** ATOT OFFICIAL STAR WARS EP. 2 Thread **

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DefRef

Diamond Member
Nov 9, 2000
4,041
1
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I can't believe that so many people are so stumped about the plot and characters of this really, really good movie! It's not the plot and dialogue that are stupid, it's the PEOPLE who can't understand simple English. (Man, the schools must really suck now!)

Harry Knowles finally posted his review at Ain't It Cool and he details a lot of stuff that I would've if I wanted to be redundant and didn't have to leave work now. (The site's been sketchy all day and the link may not work, but keep trying.)

If anyone else wants to crap on AOTC after this point, I'd appreciate if you'd list what you consider a GOOD movie to be and what AOTC did wrong that made you so irrational. (Naked Natalie and Mace Windu yelling, "Come get some, you Sith motherf***ers!!!" is not a REALISTIC option! Heck, they had to cut Jango's headbutt out in the UK to get kids under 12 in. It's a business, too.)

Anyhoo, I liked AOTC the first time and I really liked it the 2nd. There's so much to see and absorb and the plot is pretty dense and fast-moving. I guess if you're an idiot, it may elude you, but for anyone with IQs above room-temperature and something other than a desire to hate this movie going in, a good time is too be had.
 

normajean

Senior member
Apr 22, 2001
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OMG I LOVED that sound of the seismic charges. They were SOOO awesome. Star Wars has some of the best sounds and music EVER!!!!

no sh!t when that seismic charge went off with the delayed reaction...I was floored! I thought that is the coolest sound I have ever heard in a movie. It was twice as loud than any other effect. INSANE , ben burtt gets credit!
 

WilsonTung

Senior member
Aug 25, 2001
487
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I thought the intrigue with Darth Tyranous instigating a civil war was fairly interesting, and the effects/scenery/battles were incredible. I didn't like Anakin's whiny attitude - I cringed during the romance scenes.

Biggest plus - Natalie Portman was exceptionally cute and cuddly looking. Of course she falls for that jerk Anakin...
rolleye.gif
;)
 

qfg

Member
Jul 23, 2001
127
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ok im reposting this question...

What were the budgets for all the movies, esp. Ep. II?

also does anyone know how much George Lucas is worth?
 
Apr 5, 2000
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I can't believe that so many people are so stumped about the plot and characters of this really, really good movie! It's not the plot and dialogue that are stupid, it's the PEOPLE who can't understand simple English

So someone who doesn't know a single thing about Star Wars and has never watched a Star Wars movie should instantly pick up the whole Star Wars plot and characters?
 

Haervii

Senior member
Apr 20, 2000
428
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Helluva lot better than EPI, which really was awful. Child acting, Jar Jar, and switching between THREE final battle scenes didn't add up. But No. 2 really was great. It had more to do with IV-VI, and had a GREAT ending and incredible special effects.

And for those who say it had cheesy acting and cheesy monsters, true, but that's Star Wars. The originals had equally stupid lines and even more ridiculous aliens.

Additionally, MooKow said in the first page that it was similar to Lord of the Rings. I thought the same thing, and I don't really know why! Well, I loved both movies, anyway!:confused:
 

LH

Golden Member
Feb 16, 2002
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Lucas said they would start making a profit off the movie at $300million

So that means with advertising costs, around $185million. Most movies, the studio gets 55% of the box office, Lucas and Fox wants 70%, which is why, its really shown in less theaters, dont believe a word Lucas says on the matter. If those other 600-700 theaters agreed to play his movie on their MAIN screens for 90 days, and give Lucas/Fox 70% of the boxoffice the first three weeks, he'd jump on it in a heart beat, the fact remains, there are quite a few theaters that refuse to be bullied by Lucas/Fox.
 

Nefrodite

Banned
Feb 15, 2001
7,931
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Originally posted by: normajean
and be careful where you see it, i saw it again today and the sound system sucked at this thaeter, which was newer. Those sonic depth charges that jango releases rocked the first time, but the second theater were weak. Plus the crowd makes a diiference on how you react to things, the second crowd were older and maybe didn't appreciate some of the humor. I must go again...$5 a pop why not..


heh totally, the first crowd i saw it with were fanatics on opening day, they all laughed at the anikan nightmare scene..(he looks like he's jerking the mansteak;) ) the 2nd crowd had no reaction:p

 

WilsonTung

Senior member
Aug 25, 2001
487
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Additionally, MooKow said in the first page that it was similar to Lord of the Rings. Additionally, MooKow said in the first page that it was similar to Lord of the Rings. I thought the same thing, and I don't really know why!

It does - and here's why:

Lord Dooku betrays the Jedi, turns his planet into a vast underground factory making monstrous war machines. He caputures Obi Wan when Obi Wan investigates.

