8800GTX to be 30% faster than ATI's X1950XTX. GTS to be about equal to it.

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imported_wicka

Senior member
May 7, 2006
418
0
0
Originally posted by: redbox
Originally posted by: apoppin
i dunno . . . x1800 series could be considered a 'failure' ... it never overcame the late failed launch . . . ati's situation looked pretty grim until x1900 [which did have a decent launch].

looking back even further, the radeon 8500 never could overcome it's poor initial showing - even though it later managed to [nearly] catch up with the Ti series with improved drivers. . . . need i mention the DustBuster and it's failed launch and what it did for nvidia's credibility? :p

With R600 relatively near, ATi will release a lot of small details to help offset the "+30% performance lead" [evidently] held by g80 - as well as price drops to compete with the GTS . . . if G80 is PERCEIVED as disappointing or overpriced . . . then it WILLl 'hurt' nvidia's sales.

this launch is important . . . as noted by others . . . this "time to market" is especially important . . .

nvidia stands to gain or lose with g80 . . . more so than usual . . . it is a NextGen GPU on which many refreshes will likely be based . . . if G80 is flawed . . . bad news.

I hadn't thought about G80 being flawed and then having a whole bunch of refreshes based on that. While it sounds bad right away, it's not like those refreshes wouldn't or couldn't fix those problems. Look how far they have come with the G70. I think the biggest thing that people are overlooking including Gstanfor is the fact that we are all talking about the time to market on this G80. Gstanfor made the comment that developers will want to code with the newest card on the block for DX10. But won't ATI have the upper hand in this with the xbox360 already getting coded for by developers? Just something to think about I am not sure if that helps ATI or hurts them. The other thing I think that is going to affect the sells of G80 is the fact that just about everyone I talk to except a few on these forums are going to hold out untill R600 and then decide which one to get.

And therein lies my problem. I haven't upgraded my video card since I built it over a year ago, and with a few games coming out at the end of this year I can't really afford to wait for the R600 to make up my mind. I don't know how much the 8800GTS will cost but if it's like $500 it makes it even more of a difficult decision, because all in all that's really not a bad price considering the current prices of cards and the fact that it's brand new hardware. I could go ahead and buy a stop-gap card but then I don't really like the idea of spending $300+ on something I only plan on having a couple of months.
 

Smartazz

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
6,128
0
76
Originally posted by: wicka
Originally posted by: redbox
Originally posted by: apoppin
i dunno . . . x1800 series could be considered a 'failure' ... it never overcame the late failed launch . . . ati's situation looked pretty grim until x1900 [which did have a decent launch].

looking back even further, the radeon 8500 never could overcome it's poor initial showing - even though it later managed to [nearly] catch up with the Ti series with improved drivers. . . . need i mention the DustBuster and it's failed launch and what it did for nvidia's credibility? :p

With R600 relatively near, ATi will release a lot of small details to help offset the "+30% performance lead" [evidently] held by g80 - as well as price drops to compete with the GTS . . . if G80 is PERCEIVED as disappointing or overpriced . . . then it WILLl 'hurt' nvidia's sales.

this launch is important . . . as noted by others . . . this "time to market" is especially important . . .

nvidia stands to gain or lose with g80 . . . more so than usual . . . it is a NextGen GPU on which many refreshes will likely be based . . . if G80 is flawed . . . bad news.

I hadn't thought about G80 being flawed and then having a whole bunch of refreshes based on that. While it sounds bad right away, it's not like those refreshes wouldn't or couldn't fix those problems. Look how far they have come with the G70. I think the biggest thing that people are overlooking including Gstanfor is the fact that we are all talking about the time to market on this G80. Gstanfor made the comment that developers will want to code with the newest card on the block for DX10. But won't ATI have the upper hand in this with the xbox360 already getting coded for by developers? Just something to think about I am not sure if that helps ATI or hurts them. The other thing I think that is going to affect the sells of G80 is the fact that just about everyone I talk to except a few on these forums are going to hold out untill R600 and then decide which one to get.

