YOU be the manager (Updated 7/25)

[Ns1]

It's managers job to keep people busy/make sure they have work.

Or I could add value to my manager and keep myself busy/find more work myself, thus freeing up my managers time to do more useful shit.

=Respect++

 

[KeithTalent]

But you my friend also have morals and common sense.

Many managers I've seen don't think this way.

And in most cases it's never fair........and raise is not even REMOTELY on their mind hehe

You seem like you want to be an adversary, not an employee. That's fine, but that attitude doesn't work everywhere.

KT

 

[nehalem256]

- Employee has been here 2.5 years. 10 years experience in a professional field. Workday is 8 hours. He's salaried. The job might require 5 hours of overtime over a year, it's extremely rare.
- A month ago I happened to notice he came in a little late and also left early the same day (about a 7 hour day). This was sheer coincidence as I do not monitor comings and goins.
- Last week it seemed he was gone a very long time for lunch. Now I am curious so I start watching on and off but not all day every day.
- Monday took a 1.75 hour lunch (lunch is 30 minutes unless you're going to work late to cover the difference). Came back carrying a take-out lunch. Left at normal time so did not cover the extra 1+ hours at lunch.
- Tuesday most definitely only worked 7 hours.

So out of curiosity do you think this is something that just started or has been going on for the whole 2.5 years and you just noticed?

His answer was that he didn't have enough work for a full day and didn't think it mattered whether he was here 8 hours or took a long lunch.

Maybe the guy is just an introvert and doesn't like being bothered having to nag you for more work?

If he is meeting expectations in terms of workload why do you care if he warming his chair for 7 or 8 hours?

 

[dougp]

What I'm hearing is you weren't rewarded for your hard work and you didn't fight for it.

Why should I have to fight hard for my compensation, when I have my manager, director (VP) and CTO already doing the fight for me? Nothing I say would change HR's mind. I fail to see where I didn't fight for it when the only fight I could have done was speak with my manager. I'm not one of those employees who will go over a manager's head - sorry, that's how you burn bridges and piss off the wrong people.

 

[Wonderful Pork]

Incorrect. Driven individuals will.

Driven individuals will ask for more work if it offers them opportunity for advancement. I would ask for work normally done by more senior people than me so I learn and subsequently am viewed as a bigger asset for my company.

 

[rudeguy]

Incorrect. Driven individuals will.

I have done this many, many times.

My current job is a contract job. It was supposed to be a temp job but that evolved because I did step up. I figured out how to boost productivity by 350%. No kidding. Then I got bored with that and asked them for more work, which they gave me. Then I asked for more, which they gave me. Now I am running a few very important projects and have a pretty big one lined up that the president is really interested in.

If I had just done what was assigned, how it was assigned, I would be back on the street. Instead because I did ask for more work, I have become a critical part of the team.

 

[Vdubchaos]

Or I could add value to my manager and keep myself busy/find more work myself, thus freeing up my managers time to do more useful shit.

=Respect++

you do that

Unfortunately most managers won't even know or care....and will look at you as a sucker.

 

[Vdubchaos]

I have done this many, many times.

My current job is a contract job. It was supposed to be a temp job but that evolved because I did step up. I figured out how to boost productivity by 350%. No kidding. Then I got bored with that and asked them for more work, which they gave me. Then I asked for more, which they gave me. Now I am running a few very important projects and have a pretty big one lined up that the president is really interested in.

If I had just done what was assigned, how it was assigned, I would be back on the street. Instead because I did ask for more work, I have become a critical part of the team.

key words

Take that away and you will experience MUCH different scenario.

 

[Vdubchaos]

Driven individuals will ask for more work if it offers them opportunity for advancement. I would ask for work normally done by more senior people than me so I learn and subsequently am viewed as a bigger asset for my company.

Exactly and many companies don't offer that opportunity (and I'm sure many do)

 

[JEDI]

His work is of average quality and timeliness. Sometimes makes careless mistakes, other times does very impressive work.



Not a parody.

I'm sure that's what he's thinking, though. A professional with 10 years experience should do as little as possible unless someone's looking over his shoulder.

I'm not a babysitter. I have as much work to do as he and the others in the group. I don't stand at the door and see when they come in, I don't pull their badge times, I don't time their lunches. They get paid a lot of money and are to act as professionals.

