Discussion Zen 5 Speculation (EPYC Turin and Strix Point/Granite Ridge - Ryzen 9000)

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tsamolotoff

Senior member
May 19, 2019
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With regards to recall / delay - what might have happened is that AMD noticed some sort of SHA3-like instability that many x3d dual-ccd chips have - they simply crash or reboot in one specific AIDA64 test. Someone might have noticed that while testing CPU for review (or in some sort of pre-review analysis) so they decided to scrap whole batch to ensure this thing does not happen again.
 
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yuri69

Senior member
Jul 16, 2013
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inf64 said:
HW Unboxed video has info about AMD's Computex Demo system that had a low performing 9950x ES (early ES), which underperformed even vs 7950X in Cinebech... When they called it out, AMD scrambled and removed the demo systems. That was 8 weeks ago, crazy.
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Zen5%

Goop_reformed said:
The more I read up about this the more suspicious I become. What we know so far:

1/ Zen 5 is a new uarch, taped out early.
2/ Some reviews samples date way way back.
3/ Amd have already delayed official launch twice.

This screams bugs, bugs and more bugs. I have a feeling now they will do it once more. 3rd's time the charm.
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This brings Raja's Vega Frontier launch memories.

What is more hilarious showing of incompetence are those two dates 1 week apart with the flagship being in the later one... Do they really need to take care of the 2*CCD models? Ok, postpone the 1*CCD too to prevent the "Zen 5 slower than 12900K!!!" publicity.
 
Hail The Brain Slug

Hail The Brain Slug

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 2005
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Fjodor2001 said:
So who wants to be guinea pig and buy a CPU from the first batch now, unless AMD discloses what the actual problem was and how well it could be fixed?
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Well, I figure there are two takes one could reasonably have from what AMD said.

1) Launch CPUs should be avoided for risk of getting a defective unit if AMD hasn't fully rectified the issue/QA process to identify it

2) Since AMD recalled all potentially defective CPUs and sent out a wave of "fresh stock" then launch CPUs will be fine, until AMD reevaluates the questionable stock and starts sending those units back out again.

On one hand, take 2 means buying launch day is a good thing. On the other hand, take 1 means it would be prudent to wait it out.
 
Josh128

Josh128

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Oct 14, 2022
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MS_AT said:
Reviewers need the time to test the cpu, many said it would not be possible to make it in time for 31st if they got CPUs now.
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Exactly-- but my point is, if it was just a packaging issue, it wouldnt matter if some typo was on the box or the IHS of the review samples. They are saying that not only did they hold off on sending more out, they are recalling all of the ones that were sent out. They would not need to do that if the problem was errors or typos in packaging or IHS.
 
Josh128

Josh128

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uzzi38 said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1816473099468197980

Lmao. Both to the actual issue but also the doomposters everywhere regarding a 2 week delay (lol)
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So they push back reviews due to that?? Just instruct reviewers to not show photos of the typo and let them review what they have, then just focus on recalling typo SKUs and shipping corrected ones to vendors-- this didnt have to affect review times whatsoever. And still no official word on pricing. smh.
 
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Hitman928

Diamond Member
Apr 15, 2012
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Josh128 said:
Exactly-- but my point is, if it was just a packaging issue, it wouldnt matter if some typo was on the box or the IHS of the review samples. They are saying that not only did they hold off on sending more out, they are recalling all of the ones that were sent out. They would not need to do that if the problem was errors or typos in packaging or IHS.
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The box or inscription on the IHS is not what people are referring to when they say packaging issues. In the IC world, packaging means the placing of the die on the substrate and making all of the electrical connections needed.
 
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igor_kavinski

Lifer
Jul 27, 2020
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carrotmania said:
Many less people would go to a comprehensive review like Anandtechs (hahaha, I couldn't resist the joke)
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I don't know why Gavin Bonshor doesn't do some antics on official Youtube channel (if there is one?) to attract more attention to our most illustrious website. He can do so much by donning our official mascot dress (remind me what that is?) and doing some hoopla dancing.

I mean, THIS IS ANANDTECH! *kicks effigy of MLID into the bottomless pit*
 
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igor_kavinski

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Jul 27, 2020
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Timmah! said:
Or they forgot to put "," into boosting frequency, so it says it boosts to 57 GHz :-D
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They should've left such a typo in. Would've been fun for enthusiasts to chase that elusive speed with all sorts of crazy cooling solutions :D

57 GHz isn't a lot. If you add up the GHz of all the various on-die structures, maybe the sum of all those exceeds that figure.
 
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Hitman928

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Apr 15, 2012
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Doug S said:
They could easily fix a hardware issue within a week or two. Just look at Intel, they didn't need a respin they're able to solve it with a firmware update (at least to the extent of preventing future degradation, they can't undo potential past degradation)

AMD could have looked at Intel's troubles, done some internal reviews "are we vulnerable to the same sorts of problems", found they were, and are making changes to insure voltage levels are kept within bounds to prevent similar issues. By recalling before release they avoid the risk of having chips out there that are operating "unfixed" for months/years by the sort of people who never update their firmware.

Now I have no idea what AMD's problem really is, but the timing of this given Intel's announcement seems a little suspicious to me. A couple week delay to cut the possibility of such issues off at the pass would be well worth it, if it means being able to sit back with a smug grin on your face while Intel deals with the fallout for their problems for the next year or two.
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I think the jury is still out on whether Intel is able to fix their issues in microcode or not, but in regards to AMD, I highly doubt this is the case. I did say that it had to be either a QA thing or a microcode/firmware issue. If Intel is telling the truth about their problem, it is a microcode issue and can be fixed in microcode. If it were a microcode issue for AMD, they wouldn't need to recall the CPUs, they could just push the microcode update out through the OS and tell reviewers to be sure they have the latest BIOS/microcode before testing. That would be a lot simpler and cheaper than recalling all of the CPUs that have already shipped and sending out new units.

I also doubt AMD knew about this several weeks ago, as some have said, because in that time frame they have released units to retail. They only recalled them very recently. If they had known about this that long ago, they would never have gotten on store shelves to sell.

No matter the issue, it is much better that AMD is being very proactive and cautious in making sure good working units go out to reviewers and customers. While it kind of sucks that it happened, IMO, they should be judged more on how they handle their mistakes rather than if they make them to begin with, because every company makes mistakes but few handle them well.
 
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Hitman928

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IEC said:
"I don't think performance is a concern here" Aussie Steve @ ~8:27 on latest HWUB video.
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I listened to that this morning while walking my dog. Steve seems to believe it is a QA thing as well, or at least that is what he gathers from his communication with AMD. One nugget I gleaned was that if he compares his 7900x results to the Italian guy's gaming numbers, the 9900x would be about 18% faster in gaming. Obviously there is a huge caveat there that there is zero control over testing conditions between the two so it's not a reliable figure, but he did say the 7800x3d results between the two match up well, FWIW.
 
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Josh128

Josh128

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Hitman928 said:
The box or inscription on the IHS is not what people are referring to when they say packaging issues. In the IC world, packaging means the placing of the die on the substrate and making all of the electrical connections needed.
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Normally, yes, but when Ian Cutress says "due to a typo" that would be box packaging and labeling, not what you are speaking about.
 
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