And therein lies my problem. I haven't upgraded my video card since I built it over a year ago, and with a few games coming out at the end of this year I can't really afford to wait for the R600 to make up my mind. I don't know how much the 8800GTS will cost but if it's like $500 it makes it even more of a difficult decision, because all in all that's really not a bad price considering the current prices of cards and the fact that it's brand new hardware. I could go ahead and buy a stop-gap card but then I don't really like the idea of spending $300+ on something I only plan on having a couple of months.

I bought a 7900GT planning to wait 3 months until the 8800GTS/GTX. I'm regretting spending that much on a temporary card, I should have bought the 7600GT instead, but it's too late now.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: Gstanfor
Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: Gstanfor
Actually this will be the only the second time since R200 that nvidia has managed to launch ahead of ATi in recent years. ATi's slipping release dates allowing nvidia to take the launch lead may end proving extremely costly to them. It was a very large levelling factor ATi had going for it while it lasted.

You can rest assured that nvidia finding themselves in this happy situation was no accident either.
RECENT years? :p

the rivalry between ATI and nVidia has take place ALL in "recent years"

Your History is plainly wrong . . . unlike you - which flatters me by posting mini errors i make in YOUR sig - you are NOT important enough for ANYone to make a sig of your errors . . . nor is there enough room in PAGEs of signatures to put 1/4 of the misleading statements, fud, hate, personal attacks, misquotes, childish name calling and outright lies you continually spew
:thumbsdown:

letsee radeon 8500 was 6 months after the GF3 release . . then GF4 Ti was out next . . . THEN r300 [ahead of nvidia]. . . then x800 [a refresh] . . . and x1800 was 6 months late :p

and YOu are ASSuming that g80 will be perceived a "success"
:Q

if g80 is a 'failure' or 'neutral' than ati finds themselves in a happy situation . . . that may be no accident . . . either ;)

:)

I KNOW its difficult for you to think straight Batshit, but please try... What is R200 the code name for? What did that chip compete againgst when it first came out? I consider anything within the last 6 years to be recent.

you don't mind if i call you brain-damaged?

who really cares "what you consider" . . .

i gave my view, braindead

:D
 

Gstanfor

Banned
Oct 19, 1999
3,307
0
0
Originally posted by: josh6079
I KNOW its difficult for you to think straight Batshit, but please try...
Dude, wtf? Why are you so obessed with that? Back away from the dead horse...

Sure, just as soon as he stops insulting me, I'll stop insulting him. Simple really.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: Gstanfor
Originally posted by: josh6079
I KNOW its difficult for you to think straight Batshit, but please try...
Dude, wtf? Why are you so obessed with that? Back away from the dead horse...

Sure, just as soon as he stops insulting me, I'll stop insulting him. Simple really.

you're the jackass that started the name-calling . . . no one else follows me from thread to thread solely for the purpose of twisting my posts and insulting me
:thumbsdown:
 

josh6079

Diamond Member
Mar 17, 2006
3,261
0
0
Originally posted by: Gstanfor
Originally posted by: josh6079
I KNOW its difficult for you to think straight Batshit, but please try...
Dude, wtf? Why are you so obessed with that? Back away from the dead horse...

Sure, just as soon as he stops insulting me, I'll stop insulting him. Simple really.

What are you talking about? You started hopping on the fanatic tangent with your second post:
In case you had not noticed (possibly due to you rose tinted sunnies)...
Since then you've "progressed" from color-coded fanatic implications to "batshit." Wow, real mature....I can definatly tell you're the bigger person....

apoppin, we know NV30 was a flop. Thankyou for enlightening us. Can we move on now?

What exactly is the purpose of the Sound Storm II? Is it like an X-fi on the video card or what?
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: josh6079

apoppin, we know NV30 was a flop. Thankyou for enlightening us. Can we move on now?

my posts about NV30 are in direct response to questions and comments by others . . .

. . . and you're very welcome

i thought everyone already knew . . . by now :p
:Q

:D
 

Paratus

Lifer
Jun 4, 2004
17,535
15,602
146
Soundstorm was a highly regarded onboard sound solution for Nforce 2 mobos.

I believe it's still considered better than any of the current onboard HD solutions.

