5 steps to fix black society

[nehalem256]

actually in IL More is spent on students in Chicago (even the poor districts) then in nearly every country school.

http://sbronars.wordpress.com/2012/09/11/throwing-money-at-the-chicago-public-schools/

the Chicago public schools spent $12,193 per student in 2011'



We received a spreadsheet on how much is spent on each kid at the school they go to. It was under 10k. i do not remember the exact number.

Yet that school has a far higher graduation rate.


but those numbers really don't matter. very little of that is actually spent on the child. what is killing education is bureaucracy. How much of the money going to education is getting eaten up by administration cost? This is the killer in many school districts.

Maybe if they spent less money on crap like this:

http://www.psdschools.org/school-resources/student-services/equity-and-diversity

Schools could hire more teachers?

 

[berzerker60]

Well I for one am glad we have all you white heroes to step in and teach the blacks how to live. There's a real burden, a white man's burden if you will, to being so advanced and civilized, and that includes benevolently managing lesser races' lives for them. Congratulations on your clarity of vision and purpose!

 

[rudder]

This is better:

2) Increase funding for Inner City Schools
No need for any more.

The problems go a little deeper than simply money. You could have a nice, new, beautiful school in the inner city along with the state's top teachers... and you will still have lots of kids with no direction, no respect, no work ethic to take advantage of that increased funding.

 

[Doppel]

First, time-warping is making this thread nigh-impossible to work with.

Come on - at least do some research before you reach a conclusion. Just because you have anecdotal evidence that schools in your area get the same amount of money and that relative funding isn't a problem doesn't mean thats the case for everywhere. A large number of states rely on property taxes to fund education which has caused significant differences in funding between low income and high income area schools:

My area relies on property taxes for school funding (some of it), but I assume the difference is filled in via state funding. I am not relying on anecdotes. I have seen numbers that state exactly what local school districts receive in funding, along with the success of these areas. If I'm not mistaken the inner city here actually receives a hair more than some of the best suburbs--it's definitely as much, in any case. My property taxes come nowhere near the amount the schools use per student anyway.

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/wherewestand...r-schools/197/

This article has virtually no numbers and thus I can conclude absolutely nothing from it.

IIRC the shittiest school systems in the country have something like $6-8k per student, with better ones into the teens. A family of three is thus costing $24k-32k/year. Very few people pay that amount in property taxes. It's no surprise that many private schools spend less per student than the state and yes achieve better. Rich kids are smarter than poor, on the whole, but most of their success in school is because they are pushed and expectations exist.

Well I for one am glad we have all you white heroes to step in and teach the blacks how to live. There's a real burden, a white man's burden if you will, to being so advanced and civilized, and that includes benevolently managing lesser races' lives for them. Congratulations on your clarity of vision and purpose!

This kind of low-brow response is why white people tend not to discuss racial issues, because of responses like yours. However, you'll note Bill Cosby above (along with many blacks) have said the same thing.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/bestoftv/2013/07/27/nr-lemon-no-talking-points.cnn.html

5. pull up your pants
4. stop using the N-word
3. respect your communities; stop littering in your communities
2. finish school/stop shaming other blacks for acting white
1. stop having kids out of wedlock

really don't care about 3-5 as it's irrelevant and I don't see them making a big difference, IMO.
the first two however, would break the cycle within a generation.

#3 I can't stand. Everytime I see a cigg flicked out of car makes me want to punch them in the face and put one out on their neck.

Glass bottles I see too on the side of the street, would love to smash those and give it back to them.

 

[glenn1]

Well I for one am glad we have all you white heroes to step in and teach the blacks how to live. There's a real burden, a white man's burden if you will, to being so advanced and civilized, and that includes benevolently managing lesser races' lives for them. Congratulations on your clarity of vision and purpose!

Actually not "benevolently managing" is exactly how many whites would prefer to do things. However we're being undermined by progressives who can't seem to keep their hands off and keep on trying to improve blacks by ever increasing welfare and social spending, affirmative action programs, and countless other interventions.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

This is a problem that cannot be solved by the white community. It needs those within the black community that earn their living from stoking the racial divide to understand the advantage of putting themselves out of business. Should that miracle occur, it will still take a minimum of three generations to see any meaningful results.

