YART: welfare recipiant has a Scion TC???

[quakefiend420]

Originally posted by: Eli
It is NOT the peoples fault. It is human nature to take advantage of what is given to you.

thats exactly what makes it liberal thinking...how can you not hold people responsible for their own actions?

i understand how people are, and why they will take the handout...but, it doesn't make it right...

 

[quakefiend420]

Originally posted by: BlueWeasel
That poll isn't exactly true to the point of this thread. I don't feel that people on welfare should give up their car, but disagree with those using the welfare funds to purchase newer model cars or pimp out the existing cars.

exactly...they shouldn't be made to sell their 95 civic...but if they drive a 2004 cadillac, well...

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: quakefiend420

Originally posted by: Eli
What I'm saying is, have you looked to see if you qualify for any government assistance?

If you were looking for school grants, obviously you would only pay attention to the grant programs you qualified for, right? You would be ecstatic if there were some whos rules were so lienent that you easily qualified for them!

no, i haven't...because i don't need government assistance...i'm not trying to be high and mighty here, i'm not rich...and honestly i probably could qualify for something...but the point is i'm not going to freeload off the american taxpayers if i don't absolutely have to...

and you're equating education grants to welfare? come on now...the educational grants are there to help make you a productive citizen and taxpayer that doesn't require the government to support you...the welfare benefits encourage people to do exactly the opposite

No no.. The government grant analogy was only about the money.

If the money is there, it needs to be given out. If the people in charge of the system have to give a single $50,000 grant, they are going to be more strict than if they have 500,000,000 to give out many thousands of grants...

It's up to the people in charge of the system to decide the rules. Again, I want to know if the people that REALLY need assistance are NOT getting it because of the people taking advantage of the system.

If they are, that means there is too much money available and we either need to tighten up the rules and spend it elsewhere, or perhaps give the people who really qualify more. Can't at least one of you "anti-liberal" thinkers agree with that?

 

[dxkj]

Originally posted by: Juice Box
Scions are very reasonably priced cars....and it may have been a gift or a prize...you dont know and cant pass judgement till you know how she got it.

My cousins who were on welfare always had nicer toys, better cars(their family), and nicer stuff in general than my two parents who worked full time at lowish paying jobs.


Doesnt make much !@$# sense if you ask me.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Eli
It is NOT the peoples fault. It is human nature to take advantage of what is given to you.

How is it not there fault~!?

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: quakefiend420

Originally posted by: Eli
It is NOT the peoples fault. It is human nature to take advantage of what is given to you.

thats exactly what makes it liberal thinking...how can you not hold people responsible for their own actions?

i understand how people are, and why they will take the handout...but, it doesn't make it right...

Hmm, I see, interesting.

I still don't understand though. So it's my what, moral obligation to decide whether I need assistance or not, even though the rules are already clearly laid out for me?...

The rules are set. The people are saying, "OK.. I agree to your rules."

Why is that the peoples fault?

 

[quakefiend420]

Originally posted by: Eli
It's up to the people in charge of the system to decide the rules. Again, I want to know if the people that REALLY need assistance are NOT getting it because of the people taking advantage of the system.

If they are not, that means there is too much money available and we either need to tighten up the rules and spend it elsewhere, or perhaps give the people who really qualify more. Can't at least one of you "anti-liberal" thinkers agree with that?

that i agree with

 

[BlueWeasel]

Originally posted by: quakefiend420

Originally posted by: BlueWeasel
That poll isn't exactly true to the point of this thread. I don't feel that people on welfare should give up their car, but disagree with those using the welfare funds to purchase newer model cars or pimp out the existing cars.

exactly...they shouldn't be made to sell their 95 civic...but if they drive a 2004 cadillac, well...

Bingo. :thumbsup:

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: Eli

Is it really a problem? Are the people that really need Welfare not getting it? If not, then you all don't have anything to bitch about EXCEPT the fact that the welfare rules need to be changed. Let's place the blame correctly here, OK?

It is NOT the peoples fault. It is human nature to take advantage of what is given to you.

I'm saying that these are people that I find undesirable, and to make matters worse, *I* have to pay these people to live.

They are leeches on society. They consume more than they produce.

Liberal thinking says that we're all human and we must all take care of each other. I strongly disgree. While we're all human, I shouldn't be forced to take care of someone that I don't like. It's my money, I earned it. They didn't, they aren't entitled to it.

They should either:

1. Get a job like everyone else and stop spending more than they make
2. Act more decent so that people WANT to donate money to them
3. Become self sufficient so that they are not a burden
4. Shrivel up and die.

 

[Leper Messiah]

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: m2kewl

Originally posted by: L3p3rM355i4h
hey, if the gov't is going to give me free money, I'm not just going to turn it down...

you actually think it's free? you know YOUR taxes pay for their stuff.

It's free to THEM, silly.

exactly. I was being a wee bit facetous with my statement. Bear with me. 'k?

