Apple calls MS.

[waggy]

Originally posted by: TallBill

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: PieIsAwesome
That is a crappy analogy, the Kia and the BMW don't have the same specs. The PC argument is that you can get better specs for less $$. It would be more like a 20k BMW vs a 40k BMW with a custom paint job or some other marginal difference.

Originally posted by: waggy
ok thats just fucking stupid.

Show me a Kia that has better specs then any BMW. try compareing something that actually fits. not something you try to make fit.

Ok... let me try to explain this to you.

Red head Lauren picked out a HP lap top that does not even come close to a MacPro when it comes to specs. That is my point.

The only place where the two compare is screen size, but even there the HP has inferior screen resolution.

On every other spec the Mac is a much better computer.

Read some of the reviews for the HP laptop Lauren picked. Everyone of them says it is slow and that the screen resolution is poor.

Because the macpro was OUT OF HER BUDGET YOU STUPID FUCK HOLY SHIT WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU RETARDED?

and that pretty much sums it up.

she was not looking for the best computer out there. she was looking for the best computer in her price range. but you are to fucking stupid to understand that.

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: TallBill
Because the macpro was OUT OF HER BUDGET YOU STUPID FUCK HOLY SHIT WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU RETARDED?

The budget that Microsoft set in order to put the Mac out of reach.

 

[TallBill]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: TallBill
Because the macpro was OUT OF HER BUDGET YOU STUPID FUCK HOLY SHIT WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU RETARDED?

The budget that Microsoft set in order to put the Mac out of reach.

/facepalm

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: waggy
and that pretty much sums it up.

she was not looking for the best computer out there. she was looking for the best computer in her price range. but you are to fucking stupid to understand that.

Oh I understand it completely.

But you guys are acting as if the cheapo PC is better than the Apple and there is not comparison.

Price out a Mac and a PC with similar specs and then get back to me.

 

[cronos]

Originally posted by: zerocool84
Dell XPS Studio are the highest end Dells and for the same price that he was looking at you still get better specs on the Dell so you still get more computer for the money. He said he chose the Mac cus he got a student discount + free iPod Touch/printer.

If you really like OSX then you're going to get a Mac. No reason to even look at a PC. Like others have said people are willing to pay more to get the OS and there's nothing wrong with that but you can't call it a feature cus to some/many people they could care less about the OS. They just see bigger screen, faster processor, bigger harddrive, etc.

I was comparing the cheapest Macbook Pro and the cheapest Dell XPS Studio, with about exactly the same spec. As I remember the comparison off the top of my head:

Both are using NVidia 9400M for the graphics, the screens are both 13"
The cpu for the MBP is 2.2 GHz and for the Dell it's 2.00 GHz (both intel Core 2 Duo)
The hard drive for the MBP is 160 GB and for the Dell it's 250 GB
The RAM for the MBP is 2 GB and for the Dell it's 3 GB (both are DDR3)

I considered the above a wash. I intended to upgrade the RAM to 4 GB and the HD to 500 GB myself anyway (which will cost me exactly the same whichever laptop I ended up choosing). Plus there's the 7 hours battery life claimed by Apple (again, Anand's review: http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=3580&p=1)

Both laptops tally around $1100 (including $100 student discount for the Mac which anyone could get from Apple's online store. AFAIK they never checked).

Oh yeah, I also tried to go through my school's Dell academic store for the academic discount but they only offer specific models and XPS Studio is not one of them.

Finally, just to clarify:
The reason I'm writing all the above is to show that currently there *are* comparable machines between Apple and Dell that are being sold at the same price point.

People who insisted to generalize that "all of Apple's products are at least $300-400 more expensive than a PC with comparable specs" simply have not looked at Apple's current pricing scheme. The quoted statement may be true 2 months ago. Not anymore.