Our culture has redefined the family. A mother, a father and their children all living under the same roof is passé. Single mothers, two mothers, two daddies, children who a parent decides at the age of three is living inside the body of the wrong gender, etc. The breakdown of the family is colorblind. The breakdown of the family is the root of the problem.

We'll reap what we've sown. Don't expect things to get better anytime soon.

Slightly off-topic but what would you say on this topic in regards to white people? It has become the norm to work SO hard that many white families hardly know their children. Hell, the kids spend more time at the daily daycare then with their mom/dad. Wake up. Drop kid off. Go to work. Pick kid up. Have dinner. Go to sleep.

In addition, with work becoming the norm there was a negative amount of new whites born last year. Yes, negative. More whites died than were born. I know plenty of people that decided to actually get their tubes tied because they finally simply decided: They don't want the burden of children on their daily work life. Simply curious on everyone's thoughts on that.

 

[piasabird]

The New Unlcle Toms.

Try this: "Act and talk like you are an intelligent human being and maybe you will be treated that way!"

 

[Sea Ray]

Well I for one am glad we have all you white heroes to step in and teach the blacks how to live. There's a real burden, a white man's burden if you will, to being so advanced and civilized, and that includes benevolently managing lesser races' lives for them. Congratulations on your clarity of vision and purpose!

Well powerful folks like Obama, Holder, Jesse Jackson, Oprah and Sharpton haven't fixed it so whites have decided to give it a try. If they didn't the black folks would claim that whites don't care about them and are guilty of ignoring their needs. Go whine about whites butting in after you show that black leaders are successful in fixing this

 

[berzerker60]

This kind of low-brow response is why white people tend not to discuss racial issues, because of responses like yours. However, you'll note Bill Cosby above (along with many blacks) have said the same thing.

Good.

Since the beginning of this country, whites have infantilized and patronized blacks, including keeping them in slavery 'for their own good' because, the argument went, they weren't capable of taking care of themselves and were just brute savages. Then came eugenics, during which thousands of people were sterilized against their will 'for their own good,' because white people just knew better. Meanwhile, the US was brutally suppressing freedom fighters who wanted independence in the Philippines and other locations that the US had taken over as part of the international structure of imperialism wherein European and American whites ruled the world with incredible violence in the name of the 'white man's burden' to 'uplift' the other races who couldn't take care of themselves (but really mostly for money and power). American Indian children were taken from their homes and forced to attend boarding schools where they could be taught good 'American' (read: white) values and customs, part of a centuries long campaign to destroy Native American culture 'for their own good.'

Whatever your motives today, you're coming off of centuries of white people bossing everyone else in the world around 'for their own good,' while royally screwing up most everything. You can't just ignore that and go around preaching about how black people should act 'better.' You might even be right, but there's 0% chance anyone's going to listen to you, and it just perpetuates the structure of white people telling everyone else to act more like themselves.

All of this also needing a hearty dose of 'poor blacks' are not a unified block and don't act in any one particular way, they're as diverse and complicated a set of people as any other. Poor blacks don't act differently from poor whites, though some poor black in some areas act differently from some poor white people in others.

 

[Doppel]

Since the beginning of this country, whites have infantilized and patronized blacks

Yes, and the left still supports it. You seem to condemn infantalizing them but at the same time criticize people who tell blacks to try harder and stop playing the victim card. So, which one do you prefer? I agree entirely with what Bill Cosby said above, it is a stark antithesis of infantalizing blacks. Instead it places an increased burden on them for their own success.

Poor blacks do act differently than poor whites, as to rich blacks vs rich whites as do rich whites vs rich asians or poor east indians vs poor native americans. Each group has their own subculture, which influence their behavior.

You are probably right about 0% chance anyone's going to listen, or close to it. It's why most whites just ignore the issue and instead prefer to reference blacks who say the same thing, because at least then the "you're a racist" can't be used to immediately discredit their argument.

 

[cubby1223]

Since the beginning of this country, whites have infantilized and patronized blacks, including keeping them in slavery 'for their own good' because, the argument went, they weren't capable of taking care of themselves and were just brute savages.

Hmmm, does this mean we need to end welfare, end food stamps, end obamacare, end all the other free handouts from the government because it's continuing the stereotype that they are are not capable of taking care of themselves?

