WIC program in jeopardy after shutdown

[surfsatwerk]

You find the idea that:



to be frighteningly disturbing?:hmm:

You're comfortable with single mothers and their children starving to death.

 

[nehalem256]

You're comfortable with single mothers and their children starving to death.

If women are comfortable with themselves and their children starving who am I to question to them?

Its called trusting women to make choices about their family. Why don't you trust women?

 

[thraashman]

You're comfortable with single mothers and their children starving to death.

You realize who you're talking to right? I'm positive he won't be happy until women in America enjoy the same rights limitations as those in Saudi Arabia. Hell, he probably thinks they let their women run wild over there. There may not be a more misogynistic human being in this country in fact.

 

[nehalem256]

You realize who you're talking to right? I'm positive he won't be happy until women in America enjoy the same rights limitations as those in Saudi Arabia. Hell, he probably thinks they let their women run wild over there. There may not be a more misogynistic human being in this country in fact.

I'm sorry but there is no right to extort money to pay for your poor life choices.

And I do not know why you are bringing up Saudi Arabia. I posted a link showing that South Korea lives by the basic values I am talking about.

EDIT: I think the real misogynists are the progressives who think that poor women are too stupid/selfish to change their behavior to keep their own children from starving.

 

[fskimospy]

I'm sorry but there is no right to extort money to pay for your poor life choices.

And I do not know why you are bringing up Saudi Arabia. I posted a link showing that South Korea lives by the basic values I am talking about.

How many people have to tell you that your views are stupid/reprehensible before you think about re-examining them?

 

[nehalem256]

How many people have to tell you that your views are stupid/reprehensible before you think about re-examining them?

So besides your anti-Canadian racism you are also racist against South Korea?

And how is treating women as actual adults instead of retarded children "stupid/reprehensible"?

 

[Theb]

WIC is an excellent assistance program. None of the people I've known have really abused it. My only gripe would be people getting formula who were capable of breast feeding. Although according to Wiki formula isn't one of the approved items anymore.

The food items provided by WIC are juice (single strength), milk, breakfast cereal, cheese, eggs, fruits and vegetables, whole wheat bread, whole grain items including brown rice and tortillas, fish (canned)(for Exclusively Breastfed Mothers), legumes (dry/canned), and peanut butter. The program also provides tofu, soy milk, and medical foods for children and women with various metabolic or other diseases. Since the white potato was deemed less nutritious than other produce, the WIC commission banned white potatoes from the list, causing protests.[12] Organic fruits, vegetables, legumes and grains are covered under WIC while organic milk, cheese, juice, peanut butter and eggs are not covered under the program.

I wish food stamps was modeled more like WIC. Particularly when I go into a convenience store and see things like Red Bull with an "Oregon Trail Card Eligible" sign next to it.

 

[Engineer]

How many people have to tell you that your views are stupid/reprehensible before you think about re-examining them?

How many times do I have to tell people that they are wasting their time before they believe it? :biggrin:

I wish food stamps was modeled more like WIC. Particularly when I go into a convenience store and see things like Red Bull with an "Oregon Trail Card Eligible" sign next to it.

I said the same above and agree.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

false

my dad got fired and couldnt find a job for a while and lost most everything 20 years ago

and with WIC we could at least eat food for a few months

Or he could have gotten a job. Then again who am I to say that. I mean being a convicted felon where 80% of the job market is closed to me off the bat and I still find work...

 

[Londo_Jowo]

WIC is an excellent assistance program. None of the people I've known have really abused it. My only gripe would be people getting formula who were capable of breast feeding. Although according to Wiki formula isn't one of the approved items anymore.

I wish food stamps was modeled more like WIC. Particularly when I go into a convenience store and see things like Red Bull with an "Oregon Trail Card Eligible" sign next to it.

I'm sure you would get some push back restricting food stamp purchases to healthy staple items though I'm all for it.

 

[werepossum]

WIC is one program i like.

A) have to have a child
b) only can be on program a set time.
c) they actually LIMIT how much you can get and what you can get.

Agreed. WIC is in my opinion about the best-structured government program imaginable.

Its obligatory.

LOL +1

Philosophically I agree completely, but the alternatives are all worse. Very few humans have the ability or opportunity to "forage in the wild", so the human equivalent is preying on other humans. Additionally, some animals always starve; that is not acceptable for humans.

You don't need to be kicked in the nuts to understand right and wrong. Do you have to have your house foreclosed on in order to have problems with irresponsible financial institutions needing bailouts?

Ironically your post is basically conceding I am right that WIC is about bailing out women for their poor life choices.

Sometimes it's poor life choices, sometimes it's just life. People change, and there's no sure way of knowing up front if a man (or a woman) will one day leave you with nothing. Women who decide to forgo a career to devote their time and energy to raising a child are especially vulnerable to being abandoned or widowed. Similarly, people die. We all SHOULD have life insurance to provide for minor children, but it can be hard to afford and there are damned few of us who have perfectly covered every imaginable contingency. And sometimes life just kicks you in the nuts. Say your employer is going through hard times and your hours and/or pay is reduced, then later your employer goes tits up. No matter how well prepared, your safety net will be reduced by the long period of reduced income. If it's a severe economic downturn like 2007-2008, or if the employer is a very large percentage of the area workforce, then finding a replacement job (let alone at the same income level) can be very, very difficult for even the hardest worker.

