20,000 Cameras To Be Installed In UK Homes...

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
I dunno, I've seen some pretty jacked up families, it's difficult to prove abuse sometimes, and this would protect the children.

And monitoring us all with biometric sensors to detect when we show the signs of anger and then sending police would protect us all.

In fact if we were all fitted with transmitters they could record those signs along with every word we say and transmit those to a digital repository and we could eliminate 99% of all illegal activity.

Is that something you might be interested in?

 

[JS80]

It's like V for Vendetta

 

[Pliablemoose]

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
I dunno, I've seen some pretty jacked up families, it's difficult to prove abuse sometimes, and this would protect the children.

And monitoring us all with biometric sensors to detect when we show the signs of anger and then sending police would protect us all.

In fact if we were all fitted with transmitters they could record those signs along with every word we say and transmit those to a digital repository and we could eliminate 99% of all illegal activity.

Is that something you might be interested in?

I fail to see how monitoring families suspected of abuse to protect the most vulnerable members of society is a bad thing.

I feel pretty strongly that all nursing homes should be monitored 24/7 and the feeds in a resident's room be available to the patient's families too.

The elderly and children are our most at risk of abuse in society, and a society should be judged on how it cares for it's most vulnerable members.

We already have quite a bit of monitoring in the US, I don't have a problem with this either.

Video monitoring equipment to monitor a suspected abusive family $5k

Catching a child rapist or abuser? Priceless.

Ever see shitty parenting in public? You should see what happens behind closed doors...

On a personal level, I came home from work early once & caught my daughter less than 1 year old in a tub of water up to her chest, in the upstairs bathroom. the soon to be ex was downstairs, watching TV.

Think I could use that in court to get custody? Guess again. Were it on tape, there's be no wiggle room.

 

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
I dunno, I've seen some pretty jacked up families, it's difficult to prove abuse sometimes, and this would protect the children.

And monitoring us all with biometric sensors to detect when we show the signs of anger and then sending police would protect us all.

In fact if we were all fitted with transmitters they could record those signs along with every word we say and transmit those to a digital repository and we could eliminate 99% of all illegal activity.

Is that something you might be interested in?

I fail to see how monitoring families suspected of abuse to protect the most vulnerable members of society is a bad thing.

I feel pretty strongly that all nursing homes should be monitored 24/7 and the feeds in a resident's room be available to the patient's families too.

The elderly and children are our most at risk of abuse in society, and a society should be judged on how it cares for it's most vulnerable members.

We already have quite a bit of monitoring in the US, I don't have a problem with this either.

Video monitoring equipment to monitor a suspected abusive family $5k

Catching a child rapist or abuser? Priceless.

Still, do you think monitoring of all would be appropriate then as outlined in my conditions above?

 

[Pliablemoose]

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Still, do you think monitoring of all would be appropriate then as outlined in my conditions above?

We're (I'm) not talking about that, you are.

The cameras already in place in the US (atm's, security cams from private stores, tollway cameras, etc) are already used widely to prove guilt or innocence.

Grow up.

 

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Still, do you think monitoring of all would be appropriate then as outlined in my conditions above?

We're (I'm) not talking about that, you are.

The cameras already in place in the US (atm's, security cams from private stores, tollway cameras, etc) are already used widely to prove guilt or innocence.

Grow up.

So to grow up I have to allow the government to monitor me at their whim?

No thanks.

Didn't think you'd get so defensive Pliablemoose, I'm just outlining the "protect society" scenario to a slightly more fleshed out point.

 

[f95toli]

Originally posted by: TruePaige
about the above but honestly, orphanages aren't the best places in the world.

Besides, that is another slippery slope of "How good do you have to be to keep your kids?". If that mentality goes to far the state will raising huge chunks of children.

Eh?
You DO realize that the state is raising a lot of children, don't you?
There are over 500 000 kids in foster care in the US.

The main problem here in the UK is that social services tend to wait far too long before children are separated from abusive parents and -as a number of recent high-profile cases has shown- this sometimes indirectly leads to children being murdered.

If these families were living in the US (or another European county) they would almost certainly have lost custody of their children a long time ago.

Now, I am not sure cameras in the home (homes which btw the families in question almost certainly do not own; they are living in flats paid for by social services) is a good idea; it might be worth a try if it protects the kids but in most cases foster care would be a better solution.