Last time I checked, black leaders vilified that as racist too.

Black leaders have declared racism to be anything and everything that causes the black community not to be on par with the white community. Therefore it is deeply racist to *not* tell black people how to better themselves. And at the same time deeply racist to tell them.

Do you not see the clusterfuck that has emerged?

In fact, according to the definition from black leaders, saggy pants are racist. Why are we not allowed to condemn racism when we see it? Being silent while racism is happening is also a form of racism.

 

[HendrixFan]

What statistics are those exactly? And how do those statistics compare to other groups who arrived and moved on but however faced similar hurdles? You do also realize that at one time in this nation there were periods where blacks had a significantly lower rate of single mother headed house holds, lower rate of black on black violence, greater rates of business creation etc? What changed between the past (where racism was more prevalent and accepted) and today?

That poverty is the biggest indicator of the issues described. Race is an issue for many things, but it mostly is a matter of race and poverty being intertwined. Do you think we see more teen pregnancies from 3rd, 4th or 5th quintile black families or from 1st or 2nd quintile white families? The real deciding factor is income level.

Because minorities and especially blacks make up a larger percentage of lower income levels than upper income levels the issues that are consistently problematic across all races in lower income levels are attributed to being a black issue.

The shrinking middle class and concentration of wealth have pushed those in the lower quintiles into dire situations over the last 40 years. That combined with the staggering lack of class mobility we have (we are in line with most 3rd world countries) has created a whirlpool that poor minorities are stuck in.

I agree with your post above about welfare (in all forms including EIC) working to perpetuate the cycle. I disagree with any notion (not stated by you but others in this thread) that welfare is a left issue and the right opposed it. The right knows that welfare helps contain the quintiles and allows for greater concentration of wealth. The best part for them is they get to use it as a talking point and political capital to help win elections all while reaping the benefit for their voting block.

I'm not for complete elimination of welfare in all forms, but drastic scaling back is needed as is a process to get people to work and off welfare. It should be something similar to what Clinton had going on in the late 90s when welfare reform targeted putting people to work. Welfare rolls were the lowest in 30 years by the time he left office while median household income for black families had climbed at a greater rate than any other group during his 8 years.

 

[berzerker60]

Poor blacks do act differently than poor whites, as to rich blacks vs rich whites as do rich whites vs rich asians or poor east indians vs poor native americans. Each group has their own subculture, which influence their behavior.

No, they don't. This is a racist statement. This right here. Racism isn't just disliking people because of their skin color, it's attributing characteristics to people because of their race. People don't act one way or another because of their race. Culture is absolutely not split along racial lines into races having "their own subculture." Within racial and economic groups there exist cultures that are sometimes predominately connected to a particular race, but to take the stereotypical example of "inner city thug culture," there are plenty of white, latino, and asian inner-city thugs who listen to rap music and like flashy displays of wealth. Jazz used to be considered "negro music," now it's listened to mostly by upper-class whites but is also listened to all over the world by all sorts of people. There are black, white, asian, latino, etc. members of hipster culture. There are black, white, asian, latino, etc. members of wealthy high-capitalist culture. There are black, white, asian, latino, etc. members of just about every culture that isn't explicitly defined along racist terms (there probably aren't any black members of Southern racist Klan culture, though who knows). You're just wrong about this.

 

[Exterous]

A five year old article based on data from three years prior to that is not research. I doubt that it's even relevant now.

A 5 second google search tells you otherwise:
http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/20120131arizona-school-funding-gap-grows.html
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2011-11-07/news/ct-met-school-funding-gaps-20111107_1_spending-gap-taft-s-district-poorest-schools
http://schoolsofthought.blogs.cnn.com/2013/02/19/report-to-close-achievement-gap-fund-schools-by-need-not-zip-code/
http://www2.ed.gov/about/bdscomm/list/eec/equity-excellence-commission-report.pdf

My area relies on property taxes for school funding (some of it), but I assume the difference is filled in via state funding. I am not relying on anecdotes.

Anechdotes or not you are still making broad and incorrect statements about the country's problem as a whole based on your limited knowledge that is confined to your area. Funding levels are a problem in a number of states/city areas

This article has virtually no numbers and thus I can conclude absolutely nothing from it.