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: Eli
It is NOT the peoples fault. It is human nature to take advantage of what is given to you.

How is it not there fault~!?

Because the programs rules have already been laid out.

 

[FoBoT]

the USDA which runs the food stamp program is currently running radio ads to try and get more people signed up. the radio ad said that only about half of those eligible are getting food stamps.

so basically, your tax dollar is being used to solicit more people to sign up for welfare

 

[quakefiend420]

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: quakefiend420

Originally posted by: Eli
It is NOT the peoples fault. It is human nature to take advantage of what is given to you.

thats exactly what makes it liberal thinking...how can you not hold people responsible for their own actions?

i understand how people are, and why they will take the handout...but, it doesn't make it right...

Hmm, I see, interesting.

I still don't understand though. So it's my what, moral obligation to decide whether I need assistance or not, even though the rules are already clearly laid out for me?...

The rules are set. The people are saying, "OK.. I agree to your rules."

Why is that the peoples fault?

because the whole reason for the welfare system is to provide help to those who need it...if you can afford luxury items such as a brand new car...you obviously don't need it, and you should know that...it doesn't take a lot of common sense to determine whether or not you really need the assistance you're getting...the problem is a lot of people don't understand the difference between need and want...

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: FoBoT
the USDA which runs the food stamp program is currently running radio ads to try and get more people signed up. the radio ad said that only about half of those eligible are getting food stamps.

so basically, your tax dollar is being used to solicit more people to sign up for welfare

Exactly.

I don't think many of you are understanding that if the money is not given out, it does not get used(for its intended purpose).

So either the rules are so lienient because they have plenty of money to give everybody, or people that really need it are not getting it. Since the rules are so lienient, I'm kinda doubting the latter.

 

[quakefiend420]

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: Eli
It is NOT the peoples fault. It is human nature to take advantage of what is given to you.

How is it not there fault~!?

Because the programs rules have already been laid out.

so if the government brought about a program where it was legal to steal from one person a year so long as you filled out the proper paperwork and met the requirements, you would enroll and take full advantage of it, assuming you qualify, of course....knowing its wrong?

yes i'm being somewhat extreme here, but i'm trying to make a point

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: quakefiend420

exactly...they shouldn't be made to sell their 95 civic...

Sure they should.

You have certain assets, and if you owe someone money you have to sell off your assets. If you own a house and a car, and the bill collector comes knocking and says that you owe $200k, you're forced to sell your house and car, since that value isn't really yours, it's indebted to someone else.

I have lots of toys. I have a twin turbo Z, a jet ski, a RC helicopter, computers, etc. If I suddenly lost my job and couldn't afford to live, what should I do? I can't sit there with my toys and expect someone else to pay for me to live, I have to sell that stuff so I can feed myself.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: quakefiend420

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: quakefiend420

Originally posted by: Eli
It is NOT the peoples fault. It is human nature to take advantage of what is given to you.

thats exactly what makes it liberal thinking...how can you not hold people responsible for their own actions?

i understand how people are, and why they will take the handout...but, it doesn't make it right...

Hmm, I see, interesting.

I still don't understand though. So it's my what, moral obligation to decide whether I need assistance or not, even though the rules are already clearly laid out for me?...

The rules are set. The people are saying, "OK.. I agree to your rules."

Why is that the peoples fault?

because the whole reason for the welfare system is to provide help to those who need it...if you can afford luxury items such as a brand new car...you obviously don't need it, and you should know that...it doesn't take a lot of common sense to determine whether or not you really need the assistance you're getting...the problem is a lot of people don't understand the difference between need and want...

yeap pretty much hit the nail on the head.

 

[MagicConch]

I think that some corruption in all levels of govt, whether it be social programs like welfare, political support (like senator's pension), or military spending. Hardworking taxpayers pay for free-loaders and thiefs in all layers of govt, and I doubt it's possible to effectively use spending allocation as a tool to irradicate them. We have less corruption than many countries though IMO.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: quakefiend420

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: quakefiend420

Originally posted by: Eli
It is NOT the peoples fault. It is human nature to take advantage of what is given to you.

thats exactly what makes it liberal thinking...how can you not hold people responsible for their own actions?

i understand how people are, and why they will take the handout...but, it doesn't make it right...

Hmm, I see, interesting.

I still don't understand though. So it's my what, moral obligation to decide whether I need assistance or not, even though the rules are already clearly laid out for me?...

The rules are set. The people are saying, "OK.. I agree to your rules."

Why is that the peoples fault?

because the whole reason for the welfare system is to provide help to those who need it...if you can afford luxury items such as a brand new car...you obviously don't need it, and you should know that...it doesn't take a lot of common sense to determine whether or not you really need the assistance you're getting...the problem is a lot of people don't understand the difference between need and want...

LOL, I understand that.. but, obviously, you can't leave it to people to make that distinction... Everybody will take advantage of what they are given.