 

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: f95toli

Originally posted by: TruePaige
about the above but honestly, orphanages aren't the best places in the world.

Besides, that is another slippery slope of "How good do you have to be to keep your kids?". If that mentality goes to far the state will raising huge chunks of children.

Eh?
You DO realize that the state is raising a lot of children, don't you?
There are over 500 000 kids in foster care in the US.

The main problem here in the UK is that social services tend to wait far too long before children are separated from abusive parents and -as a number of recent high-profile cases has shown- this sometimes indirectly leads to children being murdered.

If these families were living in the US (or another European county) they would almost certainly have lost custody of their children a long time ago.

Now, I am not sure cameras in the home (homes which btw the families in question almost certainly do not own; they are living in flats paid for by social services) is a good idea; it might be worth a try if it protects the kids but in most cases foster care would be a better solution.

I'm not arguing that these families aren't bad families, but I think the ease at which the government has the ability to force cameras into homes is scary, and that it is a slippery slope.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Still, do you think monitoring of all would be appropriate then as outlined in my conditions above?

We're (I'm) not talking about that, you are.

The cameras already in place in the US (atm's, security cams from private stores, tollway cameras, etc) are already used widely to prove guilt or innocence.

Grow up.

So to grow up I have to allow the government to monitor me at their whim?

No thanks.

Didn't think you'd get so defensive Pliablemoose, I'm just outlining the "protect society" scenario to a slightly more fleshed out point.

If you mean take an argument to an unrealistic & moronic extreme that doesn't even bear consideration, yeah, you're 100% right, I'm not in favor of biometric monitoring of every person in the US.

It's a stupid point, and has nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Of course I was immunized against smallpox, and am likely monitored by primitive nanites already so my judgment is suspect. and I'm afraid to say what I really think because of the thought police.

Got any tape? My tinfoil hat is coming off. I'm not defensive, I just think you argument is moronic.

 

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Still, do you think monitoring of all would be appropriate then as outlined in my conditions above?

We're (I'm) not talking about that, you are.

The cameras already in place in the US (atm's, security cams from private stores, tollway cameras, etc) are already used widely to prove guilt or innocence.

Grow up.

So to grow up I have to allow the government to monitor me at their whim?

No thanks.

Didn't think you'd get so defensive Pliablemoose, I'm just outlining the "protect society" scenario to a slightly more fleshed out point.

If you mean take an argument to an unrealistic & moronic extreme that doesn't even bear consideration, yeah, you're 100% right, I'm not in favor of biometric monitoring of every person in the US.

It's a stupid point, and has nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Of course I was immunized against smallpox, and am likely monitored by primitive nanites already so my judgment is suspect. and I'm afraid to say what I really think because of the thought police.

Got any tape? My tinfoil hat is coming off. I'm not defensive, I just think you argument is moronic.

Seriously? I'm not saying it will happen tomorrow, but if this is happening today, what is to say 20 years down the line if we don't at least start protecting our rights now they won't be near non-existent by then?

I don't think anyone is going to mention any robots or crazy sci-fi concotions but it isn't hard to rig up a low powered transmitter to monitor heart rate/blood pressure and have audio. Cross reference that with CCTV footage for a pretty damn accurate monitoring situation.

It isn't anywhere near some kind of sci-fi scenario and I am not against anything like shots, etc...

Just pointing out a fairly easy implementation that could become reality in the future.

1984 was fiction at a time..but this news story is literally off the first few pages.

Honestly I think there is more of a chance of cameras everywhere than anything else. They are stationary, constant monitoring devices. Just was addressing your protect the masses reasoning.

 

[feralkid]

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Still, do you think monitoring of all would be appropriate then as outlined in my conditions above?

We're (I'm) not talking about that, you are.

The cameras already in place in the US (atm's, security cams from private stores, tollway cameras, etc) are already used widely to prove guilt or innocence.

Grow up.

So to grow up I have to allow the government to monitor me at their whim?

No thanks.

Didn't think you'd get so defensive Pliablemoose, I'm just outlining the "protect society" scenario to a slightly more fleshed out point.

If you mean take an argument to an unrealistic & moronic extreme that doesn't even bear consideration, yeah, you're 100% right, I'm not in favor of biometric monitoring of every person in the US.