As opposed to your sources for your statements?

 

[Atreus21]

This is better:

1) End the War on Drugs
2) Increase funding for Inner City Schools
No need for any more.

 

[Doppel]

No, they don't. This is a racist statement. This right here. Racism isn't just disliking people because of their skin color, it's attributing characteristics to people because of their race. People don't act one way or another because of their race. Culture is absolutely not split along racial lines into races having "their own subculture." Within racial and economic groups there exist cultures that are sometimes predominately connected to a particular race, but to take the stereotypical example of "inner city thug culture," there are plenty of white, latino, and asian inner-city thugs who listen to rap music and like flashy displays of wealth. Jazz used to be considered "negro music," now it's listened to mostly by upper-class whites but is also listened to all over the world by all sorts of people. There are black, white, asian, latino, etc. members of hipster culture. There are black, white, asian, latino, etc. members of wealthy high-capitalist culture. There are black, white, asian, latino, etc. members of just about every culture that isn't explicitly defined along racist terms (there probably aren't any black members of Southern racist Klan culture, though who knows). You're just wrong about this.

You speak as if culture and race are unrelated, when of course they are not. Obviously people associate with their race, and they thus associate with things that are commonly associated with race. Thus it is oversimplifying to disregard the huge correlation between race and culture as not at all caused and perpetuated by association with race. If a black tells another black he's "acting white", their race association cements their cultural association, just as a white telling another white he's "acting black" does the same.

Anechdotes or not you are still making broad and incorrect statements about the country's problem as a whole based on your limited knowledge that is confined to your area. Funding levels are a problem in a number of states/city areas

OK, have it your way. In my large city spending is not at all a problem between inner city and suburbs.

 

[mizzou]

Poverty IS the culture. If anyone says it's a black thing or mostly a black thing, it's wrong.

Why?

Go to any poor area that is riddled with families on welfare, white or black, it's the same thing. People talk the same and act the same.

This welfare culture which has come out of poverty, is holding everyone back, but moreso the black population because the black population is overwhelmingly concentrated in poor areas when compared to other races.

 

[sandorski]

The drug war needs to be changed, but funding for inner city schools is not the problem. I live in the suburbs and kids here get exactly the same amount of money at the public school as inner city, but they graduate high school at a 95%+ rate instead of half that because their parents are around and somebody gives a shit. You cannot fund train wreck kids from train wreck households into graduating or caring.I know you keep stressing this emphatically, lest any criticism is made of race, but there are definitely characteristics of ultra poor blacks that are different than ultra poor whites.

Concentration of their population and the War on Drugs.

 

[Atreus21]

No, they don't. This is a racist statement. This right here. Racism isn't just disliking people because of their skin color, it's attributing characteristics to people because of their race. People don't act one way or another because of their race. Culture is absolutely not split along racial lines into races having "their own subculture." Within racial and economic groups there exist cultures that are sometimes predominately connected to a particular race, but to take the stereotypical example of "inner city thug culture," there are plenty of white, latino, and asian inner-city thugs who listen to rap music and like flashy displays of wealth. Jazz used to be considered "negro music," now it's listened to mostly by upper-class whites but is also listened to all over the world by all sorts of people. There are black, white, asian, latino, etc. members of hipster culture. There are black, white, asian, latino, etc. members of wealthy high-capitalist culture. There are black, white, asian, latino, etc. members of just about every culture that isn't explicitly defined along racist terms (there probably aren't any black members of Southern racist Klan culture, though who knows). You're just wrong about this.

I don't think he's wrong. Whether it's racist or not, making a general claim that races tend to have their own subculture is not inaccurate. Of course there are exceptions, but would anyone disagree that rap is listened to disproportionately by blacks? Or j-pop listened to disproportionately by asians?

Everyone is equal in their claim to justice. But to go beyond that and claim that all races are fundamentally indistinguishable based on their customs and culture is silly.

 

[nehalem256]

That poverty is the biggest indicator of the issues described. Race is an issue for many things, but it mostly is a matter of race and poverty being intertwined. Do you think we see more teen pregnancies from 3rd, 4th or 5th quintile black families or from 1st or 2nd quintile white families? The real deciding factor is income level.

