Anyone in the Warhammer Online Beta?

[Genx87]

WoW is a horrible game, bane of the MMORPGs. It will most likely destroy that genre for the most part as everybody will copy its design.

War should be a good game. Its pvp will be better than WoW. WoW's pvp is the worst pos I have seen in a long time.

I dont expect War to knock off WoW, or even give WoW a run for its money. It will be a niche product that hits 200-300,000 subs.

 

[Jschmuck2]

Calm down nerds.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: CVSiN

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: CVSiN

Originally posted by: Malladine
What do graphics matter? i haven't had as much fun in an mmo, almost any game period, than i did in UO back in '97. Ass graphics mean nothing next to great gameplay.

But back then those were good graphics...


Warhammer does look like a half warmed over Dx8 game at this point.

I agree unless its fantastic in playablity and gets raves.. I wont be playing it based on that alone..

WoW plays fantastic in huge amounts of people PVPing and Raiding.. if it doesn't then look at your PC thats the problem.
With X64 and 1 gig graphics cards becoming the norm with gamers why cant they make a pretty game and still have good RVR..

WoW did.. and still looks fantastic and its now 5 years old since Alpha.

AOC looks fantastic and it did weigh on my new machine specs as I want max graphics and max frame rates in AOC.

I agree the above post was a total cop out.

The game looks bland.. hell from what Ive seen on thier site and on the released videos Ive seen last gen games look way better.

WoW has no real substantial form of RvR as it is traditionally known and practiced. All WoW has is instanced pvp /carrot on a stick grinds but nothing approaching what was seen in DAOC or what will be seen in WAR. World pvp in WoW is dead (besides the few random lone ganks) there is no reason to pvp outside of instanced BGs.

Sorry but I myself require a little bit more then a simplistic carrot on instanced stick approach ftoward pvp in a MMO. As for your previous comment about graphics and it relating to WAR well I never saw anything worth raving about in WoW's low polygon graphics. The world was done in a highly stylized cartoon manner and the big football player shoulder pad gear was childish but not overwhelming to the eye in terms of sheer graphics awesomeness. WoW graphics aren't what I would ever call cutting edge or jaw dropping. Sorry but I've seen better and WAR is better even while it' still in BETA and being worked on. AoC has stunning graphics but again it won't matter because it'll turn any rig that isn't a hardcore gaming rig into a slide show once you start getting a massive amounts of people on the screen pvping.

I played DOAC from Beta up till Atlantis.. and let me tell ya.. the RVR was abysimal it was a grind in itself.
The ONLY thing that kept me playing that game was the addition of the combined PVE server.
and then Atlantis killed it as well..

Mythic cant write a good game to save their lives.. why someone would trust them with such a good license as WAR is beyond me.

might as well let Turbine ruin another game.. about the same chances for success.

and BTW... Engines dont change in beta.. what you see now is what they will launch with.

Coming from an MMO vet from the days of UO beta.. Ive tested pretty much every MMO to come to market thus far.
even failed ones such as Earth and beyond..
and NONE of them made a substantial engine change this far into beta.

You want PVP that requires real skill.. try 5v5 Arenas..
thats where competitive skill based PVP is going.

That's your opinion. The point remains a lot can happen in the 6-7 months leading up to WAR launching. To condem it now is nothing short of fool hardy. Oh and trust me you are not the only person with an extensive MMO beta testing record so I could care less about your list of previous MMOs you played/beta'd.

As for WoW I can't stand it period because it's completely shallow and meaningless game. I want pvp that matters and which has a purpose. WoW's pvp is nothing short of playing a FPS style game with elves, orcs and dwarfs. If I wanted that style of game play I'd play BF2 instead.

There is basically no real reason for PvP in WoW other then gear grind. The story and lore of the game has been ripped to shreds and rival factions do not wage war on each other in any meaningful way. Sorry but at least DAOC had realm pride/politics, realm points and open pvp combat but hey you sound more like PVE'er who played the wrong game for your chosen style of game play it seems. I can see why WoW appeals to people who are into pve faction grinds, raids and useless pvp for gear instances. Some of us though want a MMO where PvP can effect the in game world instead of the useless gankfests you see in STV or the meaningless and pointless BG/Arena grind in WoW. To me at least it seems WAR might provide PvP with a cause and a open enviroment where people are not completely locked into instances 24/7. So that in and of itself is a heck of a lot better then what WoW could ever provide period.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: Genx87
WoW is a horrible game, bane of the MMORPGs. It will most likely destroy that genre for the most part as everybody will copy its design.

