Discussion Zen 5 Speculation (EPYC Turin and Strix Point/Granite Ridge - Ryzen 9000)

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Thibsie

Golden Member
Apr 25, 2017
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igor_kavinski said:
If that app isn't very CPU intensive and not a multimedia app, it should run fine in a VMware VM of MacOS. It's easy to find pre-built VMDKs for those if you look around.
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I'm playing with those. At this point, they're either too slow or too hard to make work on AMD or prone to graphic glitches or unable to got past 1027*768 definition (ouch!).
Not gonna do it.
 
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eek2121

Diamond Member
Aug 2, 2005
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Hitman928 said:
Good thing they continued to invest as the AI boom (LLM in particular) could potentially be their most profitable market ever, at least for as long as that market can sustain itself.
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AI: yes. LLM? Hopefully not. There are a number of non-LLM models that are showing a ton of promise, including one in development by Meta.

I am hoping that we get beefed up GPGPU compute engines (that can be used for any workload) for all CPUs moving forward. Apple is doing things right in this regard. Intel Meteor Lake and AMD mobile products also do okay.

Zen 4 desktop? Not so much.
 
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Hitman928

Diamond Member
Apr 15, 2012
6,686
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eek2121 said:
AI: yes. LLM? Hopefully not. There are a number of non-LLM models that are showing a ton of promise, including one in development by Meta.

I am hoping that we get beefed up GPGPU compute engines (that can be used for any workload) for all CPUs moving forward. Apple is doing things right in this regard. Intel Meteor Lake and AMD mobile products also do okay.

Zen 4 desktop? Not so much.
Click to expand...

LLM is what the current boom is all about and what AMD is both really competitive in and trying to capitalize on. Of course the future can bring a lot more prospects, but in the near term, LLM is where the money is for AMD. As far as what Meta is working on, I'm not sure what you are referring to. The thing they keep talking about, at least that I see, is Llama, which is their own LLM. Is there something else they've been promoting outside of that?
 
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Joe NYC

Diamond Member
Jun 26, 2021
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TESKATLIPOKA said:
Strix Halo will be the most costly APU they have for the client segment, thanks to IOD.
I don't think they will throw extra cache on top of that, when It's aimed for mobile, which doesn't have high margins.
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V-Cache is about $10 cost for $100 MSRP increase, so a very profitable proposition for AMD.

I think AMD will broaden the scope of Strix Halo to small form factor / Mini PCs, which in turn broadens the scope (target market) of Mini PCs to much higher performance.

If the graphics performs on level of Radeon 6600, then it will be good enough for a very large percentage of games.

Aside from the First Person AAA games, pretty much all of the strategy / simulation / survival / base or city building games all have hardware requirements that below Radeon 6600.

And, BTW, these games above I mentioned like the V-Cache.
 
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Joe NYC

Diamond Member
Jun 26, 2021
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eek2121 said:
AI: yes. LLM? Hopefully not. There are a number of non-LLM models that are showing a ton of promise, including one in development by Meta.

I am hoping that we get beefed up GPGPU compute engines (that can be used for any workload) for all CPUs moving forward. Apple is doing things right in this regard. Intel Meteor Lake and AMD mobile products also do okay.

Zen 4 desktop? Not so much.
Click to expand...

But the reason to get the desktop PC is to get a dGPU, which will have more power to run any of these models that any notebook chip.
 
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TESKATLIPOKA

Platinum Member
May 1, 2020
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Joe NYC said:
V-Cache is about $10 cost for $100 MSRP increase, so a very profitable proposition for AMD.

I think AMD will broaden the scope of Strix Halo to small form factor / Mini PCs, which in turn broadens the scope (target market) of Mini PCs to much higher performance.
Click to expand...
OEMs won't be willing to pay that much, AMD would have to sell It much much cheaper.
 
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TESKATLIPOKA

Platinum Member
May 1, 2020
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Joe NYC said:
Nice
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Is It?
40CU IGP managing only RX 6650M XT level of performance is not particularly great with 25% more CUs and dual-issue on top of that.
It would mean clocks are not very high and RDNA3.5 didn't really "fix" them.
 
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Goop_reformed

Senior member
Sep 23, 2023
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I know this has been discussed to death but does it seem like the author is saying expectation should be tempered?

chipsandcheese.com

Zen 5’s Leaked Slides

A YouTuber called Moore’s Law is Dead recently leaked a couple AMD slides about Zen 5.
chipsandcheese.com chipsandcheese.com

"AMD is prone to this because they’re an underdog that people expect to one-up its bigger competitors, so fanciful rumors get a lot of attention. Whenever Zen 5 comes out, I would encourage everyone to look at its performance with respect to how Intel and other CPU manufacturers are progressing, and not based on rumors."

So what I can deduce from reading the article / reading between the lines: ipc uplift from zen 4 to zen 5 should be greater than that of rpl to arl. Still, something is very off about zen 5 rumors and the slides.
 
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Goop_reformed

Senior member
Sep 23, 2023
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adroc_thurston said:
Yes, clam loves saying that.
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Which is kind of funny because of their wild claims about zen 4 and zen 5. Different author but I'd doubt they didn't discuss this before publication.

chipsandcheese.com

AMD’s Past and Future CPUs (Formal Retraction)

Editor’s Note: With the release of our Zen 4 article, I issued a formal retraction of this article.
chipsandcheese.com chipsandcheese.com

"I was told from a trusted source that a Genoa engineering sample (Zen 4 server chip) was 29% faster than a Milan (Zen 3) chip with the same core config at the same clocks. Factor this in with what I have heard about the possible clock gains that N5 will enable over N7 and Zen 4 sounds like it is going to be a monster of a CPU.

Now I said I had Zen 5 info, unfortunately this comes from a different, less-proven source than my Zen 4 info, however they have said that the jump [to Zen 5 from 4] from will be about as much as Piledriver to Zen 1 design goal, which if you recall to earlier in this article was 40%. I was told from a 3rd source that Zen 5’s original design goal was 2.5 to 3 times the IPC of Zen 1 which roughly lines up with the perspective of a “Piledriver to Zen 1”-like jump."
 
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jpiniero

Lifer
Oct 1, 2010
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Glo. said:
Strix Halo should be around 6700 XT desktop perf.
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I dunno, using 3dmark's average TSE scores, the 6800M is about 10% slower than the desktop 6700 XT. And the 6800M has the full memory bandwidth.

That would also be about the 4070M performance.
 
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