Arizona signs immigration bill into law

[2Xtreme21]

First of all, I am a LEGAL immigrant AND a minority plus independent voter (even more minority than blacks or hispanics) so you can't use the racist/whitey/GOP/Bush fault/rightwing extremist/etc. line on me.

Second, I haven't hear any LEGAL immigrants like myself like how things are run in the immigration process, i.e. how ILLEGALS can jump ahead of the line and have the nerve to ask for amnesty/path of citizenship while KNOWING FULLLY that they were and are breaking the laws.

Third, I and millions of LEGAL immigrants endured so much hardship, cost, time, effort, and on and on just to be a LEGAL immigrant. Why can't ILLEGALS ARE REQUIRED to do the same? Why they broke the laws and then expect to be US citizens? Is that how we want our country to be? Just broke the laws and got the same result, LEGAL immigration (follow the laws) is for morons/chumps, right?

Furthermore, I always been asked for ID (a driver license would be fine and never for birth certificate so stop the misinformation) whenever I voted (every single time and it applied for every voter) and I didn't and still don't see the problem (you are required to carry driver license with you at all time), why can't ILLEGALS do the same? Oh wait, they can't, they ARE ILLEGALS.

Like I said before, enough is enough. ILLEGAL immigrants need to be stop and stop it now!!!!

Walking into work...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

Standing outside your home...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

As you walk in to see your kid's soccer game...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

As you're standing in line at the grocery store...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

You walk out your house and realize you forgot your wallet...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."
"I forgot it at home, sorry!"
"Yeah... you're going to need to come with us."
"No but I swear I'm legal!"
"Right, Pablo. Let's sit you down in this cell here."
... 8 hours go by ...
"Hey we finally checked with the INS and saw that you're legal. Woops!"

Oh no. Nothing could go wrong with this bill. Enjoy being completely harassed at every aspect of your life. But hey, you'll be all cool with it because it's STICKIN IT TO DEM ILLEGALS!!1

 

[spidey07]

Oh no. Nothing could go wrong with this bill. Enjoy being completely harassed at every aspect of your life. But hey, you'll be all cool with it because it's STICKIN IT TO DEM ILLEGALS!!1

Will you people stop with all these lies. You are flat out lieing! Stop it!

There must be lawful contact with an officer. They can't just up and ask for ID.

 

[blackangst1]

Walking into work...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

Standing outside your home...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

As you walk in to see your kid's soccer game...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

As you're standing in line at the grocery store...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

You walk out your house and realize you forgot your wallet...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."
"I forgot it at home, sorry!"
"Yeah... you're going to need to come with us."
"No but I swear I'm legal!"
"Right, Pablo. Let's sit you down in this cell here."
... 8 hours go by ...
"Hey we finally checked with the INS and saw that you're legal. Woops!"

Oh no. Nothing could go wrong with this bill. Enjoy being completely harassed at every aspect of your life. But hey, you'll be all cool with it because it's STICKIN IT TO DEM ILLEGALS!!1

and if any of those situations happened, which is unlikely, the said detainee would be released the moment a prosecuter or atty found out. Because THOSE instances ARE illegal.

Nice try to fear monger though.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Walking into work...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

Standing outside your home...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

As you walk in to see your kid's soccer game...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

As you're standing in line at the grocery store...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

You walk out your house and realize you forgot your wallet...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."
"I forgot it at home, sorry!"
"Yeah... you're going to need to come with us."
"No but I swear I'm legal!"
"Right, Pablo. Let's sit you down in this cell here."
... 8 hours go by ...
"Hey we finally checked with the INS and saw that you're legal. Woops!"

Oh no. Nothing could go wrong with this bill. Enjoy being completely harassed at every aspect of your life. But hey, you'll be all cool with it because it's STICKIN IT TO DEM ILLEGALS!!1

And the Feds also have such power. Why do they not do this the way you describe.

 

[EagleKeeper]

How many people walk around without some type of state ID and/or can provide it if they are required to prove who they are.

As long as the LEO is not "harrassing" them, then they have to only obey the laws.

And the AZ law was written to try to curb such.
Plus they are providing additional training to the law enforcement community on handling the potential situations.

