Yep... kinda where I lost interest, too.
The lecture would have been inappropriate for a public school, but you chose to teach at a private Christian school. This is part of the package.
Yep... kinda where I lost interest, too.
The lecture would have been inappropriate for a public school, but you chose to teach at a private Christian school. This is part of the package.
Cerpin Taxt
Lifer
- Feb 23, 2005
- 11,940
- 542
- 126
Evolution is a fact, and a theory. Your attempt to make a distinction betrays an ignorance of the meaning of the word "theory" in a scientific context.
DainBramaged
Lifer
- Jun 19, 2003
- 23,454
- 41
- 91
Cerpin Taxt
Lifer
- Feb 23, 2005
- 11,940
- 542
- 126
Quite not. It is a fact, and a theory. For that matter, the theory of gravity is incomplete, and much moreso than the theory of evolution.
Originally posted by: TheChort
the school brings in a priest to talk about creationism :| :|
The school is a private christian affiliated school with about 800 students from K-12. I teach Chem, AP Chem and AP Bio to 10-12th graders. So this morning i find out about an assembly during 4th period. The assembly is broken up to 2 classes at a time. So it's a small group. I think to myself, "great, 1 hour break!" How wrong I was.
I walk in the auditorium to find out that it's a priest. He steps up and says he's only gonna talk for 5 minutes and the rest will be a debate. Ok, now I've got this a nervous optimism. Maybe things will be ok. I mean he did mention the golden word: debate. He starts off talking about the importance of us talking to each other, and that he's here to help people open up their minds, or something like that. I can never remember cliche openings like that.
Ok, so now is a good time to start up the 'Blind Date' countdown timer. You know, the one that goes something like this: "this date goes downhill in 3(beep)...2(beep)...1(beep)....
"Ok kids, now remember, God created you, and everything around you. People did not come from monkeys"
Oh ... no .... he ... didn't!
All I can remember at this point is some of my bio students turning to look at me, and me shaking my head. (I should insert the disclaimer that I DO introduce all possible theories to my students, including alien 'impregnation' of the planet)
So the rest of the lecture is a blur to me, because really it took everything in me not to get up and leave. I vaguely remember students asking questions and the priest shutting them down.
Student: But if Adam and Eve had only two sons, how did they reproduce
Priest: They had many, many children, but the Bible only writes about two because they were relevant to the story. The story has been simplified so even children can understand it.
Student: What do you think of Homosexuality?
Priest: Homosexuality is wrong. When God created us, he told us to have children. Gay people can't have children. But it has always been around, and nowadays people are parading it as if it is a good thing. If people keep this up, I suppose one day it will also be acceptable to marry your dog.
I think i'll go have a talk with the teacher who organized this, on monday.
CLIFFS:
- Small School (800 ppl k-12)
- I teach bio
- Guest lecturer is a priest
- He says we DID NOT come from monkeys in the first 2 minutes of his speech.
- The rest of the lecture is a joke
Disclaimer: I have considerable respect for religions. My issue was specifically with this man. I would ask that people who post here to keep it respectable.
EDIT:
After reading all the responses I've gotten, I realize that I have not come across the way i intended.
First, and foremost, my issue is not with teaching creationism, as I do that in my own class anyway. My issue is teaching anything as an absolute truth, when you can't know for sure wether it is or not.
Secondly, Just because a school is a private christian school, that doesn't exclude them from being progressive, and teaching their students all possible theories and modes of thought. I feel that is a fight i can comfortably take up. To those of you telling me to drop it, that it's not worth the fight, my response is, "Hey, it's a dirty job, but someone's gotta do it"
And finally, to all the people taking the time to attack me personally as a teacher, I have to say that in my short time working in this profession, I have seen enough teachers that just sit back and do anything they are told, that I cry a little bit inside when i think how little their students really learn anything about thinking freely, outside the box. Hey, i'm not perfect, and neither are your kids, but I'll be damned if i don't try my hardest to make sure these kids learn something that they can apply to their lives in a positive way.
He's right, you know. Humans didn't come from monkeys. They just have common ancestors.
This still comes down to the fact that a private Christian school brought in a priest to talk about some of the core principles of the school--God is the creator of the universe.
Your disagreement is absurd. You'd be better off leaving so you can teach in a public school.
Your disagreement is absurd. You'd be better off leaving so you can teach in a public school.
DrPizza
Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Wow. All these posts and no one mentioned that not all Christians believe in creationism. In fact, Pope Pius (whichever # he was... in the 1960's) accepted both the theory of evolution and the big bang. I also taught at a Christian school, and they had no problem with me teaching the big bang "theory." As far as I understand it, several Christian religions believe in both theories, but also believe that both were put into motion (or guided) by God. There is, and never will be empirical proof of God. God is not necessary to explain either theory; they stand on their own. But, science also cannot say that there isn't a God who has guided evolution and started the Big Bang.
To the OP, you should be better armed against such people... You probably could have quickly discredited this priest simply by pointing out that he obviously hasn't read much on evolution if he thinks that evolution means we evolved from monkeys. If the response was "I'm keeping it simple so that these children can understand," then attack that position as well, pointing out that he has no respect for the level of intelligence of the children; the children are capable of independent thought, etc.