Now, prior to FDR Americans saved much more and lived much more frugally. This is also true of nations without safety nets; people have to live below their means or a downturn will kill them off. Nothing intrinsically wrong with that, but it is not a scenario that promotes strong growth. Without Social Security, WIC, unemployment insurance and such, we likely wouldn't have such things as gaming PCs or XBoxes. Consumption would be discouraged because every dollar earned might well be needed later. Purchasing land or houses would be discouraged because one might need to relocate quickly to chase jobs. Is that an America anyone really wants?

And even if a woman's predicament is purely the result of poor life choices, WIC is about the children. As far as we know, children do not choose their parents, so there can be no justice in punishing the child for the mother's bad judgment or the father's bad behavior (or vice versa.) Children are unique humans, not extensions of their parents.

 

[surfsatwerk]

If women are comfortable with themselves and their children starving who am I to question to them?

Its called trusting women to make choices about their family. Why don't you trust women?

You are filth.

 

[werepossum]

Its not just about giving away free food. WIC does a whole lot more in education of young mothers, not just single or poor mothers to boot. What about widowed mothers, mothers who's husbands became disabled, etc. Your just a self righteous idiot.

That's a very good point too. Part of WIC is about helping women help themselves to avoid bad life choices.

Do the progressives get a badge that says "I'm a Progressive" when they show up? Also, what line on the volunteer form states political and ideological affiliation? The one that I'm around and donate money to doesn't have either but I could talk to the man who runs it to see if we could get those things added. I know him very well. He is my employer (he runs a business and and a food bank) and is also a *cough*progressive*cough*.

They tried to give me that badge, but I insisted on one that said "I'm a conservative, except I'm in favor of gay marriage and I think the proggies are generally better on the environment and human rights, except sometimes they are unreasonable and sometimes infringe on some people's rights while trying to protect other things that do have value, so basically I'm fiscally conservative and socially liberal except I do support the social safety net only I think we should do more to protect against fraud, but then on the other hand I've known some people who totally deserved disability but were unable to get it, but then I've known some on disability who totally did not deserve it, and oh I'm in favor of strong tariffs and a very well armed but isolationist defense strategy, so really I'm a conservative libertarian."

However, in the end I was unable to stand up straight under the weight of my badge and was forced to slink away in shame.

tl/dr: No, progressives do not get a badge that says "I'm a Progressive" when they show up.

 

[dainthomas]

I wish food stamps was modeled more like WIC. Particularly when I go into a convenience store and see things like Red Bull with an "Oregon Trail Card Eligible" sign next to it.

Went to Little Caesars and they sell uncooked pizzas that can be purchased with the Oregon Trail card. Then they'll cook it for 50 cents (of your own money, presumably). I think it's terrible, but I have to give them props for that clever workaround.

 

[Texashiker]

Instead of teaching people to become self-reliant, they are taught to become dependent on the government.

Where are the community gardens?

Are needy families put in touch with a local farmers market?

Where are the job outreach and job training programs for needy families?

Right now I have 3 dozen eggs my chickens laid that I could give to a needy family. But there are so many problems with putting local farmers in touch with needy families nobody wants to do it.

On top of that I know a family that will not eat farm raised food. If it does not come out of a grocery store they will not touch it.

 

[nehalem256]

Sometimes it's poor life choices, sometimes it's just life. People change, and there's no sure way of knowing up front if a man (or a woman) will one day leave you with nothing. Women who decide to forgo a career to devote their time and energy to raising a child are especially vulnerable to being abandoned or widowed. Similarly, people die. We all SHOULD have life insurance to provide for minor children, but it can be hard to afford and there are damned few of us who have perfectly covered every imaginable contingency. And sometimes life just kicks you in the nuts. Say your employer is going through hard times and your hours and/or pay is reduced, then later your employer goes tits up. No matter how well prepared, your safety net will be reduced by the long period of reduced income. If it's a severe economic downturn like 2007-2008, or if the employer is a very large percentage of the area workforce, then finding a replacement job (let alone at the same income level) can be very, very difficult for even the hardest worker.

You should note I mentioned that there are already other programs to deal with widows.

And again do you really think that most people on WIC are poor because their husbands died or abandoned them?

Now, prior to FDR Americans saved much more and lived much more frugally. This is also true of nations without safety nets; people have to live below their means or a downturn will kill them off. Nothing intrinsically wrong with that, but it is not a scenario that promotes strong growth. Without Social Security, WIC, unemployment insurance and such, we likely wouldn't have such things as gaming PCs or XBoxes. Consumption would be discouraged because every dollar earned might well be needed later. Purchasing land or houses would be discouraged because one might need to relocate quickly to chase jobs. Is that an America anyone really wants?