Because minorities and especially blacks make up a larger percentage of lower income levels than upper income levels the issues that are consistently problematic across all races in lower income levels are attributed to being a black issue.

The shrinking middle class and concentration of wealth have pushed those in the lower quintiles into dire situations over the last 40 years. That combined with the staggering lack of class mobility we have (we are in line with most 3rd world countries) has created a whirlpool that poor minorities are stuck in.

Single motherhood is not caused is not caused by poverty. If it was we should see more unwed motherhood in the past than now. If it was we should see 3rd world countries having higher levels of it than we do in poor American blacks.

Single motherhood is the single largest predictor of class immobility.

 

[justoh]

No, they don't. This is a racist statement. This right here. Racism isn't just disliking people because of their skin color, it's attributing characteristics to people because of their race. People don't act one way or another because of their race. Culture is absolutely not split along racial lines into races having "their own subculture." Within racial and economic groups there exist cultures that are sometimes predominately connected to a particular race, but to take the stereotypical example of "inner city thug culture," there are plenty of white, latino, and asian inner-city thugs who listen to rap music and like flashy displays of wealth. Jazz used to be considered "negro music," now it's listened to mostly by upper-class whites but is also listened to all over the world by all sorts of people. There are black, white, asian, latino, etc. members of hipster culture. There are black, white, asian, latino, etc. members of wealthy high-capitalist culture. There are black, white, asian, latino, etc. members of just about every culture that isn't explicitly defined along racist terms (there probably aren't any black members of Southern racist Klan culture, though who knows). You're just wrong about this.

Your statement is compatible with the sensible dictionary definition that it's "a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement."

I don't know how racist these people are, since few at least explicitly are stating that their "problem" is inherent, and if it was then it would be difficult to call for them to change. It could still be racist if they think that because of their race they're in a default state of being a problem, but only then, which isn't what everyone is saying.

People are now using "racist" to refer to someone they think lacks a certain level of empathy. Incorporated into this label are judgments about the person's level of intelligence and education. Many think "if only they understood more about history and political philosophy." You seem to be one of these people.

Anyway, it's counterproductive to call this lack of empathy racism, if that's what it is, since a lot of people get upset over shit easily, and then they aren't likely to listen to why you think they don't understand black people. Plus, really, wtf is wrong with them anyway? Where he at? That sentence doesn't even contain a fucking verb. That's right. A verb is a doing word, and they be doing nuttin.

 

[blankslate]

Bill Cosby had some great things to say about this: ‘They’re standing on the corner talking and they can’t speak English.’ I can’t even talk the way these people talk:
Why you ain’t?
Where you is?
What he drive?
Where he stay?
Who you be…?

This is better:
1) End the War on Drugs
2) Increase funding for Inner City Schools

No need for any more.

Bill Cosby is makes very good points with his "tough love" parents aren't taking enough interest in raising their children properly but it's not limited to any particular section of society

However it is aggravated by the devastating effect that the war on drugs has had on society (non-violent drug offenders who have gotten longer sentences than people who have committed violent crimes for example)

As for schools no just throwing money at them isn't a solution, however it's probably the case that inner city schools are indeed underfunded.

So the solution isn't easy but getting the parents of the school age children more involved with well considered increases in funding for certain school programs should be considered imo.

A big factor that hasn't been mentioned and probably will be ridiculed or outright ignored because of some readers' wordviews is this

TED - Richard Wilkinson: How economic inequality harms societies

^Data points presented show that unequal countries (those with greater income inequality within their borders) are more likely to have more issues with a number of societal ills including teenage pregnancy, violence, instances of mental illness, school drop out rates, and people in prison per capita...



-----

 

[woolfe9998]

I'm firmly convinced that there isn't much that "white people" or the government can do. Ending the war on drugs is an exception. Without drug dealing as an alternative form of "employment," it might encourage black youth to stick with education and legitimate employment pursuits. Particularly young black males.

 

[cubby1223]

This is a racist statement.

Fuck you.

All we hear from "the black community" is they want action, they want solutions to the problems in their community. If "the white community" ignores "the black community" then they are racist. If "the white community" tries anything people like you label it as racist.

Try doing something useful with your life instead of sitting on the sidelines shouting "racist" at everyone.