Americans... you all confuse me.

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: slsmnaz

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: locutus12
i love the way some of you are calling me European... im British or English, not European, i haven't given up my currency, we are not ruled by Brussels. show a little respect. Also some of you have taken this all very very badly. Listen to me very closely, i hope i am wrong, totally wrong about china, i hope the USA remains on top, i have to say i hope it does a better job in future of leading the world in terms of global issues than it has done during its current administration, but all this aside i am not trying to bash the USA, i am trying to make sense of its current position and its policy of ignoring the coming change in terms of the emerging global economic powers. and i am trying to understand a political system that seems to survive by seeing who can throw the most crap at their opponent.

I actually agree with you for the most part. :thumbsup:

I'm a registered republican but I didn't vote for Bush and I don't agree with the right wing extremists on most issues. I'm more of a moderate republican. I'm not at all religious and I am pro-choice. I guess you could say I'm an Arnold Schwarzenegger republican.

If the republicans put up a Bush clone in 2008 I'll vote for Hillary.

So you're a RINO?

No, I'm a person who thinks for himself...not some fool who votes based soley on which party he's aligned himself with.

 

[MmmSkyscraper]

Originally posted by: spidey07
A nice month in the carribean would be nice.

Damn tooting!

 

[Mo0o]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: locutus12
i love the way some of you are calling me European... im British or English, not European, i haven't given up my currency, we are not ruled by Brussels. show a little respect. Also some of you have taken this all very very badly. Listen to me very closely, i hope i am wrong, totally wrong about china, i hope the USA remains on top, i have to say i hope it does a better job in future of leading the world in terms of global issues than it has done during its current administration, but all this aside i am not trying to bash the USA, i am trying to make sense of its current position and its policy of ignoring the coming change in terms of the emerging global economic powers. and i am trying to understand a political system that seems to survive by seeing who can throw the most crap at their opponent.

I actually agree with you for the most part. :thumbsup:

I'm a registered republican but I didn't vote for Bush and I don't agree with the right wing extremists on most issues. I'm more of a moderate republican. I'm not at all religious and I am pro-choice. I guess you could say I'm an Arnold Schwarzenegger republican.

If the republicans put up a Bush clone in 2008 I'll vote for Hillary.

would you say you're just a fiscal conservative?

 

[Toonces]

Originally posted by: illusion88

Originally posted by: locutus12
i love the way some of you are calling me European... im British or English, not European

You call us American, but we live in The United States of America (a country on the continent called North America). England resides in Europe, thus you are European. Only fair you see.

To call me American associates me with both Cananda and Mexico (both have different currencies)

However if I was to travel to any part of the world and call myself an "American" what state do you think I'd be characterized as coming from? Canada? Hardly.

Give us back our identity!!! Oh, and stop using State in a pejorative, sub-national sense - country is such a misnomer. Give us back our word too!!!

 

[slsmnaz]

Originally posted by: locutus12
my friend in Oklahoma said America is a place where you can talk about anything, disagree with anyone about everything, and still be there best friend for lunch. this thread is unfortunately proving him very wrong.

No it proves him 100% correct. Disagree does not mean dislike. We are disagreeing because your facts are screwed up.

 

[MmmSkyscraper]

Originally posted by: waggy
hwo many you get?

I only get 20 days + national holidays atm, it used to be 26 + the nationals.

 

[sixone]

Originally posted by: locutus12
well i wasnt intending to debate clinton, i was hoping to understand your politicle system and understand why in "some" ways the USA seems to be ignoring events in other parts of the world that will effect it in the long term, i.e. 20 to 40 years. so for me actually wanting america to do well in the future and recognise the coming changes and for me wanting to understand more about the frankly insane(to me) political system you all seem to have, im suddenly a basher of the USA, jealous, a European, and a whole bunch of other things combined.

my friend in Oklahoma said America is a place where you can talk about anything, disagree with anyone about everything, and still be there best friend for lunch. this thread is unfortunately proving him very wrong.

I guess it's all a matter of perspective. We wonder the same things about Brits and Euros.