 

[thescreensavers]

Same exact specs

Dell Studio 15: 1049.0 shipped
HP G60t- 1,088.99 Shipped
Mac Book pro 15inch 2.53ghz:1,699.00 shipped

$610-640 saved why would any one get a mac?

Well in my High school everyone claimed " its easy to use" "you dont get viruses" "it does not crash" " photobooth is cool" " macs r better" blah blah so people go ok ill pay that much more because from what I hear Macs>Windows they dont care about price they dont care about anything other then "its better" If they can afford it they will get it.

Macs are not error free I always see mac users having to force quit crap and restart and so on.

 

[ProfJohn]

Some Lauren eye candy for you guys
http://laurendelong.nowcasting...s&actorID=LaurenDeLong

 

[PieIsAwesome]

Originally posted by: cronos

Originally posted by: zerocool84
Dell XPS Studio are the highest end Dells and for the same price that he was looking at you still get better specs on the Dell so you still get more computer for the money. He said he chose the Mac cus he got a student discount + free iPod Touch/printer.

If you really like OSX then you're going to get a Mac. No reason to even look at a PC. Like others have said people are willing to pay more to get the OS and there's nothing wrong with that but you can't call it a feature cus to some/many people they could care less about the OS. They just see bigger screen, faster processor, bigger harddrive, etc.

I was comparing the cheapest Macbook Pro and the cheapest Dell XPS Studio, with about exactly the same spec. As I remember the comparison off the top of my head:

Both are using NVidia 9400M for the graphics, the screens are both 13"
The cpu for the MBP is 2.2 GHz and for the Dell it's 2.00 GHz (both intel Core 2 Duo)
The hard drive for the MBP is 160 GB and for the Dell it's 250 GB
The RAM for the MBP is 2 GB and for the Dell it's 3 GB (both are DDR3)

I considered the above a wash. I intended to upgrade the RAM to 4 GB and the HD to 500 GB myself anyway (which will cost me exactly the same whichever laptop I ended up choosing). Plus there's the 7 hours battery life claimed by Apple (again, Anand's review: http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=3580&p=1)

Both laptops tally around $1100 (including $100 student discount for the Mac which anyone could get from Apple's online store. AFAIK they never checked).

Oh yeah, I also tried to go through my school's Dell academic store for the academic discount but they only offer specific models and XPS Studio is not one of them.

Finally, just to clarify:
The reason I'm writing all the above is to show that currently there *are* comparable machines between Apple and Dell that are being sold at the same price point.

People who insisted to generalize that "all of Apple's products are at least $300-400 more expensive than a PC with comparable specs" simply have not looked at Apple's current pricing scheme. The quoted statement may be true 2 months ago. Not anymore.

Bwahahahaha 9400m. I have repeatedly seen notebooks in hot deals with a 9600m gt or better under $1000. To get a 9600m gt you need the $2000 MacBook Pro. IIRC there was even a notebook with an SLI setup for around $1000.

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: cronos
People who insisted to generalize that "all of Apple's products are at least $300-400 more expensive than a PC with comparable specs" simply have not looked at Apple's current pricing scheme. The quoted statement may be true 2 months ago. Not anymore.

Someone walks into Best Buy, wanting a laptop that fulfills the following requirements:

17" screen
2GHz+ Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB RAM
320GB HDD
WiFi-N
DVDRW
Webcam

Anything above and beyond that is gravy, but they want at least those minimum specs at the lowest price.

What do they find?

PC: HP G70 $699.99

Apple: MacBook Pro 17" $2499.99

See, with a PC, you get "choices". You can choose to fulfill your minimum requirements for a nice low price of $699.99. Or if you want to splurge, grab this HP DV7 Core2Quad for $1299.99 (Apple doesn't even offer a quad-core laptop).

With Apple, you get one-size-fits-all. If you want a 17" screen, it's $2499.99.

 

[randay]

this is better than a religion thread.

 

[zerocool84]

Originally posted by: randay
this is better than a religion thread.

Shens

Apple is a religion.