It's a stupid point, and has nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Of course I was immunized against smallpox, and am likely monitored by primitive nanites already so my judgment is suspect. and I'm afraid to say what I really think because of the thought police.

Got any tape? My tinfoil hat is coming off. I'm not defensive, I just think you argument is moronic.

Seriously? I'm not saying it will happen tomorrow, but if this is happening today, what is to say 20 years down the line if we don't at least start protecting our rights now they won't be near non-existent by then?

I don't think anyone is going to mention any robots or crazy sci-fi concotions but it isn't hard to rig up a low powered transmitter to monitor heart rate/blood pressure and have audio. Cross reference that with CCTV footage for a pretty damn accurate monitoring situation.

It isn't anywhere near some kind of sci-fi scenario and I am not against anything like shots, etc...

Just pointing out a fairly easy implementation that could become reality in the future.

1984 was fiction at a time..but this news story is literally off the first few pages.

You need to adjust your meds.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Still, do you think monitoring of all would be appropriate then as outlined in my conditions above?

We're (I'm) not talking about that, you are.

The cameras already in place in the US (atm's, security cams from private stores, tollway cameras, etc) are already used widely to prove guilt or innocence.

Grow up.

So to grow up I have to allow the government to monitor me at their whim?

No thanks.

Didn't think you'd get so defensive Pliablemoose, I'm just outlining the "protect society" scenario to a slightly more fleshed out point.

If you mean take an argument to an unrealistic & moronic extreme that doesn't even bear consideration, yeah, you're 100% right, I'm not in favor of biometric monitoring of every person in the US.

It's a stupid point, and has nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Of course I was immunized against smallpox, and am likely monitored by primitive nanites already so my judgment is suspect. and I'm afraid to say what I really think because of the thought police.

Got any tape? My tinfoil hat is coming off. I'm not defensive, I just think you argument is moronic.

He's right. What will happen is that this program will work in the UK. Then the "if it saves one child it will be worth it" crowd will be clamoring for it. Once that works and is accepted, then someone will get the idea that monitoring people is inherently a good thing.

I fully expect that within three generation every man woman and child's activities will be known and monitored because "if you aren't doing anything wrong you have nothing to fear" will meet "think of the children".

It' a matter of time.

 

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: feralkid

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Still, do you think monitoring of all would be appropriate then as outlined in my conditions above?

We're (I'm) not talking about that, you are.

The cameras already in place in the US (atm's, security cams from private stores, tollway cameras, etc) are already used widely to prove guilt or innocence.

Grow up.

So to grow up I have to allow the government to monitor me at their whim?

No thanks.

Didn't think you'd get so defensive Pliablemoose, I'm just outlining the "protect society" scenario to a slightly more fleshed out point.

If you mean take an argument to an unrealistic & moronic extreme that doesn't even bear consideration, yeah, you're 100% right, I'm not in favor of biometric monitoring of every person in the US.

It's a stupid point, and has nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Of course I was immunized against smallpox, and am likely monitored by primitive nanites already so my judgment is suspect. and I'm afraid to say what I really think because of the thought police.

Got any tape? My tinfoil hat is coming off. I'm not defensive, I just think you argument is moronic.

Seriously? I'm not saying it will happen tomorrow, but if this is happening today, what is to say 20 years down the line if we don't at least start protecting our rights now they won't be near non-existent by then?

I don't think anyone is going to mention any robots or crazy sci-fi concotions but it isn't hard to rig up a low powered transmitter to monitor heart rate/blood pressure and have audio. Cross reference that with CCTV footage for a pretty damn accurate monitoring situation.

It isn't anywhere near some kind of sci-fi scenario and I am not against anything like shots, etc...

Just pointing out a fairly easy implementation that could become reality in the future.

1984 was fiction at a time..but this news story is literally off the first few pages.

You need to adjust your meds.

Way to go.

All I said was I predict a more widespread roll out of cameras if no one objects here. Which I added in since the topic had gotten so far off of that point.

As I said here "Honestly I think there is more of a chance of cameras everywhere than anything else. They are stationary, constant monitoring devices. Just was addressing your protect the masses reasoning."

But as you don't care enough to follow along you can go jump in a fire for all I care.

I'm glad you guys support authroitarian governments though!

You can keep fighting for it, the sane people (read: not you) already said their piece. I'm done here.

The UK Crazy Train continues.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Still, do you think monitoring of all would be appropriate then as outlined in my conditions above?