 

[Linflas]

Originally posted by: locutus12
it seems all i hear from americans these days with regards to politics is "dang bleeding heart liberals" or "stupid dumb rednecks" presumably denoting Democrats and Republicans...

i was speaking to my good friend in Oklahoma about current political affairs and he spoke about senator Clinton and Obama going for the race to the white house and he was adamant that not only would neither of them win, but it would be a disaster if a democrat got into office :/

now i put it to him that surely there were bigger issues of global importance and that clinton wasnt a bad president, not perfect but not a bad one at all from an outsiders perspective, i mean the US economy had 75Billion dollar surplus, good growth stable taxes and the best medicare provisions the US has had. To which he replied that clinton was a disater due to monica lewinsky...

now this took me back a bit, maybe its because I am not actually an american but regardless of what happens in a politicians private life surely the main argument must be "were they good professionally" and if they were, surely we can ignore private conduct providing no one has been hurt, i mean you wasted millions of dollars trying to impeach the guy for basically cheating on his wife. it was insane, stupid and looked very childish and pointless to the rest of the world, especially here in england, hell if your a politician here and your not drunk and sleeping with your secretary or a rent boy or both then your not a true member of parliament.

my point to this post is this, i get the feeling that your politicians forget that they are not actually republicans or democrats, but that you are all Americans. your all so busy trying to blame one side or the other for the political mistakes of the present that your missing out on a changing future and from what i can see, failing to prepare for it by allowing the global reputation of the USA to slide thus losing potential diplomatic and economic allies.

in 20 years the USA will no longer be the worlds economic driving power, it will no longer be the worlds richest country, and it will no longer be the most affluent country and eventually its military will be surpassed in size and technology. the Chinese, a formerly communist country, will have successfully overtaken the USA in terms of economics, and with the massive workforce to back them up, it is doubtful anyone will be able to top them for a very long time.

Wake up America, the world is changing, the western world needs you need to change with it.

Fixed it for you. While China is certainly a totalitarian country it is no longer a communist country in any meaningful way.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: MmmSkyscraper

Originally posted by: waggy
hwo many you get?

I only get 20 days + national holidays atm, it used to be 26 + the nationals.

wow. very nice.

 

[slsmnaz]

Originally posted by: sixone

Originally posted by: locutus12
well i wasnt intending to debate clinton, i was hoping to understand your politicle system and understand why in "some" ways the USA seems to be ignoring events in other parts of the world that will effect it in the long term, i.e. 20 to 40 years. so for me actually wanting america to do well in the future and recognise the coming changes and for me wanting to understand more about the frankly insane(to me) political system you all seem to have, im suddenly a basher of the USA, jealous, a European, and a whole bunch of other things combined.

my friend in Oklahoma said America is a place where you can talk about anything, disagree with anyone about everything, and still be there best friend for lunch. this thread is unfortunately proving him very wrong.

I guess it's all a matter of perspective. We wonder the same things about Brits and Euros.

Yeah what's up with having a Royal Family?? That's just messed up

 

[MmmSkyscraper]

Originally posted by: slsmnaz
Yeah what's up with having a Royal Family?? That's just messed up

Seriously, it is. Can't wait til we get rid of them, although it probably won't happen in my lifetime.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: locutus12

Originally posted by: sixone

Originally posted by: locutus12
he did, there are just some misinformed people around for some unknown reason. i havent botherd trying to argue that point to them as some of them seem to be kids posting on what i hoped would be a mature topic, pity it hasnt turned out that way

That's because you're starting off without enough real information to carry your end of the discussion.

well i wasnt intending to debate clinton, i was hoping to understand your politicle system and understand why in "some" ways the USA seems to be ignoring events in other parts of the world that will effect it in the long term, i.e. 20 to 40 years. so for me actually wanting america to do well in the future and recognise the coming changes and for me wanting to understand more about the frankly insane(to me) political system you all seem to have, im suddenly a basher of the USA, jealous, a European, and a whole bunch of other things combined.

my friend in Oklahoma said America is a place where you can talk about anything, disagree with anyone about everything, and still be there best friend for lunch. this thread is unfortunately proving him very wrong.

You haven't seen that Top Gear episode floating around on youtube have you? :laugh: There are a couple threads here on it. Watch that and you'll see just how tolerant people are in the deep south in this country.

 

[Aikouka]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Clinton wasn't impeached ever...

Uhh yeah he was... you are NOT always kicked out of office when you're impeached. Johnson, who was also impeached, served the reset of his term as well.

Read up on the Impeachment process in the USA:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impeachment#United_States

 

[slsmnaz]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
You haven't seen that Top Gear episode floating around on youtube have you? :laugh: There are a couple threads here on it. Watch that and you'll see just how tolerant people are in the deep south in this country.

