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AMD launches Ryzen Mobile 7 2700U & 5 2500U with Vega Graphics

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Arachnotronic said:
Missing the mark by 9W is a 6.4% deviation from rated TDP, and that is Prime95 so that's worst-case scenario for the 7900X. That's not terrible.
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dude both Intel KBL-R and Ryzen mobile support cTDP upto 25w. Its upto the OEM to decide what chassis they want to design and whether they want to support mXFR. If you want a fair review test the HP Envy x360 with core i5 8550u / 8250u with identical config (RAM, HDD or SSD, screen brightness )
 
raghu78 said:
dude both Intel KBL-R and Ryzen mobile support cTDP upto 25w. Its upto the OEM to decide what chassis they want to design and whether they want to support mXFR. If you want a fair review test the HP Envy x360 with core i5 8550u / 8250u with identical config (RAM, HDD or SSD, screen brightness )
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I didn't say anything about KBL-R/Ryzen, just commented on the 7900X.

Anyway, this is kind of the problem with comparing mobile chips, since they are intimately tied to the systems they are built into. Even the "same" SKU of a notebook from the same manufacturer but with different SoCs will have fundamentally different motherboard designs and possibly even non-CPU components that impact power, performance, and the overall user experience.
 
raghu78 said:
And Intel doesn't ? Stop being delusional.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/1155...-core-i9-7900x-i7-7820x-and-i7-7800x-tested/8

7900X 140w tdp . Power draw measured 149w.
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What about the i7 8700 TDP (and perfs...) delivered to the press :
https://www.computerbase.de/2017-11...00k-test-auto-oc-ddr4/#diagramm-cinebench-r15

And the one found in regular PCs :
https://www.computerbase.de/2017-12/medion-erazer-x67015-aldi-gaming-pc-test/2/

Back on topic RR does 450pts/CB R15 in a strict 15W TDP, KBL-U should be at 410pts, that s 10% better perf at isopower for RR, at isoperf the perf/watt advantage climb to 20%, that s of course for Cinebench R15.
 
Abwx said:
Back on topic RR does 450pts/CB R15 in a strict 15W TDP,
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According to whos testing? We have one laptop out that is 25w and nobody has configured otherwise AFAIK.

Abwx said:
KBL-U should be at 410pts,
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NBC testing says otherwise. 25w 2500u vs 15w KBL R U (Unless you mean Kaby Lake U without the "R")

GinfUKJ.png
 
Dayman1225 said:
According to whos testing? We have one laptop out that is 25w and nobody has configured otherwise AFAIK.

NBC testing says otherwise. 25w 2500u vs 15w KBL R U (Unless you mean Kaby Lake U without the "R")

GinfUKJ.png
Click to expand...

Whats the proof that the core i5 8250u is not running at cTDP =25w . Is there a measured power draw while running CB R15 MT for KBL-R ad Ryzen 2500u in the same OEM notebook design using same chassis with same cTDP and identical config ?
 
Article said:
Verdict
Since this is the first commercially available notebook equipped with Raven Ridge, our Verdict can be split into two parts. The first part relates to the AMD hardware itself. On paper, the 25 W cTDP Ryzen 5 2500U APU and RX Vega 8 GPU are able to stand neck-to-neck with current 15 W Kaby Lake-R options (i5-8250, i7-8550U) while outperforming even the Iris Pro Graphics 580 in synthetic benchmarks
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The Stilt said:
I've measured the power consumption of all CPUs AMD has released since Phenom, and none of the production parts have ever violated any of the specs.
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First, AMD in the past didn't release the thermal specifications for their CPU (at least for all BD derived cores, maybe the CAT core also).

Second, MSI boards throttling due to FX-8350 exceeding TDP -
https://forums.anandtech.com/thread...-up-to-255°-c-for-no-apparent-reason.2285799/

Third, you must have missed all the Godavari laptops that throttled to 1.6Ghz after a half minute of load.
 
Phynaz said:
First, AMD in the past didn't release the thermal specifications for their CPU (at least for all BD derived cores, maybe the CAT core also).

Second, MSI boards throttling due to FX-8350 exceeding TDP -
https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/fx-8350-temps-look-fine-and-then-spike-up-to-255°-c-for-no-apparent-reason.2285799/

Third, you must have missed all the Godavari laptops that throttled to 1.6Ghz after a half minute of load.
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You are saying that the documents (thermal design guide and model guide) don't exists? If you want to stick to that statement, give me 15 minutes and I'll show you that they do very much exist.
What AMD did or didn't release in public is irrelevant, since each and every ODM has access to these.

MSI brought up the topic in attempt to cover their own asses, since their poorly built boards were catching fire left and right. Until Z370 motherboards MSI has been building substandard motherboards (for over a decade), which in some cases haven't been anything short of a fire hazard.
Since Z370 motherboards MSI seem to have stop using those Niko-Semi fets, which caused most of the issues. Some of the lowest-end boards still utilize them, however mainstream and higher is using fets from reputable suppliers.

Take a look: http://www.overclock.net/t/1554307/guru3d-msi-releases-990fxa-gaming-with-usb-3-1/0_50

Godavari die has never been implemented in a mobile SKU, only desktop...

EDIT: Wrong link.
 
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I'm not sure why this thread became about Intel and/or AMD lying about TDP. At the very least, we don't have any evidence of that for RR. The 2500u is rated at 15W TDP with a 25W cTDP. Whether the cTDP modifier is active is up to the OEM, not AMD. And, the same issues (boosts, cTDP, ect.) complicate analysis of performance within a particular TDP for both Intel and AMD parts.