We're (I'm) not talking about that, you are.

The cameras already in place in the US (atm's, security cams from private stores, tollway cameras, etc) are already used widely to prove guilt or innocence.

Grow up.

So to grow up I have to allow the government to monitor me at their whim?

No thanks.

Didn't think you'd get so defensive Pliablemoose, I'm just outlining the "protect society" scenario to a slightly more fleshed out point.

If you mean take an argument to an unrealistic & moronic extreme that doesn't even bear consideration, yeah, you're 100% right, I'm not in favor of biometric monitoring of every person in the US.

It's a stupid point, and has nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Of course I was immunized against smallpox, and am likely monitored by primitive nanites already so my judgment is suspect. and I'm afraid to say what I really think because of the thought police.

Got any tape? My tinfoil hat is coming off. I'm not defensive, I just think you argument is moronic.

He's right. What will happen is that this program will work in the UK. Then the "if it saves one child it will be worth it" crowd will be clamoring for it. Once that works and is accepted, then someone will get the idea that monitoring people is inherently a good thing.

I fully expect that within three generation every man woman and child's activities will be known and monitored because "if you aren't doing anything wrong you have nothing to fear" will meet "think of the children".

It' a matter of time.

Can my tracker be inserted rectally?

 

[feralkid]

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: feralkid

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Still, do you think monitoring of all would be appropriate then as outlined in my conditions above?

We're (I'm) not talking about that, you are.

The cameras already in place in the US (atm's, security cams from private stores, tollway cameras, etc) are already used widely to prove guilt or innocence.

Grow up.

So to grow up I have to allow the government to monitor me at their whim?

No thanks.

Didn't think you'd get so defensive Pliablemoose, I'm just outlining the "protect society" scenario to a slightly more fleshed out point.

If you mean take an argument to an unrealistic & moronic extreme that doesn't even bear consideration, yeah, you're 100% right, I'm not in favor of biometric monitoring of every person in the US.

It's a stupid point, and has nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Of course I was immunized against smallpox, and am likely monitored by primitive nanites already so my judgment is suspect. and I'm afraid to say what I really think because of the thought police.

Got any tape? My tinfoil hat is coming off. I'm not defensive, I just think you argument is moronic.

Seriously? I'm not saying it will happen tomorrow, but if this is happening today, what is to say 20 years down the line if we don't at least start protecting our rights now they won't be near non-existent by then?

I don't think anyone is going to mention any robots or crazy sci-fi concotions but it isn't hard to rig up a low powered transmitter to monitor heart rate/blood pressure and have audio. Cross reference that with CCTV footage for a pretty damn accurate monitoring situation.

It isn't anywhere near some kind of sci-fi scenario and I am not against anything like shots, etc...

Just pointing out a fairly easy implementation that could become reality in the future.

1984 was fiction at a time..but this news story is literally off the first few pages.

You need to adjust your meds.

Way to go.

All I said was I predict a more widespread roll out of cameras if no one objects here. Which I added in since the topic had gotten so far off of that point.

As I said here "Honestly I think there is more of a chance of cameras everywhere than anything else. They are stationary, constant monitoring devices. Just was addressing your protect the masses reasoning."

But as you don't care enough to follow along you can go jump in a fire for all I care.

I'm glad you guys support authroitarian governments though!

You can keep fighting for it, the sane people (read: not you) already said their piece. I'm done here.

The UK Crazy Train continues.

I rest my case.

:moon:

 

[LumbergTech]

this certainly does make me feel uneasy, but I would have to evaluate what these parents did in the first place

would the parents have their children taken away otherwise?

what do you think is better..having a camera in your house or having your children taken away because you didnt take care of them?

 

[Moonbeam]

I can think of no greater situation than every fact of my life be on file somewhere and accessible to nobody but me, such that if I am ever accused of anything all information pertinent to that charge could be accessed and my innocence absolutely established. The information could be examined, say by a court official, sworn to reveal my guild or innocence but not any details. I should have the option to a jury view on appeal.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I can think of no greater situation than every fact of my life be on file somewhere and accessible to nobody but me, such that if I am ever accused of anything all information pertinent to that charge could be accessed and my innocence absolutely established. The information could be examined, say by a court official, sworn to reveal my guild or innocence but not any details. I should have the option to a jury view on appeal.