Gotta love the Kahleefornia mindset when it comes to the South. :roll:

 

[locutus12]

Originally posted by: slsmnaz

Originally posted by: locutus12
my friend in Oklahoma said America is a place where you can talk about anything, disagree with anyone about everything, and still be there best friend for lunch. this thread is unfortunately proving him very wrong.

No it proves him 100% correct. Disagree does not mean dislike. We are disagreeing because your facts are screwed up.

but your not showing me where, many of you have been reasonably insulting, and many have been quite nice and attempted debate. but so far no one has disputed the economic data i stated on the previous page. I worked as a Finance officer for many years and have a rather boring affinity for this type of data. you cant argue with a 9.7% growth rate. even when scaled against the USA`s larger economy, baring an economic collapse or shortage of raw materials to China, not much will stop them. Although i will admit they have serious challenges to face along the way in terms of equality and rights.

 

[locutus12]

Originally posted by: locutus12

Originally posted by: slsmnaz

Originally posted by: locutus12
my friend in Oklahoma said America is a place where you can talk about anything, disagree with anyone about everything, and still be there best friend for lunch. this thread is unfortunately proving him very wrong.

No it proves him 100% correct. Disagree does not mean dislike. We are disagreeing because your facts are screwed up.

but your not showing me where, many of you have been reasonably insulting, and many have been quite nice and attempted debate. but so far no one has disputed the economic data i stated on the previous page. I worked as a Finance officer for many years and have a rather boring affinity for this type of data. you cant argue with a 9.7% growth rate. even when scaled against the USA`s larger economy, baring an economic collapse or shortage of raw materials to China, not much will stop them. Although i will admit they have serious challenges to face along the way in terms of equality and rights.

Originally posted by: Linflas


Fixed it for you. While China is certainly a totalitarian country it is no longer a communist country in any meaningful way.

actually your right, i tend to look at them as a hybrid of communism and capitalism, the first great socio-economic experiment for over 200 years. and when i say great i mean large, not good. their human rights record is appalling.

 

[ITJunkie]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: locutus12
in 20 years the USA will no longer be the worlds economic driving power, it will no longer be the worlds richest country, and it will no longer be the most affluent country and eventually its military will be surpassed in size and technology. the Chinese, a communist country, will have successfully overtaken the USA in terms of economics, and with the massive workforce to back them up, it is doubtful anyone will be able to top them for a very long time.

Wake up America, the world is changing, the western world needs you need to change with it.

WTF! What are you smoking? We ARE the western world, europe is the tag along.

No. We are the single, most powerful, best country on the planet and will remain that way. This kind of euro-elitist crap is what ticks me off. We saved your butts so many times it isn't even funny.

Spidey, he wasn't "slamming" America so don't take it personally. His viewpoint is valid. This country has never been more divided in my lifetime. Ironic how it coincides with the election of a self-proclaimed "uniter"!
We are a stagnant culture...at the moment. Yes, our country gave the world some of the most amazing advances mankind has ever seen but what have we done lately.
We have destabilized a region that was already a powder keg with a lit fuse. The current crop of pop artists couldn't sing there way out of a fvcking paper bag without electronic help. Let alone actually play an instrument...live! Once again, it took Japanese car manufacturers to show our "Big 3" that yes...we really do want fuel efficient, environmentally friendly cars and would gladly pay extra for it. Europe has come a long way in changing the way people think about transportation while we seem to be stuck in this 50's mentality on the subject.
Has anyone ever stopped to consider the fact that there hasn't been one decade since WWII that America hasn't been involved in some sort of "military conflict"? It seems Eisenhower's (quote?) warning of the dangers of the military industrial complex were correct after all.
The OP's assessment is very much on target, IMO. We gave the world the internet yet America is quickly on its way to becoming a smaller role player because our telecom companies are relying on infrastructure that is decades old. China is deploying next gen infrastructure now. Look at the buz Verizon is generating with FIOS. It'll be years, if ever, before I have the option of signing up for it due to the myriad cable franchise agreements that effectively lock "them" out of my market for years.
The "we saved your butts so many times it isn't even funny" bit has become paper thin from overuse. We really need to wake up and retake the leadership role that much of the rest of the world has come to expect from America because it is really needed now more than ever. And by leadership, I mean showing the way not the "my way or the highway" bvllsh1t we have now.