It's quite possible that attitude is outdated but I focus my energies on the things I get measured on, and trust the others in the group are grownups and given their experience they know what they are expected to do. During the quarterly reviews I always ask if they are OK with the workload they have, he always said it was OK. I never imagined "OK" could mean "I need more work to keep me busy."

are u kidding me?!
who would volunteer for more work w/o more compensation?!

i said fire him because he's coming in late, leaving early, and taking ALOT longer than the 30min lunches. plus his entitlement attitude


edit:
ok, maybe ambitious peiople will ask for more work but probably high profile work to get that promotion.
sounds like your employee perfers being comfortable.

 

[Ns1]

you do that

Unfortunately most managers won't even know or care....and will look at you as a sucker.

I guess I'm lucky enough to work in an environment where that is most certainly not the case. We get bi-yearly reviews which directly impact our yearly raises/bonuses and they most certainly remember and note down everything I do, good and bad.

who would volunteer for more work w/o more compensation?!

Once again, people who want to show initiative and get raises/ promotions


I don't understand why people think its "get more money then do more work". No, it's do more work then get more money.

 

[Wonderful Pork]

Exactly and many companies don't offer that opportunity (and I'm sure many do)

Then it's time to take a hard look at whether its worth your time to continue working there. There are many factors (location, salary, etc) but it isn't impossible to leave though it might feel as it were.

I doubt a highly driven person would continue to work at a dead-end job unless there were external mitigating circumstances, which should factor in to the overall calculus.

 

[Vdubchaos]

I guess I'm lucky enough to work in an environment where that is most certainly not the case. We get bi-yearly reviews which directly impact our yearly raises/bonuses and they most certainly remember and note down everything I do, good and bad.

Sounds like you have a keeper. Yes there is plenty of companies that have their shit together.....and for every one of those there is 5-10 that don't hehe

I don't understand why people think its "get more money then do more work". No, it's do more work then get more money.

I don't agree with that. Especially after watching countless managers exploiting their resources and driving them to the ground.

(I get a pretty good sideline view in my profession)

Few people I work with now that had to put up a GREAT fight to get the raise they deserved.......they did 80k type of a job for 40-50k......for few years, then Manager threw some change at them hehe.

 

[gorcorps]

Guy sounds like a dick, but maybe he'll straighten up now that he knows you have an issue. The one talk should be all you need and now you can see if he'll turn it around. Also, give him more to do apparently. That last part still throws me for a loop, because where I work we're very self led. If I get done with some work, I go out to find out what else needs attention (because there's always something). But if it's the type of job that requires things to be assigned to them, I guess assign more.

 

[Vdubchaos]

Then it's time to take a hard look at whether its worth your time to continue working there. There are many factors (location, salary, etc) but it isn't impossible to leave though it might feel as it were.

I doubt a highly driven person would continue to work at a dead-end job unless there were external mitigating circumstances, which should factor in to the overall calculus.

You are assuming I care about the opportunity or want to climb ladders etc.

I don't. I'm happy where I am and pretty comfortable (many reasons for that). Especially since in my profession finding a job that doesn't require travel is next to impossible.

 

[NesuD]

If you have assigned him a workload comparable to his coworkers and he is completing it all on time and at a comparable or better level of quality than that of his peers then he has delivered. I personally have no issue with long lunches, late arrivals, or leaving early in that situation. As his manager it is your call as to whether he stays the full eight each day but if you are going to require that it is on you to make that clear. I would not increase his workload over what is expected of everyone else just to fill his time without appropriate compensation. Fact is I have worked in both tightly regulated workplaces and highly flexible workplaces and rigidly enforced work hours more often than not turned out to be more about control than anything else and did not contribute to overall productivity in any way.

I would say tell him exactly what you want and leave it at that. As long as he does good work it's not that big a deal.

 

[darkxshade]

Once again, people who want to show initiative and get raises/ promotions I don't understand why people think its "get more money then do more work". No, it's do more work then get more money.

Not all work places are like that. In my first job, several people had left including my immediate manager who I were friends with and I covered for them by taking on their workload. What did the VP do? Well, he didn't give me a raise or any recognition but he was happy that I was holding everything together so that he can hire replacements with a higher starting salaries than me. He did promote some other members of other groups(favortism). I resigned shortly after.

Coming out of college, I was very driven and hard working and it bit me in the ass. It was a great lesson being disenchanted with the fact that working hard and taking on more responsibilities guarantees any upward mobility.

 

[PowerYoga]

I guess I'm lucky enough to work in an environment where that is most certainly not the case. We get bi-yearly reviews which directly impact our yearly raises/bonuses and they most certainly remember and note down everything I do, good and bad.

You're lucky. Lots of places have no accountability especially in major companies.

Once again, people who want to show initiative and get raises/ promotions

I don't understand why people think its "get more money then do more work". No, it's do more work then get more money.