Something to keep in mind about the R15 scores for the 2500u, according to the NBcheck review they were rock steady at ~560-570 over many runs. The Intel 8250u and 8550u notebooks varied widely from 480 to 650, which huge differences over multiple runs. All in all, in makes it very difficult to compare the efficiency of the parts.
 
I also find interesting the difference when operating off the grid vs the battery. 3DMark Physics (CPU) scores differ 1.5 times: 8768/5837. 3DMark graphics scores differ only 2460/2063=~1.2x . And battery life on 'load' was 77 minutes- 55.8Wh/1.28h= 43.75W- almost the same as average power use (45.7W) when plugged in. This makes one question: does running off battery only limit maximum allowed clocks, but does not reduce power budget?
 
Abwx said:
Price
630 USD

Better CPU and iGPU perfs than anything Intel in this TDP class, the HDD can be swapped later at acceptable price...
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Read the review perhaps? Yes, the CPU appears to be potentially perfectly good, and hopefully some people will put it in worthwhile notebooks.

This notebook though? Its badly designed on a few grounds, and also the software/drivers they were testing with were clearly not remotely ready for prime time. Random crashes, lower gaming performance and goodness knows what else. No idea if that's down to HP or AMD but whoever it is they really, really need to fix it.
 
Qwertilot said:
Random crashes, lower gaming performance and goodness knows what else. No idea if that's down to HP or AMD but whoever it is they really, really need to fix it.
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Techreport said that the system is very stable, no crash, but true that they made a clean install of W10, perhaps that NBC should complain to HP instead of forever pointing AMD...

May i add that they ranked this laptop the same score as the sister model with a 2C/4T SKL despite this latter using the same screen, if not worse, as well as an HDD...

Edit : Depending of the bench NBC change the laptops that are used as comparison, FI the HP Spectre with the 8550U is a comparison in CB R15 ST but disppear in the MT test, instead they put the Xiaomi with the 8250U since it has the best KBL score, but still, they increase its score by 2pts while reducing the 2500U score by 5pts to get the former 2pts ahead, and then write that the 2500U is nearly as fast while it beats it hands down...
 
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Abwx said:
What about the i7 8700 TDP (and perfs...) delivered to the press :
https://www.computerbase.de/2017-11...00k-test-auto-oc-ddr4/#diagramm-cinebench-r15

And the one found in regular PCs :
https://www.computerbase.de/2017-12/medion-erazer-x67015-aldi-gaming-pc-test/2/

Back on topic RR does 450pts/CB R15 in a strict 15W TDP, KBL-U should be at 410pts, that s 10% better perf at isopower for RR, at isoperf the perf/watt advantage climb to 20%, that s of course for Cinebench R15.
Click to expand...
Are you going to buy a RR laptop to run cinebench? Check the PCMark performance for a better idea of a real world scenario, please. Unfortunately, you won't be too pleased with the results,
 
The Stilt said:
I've measured the power consumption of all CPUs AMD has released since Phenom, and none of the production parts have ever violated any of the specs.
Sometimes the specs / marketing is rather vague, since e.g. with FP4/FP5 mobile parts the maximum power consumption (which can be sustained for an electrically / thermally significant time period) is not clearly stated.
At least I haven't found any public release stating that 15W FP4/FP5 parts actually boost to 25W (or 12W to 20W, 25W to 42W and 35W to 42W), until the thermal conditions (ODM programmable) prevent doing so.
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I think we all know what he is doing here. His blatant anti-AMD crap is really just annoying and old.

Moderator edit:
Member callouts are not allowed per forum rules. -IEC
 
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neblogai said:
I also find interesting the difference when operating off the grid vs the battery. 3DMark Physics (CPU) scores differ 1.5 times: 8768/5837. 3DMark graphics scores differ only 2460/2063=~1.2x . And battery life on 'load' was 77 minutes- 55.8Wh/1.28h= 43.75W- almost the same as average power use (45.7W) when plugged in. This makes one question: does running off battery only limit maximum allowed clocks, but does not reduce power budget?
Click to expand...

I'm not at all a fan of power measurement tests on a notebook. Because battery life figures are often different. As a user you care about battery life, not how much power it uses.* They also have weird results where sometimes you see "Load Maximum" not being the highest figure. What the heck is up with that?

What you are asking depends on the implementation. You can hard cap the maximum clocks, or you can limit the power budget by using cTDP flavors. The latter wouldn't put a ceiling on the maximum clock, but due to TDP limit it wouldn't stay at that clock for long.

*As weird as it might sound to folks that are familiar with Desktops, power measurements don't reflect battery life because it measures instantaneous power consumption. Not only you have to average it out, but open up the laptop and connect the meter to the right circuitry to have power measurement be aligned with battery life numbers. Practically impossible.
 
The Stilt said:
MSI brought up the topic in attempt to cover their own asses, since their poorly built boards were catching fire left and right. Until Z370 motherboards MSI has been building substandard motherboards (for over a decade), which in some cases haven't been anything short of a fire hazard.
Since Z370 motherboards MSI seem to have stop using those Niko-Semi fets, which caused most of the issues. Some of the lowest-end boards still utilize them, however mainstream and higher is using fets from reputable suppliers.

Take a look: http://www.overclock.net/t/1547985/new-am3-motherboard-msi-970a-sli-krait-edition-with-usb-3-1/0_50
Click to expand...

Wait , did MSI use Niko-Semi fets on X370 MB?
 
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