 

[cronos]

Originally posted by: thescreensavers
Same exact specs

Dell Studio 15: 1049.0 shipped
HP G60t- 1,088.99 Shipped
Mac Book pro 15inch 2.53ghz:1,699.00 shipped

I don't know about the HP, but Dell Studio is not comparable with a Macbook Pro. You have to spec an XPS. Go look closer, the Studio has DDR2 RAM.

I agree though at the 15" and 17" the price of the Macs are still a quite a bit more expensive. But it's not as dramatic as you said it.

 

[cronos]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: cronos
People who insisted to generalize that "all of Apple's products are at least $300-400 more expensive than a PC with comparable specs" simply have not looked at Apple's current pricing scheme. The quoted statement may be true 2 months ago. Not anymore.

Someone walks into Best Buy, wanting a laptop that fulfills the following requirements:

17" screen
2GHz+ Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB RAM
320GB HDD
WiFi-N
DVDRW
Webcam

Anything above and beyond that is gravy, but they want at least those minimum specs at the lowest price.

What do they find?

PC: HP G70 $699.99

Apple: MacBook Pro 17" $2499.99

See, with a PC, you get "choices". You can choose to fulfill your minimum requirements for a nice low price of $699.99. Or if you want to splurge, grab this HP DV7 Core2Quad for $1299.99 (Apple doesn't even offer a quad-core laptop).

With Apple, you get one-size-fits-all. If you want a 17" screen, it's $2499.99.

Oh I completely agree with you, 100%

And to clarify, I also agree with most everyone here about the topic of this thread. Dumb move by Apple and I am lol'ing with you and Microsoft on this one.

Most of you may also be surprised that even on Mac-specific messageboards around the internet, the responses to this topic are similar. Most people thought that Apple was dumb by doing this, with a few silly fanboys with convoluted reasoning that somehow Apple has a reason to do this.

 

[zerocool84]

Originally posted by: cronos

Originally posted by: zerocool84
Dell XPS Studio are the highest end Dells and for the same price that he was looking at you still get better specs on the Dell so you still get more computer for the money. He said he chose the Mac cus he got a student discount + free iPod Touch/printer.

If you really like OSX then you're going to get a Mac. No reason to even look at a PC. Like others have said people are willing to pay more to get the OS and there's nothing wrong with that but you can't call it a feature cus to some/many people they could care less about the OS. They just see bigger screen, faster processor, bigger harddrive, etc.

I was comparing the cheapest Macbook Pro and the cheapest Dell XPS Studio, with about exactly the same spec. As I remember the comparison off the top of my head:

Both are using NVidia 9400M for the graphics, the screens are both 13"
The cpu for the MBP is 2.2 GHz and for the Dell it's 2.00 GHz (both intel Core 2 Duo)
The hard drive for the MBP is 160 GB and for the Dell it's 250 GB
The RAM for the MBP is 2 GB and for the Dell it's 3 GB (both are DDR3)

I considered the above a wash. I intended to upgrade the RAM to 4 GB and the HD to 500 GB myself anyway (which will cost me exactly the same whichever laptop I ended up choosing). Plus there's the 7 hours battery life claimed by Apple (again, Anand's review: http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=3580&p=1)

Both laptops tally around $1100 (including $100 student discount for the Mac which anyone could get from Apple's online store. AFAIK they never checked).

Oh yeah, I also tried to go through my school's Dell academic store for the academic discount but they only offer specific models and XPS Studio is not one of them.

Finally, just to clarify:
The reason I'm writing all the above is to show that currently there *are* comparable machines between Apple and Dell that are being sold at the same price point.

People who insisted to generalize that "all of Apple's products are at least $300-400 more expensive than a PC with comparable specs" simply have not looked at Apple's current pricing scheme. The quoted statement may be true 2 months ago. Not anymore.

Actually the base Studio XPS is $999 with those specs. The $1099 Studio XPS has 4GB RAM and 500GB HD but everything else is the same.

