Zen 2 for Distributed Computing: Any interest?

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biodoc

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
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874
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@StefanR5R , thanks for putting all this data together. I still don't know which system I would go with though. The advantage of the TR3 3970X is lower hardware cost and the option of running it more efficiently by lowering the cTDP/PPT if I choose to do so. For FAH SMP tasks with the Quick Return Bonus, it may make sense to run it at higher clock speeds. For creditnew projects lower clocks may make more sense. Then there's the winter/summer factor.
 

Markfw

CPU Moderator, VC&G Moderator, Elite Member
Super Moderator
May 16, 2002
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@StefanR5R , thanks for putting all this data together. I still don't know which system I would go with though. The advantage of the TR3 3970X is lower hardware cost and the option of running it more efficiently by lowering the cTDP/PPT if I choose to do so. For FAH SMP tasks with the Quick Return Bonus, it may make sense to run it at higher clock speeds. For creditnew projects lower clocks may make more sense. Then there's the winter/summer factor.
F@H only makes sense on nvidia video cards IMO. For WCG and Rosetta, bang/buck is in 2990wx or 7601 (if you get a good ebay deal like I did) Rome is great, but at 3-4 times the cost of a 7601. I got mine for less than the current 2990wx ebay prices. But the motherboards are more. $900 is the best deal I have gotten on 2990wx, and $850 on the 7601. (each)
 

biodoc

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
5,596
874
126
Like many others, I've been frustrated by AMD's delayed support for Zen 2 CPU temp/voltage monitoring on linux.
I installed the recently released Linux Mint Mate 19.3 Beta on another partition and after all the updates, k10temp for Zen2 processors is now there. :) The kernel version after updates is 5.0.0-37-generic. The change log for this kernel version shows:

hwmon: (k10temp) Add support for AMD family 17h, model 70h CPUs
 

Markfw

CPU Moderator, VC&G Moderator, Elite Member
Super Moderator
May 16, 2002
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Now that I have these boxes up and running for a everyday on Rosetta, I though I would pass on their PPD cost/core
64 core 128 thread dual 7601 EPYC@2.6 81,442 PPd per thread per ghz 245 $850 = 26
32core/64 thread 2990wx@3.8 (using 62) 30,568 134 $900 = 28
16 core/32 thread 1950x@3.4 (using 30) 21,669 212 $350 = 21

Xeon 2683v3@2.5 (using 28) 16,855 241 $250= 18

While the xeon does less per day, they cost $250 or so right now. They use more juice also.

Its obvious that the 8 channel ram EPYC is wiping the floor with the quad channel threadrippers. And the 4 channels on the 32 core 2990wx are very handicapped. Even though they are the fastest cores of the bunch. Unless my math is off.
The first is simply the ppd/threads. The second accounts for clock speed. Regardless of speed (3.8 vs 2.6) the EPYC still wins.
636.265625​
244.7175481​
509.4666667​
134.0701754​
722.3​
212.4411765​
601.9642857​
240.7857143​
 

Assimilator1

Elite Member
Nov 4, 1999
23,438
192
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Well I finally was able to grab a little time to install my Zen2, after over 2 months when I bought it!

I'm still a long way from finishing installing everything, but before that I've got a major problem with CPU temps.
If I run F@H on it, it goes over 90C!o_O Although it's on the stock cooler & paste, it's not overclocked, & I haven't even put the side of the case on! Wth?? Load vcore seems to peak at about 1.45v. Mbrd is an MSI B450 carbon something or other :p
Any ideas anyone?
 

biodoc

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
5,596
874
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Load vcore seems to peak at about 1.45v.
A lot of these motherboards have settings out of the box that automatically overclock to the max. A vcore of 1.45 is quite high by my standards although I don't overclock. My Zen 2 chips are running at 1.1 -1.2 volts. I checked your MB manual and there is a feature called "game boost" on the EZ setup. Is that turned on or off? Also what are the temps in the bios?

Are you using the AMD Ryzen master utility to monitor temps/vcore etc? Other cpu monitoring utilities may not give the correct values.
 

Assimilator1

Elite Member
Nov 4, 1999
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Yeah I've got Ryzen master, (Coretemp's temp's match, but vcore doesn't btw).
I was under the impression that a max load vcore of about 1.45v was normal, & that it should drop to less than 1v when idle (which it does).
Re Game boost, I believe so, but I'll double check it's off.
I just thought of something else too, I'd better check that the fans aren't in quiet mode.
 

Assimilator1

Elite Member
Nov 4, 1999
23,438
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Confirmed game boost is disabled.
Re fans, not in quite mode, but fan speed was ramping up really slowy, have tweaked, but needs further tweaking.
So a few things I found wrong, turned out the fan housing was butting up against the RAM! Needed to move a stick anyway to get dual channel RAM! Doh!
So temps don't shoot over 90 now, but I'm still getting into the high 80sC!! So still far too high. Maybe it needs new thermal paste since I had to remove the HSF. I wish I could remember where my decent paste is.......
 

Assimilator1

Elite Member
Nov 4, 1999
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Seems to be mostly for overclocking that guide? I'm not.

Right, I've taken the cooler off, the OEM paste was nicely spread, so it wasn't that.
I've just put on some thermal grizzly, & it doesn't seem to have made any difference, although it probably needs to bed in, & I had problems applying it (the supplied rubber blade tip was useless).

Anyway, a quick bit of Googling seems to show that the std cooler is rubbish & often ends running in the high 80s! Anyone else found that?
Seems like I need an aftermarket cooler.....
 

biodoc

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
5,596
874
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Seems to be mostly for overclocking that guide? I'm not.
The bios is automatically overclocking the chip. Set the clock speed manually to just over base frequency and then start dropping the vcore. The temps will come down. Alternatively, you buy a big water cooler and leave the bios at defaults.
 