In many places, you do more work you don't get more money, especially if you're salaried. Some people think its ok to work you for 60-70 hours a week because you're salaried and so they don't have to pay you overtime.

Amount of effort does not always equal the output in reward especially in today's job place. The only option for advancement oftentimes is to quit and find a better job.

short answer to op's problem: give him more work. Why is that so hard? It's your job to manage him.

 

[tfinch2]

Yeah, I'm going to need you to twiddle your thumbs at your desk for the full eight hours, even if your work is done. That'd be great.

 

[Ns1]

You are assuming I care about the opportunity or want to climb ladders etc.

That's pretty much the key here - if you're happy with where you are you're absolutely right: there is no reason to do more than you have to. For driven individuals who want to climb the ladder, you gotta learn how to play the game - do killer work, go above and beyond, impress the right people.

Not all work places are like that. In my first job, several people had left including my immediate manager who I were friends with and I covered for them by taking on their workload. What did the VP do? Well, he didn't give me a raise or any recognition but he was happy that I was holding everything together so that he can hire replacements with a higher starting salaries than me. He did promote some other members of other groups(favortism). I resigned shortly after.

Coming out of college, I was very driven and hard working and it bit me in the ass. It was a great lesson being disenchanted with the fact that working hard and taking on more responsibilities guarantees any upward mobility.

Amount of effort does not always equal the output in reward especially in today's job place. The only option for advancement oftentimes is to quit and find a better job.

You're right - going above and beyond does not always lead to success, if you define success as more money/power. However, performing par for the course is definitely NOT the way to get ahead.

Personally, even if I don't get more money/power right away I want to impress people and have them remember me. That way I will be able to use them as GOOD references, or call them up when I need a job.

 

[rudeguy]

I guess I'm lucky enough to work in an environment where that is most certainly not the case. We get bi-yearly reviews which directly impact our yearly raises/bonuses and they most certainly remember and note down everything I do, good and bad.

admit it...all you do is bring in pictures of Corgi's to distract them.

 

[Ns1]

admit it...all you do is bring in pictures of Corgi's to distract them.

if it were only so easy...

 

[CountZero]

His work is of average quality and timeliness. Sometimes makes careless mistakes, other times does very impressive work.



Not a parody.

I'm sure that's what he's thinking, though. A professional with 10 years experience should do as little as possible unless someone's looking over his shoulder.

I'm not a babysitter. I have as much work to do as he and the others in the group. I don't stand at the door and see when they come in, I don't pull their badge times, I don't time their lunches. They get paid a lot of money and are to act as professionals.

It's quite possible that attitude is outdated but I focus my energies on the things I get measured on, and trust the others in the group are grownups and given their experience they know what they are expected to do. During the quarterly reviews I always ask if they are OK with the workload they have, he always said it was OK. I never imagined "OK" could mean "I need more work to keep me busy."

Ignore the hours worked, are you happy with the amount/quality of work he gets done? If he had been "working" for exactly 40 hours come review time would you rate him high or low on productivity? He is focusing on what he gets measured on as well, unless you measure hours worked which apparently you don't. Are your superiors questioning the productivity of your team?

I'd also question his trajectory, if he claims to want to move up (whatever that means in your case) this is a red flag. If he is happy where he is and before you counted hours you were also happy with his output then I don't see a huge problem. Bringing it up is not a bad thing but I would've treaded carefully to steer it less from "you should tell me" to "if you have extra hours I have stuff that needs to get done".

 

[Vdubchaos]

Not all work places are like that. In my first job, several people had left including my immediate manager who I were friends with and I covered for them by taking on their workload. What did the VP do? Well, he didn't give me a raise or any recognition but he was happy that I was holding everything together so that he can hire replacements with a higher starting salaries than me. He did promote some other members of other groups(favortism). I resigned shortly after.

Coming out of college, I was very driven and hard working and it bit me in the ass. It was a great lesson being disenchanted with the fact that working hard and taking on more responsibilities guarantees any upward mobility.

You and countless others.

I see SO many driven people come thru the door and try so hard ONLY to be hit with a BIG HAMMER right on the head.

That's pretty much the key here - if you're happy with where you are you're absolutely right: there is no reason to do more than you have to. For driven individuals who want to climb the ladder, you gotta learn how to play the game - do killer work, go above and beyond, impress the right people.

I've been there and have seen 100s in that position as well.

Give it time

 

[Ns1]

You and countless others.

I see SO many driven people come thru the door and try so hard ONLY to be hit with a BIG HAMMER right on the head.

driven people find a new door, complacent people stay put.