Brain Damaged should be able to tell us more about it. :p
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Soundstorm was and still is the only onboard sound to fully support hardware accelrated 3d audio. Best onboard sound solution ever..made back when NV was trying to crack AMD chipset market. I don't know what this has to do with graphics cards though.
 

josh6079

Diamond Member
Mar 17, 2006
3,261
0
0
Originally posted by: Zebo
Soundstorm was and still is the only onboard sound to fully support hardware accelrated 3d audio. Best onboard sound solution ever..made back when NV was trying to crack AMD chipset market. I don't know what this has to do with graphics cards though.

Word is, it (meaning Sound Storm II) might be the mystery chip on the G80.
 

Keysplayr

Elite Member
Jan 16, 2003
21,211
50
91
Originally posted by: wicka
Threads like this make me wonder why the "arguing on the internet..." pic has met its de facto retirement...


They just need to get in better control of their egos. Not an easy task, believe me. ;)
 

Paratus

Lifer
Jun 4, 2004
17,535
15,602
146
While a 16X PCIe slot should have more than enought bandwith I'd have to think we'd be seeing some slow downs on 8x slots if the 8800GTX is requesting Video, Sound, and Physics data from the CPU. Not to mention texture thrashing to the system ram. (Although with 640-768mb this shouldn't be a problem)


I just can't see them providing a sound solution - it make much more sense to stick it on the Nforce mobos.
 

Gstanfor

Banned
Oct 19, 1999
3,307
0
0
3D sound acceleration is all about crunching numbers - something a modern GPU is exceptionally good at doing. Thats what the original SoundStorm did too. The actual outputting of sound is left to discrete PHY audio chips on the motherboard.
 

Paratus

Lifer
Jun 4, 2004
17,535
15,602
146
They must be awfully sure of their performance if they are wasting board space for something that doesn't improve IQ or FPS. Plus now they're writing new drivers & competing with creative
 

josh6079

Diamond Member
Mar 17, 2006
3,261
0
0
Maybe. I don't think it's been confirmed at all if that mystery chip is a Sound Storm II one.

We'll just have to wait and see.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: Paratus
They must be awfully sure of their performance if they are wasting board space for something that doesn't improve IQ or FPS. Plus now they're writing new drivers & competing with creative
you mean "committing" board space. :p

hold on a second . . .


we still don't know what the "mystery" chip is . . . for sure ;)

it may not be a sound chip at all
:Q
 

Gstanfor

Banned
Oct 19, 1999
3,307
0
0
It's highly unlikely to have only one purpose. That would be contrary to the direction this generation is headed towards.
 

Cookie Monster

Diamond Member
May 7, 2005
5,161
32
86
Sound Storm 2 would be better off on nforce mobos, but it would still be awesome if your graphics card comes with Xi Fi capabailities/audio qualities that rival creative. 8600GT +Soundstorm 2 could be one hell of a mid range card, not to mention the enormous amount of potential marketing BS that could be used by the nVIDIA marketing department.

It could be a dedicated PPU, but it would simply be a waste. They could use their older cards to act as PPUs, unless this doesnt work. I think nVIDIA's quantum physics effects is nVIDIAs own physics API (something that couldve been done with Havok).

Another potential could be HDCP, Sli composition engine, or pure video HD.

Im thinking HDCP/soundstorm 2.

edit - im noticing that the GTX has 12 memory chips, same as the GTX!

What does this tell you? is the GTS going to be 384bit? if the memory chips are different, then 2 memory controllers are needed.
 

Cookie Monster

Diamond Member
May 7, 2005
5,161
32
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From the user razor1, whos under NDA, he seems to hint several things.

-All the rumours are based on one leak.
-The rumoured specs have several holes in them. (due to being based on the one leak, some sites have made up the rest of the specs)
LOL was trying to get some smiles into my post with the edit but couldn't ! wierd. Anyways, was just ribbing ya a little too They will end up faster, alot faster then 80%. If you think the AA and AF performance of the r580 was good, just wait and see , I wouldn't be suprised if we see x8 aa and x16 af with very ittle penelties on both the g80 and r600.

Just food for thought. We could be in for a big surprise. :D
 

Gstanfor

Banned
Oct 19, 1999
3,307
0
0
A figure of 80% faster could definitely cause me to not bother waiting for the refresh before buying. Mind you, assuming thats 80% faster in 3dmark we still have to see what that translates to in actual games - not that performance is the only thing G80 will have going for it.