So there'd maybe be some doubt as to your innocence that would require a finder of fact to establish one way or another.. hmmm... On appeal of course... :+)

You put Saran wrap on a fish tank thereby 'offing' the population... Guilty Cries the Porpoise in charge... but ... but ... but ... I appeal... hmmmm says the School of Goldfish.... looks like Saran wrap to me... Guilty... and off Goes Moonbeam to the polluted wastes of the bay...

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: ebaycj

Originally posted by: jackschmittusa
At a loss for words. How can people accept such government intrusion?

I beleive that most people would volunteer for this to keep their kids rather than having their kids go into the foster care system.

Perhaps. What are the standards? Would these kids otherwise be taken out? If not, in the future will the standards for volunteering video camera in your house be very light, afterall if you don't want this you must be hiding how you are with your kids so we'll take them from you if you don't oblige?

And to think that the proponents of their public street CCTV system said it would never get this far. Unfucking believable.

I could see it was getting worse, but this far already, holy crap.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: spittledip

Originally posted by: sandorski
Well, I wouldn't breakout out the 1984 comparisons just yet. This seems an alternative to just removing Children from home and sending them to Foster Care. Almost like a form of House Arrest that keeps families together. I'd wait to see the results of such a Program.

Of course it is like 1984. It doesn't matter what the reason is for doing so- it is the fact that it is happoening. BTW is it actually true?

I think you guys are just looking at it all wrong. They're doing this to people who are having serious issues.

For now.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Still, do you think monitoring of all would be appropriate then as outlined in my conditions above?

We're (I'm) not talking about that, you are.

The cameras already in place in the US (atm's, security cams from private stores, tollway cameras, etc) are already used widely to prove guilt or innocence.

Grow up.

So to grow up I have to allow the government to monitor me at their whim?

No thanks.

Didn't think you'd get so defensive Pliablemoose, I'm just outlining the "protect society" scenario to a slightly more fleshed out point.

If you mean take an argument to an unrealistic & moronic extreme that doesn't even bear consideration, yeah, you're 100% right, I'm not in favor of biometric monitoring of every person in the US.

It's a stupid point, and has nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

Of course I was immunized against smallpox, and am likely monitored by primitive nanites already so my judgment is suspect. and I'm afraid to say what I really think because of the thought police.

Got any tape? My tinfoil hat is coming off. I'm not defensive, I just think you argument is moronic.

He's right. What will happen is that this program will work in the UK. Then the "if it saves one child it will be worth it" crowd will be clamoring for it. Once that works and is accepted, then someone will get the idea that monitoring people is inherently a good thing.

I fully expect that within three generation every man woman and child's activities will be known and monitored because "if you aren't doing anything wrong you have nothing to fear" will meet "think of the children".

It' a matter of time.

i agree.

BUT i think it may be a little longer then3 generations.

 

[Rockinacoustic]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Rockinacoustic

Originally posted by: sandorski
Well, I wouldn't breakout out the 1984 comparisons just yet. This seems an alternative to just removing Children from home and sending them to Foster Care. Almost like a form of House Arrest that keeps families together. I'd wait to see the results of such a Program.

The end justifies the mean right?

What is this "End" you speak of? Exactly what is "Wrong" with this situation other than it being something mentioned in a Science Fiction book at one time?

So long as it keeps families together and children out of foster homes it's just right?

Are you as indifferent to this as you are wiretapping's and torture?

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Rockinacoustic

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Rockinacoustic

Originally posted by: sandorski
Well, I wouldn't breakout out the 1984 comparisons just yet. This seems an alternative to just removing Children from home and sending them to Foster Care. Almost like a form of House Arrest that keeps families together. I'd wait to see the results of such a Program.

The end justifies the mean right?

What is this "End" you speak of? Exactly what is "Wrong" with this situation other than it being something mentioned in a Science Fiction book at one time?

So long as it keeps families together and children out of foster homes it's just right?

Are you as indifferent to this as you are wiretapping's and torture?

Why not? Do you think it's better to rip families apart than to perhaps fix a family so they can stay together?

 

[1prophet]

Dysfunctional families are the ones those in authority deem to be dysfunctional, don't upset those in authority and all will be well with you.

 

[sandorski]

If Prisons didn't exist up to this point, how many here would object to the Government forcing Criminals into Buildings that they were not able to Freely leave/return at Will?