X-COM: Enemy Unknown remake by 2K / Firaxis!

[GoodRevrnd]

I am WAY not happy about those points you mentioned, ESPECIALLY the one base thing. That was an important aspect about getting better coverage vs spreading yourself too thin and not being able to defend those assets. I suppose in reality you only needed 2 working bases and the rest were just radar bases, but still.

I'm not thrilled about the time units thing. Adding classes to the soldiers sounds awesome, but in some ways I worry about TU removal cutting down on variety unless some classes can "do more" (like move further) with their turns than others. On the bright side this will help curb the end game super soldiers that can cover obscenely massive ground.

Abstracted ammo.... EGH.... idk man. With alien weapons it was there as a check on you. Are they going to abstract more powerful weapons like rockets and blaster bombs? That would just be OP.

And then there's this:

You start out with only 4 soldiers and then upgrade your limit from there.

They better define "limit" and "upgrade" because I fucking hate this idea as it sounds. I already slightly specialized soldiers in the original XCOM and if they have classes now it will be even more destructive to not be able to maintain a good soldier surplus that you keep evenly trained up and swap in and out for different missions.

Other than these sticking points it sounds like they're adding a lot of cool features I'm looking forward to.

 

[lozina]

And then there's this:

They better define "limit" and "upgrade" because I fucking hate this idea as it sounds. I already slightly specialized soldiers in the original XCOM and if they have classes now it will be even more destructive to not be able to maintain a good soldier surplus that you keep evenly trained up and swap in and out for different missions.

Yikes! I missed that one ...

That's a TERRIBLE decision! The thing that was so cool about the original XCOM was you take a large team of rookie soldiers and most of them get themselves killed against the sheer overwhelming power of the aliens. Whoever makes it out passes the gauntlet and is on their way to becoming part of your elite forces.

So if we only have a team of 4 soldiers that would mean the aliens are either going to be total whimps or our soldiers will start off as super soldiers - meaning it takes multiple aliens multiple shots to kill one XCOM soldier which would just be silly especially early game...

 

[lozina]

P.S. New screenie discovered: GEOSCAPE

[Edit] Another new screenie discovered:

Looks pretty nice I just dont like the "chunky" art style. Why do so many games go for this style? It makes it too cartoony and unrealstic... (Those are Mutons, BTW)

 

[lozina]

More screens

 

[LurkerPrime]

I was a huge fan of the original x-com series. I've been waiting for a true remake of the game forever. This seems like it might come close, but there are a few things in that list that I'm not sure I'll like or have concerns about:

Starting with only 4 soldiers: As long as I can buy as many more as I want after the start of the game and have the ability to at least bring 8 + a tank along to missions with my starting skyranger I'll be ok. To be honest I usually only used maybe 8 total guys in the end game of x-com with 4 or so being super soldiers, 2-3 psi guys and 1 smuck to shoot blaster bombs.

No time units: This is what differentiated your recruits from your experienced guys. Action points (time units, etc...) are what make a turn based game a turn based game. This is something that will most likely make this game not feel anything like an x-com game and end up being just like all the other bastardizations out there.

Unlimited ammo: Not liking this at all. Ammo was a limiting factor on newer alien tech. Was also why getting laser rifles at the start was worthwhile just to save on ammo costs. If ammo is unlimited every guy in my squad will have a blaster bomb rifle if it exists in the game, no point not to. The only reason I usually didn't do this in the original is that I didn't want to spend my precious elerium making the damn ammo. In addition ammo took up space on your marines which you had to plan out. You knew your rocket launcher guy only had 3 rockets in his backback, so you had to make those shots count (not to mention the rockets weren't cheap).

One main base: This amazing doesn't bother me all that much since you can still have satellite bases that can have hangers and radar coverage. Its all I basically used the other bases for anyway. I wonder how you'll defend these satellite bases. At least in the original if you didn't build defenses and/or have soldiers at your bases, you risked the aliens bulldozing it.

xp/perks/classes: While not in the original since your soldiers skills increases through use, I like this concept. As long as they still dole out xp based off actions so you can't just leave a guy in the ship the whole time and he levels up.

 

[NTAC]

Lets keep the freak out to a minimum till we find out more details

The no time units is interesting, I need to know more about it before I make a decision.

I like the idea of soldiers molding into specific classes, that doesn't bother me.

The one base thing is meh, at first it was disappointing, but thinking back on the original, it was more of a haste than anything to bring up a second base. I like the radar installation thing much better, you don't really need more than one base.

The soldier limit won't be a problem, I doubt we will be limited to 4 soldiers for very long at all, I'm sure we'll have the liberty to buy many soldiers.

Everything else looks great, I LOVE the grapling hook idea, that the sniper class can scale buildings, that's pretty bad ass, I've always wanted that ability.