 

[Svnla]

Walking into work...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

Standing outside your home...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

As you walk in to see your kid's soccer game...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

As you're standing in line at the grocery store...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

You walk out your house and realize you forgot your wallet...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."
"I forgot it at home, sorry!"
"Yeah... you're going to need to come with us."
"No but I swear I'm legal!"
"Right, Pablo. Let's sit you down in this cell here."
... 8 hours go by ...
"Hey we finally checked with the INS and saw that you're legal. Woops!"

Oh no. Nothing could go wrong with this bill. Enjoy being completely harassed at every aspect of your life. But hey, you'll be all cool with it because it's STICKIN IT TO DEM ILLEGALS!!1

Read the bill, please. Cops can't just stop you for no reason. Stop the scare tactics such as "ask for birth certificate to vote" or "stop and ask for ID while a person just mind his or her business".

As a minority person that live in the US for over 20 years, I had been asked for ID for many times but always for a good reason (to vote, got pull over due to speeding, apply for a job, open a bank account, etc.) but never when I stood in front of my house or going to work or to a sporting event or to a grocery store.

 

[her209]

Read the bill, please. Cops can't just stop you for no reason.

Doesn't mean they can't make up some bullshit excuse.

 

[2Xtreme21]

Read the bill, please. Cops can't just stop you for no reason. Stop the scare tactics such as "ask for birth certificate to vote" or "stop and ask for ID while a person just mind his or her business".

As a minority person that live in the US for over 20 years, I had been asked for ID for many times but always for a good reason (to vote, got pull over due to speeding, apply for a job, open a bank account, etc.) but never when I stood in front of my house or going to work or to a sporting event or to a grocery store.

Ok, and that will change as a result of the new law. All they have to do is be suspicious that you're not a citizen. And I'm sure you'll be all-too-willing to comply to their polite harassment.

Point is, why does the government have the right to harass me on a whim? It seems they're too fucking stupid to come up with a better solution to this illegal immigration "problem."

 

[Svnla]

Doesn't mean they can't make up some bullshit excuse.

But to stop a person and ask for ID just walk to a store or to work or just stand front of his/her house? The bill already has built in clauses to stop racial profiling. Like I said before, I haven't been stopped by cop(s) when I just mind my business AND I am a minority AND I live in the deep South of US for the last 20 plus years. Goosh, cops must went blind and saw me as a white blonde buxom chick :awe:

If you are talking about bad cop(s) that create some BS excuses, this is not the right thread.

 

[spidey07]

Ok, and that will change as a result of the new law. All they have to do is be suspicious that you're not a citizen. And I'm sure you'll be all-too-willing to comply to their polite harassment.

Point is, why does the government have the right to harass me on a whim? It seems they're too fucking stupid to come up with a better solution to this illegal immigration "problem."

NO! STOP IT!

Must have lawful contact.

 

[her209]

Ok, and that will change as a result of the new law. All they have to do is be suspicious that you're not a citizen. And I'm sure you'll be all-too-willing to comply to their polite harassment.

Point is, why does the government have the right to harass me on a whim? It seems they're too fucking stupid to come up with a better solution to this illegal immigration "problem."

They don't have a right to harrass you for no reason, but they could claim that looked suspicious and had probable cause to believe you are a gang member, etc.

 

[her209]

But to stop a person and ask for ID just walk to a store or to work or just stand front of his/her house? The bill already has built in clauses to stop racial profiling. Like I said before, I haven't been stopped by cop(s) when I just mind my business AND I am a minority AND I live in the deep South of US for the last 20 plus years. Goosh, cops must went blind and saw me as a white blonde buxom chick :awe:

If you are talking about bad cop(s) that create some BS excuses, this is not the right thread.

I have been stopped, asked for ID, and frisked by cops for simply walking in a group of 3-4 people. Just because you haven't doesn't mean its never happened.

 

[boomerang]

Walking into work...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

Standing outside your home...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

As you walk in to see your kid's soccer game...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

As you're standing in line at the grocery store...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."

You walk out your house and realize you forgot your wallet...
"Excuse me sir, I'm going to need to see some proof you're a citizen of the US."
"I forgot it at home, sorry!"
"Yeah... you're going to need to come with us."
"No but I swear I'm legal!"
"Right, Pablo. Let's sit you down in this cell here."
... 8 hours go by ...
"Hey we finally checked with the INS and saw that you're legal. Woops!"