War should be a good game. Its pvp will be better than WoW. WoW's pvp is the worst pos I have seen in a long time.

I dont expect War to knock off WoW, or even give WoW a run for its money. It will be a niche product that hits 200-300,000 subs.

I agree it won't eclipse WoW because to many people are into PVE only but WAR will gut the hardcore WoW pvp population (IMHO) if it holds up and delivers on meaningful PvP. In the end though if WAR does fail and is as horrible as some of it's detractors think it will be (even though it's 6-7 months away from launch) at least I have EVE Online which is my bread and butter go to PvP game.

 

[Baked]

LOL I just watch some EVE "pvp" on youtube. You've have got to be kidding me. Spinning around shooting pew pew lasers from your space ship is pvp? *falls off chair*

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: imaheadcase
I played DAOC from release to, had the best Animist in game till i sold him for $800. DAOC was a GREAT game, it had some flaws like ToA, but overall it was a good MMO.

I for once can't stand WoW, its boring, repetitive, has no PvP really, graphics are lackluster. Its not openended at all.

As someone who played DAOC extensively, i have to agree with your WoW sentiments. After playing DAOCs RvR for years, WoWs PvP is quite literally a joke.

As for the beta, mythic granted me beta about a month ago. It was fantastic, they send me 5 dead links for downloading the files to install, and didnt give me access to the forums to get support. I gave up there.

My experience with "mythic" and "beta" has been extremely poor anyway. I have betad for them 3 times in the past (DAOC, SI, TOA) and not just some, all of my bug reports have gone live every time. For TOA i actually counted the number of bugs i reported, 76. All of them went live on launch day...

 

[skace]

Originally posted by: Malladine
What do graphics matter? i haven't had as much fun in an mmo, almost any game period, than i did in UO back in '97. Ass graphics mean nothing next to great gameplay.

All things considered, UO had decent graphics for the time period.

 

[Markbnj]

You want PVP that requires real skill.. try 5v5 Arenas..
thats where competitive skill based PVP is going.

In the early days of RvR in Dark Ages people played it who specifically got a kick out of the realm-oriented aspect of it. Yes, it was a lag-fest a lot of the time, but no game before or since has given me the charge I got out of taking a group of 30 people into Pennine and dropping Alb keeps one after another. The defenses when they tried to take them back were sometimes epic, lasting for hours.

But then the "skill" PvPers like you came in, and over time we had the maxed out gank squads and the "8v8" crews and all the complaining on the boards about zergs. Interestingly, this development coincided almost exactly with the introduction of e-peen points in the form of RPs and realm skills.

I don't know if Warhammer will be worth playing when it's done, but the chance that it will goes up if you guys stay out of it . (No offense intended, seriously, it's just a different way of looking at the whole thing).

 

[skace]

Originally posted by: Markbnj
In the early days of RvR in Dark Ages people played it who specifically got a kick out of the realm-oriented aspect of it. Yes, it was a lag-fest a lot of the time, but no game before or since has given me the charge I got out of taking a group of 30 people into Pennine and dropping Alb keeps one after another. The defenses when they tried to take them back were sometimes epic, lasting for hours.

But then the "skill" PvPers like you came in, and over time we had the maxed out gank squads and the "8v8" crews and all the complaining on the boards about zergs. Interestingly, this development coincided almost exactly with the introduction of e-peen points in the form of RPs and realm skills.

I don't know if Warhammer will be worth playing when it's done, but the chance that it will goes up if you guys stay out of it . (No offense intended, seriously, it's just a different way of looking at the whole thing).

So let me get this straight. You love PVP, but only if the PVPers largely suck and take a casual role towards it? And most important to you is when you can lead large groups on your enemies and destroy all their bases?

That seems a bit biased towards "I like to win and I hate to lose".

 

[Malladine]

Originally posted by: skace

Originally posted by: Malladine
What do graphics matter? i haven't had as much fun in an mmo, almost any game period, than i did in UO back in '97. Ass graphics mean nothing next to great gameplay.

All things considered, UO had decent graphics for the time period.

Sure, but i stand by my last sentence there

Originally posted by: CVSiN

Originally posted by: Malladine
What do graphics matter? i haven't had as much fun in an mmo, almost any game period, than i did in UO back in '97. Ass graphics mean nothing next to great gameplay.

But back then those were good graphics...


Warhammer does look like a half warmed over Dx8 game at this point.

I agree unless its fantastic in playablity and gets raves.. I wont be playing it based on that alone..

...

I agree the above post was a total cop out.

The game looks bland.. hell from what Ive seen on thier site and on the released videos Ive seen last gen games look way better.