Saruman betrays the Wizards and Middle Earth, and turns his domain into a vast undeground factory making monstrous war creatures. Saruman captures Gandalf and beats on him a bit.

I also noticed that the car chase scenes on Coruscant were reminicant of the '5th Element' and the execution scene was rather like 'Gladiator'. I almost expected Russel Crowe to come out and shout ARE YOU NOT ENTERTAINED?!?! at the end when the clones kill all the droids and just 3P0 and R2 are left.
 

neomits

Diamond Member
Aug 18, 2001
3,228
0
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Originally posted by: qfg
ok im reposting this question...

What were the budgets for all the movies, esp. Ep. II?

also does anyone know how much George Lucas is worth?


Here's some info

Episode II Production Budget: $115 million Marketing Costs: $25 million

Episode I Production Budget: $115 million
 

abaez

Diamond Member
Jan 28, 2000
7,155
1
81
"What were the budgets for all the movies, esp. Ep. II?"

It cost Lucasfilm $120 million.

"Lucas said they would start making a profit off the movie at $300million

So that means with advertising costs, around $185million. Most movies, the studio gets 55% of the box office, Lucas and Fox wants 70%, which is why, its really shown in less theaters, dont believe a word Lucas says on the matter. If those other 600-700 theaters agreed to play his movie on their MAIN screens for 90 days, and give Lucas/Fox 70% of the boxoffice the first three weeks, he'd jump on it in a heart beat, the fact remains, there are quite a few theaters that refuse to be bullied by Lucas/Fox. "

The booking terms for Star Wars at most theatres are 70/70/70/60/60/60/50/40 vs 90/10 over your house expense (whichever is higher). 8 week minimum. And most movies the studios get much higher than 55%. Alot bigger theatres got 4 week minimum, some theatres in New York got a 2 week minimum. And Lucasfilm *leases* Star Wars to Fox to handle the distribution, Fox gets a cut, but probably a much smaller one than most big movies. Lucasfilm is very demanding of terms and stuff, and people don't like it. At many theatres there are only 3 prints of Star Wars playing vs 4 for Spider-man. Everyone knows that Star Wars will make them a pile of money so they always agree. Warner Bros. had some pretty strong demands for Harry Potter, and unless a theatre wants to pass on the income a big movie brings, they usually always agree.
 

piku

Diamond Member
May 30, 2000
4,049
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I can't believe that so many people are so stumped about the plot and characters of this really, really good movie! It's not the plot and dialogue that are stupid, it's the PEOPLE who can't understand simple English.
Of course it's simple English, it sounded like it was written for 4 year olds.

Anyway, I was thoroughly disappointed with Episode II. A great deal of it was because of the God-awful dialog of Anakin, but that wasn't all of it by any means.

I have to admit though, I need to watch it again. I keep switching from totally disliking it to thinking it was alright, and I need to know just what the heck my opinion is of it :D
 

fatbaby

Banned
May 7, 2001
6,427
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when mace windu decapitates jango, and boba goes and picks up his helmet, why don't you see jango's head fall out?

and where did all the star destroyers come from?
 

Daxxax

Senior member
Mar 9, 2001
521
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He also told Luke that Vader killed his father. The entire Star Wars lineup is filled with inconsistencies like that. It's the product of the films being made years apart.


I believe Obi-wan told Luke these Lies because he didn't think that was the right time to tell him the truth. The way I see it in (A New Hope) Ben kept as much info to himself as he could if he had told Luke all about the clone wars, the droids or that Vadar was his father it would of been to much for the farm boy to handle.

Damn people use your imagination a little bit, so far I have not seen one inconsistencie.
 

zimmie6576

Senior member
Apr 7, 2002
499
0
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Originally posted by: CptObvious
Zimmie, your quote about the "human being" line in ANH being a "joke" is incorrect... The original actually had Jaba as a person, a big fat dude, standing there acting the part....it wasnt until later that Lucas decided to make Jabba another species of creature and not human, thats why that line is there.

And the dissapearing / reappearing act done in the original trilogy is explained in Ep III

Sorry, but while there was originally a human actor there, Lucas meant the whole time for that person to be a stand in for some special effect creature to be put in later (yes, it was possible to add effects after the fact back then). He just wasn't able to do it to satisfaction with the technology he had when the movie was orginally made.
 

DefRef

Diamond Member
Nov 9, 2000
4,041
1
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Of course it's simple English, it sounded like it was written for 4 year olds.
I'm sure you could do better.
rolleye.gif


I'm not saying it's flawless, but there IS a dimension to the writing and performances that has obviously eluded the people who are counting the days to the next Adam Sandler movie. Read Knowles review and maybe you'll learn something.

