Question Zen 6 Speculation Thread

[jpiniero]

Nope.

Yep, it's Quadratic. Which is worse.

 

[DrMrLordX]

really AMD sees such profit opportunity in having 4p+8c rammed literally everywhere in 5 product families instead of classic 12 full cores ccd?

N2 wafers are stupid expensive. Cost/transistor isn't going down anymore. And supposedly, at least in mobile power envelopes, the dense cores can maintain high enough clockspeed in 9t+ scenarios that there's little-to-no advantage for 12p standard core CCDs. Though I'd like to see some comparisons in mt clockspeeds within variable power envelopes between the two different CCD types. Maybe someone will get us that data, eventually.

 

[adroc_thurston]

that there's little-to-no advantage for 12p standard core CCDs.

Oh there's a ton.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Oh there's a ton.

In mobile power envelopes? How frequency-restricted are these dense cores gonna be?

 

[adroc_thurston]

In mobile power envelopes?

In any power envelope.
Why do you think all server Zen6 is N2?

How frequency-restricted are these dense cores gonna be?

They're just on N3p.

 

[Jan Olšan]

We can argue back and forth but AMD doesn't do big.LITTLE.

phat.DENSE

 

[Thunder 57]

AMD users laughed at Intel ADL's big.LITTLE, yet AMD was just a gen or two late with big.LITTLE...

What AMD really needs to step up its game in mobile is to provide a top-noch SW/HW support and viable (complete) platforms to OEMs. OEMs juggling with 7 different SKU lines doesn't seem like it.

That's horse shit and you know it. I don't know anyone who laughed at big.LITTLE. Troll outside of an AMD thread.

 

[jpiniero]

In any power envelope.
Why do you think all server Zen6 is N2?

I have doubts that the Hi product will ever make it onto an actual machine... but I wonder if it might be a dumping ground for busted parts.

 

[adroc_thurston]

I have doubts that the Hi product will ever make it onto an actual machine

?
It's the Ryzen 9 MDS1.

 

[itsmydamnation]

phat.DENSE

DR DENSITY here....... time to horsecock some loads

 

[DrMrLordX]

In any power envelope.
Why do you think all server Zen6 is N2?

They're just on N3p.

Wait, ALL the 4p+8c Zen6 dice are on N3p? Even the ones that go into Halo?

 

[fastandfurious6]

yeah I don't get it

server zen6 EPYC cores are both dense and N2

client zen6 has N3P instead???

as with zen5, the flagship-on-mobile-package will be both best deal and best performer

24 full phat N2 cores + 2LP + 3D (X2)

 

[marees]

Wait, ALL the 4p+8c Zen6 dice are on N3p? Even the ones that go into Halo?

they are SoCs (with maybe bundled i/o too)

the ccd chiplet is only one. 2nm 12p ccd

 

[fastandfurious6]

10565HX3DX2 ?

or "RYZEN 9 AI PRO 590X3D MAX"

 

[marees]

yeah I don't get it

server zen6 EPYC cores are both dense and N2

client zen6 has N3P instead???

as with zen5, the flagship-on-mobile-package will be both best deal and best performer

24 full phat N2 cores + 2LP + 3D (X2)

anything with graphics is 3nm. you are not getting graphics on 2nm

 

[fastandfurious6]

10965HX3D (24 full cores) + dGPU > Medusa Halo

if there's 5 medusa CPU families before Halo, then Halo will be priced 3000+++ and won't be worth vs full 10965HX3D on mobile

only for LLMs basically

 

[ToTTenTranz]

1 IOD, 1 CCD, 3 SoCs, 2 GMDs (which are also used for dGPUs)

This is less modular than one would think. If the memory controllers are in the GMDs, why exactly do the MDS Premium and Halo use different SoCs? Higher MT CPU performance on either could be had just by adding a CCD.

I get that MDS Point needs a different SoC because it's a cost-focused monolithic oriented design (even if the 8xCU RDNDA3.5 iGPU seems like a very dumb idea). But if the other two MDS aren't using the same IOD, then the general approach isn't making a lot of sense to me.

Olympic Ridge: IOD + CCD
Medusa Point: SoC + (optional) CCD
Medusa Premium: SoC + AT4 GMD
Medusa Halo: SoC + AT3 GMD

Isn't the Magnus SoC + AT2 config missing here, as it follows the same SoC + ATx scheme?

10965HX3D (24 full cores) + dGPU > Medusa Halo

if there's 5 medusa CPU families before Halo, then Halo will be priced 3000+++ and won't be worth vs full 10965HX3D on mobile

only for LLMs basically

That was when large amounts of DRAM were reallistically available to consumers and prosumers, which they aren't at the moment and could still not be a year from now.
Which leaves MDS Halo in a very awkward position.

 

[Kepler_L2]

Wait, ALL the 4p+8c Zen6 dice are on N3p? Even the ones that go into Halo?

All SoCs are on N3P. All CCDs are on N2P

 

[Kepler_L2]

Isn't the Magnus SoC + AT2 config missing here, as it follows the same SoC + ATx scheme?

That's not part of client Zen6

 

[DrMrLordX]

All SoCs are on N3P. All CCDs are on N2P

That seems unfortunate that they don't have an N2P version of the SoC for Halo/Halo mini. It'll only be a problem for Halo mini I guess.

 

[ToTTenTranz]

That's not part of client Zen6

The only difference between Magnus and the rest is it'll initially be sold to a single and exclusive client, Microsoft. It it's using AT2 which is also going into dGPUs, then it's safe to assume there are no custom blocks in the silicon (not that there were any relevant ones in Scarlett and Lockhart anyway).


Even the client exclusivity may end, as AMD eventually sold Series X chips as 4800S and even XBOne chips as A9-9820. The 4800S is basically the Series X with the iGPU disabled, so the Magnus equivalent to that would be just the SoC without the AT2 attached.

That seems unfortunate that they don't have an N2P version of the SoC for Halo/Halo mini. It'll only be a problem for Halo mini I guess.

I'd say it's more to gain in having the GMDs made on N2P than the SoC.

 

[adroc_thurston]

The only difference between Magnus and the rest is it'll initially be sold to a single and exclusive client

Nope.
Consoles have poverty CPUs.
Client stuff can't go with poverty CPUs anymore.

 

[marees]

Nope.
Consoles have poverty CPUs.
Client stuff can't go with poverty CPUs anymore.

medusa premium (mini halo) is for whom actually ?

there was no such product / swimlane before right ?

 

[adroc_thurston]

medusa premium (mini halo) is for whom actually ?

It's for no one.
Just a big iGP 128b part on normal platforms.

there was no such product / swimlane before right ?

Wtaf is stx1 then

 

[marees]

Wtaf is stx1 then

that is succeeded by medusa point 1 right ?