Yeah, I guess you're right, if graphics are "bland" that kind of kills it. There has to be some attraction artistically, at least in this genre. Of course, bland is subjective, and physics also plays a part. If the animations are awesome that can go a long way to correcting a less colourful palate.

 

[Markbnj]

That seems a bit biased towards "I like to win and I hate to lose".

I was in Midgard for five years-ish, so if you've ever played the game then you know I got used to losing.

I like the big battles, keep takes, tower defenses, relic attempts. That was DAoC to me, in the early days before the 8-mans turned it into Unreal Tournament w/Swords and Flashing Lights.

 

[skace]

Originally posted by: Malladine
Sure, but i stand by my last sentence there

I'd say the statement makes more sense as "Graphics are not important as long as they are consistent and bearable". And this comes from someone who plays MUDs, in which case my stance would be "If you can't make graphics that meet both of those qualities, don't make them at all".

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: Baked
LOL I just watch some EVE "pvp" on youtube. You've have got to be kidding me. Spinning around shooting pew pew lasers from your space ship is pvp? *falls off chair*

EVE pvp is leap years ahead of WoW's CTF/DM instanced gear grind button mashing pvp. PvP in EVE is the most meaningful pvp you could ever encounter in a MMO. EVE has both strategic and tactical pvp aspects that bleed into every aspect of the game as player run corps and alliances via for control of whole regions of space. If you think it only takes "spinning around going pew pew laser" then you are speaking out of complete ignorance.

 

[Sunner]

Originally posted by: CVSiN
You want PVP that requires real skill.. try 5v5 Arenas..
thats where competitive skill based PVP is going.

While I do play WoW, I can't fathom how anyone can seriously consider arenas to be "good pvp".
They're more like a small scale match of Quake or CS, minus about 80% of the skill required.

 

[Subyman]

Originally posted by: Sunner

Originally posted by: CVSiN
You want PVP that requires real skill.. try 5v5 Arenas..
thats where competitive skill based PVP is going.

While I do play WoW, I can't fathom how anyone can seriously consider arenas to be "good pvp".
They're more like a small scale match of Quake or CS, minus about 80% of the skill required.

There is no way you could just go into 1800+ arena and think you can even have a remote chance of winning unless you are a skilled player. Arena does take skill especially the equally geared arena tourny bliz is running.

 

[Xavier434]

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: Genx87
WoW is a horrible game, bane of the MMORPGs. It will most likely destroy that genre for the most part as everybody will copy its design.

War should be a good game. Its pvp will be better than WoW. WoW's pvp is the worst pos I have seen in a long time.

I dont expect War to knock off WoW, or even give WoW a run for its money. It will be a niche product that hits 200-300,000 subs.

I agree it won't eclipse WoW because to many people are into PVE only but WAR will gut the hardcore WoW pvp population (IMHO) if it holds up and delivers on meaningful PvP. In the end though if WAR does fail and is as horrible as some of it's detractors think it will be (even though it's 6-7 months away from launch) at least I have EVE Online which is my bread and butter go to PvP game.

Ya, I would say that most people who truly hate WoW are mostly influenced by their dissatisfaction with PvP and I can't really blame them. PvP in WoW is ok, but it could be so much better. Most likely, those who are very upset with WoW's PvP will be happy with Warhammer, but it should only steal a small sliver of the pie since there are just too many PvPers who are not willing to give up the PvE aspects of WoW.

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: Baked
LOL I just watch some EVE "pvp" on youtube. You've have got to be kidding me. Spinning around shooting pew pew lasers from your space ship is pvp? *falls off chair*

EVE pvp is leap years ahead of WoW's CTF/DM instanced gear grind button mashing pvp. PvP in EVE is the most meaningful pvp you could ever encounter in a MMO. EVE has both strategic and tactical pvp aspects that bleed into every aspect of the game as player run corps and alliances via for control of whole regions of space. If you think it only takes "spinning around going pew pew laser" then you are speaking out of complete ignorance.

You seriously think that clicking orbit and clicking guns and shields constitutes anything skill based at all?

For 99% of the players in the game, the battles are decided by whos had an account longer.

For the other 1%, its who has more capital ships.

 

[Engraver]

Originally posted by: Xavier434

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: Genx87
WoW is a horrible game, bane of the MMORPGs. It will most likely destroy that genre for the most part as everybody will copy its design.

War should be a good game. Its pvp will be better than WoW. WoW's pvp is the worst pos I have seen in a long time.

I dont expect War to knock off WoW, or even give WoW a run for its money. It will be a niche product that hits 200-300,000 subs.