That's what rules and regulations are FOR!...

It's like saying we may as well remove all speed limit signs and rules because people just know they shouldn't go fast.

 

[quakefiend420]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: quakefiend420

exactly...they shouldn't be made to sell their 95 civic...

Sure they should.

You have certain assets, and if you owe someone money you have to sell off your assets. If you own a house and a car, and the bill collector comes knocking and says that you owe $200k, you're forced to sell your house and car, since that value isn't really yours, it's indebted to someone else.

I have lots of toys. I have a twin turbo Z, a jet ski, a RC helicopter, computers, etc. If I suddenly lost my job and couldn't afford to live, what should I do? I can't sit there with my toys and expect someone else to pay for me to live, I have to sell that stuff so I can feed myself.

well...the reason i say that, is not having a vehicle makes it that much harder to find and keep a job, which means they're even more likely to stay on welfare

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: Eli


It's up to the people in charge of the system to decide the rules. Again, I want to know if the people that REALLY need assistance are NOT getting it because of the people taking advantage of the system.

But it doesn't work that way. Instead of the welfare system running out of money, they simply increase everyone's taxes to pay for it.

In other words, instead of one welfare applicant being denied because of the welfare abusers, they all get their money- WE just end up paying for it.

 

[shilala]

In PA, people can get 5 years of cash assistance. At that point, they must become employed or employable. They can become employable by going to college or trade school, and it will be paid by the welfare department. They will also continue to get cash assistance as long as they are going to school. They will also get a car if they qualify.

The hope here is that by educating a few scumbags and making them responsible human beings, it will break the cycle that welfare creates. Welfare breeds welfare. If you can break the cycle you can save money in the long run.

Cash assistance aside, they can still get housing subsidy, food stamps, and health insurance regardless of employment status.

They can have it. I'd rather take care of myself. I don't have to fill out any forms, kiss any ass, and I can get whatever I want whenever I want.
I don't begrudge what welfare people get any more than I begrudge what people much wealthier than myself have.
If I want more, I can get it. I don't want any more.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: FoBoT
the USDA which runs the food stamp program is currently running radio ads to try and get more people signed up. the radio ad said that only about half of those eligible are getting food stamps.

so basically, your tax dollar is being used to solicit more people to sign up for welfare

Exactly.

I don't think many of you are understanding that if the money is not given out, it does not get used(for its intended purpose).

So either the rules are so lienient because they have plenty of money to give everybody, or people that really need it are not getting it. Since the rules are so lienient, I'm kinda doubting the latter.

if they have so much extra money that they dont have enough people to take it great! then take that money and put it other resources.

Tax revenu is not a limitless recource.

If poeple cant help themsevles then why should we help them? I have no trouble helping someone out who has fallen on hard times. but i do expect them to bust there rear end trying ot get another job. Even if that job does not pay as much as the old one did. If that means selling teh new lexus and the $300k+ house for something cheaper then do it.

 

[quakefiend420]

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: quakefiend420

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: quakefiend420

Originally posted by: Eli
It is NOT the peoples fault. It is human nature to take advantage of what is given to you.

thats exactly what makes it liberal thinking...how can you not hold people responsible for their own actions?

i understand how people are, and why they will take the handout...but, it doesn't make it right...

Hmm, I see, interesting.

I still don't understand though. So it's my what, moral obligation to decide whether I need assistance or not, even though the rules are already clearly laid out for me?...

The rules are set. The people are saying, "OK.. I agree to your rules."

Why is that the peoples fault?

because the whole reason for the welfare system is to provide help to those who need it...if you can afford luxury items such as a brand new car...you obviously don't need it, and you should know that...it doesn't take a lot of common sense to determine whether or not you really need the assistance you're getting...the problem is a lot of people don't understand the difference between need and want...

LOL, I understand that.. but, obviously, you can't leave it to people to make that distinction... Everybody will take advantage of what they are given.

That's what rules and regulations are FOR!...

It's like saying we may as well remove all speed limit signs and rules because people just know they shouldn't go fast.

i never said we should remove the rules...what i'm saying is people should know better than to drive 70mph in a blizzard, even though the speed limit sign says they can drive that fast...

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ

Originally posted by: Eli


It's up to the people in charge of the system to decide the rules. Again, I want to know if the people that REALLY need assistance are NOT getting it because of the people taking advantage of the system.

But it doesn't work that way. Instead of the welfare system running out of money, they simply increase everyone's taxes to pay for it.

In other words, instead of one welfare applicant being denied because of the welfare abusers, they all get their money- WE just end up paying for it.

Ah ha! I see, now we're getting somewhere.

Wow, that would appear to be a completely different issue entirely.... Not really sure how to tackle that one. If that is indeed the way it works, then yes.. that is a problem.

I agree that the system needs to be changed, but I still firmly believe that it is the systems fault that it is abused. If you don't want people to abuse it, you need to remove that ability.