A friend who went to see it with me on Thurs. afternoon (we'd gone to seperate Midnight shows) had avoided almost all details and reviews before seeing for himself. After the show, we were chatting about the reviews I'd read and mentioned the constant "me too!" drumbeat of complaints about the dialogue and he said, "Heck, all the Star Wars movies have had goofy dialogue. That's what makes them Star Wars movies." (This guy has a 7" long tattoo on the inside of his left arm of Naboo script from TPM, too.:Q)

My g/f, who doesn't really know the ins and outs of the series really enjoyed it and talked about it for hours and wants to see it again. For reference, before we went to the afternoon show, whenever I mentioned friends and co-workers who were seeing/had seen the Midnight show, she sing-songed, "Loooz-zers." She got over that.

The first time I saw it, I was kinda so-so on it, but the 2nd time, it tightened up and really rocked and I started to get mad at the rudely and ignorantly negative reviews. I've read at least 30 reviews and in a lot of the negative ones, I've noticed that people probably were looking to beat it down before the lights even dimmed. Here's why...

Remember the tree scene in Empire when Luke asks Yoda what's in there and Yoda replies, "Only what you take with you."? Well, I think a lot of people dragged in a lot of baggage to AOTC and it's messing with their perceptions and attitudes.
  • The revisionism about The Phantom Menace is insane - according to this Canadian article, "Fans did appreciate Phantom, says Lucas. "For four weeks they did exit polls and 80% of the people coming out thought it was fantastic. Only 20% thought it was good or less than good or fair. So it had overwhelmingly good exit polls." Even the reviews were 60% good and 40% negative, Lucas says, although he complains now that only the negative ones are remembered by carping critics."

    Considering that TPM is the #4 domestic and #3 worldwide box office champ, how did that happen when no one saw it and no one liked it?!?!? (According to today's stories and selective memories.)
  • Not everyone hated Jar Jar! He didn't bug me (HATED the brat though) and the only reason that the charges of racism started was because people knew that a black man (Ahmed Best) was performing the role. If a white man had done the EXACT SAME THING, the nattering twits would say he was a surfer dude. People wanted to see racism and SURPRISE!!!!, they found it.:|
  • People bitching about the look of the digital image only saw that because they were looking for flaws in this new digital technique. If you didn't know it was shot on video, you wouldn't have even noticed. Roger Ebert is an outspoken opponent of digital cinema and he couldn't get past he prejudices and he panned AOTC when he raved about TPM.
  • Criticisms that the actors were weak because they didn't have real sets are from idiots. In theatre productions, bare stages with few props are sometimes used to focus on the actors, so why are actors suddenly screwed because they didn't have REAL droid factories to run through?!? Once again, because you knew that nothing was there, you let it affect your attitudes.
  • Complaining that Samuel L. didn't act like Jules or Shaft shows that you must've thought you were seeing "Quentin Tarantino's Attack of the Clones" or that Issac Hayes should've been singing, "Who is the Jedi who'd cut a bounty hunter's head off?/MACE!!/You're damn right" Jedi are keepers of the peace, not badass motherf*ckers. (Duh.) Shouldn't they be more chilled in their hang?
  • The romance was something out of "Romeo & Juliet" - two kids from different worlds whose roles, responsibilities and oaths are keeping them apart. The way she treats him like a child, ("Oh, he's not a Jedi yet..."), but is obviously lonely due to her political life and the way he chafes at the Jedi prohibitions against forming attachments and relationships is a recipe for young and stupid love and the disasters to come. The muddled words Anikin uses to express his feelings to her (fireplace scene) felt no weirder than the way some Shakespearean characters express their love. It sounds odd to our ears, but how should he have said it? "Yo, Amidala....you give me a chubby lightsabrer in my pants."?:disgust:
  • Subtle comments from Yoda show that the Jedi have lost their edge and are blithely heading for their destruction and they don't even see it. The arrogant librarian ("If it's not in the archives, it doesn't exist.") is typical and my g/f thought that his comment about how the older Jedi were slipping was directed at Obi-Wan. The fact that Yoda's Dark Side Detector doesn't peg off the scale when he gets into the same building as Palpatine shows just how powerful this Sith mofo is and how he's been able to manipulate everyone into doing his bidding.
I'd go on, but I'm sure that if I posted another 1000 words about this, someone would just barf up, "Gawd it sucked. Lucas is suck. LOTR/Matrix/Spiderdude RULES!!!!" and ignore the point.

There were a few things that could've been a bit better. I think the editing of the dramatic scenes could've been a bit tighter and more effective, but there were no ultra-clunky moments that made TPM merely a good movie. A few of the effects looked a bit flat, but when you've got over 2000 shots that need work, if you end up with 40 duff ones, that's still only 1 in 50, leaving 49 other shots of things you've never seen before in ways you never imagined.