Assimilator1

Elite Member
Nov 4, 1999
23,438
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My loaded vcore is 1.3v, so that guide won't help there, it might help idle temps though. Although I seem to remember from a post by an AMD staff member saying not to drop vcore.....*sigh*, what a PITA, I expect this kind of hassle when I'm overclocking, but not at default!
 

Kiska

Senior member
Apr 4, 2012
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My loaded vcore is 1.3v, so that guide won't help there, it might help idle temps though. Although I seem to remember from a post by an AMD staff member saying not to drop vcore.....*sigh*, what a PITA, I expect this kind of hassle when I'm overclocking, but not at default!
Zen 2 will behave like a GPU with GPU boost, so... yeah, I think it'll stop boosting when it hits somewhere between mid-80C low 90C
 

Assimilator1

Elite Member
Nov 4, 1999
23,438
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I'll give that a try as a short term fix.

But basically, is it the case that the AMD cooler just isn't upto the job? Looking at it's piddly size I wouldn't be surprised! A ~1/2" tall all ally heatsink :p

Zen 2 will behave like a GPU with GPU boost, so... yeah, I think it'll stop boosting when it hits somewhere between mid-80C low 90C
Yea, that's why I want to get temps down, as well as it's long term health!
 
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biodoc

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
5,596
874
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But basically, is it the case that the AMD cooler just isn't upto the job?
I did replace the wraith spire on my 3900X with a Noctua NH-U12S. The latter is quieter and reduces temps by a few degrees. I'm running the 3900X with a PPT of 105 watts so the clock speed is around 3800 MHz. Under full load the cpu temp is around 65 C but I have the side cover off the case because I have 2 - 1080Ti's running FAH. If I put the side cover on, the GPU temps go up and the CPU temps will go up to mid 70's C.
 

Assimilator1

Elite Member
Nov 4, 1999
23,438
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Pity you're across the pond, I would've bought the wraith spire from you! :)
Btw, found PBO was on, but disabling it doesn't seem to have made any difference.
 

biodoc

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
5,596
874
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Btw, found PBO was on, but disabling it doesn't seem to have made any difference.
I think you need PBO on to use PPT/PLL control. It's very confusing. I "upgraded" the bios on my ASRock x370 board and now it won't respond to PPT/PLL settings so I need to check and see if PBO is on.
 

Assimilator1

Elite Member
Nov 4, 1999
23,438
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I lowered PPT from the default (88w) to 70w, and now running F@H it stays below 80C, but that's still a pathetic performance from this cooler!
This stock cooler just isn't adequate, it's totally sub par! :(, I don't know what AMD are thinking with this CPU-cooler combo!

Anyway, now my 2nd PC's old C2 rig is retired (replaced by the i7 4930k), I'm going to see if I can modify it's TR Ultima 90 cooler for my Ryzen. If I can find the AM3 base plate for it I should be able to drill out new holes to mount it :), if I can find where the fitting kit is!........
 

VietOZ

Member
Aug 3, 2019
29
67
51
had my 3990X on Universe for about 3 days now ... pretty impressive cpu. It still has more potentials since Asus decided to pumped out a bios and lock DRAM speed at stock. They don't say it in the download page ... but if dig in more to CPU compatible list then there's a little note saying "Memory runs at stock settings". So now my DRAM stuck at 2133mhz, if I tried to change it to anything I'll get the F1 error. I also tried other bioses listed on the site, but same issue. All 128 threads are running Universe on linux Mint 19.3.
All settings are on Auto since if i tried to change anything i'll get F1 error and can not boot to OS. I could disable bluetooth though ... friggin awesome.
All fans set at 100% except chipset (50%) and VRM also at 50% ... they're surprising quiet so good job on that one Asus.
Power draw reading at the wall = 388 watts (full Universe loaded)
CPU temp = 67 C (deepcool castle 360ex AIO)
from the looks of today's output, I think it'll do about 2.2m/day on Universe. Which is about 2x 2990WX (pic below)... insane. The 2x 2990WX draw 750 watts at the wall combined.
The 3970X is running 2 VMs with 31 threads each on W10... so I can't really tell how much it can do with native Linux.

Edit: I've unhide my hosts on Universe so y'all can monitor the beast for the next few days.
 

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Assimilator1

Elite Member
Nov 4, 1999
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Awesome! :D

On the other end of the scale, my R5 3600 (currently throttled to 70w PPT due to the rubbish Stealth cooler), is pulling just 134w running SETI :), clocking at 3.6-3.65 GHz. I will be fitting a better cooler to the Ryzen.
My old i7 4930k @4.1 GHz was pulling ~243w from the wall, lol. Pity I don't know the output from either! Anyone know how I can figure that out these days?
 

VietOZ

Member
Aug 3, 2019
29
67
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asking the Stealth cooler to cool what we're doing is a bit much. Honestly, I don't think even the popular Hyper 212 can cool these 7nm chips for crunching and that's a 4 heat pipes cooler. The Hyper 212 can handle any V3/V4 xeon, but won't survive with these new Ryzen. Unless you undervolt the crap out of it and that'll cause clock stressing. My 3600 non X is running at 4ghz with 1.32v vcore all core and cooled by a 280mm AIO (Corsair) still hits low 70s with avx WUs. 70s are high for me .. it's just personal preferences.... so I lowered my cpu to 3.9ghz kept the temp under control. I don't like my cpu or gpu goes over 70C.
 

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