I agree it won't eclipse WoW because to many people are into PVE only but WAR will gut the hardcore WoW pvp population (IMHO) if it holds up and delivers on meaningful PvP. In the end though if WAR does fail and is as horrible as some of it's detractors think it will be (even though it's 6-7 months away from launch) at least I have EVE Online which is my bread and butter go to PvP game.

Ya, I would say that most people who truly hate WoW are mostly influenced by their dissatisfaction with PvP and I can't really blame them. PvP in WoW is ok, but it could be so much better. Most likely, those who are very upset with WoW's PvP will be happy with Warhammer, but it should only steal a small sliver of the pie since there are just too many PvPers who are not willing to give up the PvE aspects of WoW.

I wouldn't count on War's PVP stealing much of anything away. From what I've experience so far, their PVP will be worse than WoW's. There is always the chance they could turn it around, but I highly doubt that. Better off waiting to dismember people in AoC.

 

[Xavier434]

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: Baked
LOL I just watch some EVE "pvp" on youtube. You've have got to be kidding me. Spinning around shooting pew pew lasers from your space ship is pvp? *falls off chair*

EVE pvp is leap years ahead of WoW's CTF/DM instanced gear grind button mashing pvp. PvP in EVE is the most meaningful pvp you could ever encounter in a MMO. EVE has both strategic and tactical pvp aspects that bleed into every aspect of the game as player run corps and alliances via for control of whole regions of space. If you think it only takes "spinning around going pew pew laser" then you are speaking out of complete ignorance.

I don't think it is really fair to compare EVE PvP to WoW PvP. The only reason why I am saying that is because unlike most MMOs that are known to be PvP oriented (especially EVE), WoW's PvP was designed to encourage casual players to participate and be able to play well without spending a tremendous amount of time in the game in order to keep up. When it comes to MMO PvP, it can be very difficult to try and blend the casuals and the hardcore players without making the hardcore players feel like "something isn't good enough". I am convinced that Blizz could have chosen to design WoW for the hardcore PvP players but that just was not one of their goals with WoW and it never will be.

All gamers would be better off if they realize that a PvP focused MMO and a PvE focused MMO are so very different that they might as well be classified into two separate genres. While there are obvious similarities, the actual experience one gets while playing the games is very different. Perhaps someday more MMOs will crack the code when it comes to blending the two successfully, but that day has yet to come.

 

[Xavier434]

Originally posted by: Engraver
I wouldn't count on War's PVP stealing much of anything away. From what I've experience so far, their PVP will be worse than WoW's. There is always the chance they could turn it around, but I highly doubt that. Better off waiting to dismember people in AoC.

Even with the lack of available facts on AoC, I would venture to guess that they are the #1 contender for the time being. We'll see what happens. My guess is that they will only steal a sliver of the pie too. A lot of that will depend on how much they are designing their game with casuals in mind. If they focus too much on the hardcore MMO players (both in PvE and PvP) then their customer base will be small and their stolen customer base will be even smaller despite how much "better" the game actually is. That and they will have to battle the WoW addiction of course.

 

[VashHT]

Originally posted by: Engraver



I wouldn't count on War's PVP stealing much of anything away. From what I've experience so far, their PVP will be worse than WoW's. There is always the chance they could turn it around, but I highly doubt that. Better off waiting to dismember people in AoC.

Just wondering whats so bad about it, I'm looking forward to this game so I'm just curious.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: Xavier434

Originally posted by: Engraver
I wouldn't count on War's PVP stealing much of anything away. From what I've experience so far, their PVP will be worse than WoW's. There is always the chance they could turn it around, but I highly doubt that. Better off waiting to dismember people in AoC.

Even with the lack of available facts on AoC, I would venture to guess that they are the #1 contender for the time being. We'll see what happens. My guess is that they will only steal a sliver of the pie too. A lot of that will depend on how much they are designing their game with casuals in mind. If they focus too much on the hardcore MMO players (both in PvE and PvP) then their customer base will be small and their stolen customer base will be even smaller despite how much "better" the game actually is. That and they will have to battle the WoW addiction of course.

Well from what I have heard of AoC it won't be PvP focused and will have enclosed environments that are fenced off by invisible walls ( ala Guild Wars ) to steer players according to some people who have played the beta. It will also come with instanced zones which I find completely annoying.

http://forums.ageofconan.com/showthread.php?p=1605378

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: Acanthus

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: Baked
LOL I just watch some EVE "pvp" on youtube. You've have got to be kidding me. Spinning around shooting pew pew lasers from your space ship is pvp? *falls off chair*

EVE pvp is leap years ahead of WoW's CTF/DM instanced gear grind button mashing pvp. PvP in EVE is the most meaningful pvp you could ever encounter in a MMO. EVE has both strategic and tactical pvp aspects that bleed into every aspect of the game as player run corps and alliances via for control of whole regions of space. If you think it only takes "spinning around going pew pew laser" then you are speaking out of complete ignorance.