Except WIC is structured very different. Social Secruity and unemployment are government run insurance schemes.

WIC is structed to be a bail out program for people making poor life choices, which is why the only requirement is being poor. Could it be structured to give benefits to people who deserve it instead. Sure, and in fact I have previously stated so.

Basically the problem as I see it as the obligations only run in one direction. Society is supposed to be obligated to support people, but yet people have no obligation to live their life in a way that will minimize the need for that support.

And even if a woman's predicament is purely the result of poor life choices, WIC is about the children. As far as we know, children do not choose their parents, so there can be no justice in punishing the child for the mother's bad judgment or the father's bad behavior (or vice versa.) Children are unique humans, not extensions of their parents.

Well except for the whole W part. Unless you are going to go along with the progressive belief that women should be treated as children .

And except that progressives will in one breadth say a fetus is essentially an extension of its mother so its fine to kill it, but then turn around and say WIC is for children...

 

[dainthomas]

You should note I mentioned that there are already other programs to deal with widows.

And again do you really think that most people on WIC are poor because their husbands died or abandoned them?



Except WIC is structured very different. Social Secruity and unemployment are government run insurance schemes.

WIC is structed to be a bail out program for people making poor life choices, which is why the only requirement is being poor. Could it be structured to give benefits to people who deserve it instead. Sure, and in fact I have previously stated so.

Basically the problem as I see it as the obligations only run in one direction. Society is supposed to be obligated to support people, but yet people have no obligation to live their life in a way that will minimize the need for that support.



Well except for the whole W part. Unless you are going to go along with the progressive belief that women should be treated as children .

And except that progressives will in one breadth say a fetus is essentially an extension of its mother so its fine to kill it, but then turn around and say WIC is for children...

You're like Moonbeam's evil alter-ego.

 

[dank69]

You find the idea that:



to be frighteningly disturbing?:hmm:

So since I exposed your argument for the sham that it is, you are going to ignore me now and continue on as if it didn't happen?

 

[nehalem256]

So since I exposed your argument for the sham that it is, you are going to ignore me now and continue on as if it didn't happen?

You exposed nothing.

Your argument is that unless I can show that every single single-mother is in poverty that I shouldn't oppose single-motherhood on the basis of it causing poverty.

Which is absurdly stupid. As can be seen by anyone with any sense whatsoever.

By your logic of need 100% buying lottery tickets for your 401K is not a stupid act and should not be opposed.

 

[werepossum]

You should note I mentioned that there are already other programs to deal with widows.

And again do you really think that most people on WIC are poor because their husbands died or abandoned them?

Except WIC is structured very different. Social Secruity and unemployment are government run insurance schemes.

WIC is structed to be a bail out program for people making poor life choices, which is why the only requirement is being poor. Could it be structured to give benefits to people who deserve it instead. Sure, and in fact I have previously stated so.

Basically the problem as I see it as the obligations only run in one direction. Society is supposed to be obligated to support people, but yet people have no obligation to live their life in a way that will minimize the need for that support.

Well except for the whole W part. Unless you are going to go along with the progressive belief that women should be treated as children .

And except that progressives will in one breadth say a fetus is essentially an extension of its mother so its fine to kill it, but then turn around and say WIC is for children...

I can't imagine much worse than government handing out loot on the basis of "who deserves it". Unless it's the concept that we should feed children while their mothers slowly starve.

You're like Moonbeam's evil alter-ego.

LOL Nah, Moonie's just a beautiful soul with a damaged psyche. Or is that id . . .

 

[piasabird]

Don't get Pregnant. Your children are not the Government's problem!

 

[piasabird]

Why not just change the name of WIC to Money For Sluts (MFS).

 

[dank69]

You exposed nothing.

Your argument is that unless I can show that every single single-mother is in poverty that I shouldn't oppose single-motherhood on the basis of it causing poverty.

If single motherhood causes poverty, every single mother would be in poverty.

Which is absurdly stupid. As can be seen by anyone with any sense whatsoever.

That's what everyone says about your arguments.

By your logic of need 100% buying lottery tickets for your 401K is not a stupid act and should not be opposed.

You seem to be coming unravelled.

 

[nehalem256]

I can't imagine much worse than government handing out loot on the basis of "who deserves it". Unless it's the concept that we should feed children while their mothers slowly starve.

How about the government handing out loot on the basis of women using children as hostages to extort swag?

And once again we have the non gender neutral mother. People around here sure seem to have a low opinion of women. Although why they think letting people who are too selfish/stupid to make good choices raise children is a good idea is beyond me.

 

[nehalem256]

If single motherhood causes poverty, every single mother would be in poverty.

If gunshots to the head caused death, every single gunshot to the head would be fatal.

Since not every gunshot to the head is fatal clearly being shot in the head does not cause death :hmm:

Why not just change the name of WIC to Money For Sluts (MFS).

Suggest it to foxnews. It can be the new Government Slimdown!

EDIT: Although since they are being paid they would be prostitutes not sluts.