 

[ProfJohn]

The price on the 17" Mac is nuts.

But at 13 or 15 they are comparable.

My Sister in-law has one of those 17" cheapo laptops, I think my Macbook would run circles around the thing in a speed test.

What is really funny is reading various Mac v PC articles and seeing them point out that Macs running Bootcamp run PC programs faster than similar PCs.

 

[TallBill]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: cronos
People who insisted to generalize that "all of Apple's products are at least $300-400 more expensive than a PC with comparable specs" simply have not looked at Apple's current pricing scheme. The quoted statement may be true 2 months ago. Not anymore.

Someone walks into Best Buy, wanting a laptop that fulfills the following requirements:

17" screen
2GHz+ Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB RAM
320GB HDD
WiFi-N
DVDRW
Webcam

Anything above and beyond that is gravy, but they want at least those minimum specs at the lowest price.

What do they find?

PC: HP G70 $699.99

Apple: MacBook Pro 17" $2499.99

See, with a PC, you get "choices". You can choose to fulfill your minimum requirements for a nice low price of $699.99. Or if you want to splurge, grab this HP DV7 Core2Quad for $1299.99 (Apple doesn't even offer a quad-core laptop).

With Apple, you get one-size-fits-all. If you want a 17" screen, it's $2499.99.

And apple wont release OSX on any machines not built by them, because that would wipe away the whole "we're different" idea. I'm sure that they would have the ability to do so.

 

[zerocool84]

Originally posted by: TallBill

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: cronos
People who insisted to generalize that "all of Apple's products are at least $300-400 more expensive than a PC with comparable specs" simply have not looked at Apple's current pricing scheme. The quoted statement may be true 2 months ago. Not anymore.

Someone walks into Best Buy, wanting a laptop that fulfills the following requirements:

17" screen
2GHz+ Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB RAM
320GB HDD
WiFi-N
DVDRW
Webcam

Anything above and beyond that is gravy, but they want at least those minimum specs at the lowest price.

What do they find?

PC: HP G70 $699.99

Apple: MacBook Pro 17" $2499.99

See, with a PC, you get "choices". You can choose to fulfill your minimum requirements for a nice low price of $699.99. Or if you want to splurge, grab this HP DV7 Core2Quad for $1299.99 (Apple doesn't even offer a quad-core laptop).

With Apple, you get one-size-fits-all. If you want a 17" screen, it's $2499.99.

And apple wont release OSX on any machines not built by them, because that would wipe away the whole "we're different" idea. I'm sure that they would have the ability to do so.

They'd run into the same issues with Windows and having to support millions of different configurations and make their OS less reliable.

 

[thescreensavers]

Originally posted by: cronos

Originally posted by: thescreensavers
Same exact specs

Dell Studio 15: 1049.0 shipped
HP G60t- 1,088.99 Shipped
Mac Book pro 15inch 2.53ghz:1,699.00 shipped

I don't know about the HP, but Dell Studio is not comparable with a Macbook Pro. You have to spec an XPS. Go look closer, the Studio has DDR2 RAM.

I agree though at the 15" and 17" the price of the Macs are still a quite a bit more expensive. But it's not as dramatic as you said it.

I understand but the difference in performance is not ground breaking awesome. So I still think its a perfect comparison.

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: thescreensavers

Originally posted by: cronos

Originally posted by: thescreensavers
Same exact specs

Dell Studio 15: 1049.0 shipped
HP G60t- 1,088.99 Shipped
Mac Book pro 15inch 2.53ghz:1,699.00 shipped

I don't know about the HP, but Dell Studio is not comparable with a Macbook Pro. You have to spec an XPS. Go look closer, the Studio has DDR2 RAM.

I agree though at the 15" and 17" the price of the Macs are still a quite a bit more expensive. But it's not as dramatic as you said it.

I understand but the difference in performance is not ground breaking awesome. So I still think its a perfect comparison.