/rant

 

[slsmnaz]

Originally posted by: locutus12

Originally posted by: slsmnaz

Originally posted by: locutus12
my friend in Oklahoma said America is a place where you can talk about anything, disagree with anyone about everything, and still be there best friend for lunch. this thread is unfortunately proving him very wrong.

No it proves him 100% correct. Disagree does not mean dislike. We are disagreeing because your facts are screwed up.

but your not showing me where, many of you have been reasonably insulting, and many have been quite nice and attempted debate. but so far no one has disputed the economic data i stated on the previous page. I worked as a Finance officer for many years and have a rather boring affinity for this type of data. you cant argue with a 9.7% growth rate. even when scaled against the USA`s larger economy, baring an economic collapse or shortage of raw materials to China, not much will stop them. Although i will admit they have serious challenges to face along the way in terms of equality and rights.

The amazing default rate on loans and their inevitable health care burst have been cited in this thread. You would think your finance job would allow you to comprehend what a default rate of 50% could do.

 

[locutus12]

Originally posted by: ITJunkie

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: locutus12
in 20 years the USA will no longer be the worlds economic driving power, it will no longer be the worlds richest country, and it will no longer be the most affluent country and eventually its military will be surpassed in size and technology. the Chinese, a communist country, will have successfully overtaken the USA in terms of economics, and with the massive workforce to back them up, it is doubtful anyone will be able to top them for a very long time.

Wake up America, the world is changing, the western world needs you need to change with it.

WTF! What are you smoking? We ARE the western world, europe is the tag along.

No. We are the single, most powerful, best country on the planet and will remain that way. This kind of euro-elitist crap is what ticks me off. We saved your butts so many times it isn't even funny.

Spidey, he wasn't "slamming" America so don't take it personally. His viewpoint is valid. This country has never been more divided in my lifetime. Ironic how it coincides with the election of a self-proclaimed "uniter"!
We are a stagnant culture...at the moment. Yes, our country gave the world some of the most amazing advances mankind has ever seen but what have we done lately.
We have destabilized a region that was already a powder keg with a lit fuse. The current crop of pop artists couldn't sing there way out of a fvcking paper bag without electronic help. Let alone actually play an instrument...live! Once again, it took Japanese car manufacturers to show our "Big 3" that yes...we really do want fuel efficient, environmentally friendly cars and would gladly pay extra for it. Europe has come a long way in changing the way people think about transportation while we seem to be stuck in this 50's mentality on the subject.
Has anyone ever stopped to consider the fact that there hasn't been one decade since WWII that America hasn't been involved in some sort of "military conflict"? It seems Eisenhower's (quote?) warning of the dangers of the military industrial complex were correct after all.
The OP's assessment is very much on target, IMO. We gave the world the internet yet America is quickly on its way to becoming a smaller role player because our telecom companies are relying on infrastructure that is decades old. China is deploying next gen infrastructure now. Look at the buz Verizon is generating with FIOS. It'll be years, if ever, before I have the option of signing up for it due to the myriad cable franchise agreements that effectively lock "them" out of my market for years.
The "we saved your butts so many times it isn't even funny" bit has become paper thin from overuse. We really need to wake up and retake the leadership role that much of the rest of the world has come to expect from America because it is really needed now more than ever. And by leadership, I mean showing the way not the "my way or the highway" bvllsh1t we have now.

/rant

well, thankyou for understanding where i was coming from that is exactly what i meant.

Originally posted by: slsmnaz


The amazing default rate on loans and their inevitable health care burst have been cited in this thread. You would think your finance job would allow you to comprehend what a default rate of 50% could do.

there default rate on loans doesnt make a difference as there loans equate to only a small proportion of their GDP due to state funding and state provision of services. one of the few good aspects of communism.

i have to say i always did like the idea of communism, its a fantastic system on paper, all people are equal, all benefit equally, rather amusingly i realised when i was 15 that StarTreks universe was intrinsically communist. its just a pity the system never worked the way it was intended. perhaps this communist /capitalist hybrid that china is using will be a partial solution.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: locutus12

Originally posted by: slsmnaz

Originally posted by: locutus12
my friend in Oklahoma said America is a place where you can talk about anything, disagree with anyone about everything, and still be there best friend for lunch. this thread is unfortunately proving him very wrong.