You seriously think that clicking orbit and clicking guns and shields constitutes anything skill based at all?

For 99% of the players in the game, the battles are decided by whos had an account longer.

For the other 1%, its who has more capital ships.

Right...You do realize that a player who has specializes in one area like flying covert ops ships can fly them just as well as any veteran player with a few more years under their belt right? Oh wait you are using generalizations to make a false and untrue point.

Eve players who have played longer have the benefit of being able to fly more ships and equip them properly compared to newer players but it does not give them the huge edge you are insinuating. If a new player specializes on one type of ship they can very easily end up being able to compete with veterans as there are only so many skills that effect each ship and it's module setup.

EVE veterans may have more skills to fly more ships and more varied setups but at the end of the day they can only fly one ship out of the station to use in PvP and only use one type of setup for PvP for which there are usually many more counters too.

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: Acanthus

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: Baked
LOL I just watch some EVE "pvp" on youtube. You've have got to be kidding me. Spinning around shooting pew pew lasers from your space ship is pvp? *falls off chair*

EVE pvp is leap years ahead of WoW's CTF/DM instanced gear grind button mashing pvp. PvP in EVE is the most meaningful pvp you could ever encounter in a MMO. EVE has both strategic and tactical pvp aspects that bleed into every aspect of the game as player run corps and alliances via for control of whole regions of space. If you think it only takes "spinning around going pew pew laser" then you are speaking out of complete ignorance.

You seriously think that clicking orbit and clicking guns and shields constitutes anything skill based at all?

For 99% of the players in the game, the battles are decided by whos had an account longer.

For the other 1%, its who has more capital ships.

Right...You do realize that a player who has specialized in one area like flying covert ops ships can fly them just as well as a veteran player with a few more years under their belt right

Oh wait you using generalizations to make a false and untrue point. Eve players who have played longer have the benefit of being able to fly more ships and equip them properly compared to newer players but it does not give them the huge edge as you are insinuating. If a new player specializes on one type of ship they can very easliy end up being able to compete with veterans as there are only so many skills that effect each ship. So while EVE veterans have more skills to fly more varied ships at the end of the day they can only fly one ship out of the station to use in PvP and only use one type of setup for PvP for which there are usually many more counters too.

We all know that Cruiser 5, battleship 5, and frigate 5 are easy to get.

You mistake me for someone that didnt play the game i believe.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: Acanthus

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: Acanthus

Originally posted by: Drift3r

Originally posted by: Baked
LOL I just watch some EVE "pvp" on youtube. You've have got to be kidding me. Spinning around shooting pew pew lasers from your space ship is pvp? *falls off chair*

EVE pvp is leap years ahead of WoW's CTF/DM instanced gear grind button mashing pvp. PvP in EVE is the most meaningful pvp you could ever encounter in a MMO. EVE has both strategic and tactical pvp aspects that bleed into every aspect of the game as player run corps and alliances via for control of whole regions of space. If you think it only takes "spinning around going pew pew laser" then you are speaking out of complete ignorance.

You seriously think that clicking orbit and clicking guns and shields constitutes anything skill based at all?

For 99% of the players in the game, the battles are decided by whos had an account longer.

For the other 1%, its who has more capital ships.

Right...You do realize that a player who has specialized in one area like flying covert ops ships can fly them just as well as a veteran player with a few more years under their belt right

Oh wait you using generalizations to make a false and untrue point. Eve players who have played longer have the benefit of being able to fly more ships and equip them properly compared to newer players but it does not give them the huge edge as you are insinuating. If a new player specializes on one type of ship they can very easliy end up being able to compete with veterans as there are only so many skills that effect each ship. So while EVE veterans have more skills to fly more varied ships at the end of the day they can only fly one ship out of the station to use in PvP and only use one type of setup for PvP for which there are usually many more counters too.

We all know that Cruiser 5, battleship 5, and frigate 5 are easy to get.

You mistake me for someone that didnt play the game i believe.

Easy to get but you can only fly one ship and only use one setup in a fight no matter how many skill points you have period. Thus veterans do not have the huge edge you are suggesting. Just because you are flying a BS does not mean you are invulnerable to a frigate, cruiser and BC gank squad looking to pop a T2 fitted Navy BS.