I think it is a good comparison.

But how much is iLife software worth?
iPhoto is awesome, the ability to remove dust spots is killer, how much would something for the PC that does the same things cost?

And then you have iMovie and iWeb, both good software but a little more specialized.

BTW I think you have to upgrade the Dell to around $1200 to get it closer to the Mac. You need to bump up the processor and the screen to get a closer match to the Mac, although the Mac would still be faster and have better memory. You also have to add blue tooth and back-lit keyboard and I don't think the Dell has firewire either.

That is sort of the problem with Macs, they come with everything whether you need them or not. Have never used Blue-tooth on either of my Macs nor have I used firewire. (I do have an external drive wire firewire, but due to some glitch with the drive the firewire does not work with my model Mac.)

 

[zerocool84]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: thescreensavers

Originally posted by: cronos

Originally posted by: thescreensavers
Same exact specs

Dell Studio 15: 1049.0 shipped
HP G60t- 1,088.99 Shipped
Mac Book pro 15inch 2.53ghz:1,699.00 shipped

I don't know about the HP, but Dell Studio is not comparable with a Macbook Pro. You have to spec an XPS. Go look closer, the Studio has DDR2 RAM.

I agree though at the 15" and 17" the price of the Macs are still a quite a bit more expensive. But it's not as dramatic as you said it.

I understand but the difference in performance is not ground breaking awesome. So I still think its a perfect comparison.

I think it is a good comparison.

But how much is iLife software worth?
iPhoto is awesome, the ability to remove dust spots is killer, how much would something for the PC that does the same things cost?

And then you have iMovie and iWeb, both good software but a little more specialized.

BTW I think you have to upgrade the Dell to around $1200 to get it closer to the Mac. You need to bump up the processor and the screen to get a closer match to the Mac, although the Mac would still be faster and have better memory. You also have to add blue tooth and back-lit keyboard and I don't think the Dell has firewire either.

That is sort of the problem with Macs, they come with everything whether you need them or not. Have never used Blue-tooth on either of my Macs nor have I used firewire. (I do have an external drive wire firewire, but due to some glitch with the drive the firewire does not work with my model Mac.)

Dell Studio and Studio XPS have backlit keyboards/Bluetooth/firewire but USB is more prevelant anyways.

He needed to do the XPS Studio like I did with the 13" and the Studio XPS was cheaper and better spec'd than the Macbook Pro 13" cus the regular Studios are old news.

 

[thescreensavers]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: thescreensavers

Originally posted by: cronos

Originally posted by: thescreensavers
Same exact specs

Dell Studio 15: 1049.0 shipped
HP G60t- 1,088.99 Shipped
Mac Book pro 15inch 2.53ghz:1,699.00 shipped

I don't know about the HP, but Dell Studio is not comparable with a Macbook Pro. You have to spec an XPS. Go look closer, the Studio has DDR2 RAM.

I agree though at the 15" and 17" the price of the Macs are still a quite a bit more expensive. But it's not as dramatic as you said it.

I understand but the difference in performance is not ground breaking awesome. So I still think its a perfect comparison.

I think it is a good comparison.

But how much is iLife software worth?
iPhoto is awesome, the ability to remove dust spots is killer, how much would something for the PC that does the same things cost?

And then you have iMovie and iWeb, both good software but a little more specialized.

BTW I think you have to upgrade the Dell to around $1200 to get it closer to the Mac. You need to bump up the processor and the screen to get a closer match to the Mac, although the Mac would still be faster and have better memory. You also have to add blue tooth and back-lit keyboard and I don't think the Dell has firewire either.

That is sort of the problem with Macs, they come with everything whether you need them or not. Have never used Blue-tooth on either of my Macs nor have I used firewire. (I do have an external drive wire firewire, but due to some glitch with the drive the firewire does not work with my model Mac.)