Seriously, if you got a 98% on a test, you'd expect an 'A'-grade, but if George Lucas delivers a 98% correct movie, you shout that he sucks, he raped your childhood, is a talentless hack and should be forced to let someone else take over the story HE CREATED to satisfy your ignorant and juvenille rantings. If you're so culturally deprived that you don't recognize classic mythology combined with old Flash Gordon serials and then run thru the most bleeding edge technology to create a fine entertainment, then I guess who should just go watch whatever makes you happy and leave those who still have open minds alone. Thank you.
 

LAUST

Diamond Member
Sep 13, 2000
8,957
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Just got back from it... Far better then Episode 1 was... could have used a little less love crap and more of that good action in the beginning, but over all I thought it was good.
 

johnjohn320

Diamond Member
Jan 9, 2001
7,572
2
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I don't know if someone's mentioned this yet or not, at least no one did on the 1st page, hehe, but did anyone else notice that the "good guy" outfits (sorry, SW newbie here) looked strikingly similar to the Strom Trooper outfits in ep 4?

Pretty good movie, overall. There's apparently some stuff that I missed, i.e. Senator Palepetine became Darth Sideous...I'm sorry but I really missed something...who the hell is Senator Palepetine? Where did he appear earlier in the movie?

I also missed the combined shadow looking like Vadar as well. Interesting, I'll have to watch it again when it comes out on video 3 years from now.

Natlie Portman just got hotter and hotter with every scene, too. :)
 

Siddhartha

Lifer
Oct 17, 1999
12,505
3
81
Some observations:
I thought that the Jedi were lame and rather iineffectual. Consider how they were slaughtered in the droid battle and how easily Anakin was turned right under their noses.

The droids were at least 30+year old technology by the beginning of ANH. Do you own any 30 year old technology?


Is it possible Anakin brought balance to the force by killing the Emperor?
 

PlatinumGold

Lifer
Aug 11, 2000
23,168
0
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I thought that the Jedi were lame and rather iineffectual. Consider how they were slaughtered in the droid battle and how easily Anakin was turned right under their noses.

I think ur severly underestimating Yoda here.

My suspicion is that Yoda knows a lot more than he lets on. The prophecy speaks of the one that will bring balance to the force. What exactly is this balance, well, it would seem to me that the balance is balance between the dark and non dark sides of the force.

I think Yoda is the only one tho that really understands that.

On the other hand, Yoda looked pretty foolish bringing the clones to that planet and doing exactly what sidious wanted done.

 

OneOfTheseDays

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2000
7,052
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I will give you my relatively unbiased opinion. I cannot say I have been a huge fan of the star wars series, but I have watched every single one and understand the story line fairly well.

To the person who said that these prequels cannot stand alone by themselves, I completely agree. This movie, while it takes place 10 years later, seems as if it starts off just when the other one ended. The movie itself looks spectacular and the graphics are quite amazing. BUT, the CG effects are way too overdone. I just watched my Return of the Jedi LP today, and was much more impressed with those graphics than with this new CG computer animated crap that Lucas is puttin out. Lucas needs to understand that the graphics don't make the movie, and in this case they actually diminish from the atmosphere of the movie. Sound, on the other hand, was excellent and as was said before the seismic charges were great.

Acting was not that bad at all. I thought Anakin was portrayed quite well and we can see his anger and frustration quite well. I just saw a movie with this same guy today and I think that is just his natural style of acting, being pissed off and whiny. I didn't buy into this love story, however, and i think the movie could have concentrated less on it. Dialogue was also quite weak, and I got kinda annoyed with the stupid C-3PO head saying stupid one liners. I don't think comedy really has a place in the Star Wars series, the first 3 contained very little comedy and I think comedy actually hurts this film. It makes Yoda look like some Matrix spinoff when he does that martial arts stance.

The saving grace of this movie would definitely be the fighting scenes, especially Yoda vs Dooku. I wanted more, but that is Lucas' style (always leave the audience wanting more). Remember in TPM, the fight scene with Darth Maul was delayed until the very end, but at least with Darth Maul it was drawn out a bit. I think the next episode will definitely be the best out of this lackluster prequel series. Anyone that believes this movie was awesome obviously has pretty low standards as far as movies goes. Looking at this movie independent of all the other Star Wars series, I would still say it was not that great ( a B+ at best).

The one question i have is if Lucas will be making any more movies after this last episode. Will he continue where Return of the Jedi ends? I hear that Leia actually becomes a Jedi herself and that Luke has kids, so it seems as if there is plenty of good storyline left for Lucas to create movies off of.