for 19 days before Bill Clinton was inaugurated and his wife began first lady on Jan. 20, 1993, are closed to the public under the Presidential Records Act.

 

[EXman]

Originally posted by: Arkaign
What bad judgment? I don't see Obama supporting any hate organization or supporting racism. He has a friend who's imperfect, but also a dedicated leader and supporter of his community. Obama flatly criticized him for the stupid remarks that were made. Sorry but this story is done. You know what's going to take over? How about :

nevermind just pass the kool-aid to the left.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: EXman

Originally posted by: Arkaign
What bad judgment? I don't see Obama supporting any hate organization or supporting racism. He has a friend who's imperfect, but also a dedicated leader and supporter of his community. Obama flatly criticized him for the stupid remarks that were made. Sorry but this story is done. You know what's going to take over? How about :

nevermind just pass the kool-aid to the left.

Had a bit too much to drink?

 

[da loser]

Originally posted by: da loser

Originally posted by: Rainsford
Isn't the "next question" whether or not Obama knew of Wright's views? So far as I can tell, there is no evidence that Obama DID know. Now that he's found out, he's flat out denounced Wright's views. There is nothing here except people suggesting that the explanation is unlikely. And whether or not that's true, the fact is that there is no proof otherwise...there is nothing here.

other than his relationship being 20 years and thinking obama is a relatively astute individual that should be able to evaluate a person properly after 20 years.


obama really can knock this one out of the park. all he has to talk about is the difference between race relations 40 years ago and today, how wright represents the past. blah blah blah. he can speak his message of change and hope for the future, while saying what people need to hear not what they want to hear. and really solidify his position.

pats self on back

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: da loser

Originally posted by: da loser

Originally posted by: Rainsford
Isn't the "next question" whether or not Obama knew of Wright's views? So far as I can tell, there is no evidence that Obama DID know. Now that he's found out, he's flat out denounced Wright's views. There is nothing here except people suggesting that the explanation is unlikely. And whether or not that's true, the fact is that there is no proof otherwise...there is nothing here.

other than his relationship being 20 years and thinking obama is a relatively astute individual that should be able to evaluate a person properly after 20 years.


obama really can knock this one out of the park. all he has to talk about is the difference between race relations 40 years ago and today, how wright represents the past. blah blah blah. he can speak his message of change and hope for the future, while saying what people need to hear not what they want to hear. and really solidify his position.

pats self on back

yep. you certainly did. let's wait for the fallout.

 

[Capt Caveman]

Originally posted by: Arkaign
What bad judgment? I don't see Obama supporting any hate organization or supporting racism. He has a friend who's imperfect, but also a dedicated leader and supporter of his community. Obama flatly criticized him for the stupid remarks that were made. Sorry but this story is done.

The story is far from done. Current polls reflect that.

You do realize Obama has been supporting this man and his church for over twenty years. Yet, Obama put him on his campaign staff, calls him his spiritual leader and moral compass.

Obama only denounces him and takes him off his campaign staff now though he's known about these comments for years. Stick your head in the sand much?

 

[EXman]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: EXman

Originally posted by: Arkaign
What bad judgment? I don't see Obama supporting any hate organization or supporting racism. He has a friend who's imperfect, but also a dedicated leader and supporter of his community. Obama flatly criticized him for the stupid remarks that were made. Sorry but this story is done. You know what's going to take over? How about :

nevermind just pass the kool-aid to the left.

Had a bit too much to drink?

I'm to the right thanks. No reason to babble with him every time I see his posts all I read is what I have bolded.

 

[Jhhnn]

Heh. I like Vic's POV, and Obama's point that his detractors are more like distractors, trying to make the election turn on anything but the real issues and the answers to them that affect our lives, and on the traditional wedge politics so beloved on the rightwing- exploiting division and bitterness, rather than disowning and overcoming them.

Which is apparently more than those accustomed to the simple minded extremism of talk radio and christian fundamentalism can even begin to comprehend, let alone appreciate. It won't fit in a 30 second soundbite, and requires the listener to judge themselves by the same standards they apply to others, accept the imperfections of the human race and of our nation itself while recognizing that progress is possible and necessary for our well being...

It's like trying to explain the workings of a nuclear powerplant to the ants living nearby, kept warm by the waste heat...

 

[Wheezer]

You know, if Obama was a white man and the "pastor" Wright was the Grand Dragon of the KKK making the same speech......Obama would have been crucified by now....especially his own party.

Funny how everyone rushes to his defense......perhaps race does play an issue?

 

[Throckmorton]

Originally posted by: Wheezer
You know, if Obama was a white man and the "pastor" Wright was the Grand Dragon of the KKK making the same speech......Obama would have been crucified by now....especially his own party.