To the OP, you should be better armed against such people... You probably could have quickly discredited this priest simply by pointing out that he obviously hasn't read much on evolution if he thinks that evolution means we evolved from monkeys. If the response was "I'm keeping it simple so that these children can understand," then attack that position as well, pointing out that he has no respect for the level of intelligence of the children; the children are capable of independent thought, etc.
TehMac
Diamond Member
- Aug 18, 2006
- 9,976
- 3
- 71
You're right, Science does not prove anything. It merely disproves. Things like religion cannot be disproved, but neither can they be proved. Your own experiences and choices as well as background are what your deciing factors are in choosing or shunning religion and faith.
I didn't have any opportunities on the spot to say anything. My role in the assembly was to keep the kids quiet. But what you mentioned is partly the approach I plan on taking on monday when I talk to the teacher that set this up .
Listen, in my opinion, you sound like every teacher I've had in college. I came from a small, private Christian K-12 school, so me going to a secular college was a giant, but much appreciated, wakeup. I'm a Christian, and on the first day of my history class, my professor (the biggest jacka$$ I've ever met) walks in and says, "Evolution is a FACT, not a theory, and anything else is bull$hit!". I hit the roof. You get mad because this guys says "We did not descend from monkeys", while I got mad at "Evolution is a fact" (the rest of the lecture, he bashed Christian with no remorse). You're right, it's not a bad thing to be progressive. I've since meshed my Christian values and beliefs to wehre they can accept evolution, no problem. But you get mad because this guy said one thing...calm down. Are you a Christian? If not, then why are you teaching a Christian school if you're gonna complain about someone doing this? You knew it was a possibility...
EDIT: Went back and read your EDIT:
Why was the rest of the lecture a joke? From the questions/answers you posted, it seems like all he did was tell what he believed. You say that he "shut them down" (them=students). That happens everywhere. The second someone ask a question where the speaker has a ready response, they do that. Period. It's sad, but true.
2x EDIT: If evolution is so true, what about the platypus? (Oh yeah, the card that any Creationist can play and win with)...I'm just kiddin...The platypus is an example of God's sense of humor...
EDIT: Went back and read your EDIT:
Why was the rest of the lecture a joke? From the questions/answers you posted, it seems like all he did was tell what he believed. You say that he "shut them down" (them=students). That happens everywhere. The second someone ask a question where the speaker has a ready response, they do that. Period. It's sad, but true.
2x EDIT: If evolution is so true, what about the platypus? (Oh yeah, the card that any Creationist can play and win with)...I'm just kiddin...The platypus is an example of God's sense of humor...
Originally posted by: DaveSimmons
Since it would only be an opinion, and one based on faith not facts, then perhaps he should be.
Radical atheists can be just as arrogant in their unjustified certainty as the radical Christians and Muslims.
Only we agnostics know the real truth about life, the universe and everything
I LoLd. As a Christian, radical Christians (Westboro Church, and I use the word church EXTREMELY liberally, there) and radical athiest make me so sad. When a debate happens, it has real potential sometimes, but it ALWAYS turns into a shouting match...
Good point! I think after so many years of college, I've gotten completely accustomed to most people (except the soapbox preachers) not pressuring others on the topic of religion. I guess I felt bringing religion into the classroom was a big no-no.
When I heard the priest's initial comments, it really discredited him in my mind, so of course, it became my opinion that anything he said after that was a waste. I did talk to some of my students afterwords, and they too said some negative things about him (whether i encouraged to say it, or not, I can't be sure)
BTW, the priest is orthodox (both religion and personality) so that had a lot to do with why i didn't like him. I mean, his personality turned me off because he was so old-worldish.
The nice thing (in my mind), is that some people feel it's OK to bring it in and that it does have a place, which makes (sometimes) for an interesting and scholarly debate.
Like you, I also discredited my professor because of his initial comments, and he has since proven to be a Christian bashing radical athiest. My chance to stand up comes next week.
yhelothar
Lifer
- Dec 11, 2002
- 18,409
- 39
- 91
Funny how you cite the platypus as your argument against evolution as it's very often used as evidence for evolution. Platypus, as you may know, is a mammal, but yet lays eggs like birds/reptiles. Evolution states that reptiles evolved to birds, then evolved to mammals. I hate to use the term transition species, as all species are transitional species, but the platypus is a good example of a transition species between birds and mammals.
What makes the platypus more interesting, is that it's only found in Australia. If you remember geology, the earth started out as one solid continent. Australia broke off with the rest of the world early on, so they have many more primitive type of animals, such as the platypus, kangaroos, and koalas, that have died out in the rest of the world due to placental mammals having a biological advantage. The fossil record confirms this as fossils of animals like the ones found in australia are found in other continents around the time when australia was interlinked.
Originally posted by: CadetLee
So in other words, you didn't even listen to him.
What!? My students agree with me to try and get more points from me? Maybe in other classes, but not mine!
where is evolution? I cannot see, hear, or touch it. It must not exist. (same way an atheist argues against creationism)
TRENDING THREADS
-
Discussion Zen 5 Speculation (EPYC Turin and Strix Point/Granite Ridge - Ryzen 9000)- Started by DisEnchantment
- Replies: 25K
-
Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes + WCL Discussion Threads
- Started by Tigerick
- Replies: 23K
-
Discussion Intel current and future Lakes & Rapids thread- Started by TheF34RChannel
- Replies: 23K
-
-
Facebook
Twitter