Oh no. Nothing could go wrong with this bill. Enjoy being completely harassed at every aspect of your life. But hey, you'll be all cool with it because it's STICKIN IT TO DEM ILLEGALS!!1

Do you have any issues with the substance of the law? You know the part that says illegals are not allowed to be in the State of Arizona? I would think not because you're attacking the process by which it will be implemented. This while getting all hysterical about it like a 7 year old girl.

The sky ain't falling chicken little.

 

[EagleKeeper]

They don't have a right to harrass you for no reason, but they could claim that looked suspicious and had probable cause to believe you are a gang member, etc.

Should such a pattern develop, the LEO will be in hot water.

They are being instructed on how to prepare.

You do not see Feds walking down the streets of Tuscon hitting on every Hispanic they see. They have the power, but do not.

Why not take the Feds to taks for not enforcing the laws - forcing AZ to create soemthing that you feel is able to be abused?

What about all the people that abuse/take advantage of the laws by deliberately breaking them. Why should they be rewarded?

 

[2Xtreme21]

Do you have any issues with the substance of the law? You know the part that says illegals are not allowed to be in the State of Arizona? I would think not because you're attacking the process by which it will be implemented. This while getting all hysterical about it like a 7 year old girl.

The sky ain't falling chicken little.

Gee, and I bet if we locked up every single person in the US, we'd get every criminal too. Sounds perfect.

 

[her209]

Should such a pattern develop, the LEO will be in hot water.

Haha... I doubt it. This was in Sacramento where there are a lot notorious Asian gangs.

Of course, the only description that we fit was that we were Asian and walking in a group.

 

[blackangst1]

Doesn't mean they can't make up some bullshit excuse.

Are you an anarchist?

 

[boomerang]

Gee, and I bet if we locked up every single person in the US, we'd get every criminal too. Sounds perfect.

How about this. How about we have the Police deliver the illegals their welfare checks? They can ask for ID when they present the check to ensure they're giving the right check to the right person. Surely you'd want that check to go to the right person?

If you don't like the welfare check idea, we could make it food stamps, ADC payments, Social Security benefits checks or whatever other social programs our tax dollars are funding for people who broke the law to come here and are breaking the law by staying.

Sounds perfect.

Let's explore the rights of citizens of this country. Should we as citizens and taxpayers have to foot the bill for the health care of illegals and their ER visits? Is it right that we have to pay the cost of dealing with the crime they cause? The cost of hiring more teachers to accommodate their children who don't speak English? Is it fair that millions of our tax dollars go to translating countless documents? Should we, as citizens, have to drive on the streets with illegals who can't read the signs in English and don't know the traffic laws? Who's being treated unfairly here?

This problem has existed for decades. It has been ignored by administrations of both parties. With no penalties enforced, our borders have become a joke. Instead of nipping it in the bud, it has been ignored. It has turned into a very, very big problem and as such it requires this type of solution.

The law is specific. Every effort will be made to not profile along racial lines. That's all we can expect. The problem has escalated to the point it must be dealt with in this manner.

Get your little pink panties in whatever kind of a bunch that works for you. It's a known fact that Mexicans here illegally typically look like Mexicans. That should come as no surprise.

 

[nick1985]

Gee, and I bet if we locked up every single person in the US, we'd get every criminal too. Sounds perfect.

Calm down

 

[bob4432]

The law is not about stemming the flow of illegals it is about scaring people of color away from the voting booth. This november people will be voting for their elected representatives and yes, even in AZ, for now anyway. I'm sure If you feel because of your color and having to produce documents like a birth certificate to rent a cops hired by the GOP at the polling station.... this is as much the same as the poll tax or the poll tests they had in the racist south to prevent blacks from voting. Now, instead of a "tax" they have to produce their birth certificate?! How many whites even carry or even have a copy or the original of their birth certificate? I would wager way less than half and it can be expensive to get a valid copy sometimes running well over $100.00. For the working poor, the elderly, these costs just to be able to cast your vote, which is your right under the constitution, can be more than they can afford. So, while those on the right can say it is all about immigration, they are either lying or just stupid. I prefer to think the latter judging by the posters the teabaggers carry and the spelling on them. Besides, if they're worried about brown crime in AZ I thought all you cowboys carried a hogleg around with you for just such an opportunity....ahem, I mean for self defense.