Backlit keyboard was a 25 buck option on the dell so just add it to the price I have, its still cheaper

Software only costs as much as you need it. Something that may take out dust spots might cost 200 bucks but it still will overall be cheaper then the mac, or you could email it to your mac friends :evil:

DD3 vs DDR2
improves buffered memory bandwidth by 16% to 18%, with a real-world improvement in gaming and application performance of 2 to 5%.T

indeed it has the faster ram but its not holy crap much faster, this test was done with desktops chipsets aswell so it will show better performance gains there then with a laptop. What will an average user notice going from DDR2 to DDR3? mostly nothing other then having 3 instead of 2 the average user will just know 3 is higher. But is it worth the price difference, no

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: thescreensavers
Software only costs as much as you need it. Something that may take out dust spots might cost 200 bucks but it still will overall be cheaper then the mac, or you could email it to your mac friends :evil:

Once you add that software though you are starting to creep up close to the same price as the Mac.

I came up with $1149 I think for similar models. Of course I could skip the back-lit and the blue tooth etc and save a little bit of money.

But then I have to add the money for the photo software. And then I have to deal with the typical PC headaches, virus software or just take the risk that I don't get one because I am a smart surfer etc etc.

I think once you get down to $100-200 it becomes almost a toss-up unless you HAVE to stay under a certain point.


BTW I have a kick ass PC on my desk (2.4Ghz Quad core, 4 gig, 8800 gt, over 1Tb of HD space, 22" screen) and a 20" iMac 2Ghz Core Duo with 1 gig of ram and a much smaller HD and yet I use the Mac 10 times as much as the PC because the Mac is just a better user experience. Also, the Mac boots faster than the PC despite the PCs having much faster everything. (while typing this and trying to look at my PCs speed rating Vista hung up and restarted itself. Never had that problem on the Mac)

 

[zerocool84]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

And then I have to deal with the typical PC headaches, virus software or just take the risk that I don't get one because I am a smart surfer etc etc.

And now that Apple recommends one for Macs since they are suffering many virus' as well.

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: zerocool84

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

And then I have to deal with the typical PC headaches, virus software or just take the risk that I don't get one because I am a smart surfer etc etc.

And now that Apple recommends one for Macs since they are suffering many virus' as well.

I have yet to see one or even hear of one.

I thought the whole Apple recommends one was just a software company trying to get some business??

I think Macs are safer because it is harder to get the files onto the computer and get them executed.

On a PC it is like "oh look a Jessica Alba sex tape!! cool" :click: "what the hell just happened to my machine?"

I had to totally reinstall Vista 3 times on my Dell due to stupid crap happening with drivers or one nasty virus. I also had all kinds of 'does not want to start" issues with the machine until I got Vista SP 1.

Again, on the Mac I have never had one major problem. Safari will die some times, but it seems that browsers die all the time due to web page makers pushing the envelop faster than the browsers makers. Those 'interactive' web ads were killing Safari till the latest upgrade.

 

[zerocool84]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: zerocool84

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

And then I have to deal with the typical PC headaches, virus software or just take the risk that I don't get one because I am a smart surfer etc etc.

And now that Apple recommends one for Macs since they are suffering many virus' as well.

I have yet to see one or even hear of one.

I thought the whole Apple recommends one was just a software company trying to get some business??

I think Macs are safer because it is harder to get the files onto the computer and get them executed.

On a PC it is like "oh look a Jessica Alba sex tape!! cool" :click: "what the hell just happened to my machine?"

I had to totally reinstall Vista 3 times on my Dell due to stupid crap happening with drivers or one nasty virus. I also had all kinds of 'does not want to start" issues with the machine until I got Vista SP 1.

Again, on the Mac I have never had one major problem. Safari will die some times, but it seems that browsers die all the time due to web page makers pushing the envelop faster than the browsers makers. Those 'interactive' web ads were killing Safari till the latest upgrade.

http://www.dailytech.com/Apple...ogram/article13562.htm