I also want more info on the destructible environments... will it be like the original game where you can completely take out the 1st floor and the 2nd floor still hovers in mid air, or will an entire structure come crashing down to the ground if you take out the supports? That would be pretty cool.

I'm torn on the ammo. On one hand, its a good realistic thing to worry about, those tense moments when you get the jump on the alien only to find that ... OH NO, I'm out of ammo!! Then someone can maybe relay toss you the ammo that you need, and you'd have just enough TUs to lock and load and put a bullet in the bastards head...

On the other hand, it was annoying to keep track of, and load out every freaking time we went on missions, more ammo, I feel like my entire inventory was nothing but ammo ammo ammo ammo, so I think I'll get over it very quickly.

 

[GoodRevrnd]

Mission loadouts were annoying because the game did not remember what soldiers carried what so you had to redo it each time. There is actually a mod that fixes this. Pre laser weapons this mod has no effect. Once you hit beginning plasma and midgame though it was always a choice about how much you expended and not using your elerium to manufacture anything you absolutely didn't need to.

That's a good point about the experienced soldier TUs. I figured your vets would just move further per turn than the rookies, but with that system a rookie will still shoot just as much as a vet does. =/

 

[Qbah]

Those screens look awesome! Thanks for posting!

Love the style too. And I'm looking forward to the things they are planning to change. I'm just a bit hesitant on the ammo thing, but NTAC sums up the issue from the last game - so much ammo to think about and distribute before every mission.

Love the perk and exp ideas!

All in all I'm totally pumped for it

That's a good point about the experienced soldier TUs. I figured your vets would just move further per turn than the rookies, but with that system a rookie will still shoot just as much as a vet does. =/

You don't know that. Maybe the experienced soldiers will get perks to shoot more times or walk more distance? Plenty of ways to make experienced members stand out from the newbie ones with perks.

 

[Martimus]

One of the major reasons for having multiple bases was to make sure you could get to the missions in time. A base in the US wouldn't get you to Australia before the terror mission was over, as an example.

The other major reason was to have extra guys incase the aliens found your base and annihilated you in the early game.

I had multiple interceptor/radar bases as well, and a psyonics base.

The first point could be moot if they make it so that you can travel anywhere without worrying about time or fuel. The second would be if they make the aliens weaker, or just make it so they couldn't attack you. I don't like either of these options, but it will probably still be fun.

 

[NTAC]

Mission loadouts were annoying because the game did not remember what soldiers carried what so you had to redo it each time. There is actually a mod that fixes this. Pre laser weapons this mod has no effect. Once you hit beginning plasma and midgame though it was always a choice about how much you expended and not using your elerium to manufacture anything you absolutely didn't need to.

They remembered your loadouts after the patch, which is fine, and obviously they will reember your loadouts in this new game, but ammo goes away, so you'd have to constantly get more ammo and load it up in the load out, it still became tedious.

That's a good point about the experienced soldier TUs. I figured your vets would just move further per turn than the rookies, but with that system a rookie will still shoot just as much as a vet does. =/

You don't know this for sure.

One of the major reasons for having multiple bases was to make sure you could get to the missions in time. A base in the US wouldn't get you to Australia before the terror mission was over, as an example.

The other major reason was to have extra guys incase the aliens found your base and annihilated you in the early game.

I had multiple interceptor/radar bases as well, and a psyonics base.

The first point could be moot if they make it so that you can travel anywhere without worrying about time or fuel. The second would be if they make the aliens weaker, or just make it so they couldn't attack you. I don't like either of these options, but it will probably still be fun.

Obviously they won't force you to have 1 base and then not give you teh ability to cover the entire globe with ships, that would be silly.

I would be very upset if they removed the aliens ability to attack the human base, that was one of the best parts!!

 

[GoodRevrnd]

As long as there was ammo in your reserve stores, it would automatically replace what was used on the craft. You never needed to actually do anything extra to constantly reload ammo for missions.

Regarding the shooting frequency, they described a move-move, move-action, action-action system. I suppose there could be perks to get an extra "turn" or 2 for one shooting or something, but not strictly as they described it thus far.

 

[NTAC]

As long as there was ammo in your reserve stores, it would automatically replace what was used on the craft. You never needed to actually do anything extra to constantly reload ammo for missions.

Regarding the shooting frequency, they described a move-move, move-action, action-action system. I suppose there could be perks to get an extra "turn" or 2 for one shooting or something, but not strictly as they described it thus far.

I feel as if I still had ot mess around with the ammo load out, even if they automatically put it on the soldiers, they would never put it in the right place, always takikng up the wrong slot, etc...etc...