No it proves him 100% correct. Disagree does not mean dislike. We are disagreeing because your facts are screwed up.

but your not showing me where, many of you have been reasonably insulting, and many have been quite nice and attempted debate. but so far no one has disputed the economic data i stated on the previous page. I worked as a Finance officer for many years and have a rather boring affinity for this type of data. you cant argue with a 9.7% growth rate. even when scaled against the USA`s larger economy, baring an economic collapse or shortage of raw materials to China, not much will stop them. Although i will admit they have serious challenges to face along the way in terms of equality and rights.

It is a poor comparison as the US is a fully developed, first world nation with a high standard of living. Last time I checked China had roughtly 15% the GDP the US does and the US still grows at 3-5% a year.

China is a Communist nation in name alone.

 

[davestar]

Originally posted by: illusion88

They didn't try to impeach him because of what he did with that woman. They impeached him because he lied under oath. The difference can be measured in miles....

yes, but why was he under oath? because he messed around with lewinsky. not commendable, but he shouldn't have been put in front of a grand jury to answer for his infidelity.

 

[soulcougher73]

Originally posted by: ITJunkie

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: locutus12
in 20 years the USA will no longer be the worlds economic driving power, it will no longer be the worlds richest country, and it will no longer be the most affluent country and eventually its military will be surpassed in size and technology. the Chinese, a communist country, will have successfully overtaken the USA in terms of economics, and with the massive workforce to back them up, it is doubtful anyone will be able to top them for a very long time.

Wake up America, the world is changing, the western world needs you need to change with it.

WTF! What are you smoking? We ARE the western world, europe is the tag along.

No. We are the single, most powerful, best country on the planet and will remain that way. This kind of euro-elitist crap is what ticks me off. We saved your butts so many times it isn't even funny.

Spidey, he wasn't "slamming" America so don't take it personally. His viewpoint is valid. This country has never been more divided in my lifetime. Ironic how it coincides with the election of a self-proclaimed "uniter"!
We are a stagnant culture...at the moment. Yes, our country gave the world some of the most amazing advances mankind has ever seen but what have we done lately.
We have destabilized a region that was already a powder keg with a lit fuse. The current crop of pop artists couldn't sing there way out of a fvcking paper bag without electronic help. Let alone actually play an instrument...live! Once again, it took Japanese car manufacturers to show our "Big 3" that yes...we really do want fuel efficient, environmentally friendly cars and would gladly pay extra for it. Europe has come a long way in changing the way people think about transportation while we seem to be stuck in this 50's mentality on the subject.
Has anyone ever stopped to consider the fact that there hasn't been one decade since WWII that America hasn't been involved in some sort of "military conflict"? It seems Eisenhower's (quote?) warning of the dangers of the military industrial complex were correct after all.
The OP's assessment is very much on target, IMO. We gave the world the internet yet America is quickly on its way to becoming a smaller role player because our telecom companies are relying on infrastructure that is decades old. China is deploying next gen infrastructure now. Look at the buz Verizon is generating with FIOS. It'll be years, if ever, before I have the option of signing up for it due to the myriad cable franchise agreements that effectively lock "them" out of my market for years.
The "we saved your butts so many times it isn't even funny" bit has become paper thin from overuse. We really need to wake up and retake the leadership role that much of the rest of the world has come to expect from America because it is really needed now more than ever. And by leadership, I mean showing the way not the "my way or the highway" bvllsh1t we have now.

/rant

:thumbsup:

 

[RichUK]

Originally posted by: MmmSkyscraper

Originally posted by: waggy
hwo many you get?

I only get 20 days + national holidays atm, it used to be 26 + the nationals.

Same except I currently get 25.

 

[JD50]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: waggy
wow im shocked so many did not know he was impeached. kinda figure with all the news there was on this it would be common knowledge.

Meh, I remember there were impeachment hearings but I also remember he served his 2 presidential terms fully.

Ok, I guess that you need to have it spelled out for you. Just because a President is impeached, does not mean that he is removed from office. Please do some research on what happens when a President is impeached so you stop making a fool of yourself.

 

[locutus12]

Originally posted by: K1052


It is a poor comparison as the US is a fully developed, first world nation with a high standard of living. Last time I checked China had roughly 15% the GDP the US does and the US still grows at 3-5% a year.

they are currently at 20% of US GDP. and the USA hasn't grown at 5% for a very very very long time. analysts pin long term US growth under current fiscal policys as ranging between 1.9 and 3.2%

JD50, your signature quote made me giggle