Funny how everyone rushes to his defense......perhaps race does play an issue?

I must have missed where McCain was crucified for his endorsement by Hagee.

The preacher didn't say anything even close to what a KKK member would.

 

[EXman]

Originally posted by: Throckmorton

Originally posted by: Wheezer
You know, if Obama was a white man and the "pastor" Wright was the Grand Dragon of the KKK making the same speech......Obama would have been crucified by now....especially his own party.

Funny how everyone rushes to his defense......perhaps race does play an issue?

I must have missed where McCain was crucified for his endorsement by Hagee.

The preacher didn't say anything even close to what a KKK member would.

McCain is a Sonofabitch too But comparing the relationship between Hagee and McCain to Obama and his pseudo-Uncle is like comparing apples to oranges. The dynamic is not that similar. Still ugly but not that similar.

 

[Thump553]

Originally posted by: Wheezer
You know, if Obama was a white man and the "pastor" Wright was the Grand Dragon of the KKK making the same speech......Obama would have been crucified by now....especially his own party.

Funny how everyone rushes to his defense......perhaps race does play an issue?

This is repeated over and over again, yet McCain was recently endorsed by at least two wacko right-wing "preachers" (one of whom he joins on stage during the endorsement) with hardly a murmur of disgust, much less any sort of repudiation coming from McCain.

I think we all have to realize that religion tends to bring out the worst type of nutjobs, and it should be basically ignored in evaluating the character of a candidate. Nearly all of us can point to a close friend or relative who hold beliefs that we find incredible and preposterous.

 

[kage69]

I don't understand the sudden right-wing fixation on Rev. Wright here, all it takes is the same uncaring, dismissive attitude they've employed for years over GWB's relationship with Pat Robertson to move along to other more relevant issues.

Fired up preachers say stupid shit sometimes, big fookin deal. It'd be different if Barak himself opined sentiments akin to Wright's, or at least admitted to subscribing to those views.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: Wheezer
You know, if Obama was a white man and the "pastor" Wright was the Grand Dragon of the KKK making the same speech......Obama would have been crucified by now....especially his own party.

Funny how everyone rushes to his defense......perhaps race does play an issue?

And if your aunt had balls, she'd be your uncle. Argument by positing "what if" scenarios is always suspect...and this is why.

But you're right in some sense, this IS at least a little bit about race. "Religious leaders" say dumb stuff all the time, much of it is far more hateful and divisive (and frequent) than what Wright said...yet nobody gives it a second look until it's a black religious figure directing his anger at white people. And I doubt you'd be making a comparison to the KKK if Wright was white, what he said may have been stupid...but the KKK has supported and carried out attacks on the civil liberties (and lives) of non-white Americans, nothing Wright said even came close to what the KKK has said and done.

 

[Wheezer]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Wheezer
You know, if Obama was a white man and the "pastor" Wright was the Grand Dragon of the KKK making the same speech......Obama would have been crucified by now....especially his own party.

Funny how everyone rushes to his defense......perhaps race does play an issue?

And if your aunt had balls, she'd be your uncle. Argument by positing "what if" scenarios is always suspect...and this is why.

But you're right in some sense, this IS at least a little bit about race. "Religious leaders" say dumb stuff all the time, much of it is far more hateful and divisive (and frequent) than what Wright said...yet nobody gives it a second look until it's a black religious figure directing his anger at white people. And I doubt you'd be making a comparison to the KKK if Wright was white, what he said may have been stupid...but the KKK has supported and carried out attacks on the civil liberties (and lives) of non-white Americans, nothing Wright said even came close to what the KKK has said and done.

So what?

The fact is that if a white racist made those same comments, (and make no mistake....Wright is a racist)....then any endorsement or affiliation of a white man/woman seeking ANY office anywhere....(it does not have to be presidential)....would have a severe blow dealt to their campaign.

Obama has been a member of this church for years....was he REALLY that fvcking stupid to think that a video such as this would never see the light of day? When we would actually see who he affiliates himself with in their natural surroundings acting and talking the way they normally would?

He should have come out swinging and addressed this first thing and hit it head on before it became a factor....now it's too late and too many people who were on the fence about voting for him and those whites that originally cast votes for him probably will start second guessing thier choices and it will probably affect the election.

To them it seems as if he was trying to hide something for some reason.

Hell people went on and on and on about Bush and the oil companies and how he was or is in their pocket....and how Cheneys affiliation with Haliburton was bullshit and he should not be VP because of it, and yet...those same people want to completely dismiss this whole thing with Obama as if it plays no part in judging his character.....seems kinda hypocritical to me.

 

[fallout man]

Barack Obama goes to church.