 

[GoodRevrnd]

Ya putting it on the ankles instead of the belt was kind of wonky, but with that mini-mod posted in the other thread it hard remembers where everything goes.

 

[lozina]

character customization screen?

 

[boozie]

It's nice to see I'm not the only one who has gotten frustrated with the tedium of some TFTD levels. I'm not necessarily an ADD gamer, but I always loved the landed/downed alien ship fights more than anything else. In UFO I could tough out the terrorist missions and even the base missions, but even the TFTD alien base missions were pretty long.

I vaguely remember artifact missions, were those two-phased as well? I feel ashamed to admin I've beaten UFO 2-3 times and TFTD 0.

 

[NTAC]

It's nice to see I'm not the only one who has gotten frustrated with the tedium of some TFTD levels. I'm not necessarily an ADD gamer, but I always loved the landed/downed alien ship fights more than anything else. In UFO I could tough out the terrorist missions and even the base missions, but even the TFTD alien base missions were pretty long.

I vaguely remember artifact missions, were those two-phased as well? I feel ashamed to admin I've beaten UFO 2-3 times and TFTD 0.

TFTD Ship (water ships) missions were the most annoying by far... took FOREVER and those little fckers would hide in closets and shit, OMG, that was annoying.

TFTD Alien base missions were also kind of annoying after a while, but not as bad..

TFTD was just a really hard game to boot, I don't think I beat that one either. I did like the story and the idea.

 

[boozie]

TFTD Ship (water ships) missions were the most annoying by far... took FOREVER and those little fckers would hide in closets and shit, OMG, that was annoying.

I think we're on the same page but i just wanted to clarify the cruise ships were the worst. My favorite part of the game was the ships that you shot down and attacked underwater.

Even with hacked dudes I don't think I can go back and play through the whole TFTD game sadly.

 

[lozina]

TFTD Ship (water ships) missions were the most annoying by far... took FOREVER and those little fckers would hide in closets and shit, OMG, that was annoying.

LoL yeah I almost forgot about that... searching through an entire giant ship to find the frickin lobster was hiding in the last closet you check

 

[NTAC]

LoL yeah I almost forgot about that... searching through an entire giant ship to find the frickin lobster was hiding in the last closet you check

Yep then you shoot the lobster 15 times in the face, and he just smiles and takes you down with one shot... oh those lobsters were a bitch!!!

 

[NTAC]

I'm LOVING this screen shot:
http://www.strategycore.co.uk/forums/uploads/monthly_01_2012/post-503-1326478815.jpg

OH and this one:
http://www.strategycore.co.uk/forums/uploads/monthly_01_2012/post-503-1326478830.jpg

Notice the drop of rain splattering on the Soldiers shoulder... oh man, this is looking EXCELLENT!

 

[GoodRevrnd]

I'm not really a fan of the way the Mutons look. That hump armor looks a little too terrestrial to me. I would have liked to see some nice rough alien looking thick green skin with organic looking armor plates directly grafted into it in different areas. Minor sticking point.

Now from the second screenshot, something that GREATLY concerns me--low damage and hit point values. This is done in the name of simplifying and streamlining, but this was also THE main thing that broke Civ V. The oversimplification of resource values made it flat out impossible to balance the economy, buildings and tile improvements. The best mods went as far as tripling (or more) food/gold/prod values and tweaking from there.

Now I'm slightly less worried about the impact this will have on XCOM but it still has me concerned.

 

[iCyborg]

Some of the screenshots look great.
But some earlier stuff in the thread is worrying me. I liked having a couple bases, building a couple strong teams, and then selecting a "dream team" near the end. Or buying like 50 soldiers and then sacking all but a few based on their stats, especially those that can't be leveled like bravery, psionic strength etc. And getting rid of TUs? "Abstracting" ammos away? Wtf? Graphics looks great and all, but I feel they are "streamlining" and "abstracting away" too much here. I really don't want any major gameplay changes - up-to-date graphics, less clunky/tedious UI, no annoying bugs, perhaps a bit more variety in missions, aliens, research etc, that's about it...

 

[lozina]

Yep then you shoot the lobster 15 times in the face, and he just smiles and takes you down with one shot... oh those lobsters were a bitch!!!

Heh heh, yes exactly!

I didnt have much problem with them once I had soldiers with a lot of TU's and they were equipped with those powered swords- I called them vorpal swords but I dont remember their game name. Those blades would slice through anything like butter.

 

[postmortemIA]

I think some of you are missing the target audience for this game. It is not people who already played it almost 20 yrs ago (because such people are at least 35 yrs old now, and some of them are not gaming anymore), but new generation of players ... hence making it for consoles as well. In other words, difference between games will not irritate new players.

 

[GoodRevrnd]

Then the lead designer shouldn't go on video proclaiming "challenging gameplay is having a revival."