AZ will regret passing this law. If not because of the unconstitutional nature of it, and it will be struck down but because of not only the national back lash against them but for the millions of dollars the state will spend in court trying to fight the avalanche of lawsuits that will arise from this. Money that could be going to schools, hospitals, road work, etc.. Taxpayers of AZ, you are getting royally screwed by your politicians. So.....bend on over....AZ get ready for the Duke.

wow, you are a fucking idiot

 

[bob4432]

Will you people stop with all these lies. You are flat out lieing! Stop it!

There must be lawful contact with an officer. They can't just up and ask for ID.

spidey - they can't think for themselves, they got their talking points from huffington post, msnbc, cnn, etc and can't take the time to read and comprehend a bill that is less than 20pages in length nor can they understand that is mirrors federal law anyway.

 

[2Xtreme21]

How about this. How about we have the Police deliver the illegals their welfare checks? They can ask for ID when they present the check to ensure they're giving the right check to the right person. Surely you'd want that check to go to the right person?

If you don't like the welfare check idea, we could make it food stamps, ADC payments, Social Security benefits checks or whatever other social programs our tax dollars are funding for people who broke the law to come here and are breaking the law by staying.

Sounds perfect.

Let's explore the rights of citizens of this country. Should we as citizens and taxpayers have to foot the bill for the health care of illegals and their ER visits? Is it right that we have to pay the cost of dealing with the crime they cause? The cost of hiring more teachers to accommodate their children who don't speak English? Is it fair that millions of our tax dollars go to translating countless documents? Should we, as citizens, have to drive on the streets with illegals who can't read the signs in English and don't know the traffic laws? Who's being treated unfairly here?

This problem has existed for decades. It has been ignored by administrations of both parties. With no penalties enforced, our borders have become a joke. Instead of nipping it in the bud, it has been ignored. It has turned into a very, very big problem and as such it requires this type of solution.

The law is specific. Every effort will be made to not profile along racial lines. That's all we can expect. The problem has escalated to the point it must be dealt with in this manner.

Get your little pink panties in whatever kind of a bunch that works for you. It's a known fact that Mexicans here illegally typically look like Mexicans. That should come as no surprise.

The costs of illegal immigrants receiving social services is almost completely outweighed by the benefit they provide to the average consumer by doing jobs like berry picking for next to nothing. When that method of easy production dries up, who's it going to affect?

Like it or not, these undocumented workers that don't fall under minimum wage laws are a very large benefit to the capitalist economy you people swear by-- hence why nothing has ever been done at the federal level. Arizona is shooting itself in the foot by passing this law both by terminating this extremely easy and effective means of production AND by infringing on everyday American citizens' fourth amendment rights.

 

[blackangst1]

The costs of illegal immigrants receiving social services is almost completely outweighed by the benefit they provide to the average consumer by doing jobs like berry picking for next to nothing. When that method of easy production dries up, who's it going to affect?

Like it or not, these undocumented workers that don't fall under minimum wage laws are a very large benefit to the capitalist economy you people swear by-- hence why nothing has ever been done at the federal level. Arizona is shooting itself in the foot by passing this law both by terminating this extremely easy and effective means of production AND by infringing on everyday American citizens' fourth amendment rights.

wahahahahahaha youre a funny guy! Oh, and wrong! Good thing you arent SCOTUS

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Do you have any issues with the substance of the law? You know the part that says illegals are not allowed to be in the State of Arizona? I would think not because you're attacking the process by which it will be implemented. This while getting all hysterical about it like a 7 year old girl.

The sky ain't falling chicken little.

He's having a bad day

 

[IronWing]

The Police Chief of Tucson was interviewed on All Things Considered this afternoon. He gave his interpretation of "legal contact". His definition included contacting folks suspected of crimes, contacting potential witnesses to crimes, and contacting victims of crimes. In all these case, according to him, officers would be obligated to take action if they developed a reasonable suspicion of illegal status. He also stated that local police are waiting on state guidelines which may differ. The transcript of the interview is supposed to be available by tomorrow. I'll try to remember to post it here.

Using his interpretation we can reasonably expect reporting of crimes and testifying against criminals to drop in Hispanic and other minority neighborhoods. Who would want to risk getting hauled off to jail, the same jail the suspect you just witnessed against got sent to, because an officer decided you look like you might be in the country illegally? Alternately, you might get turned over to Border Patrol for deportation. Yes, if you're legal you might get sprung quickly, but in the meantime your ass is in jail, not at work/home.