Why is there controversy over Atkins?

[minendo]

Originally posted by: glugglug

Grapefruits are high carbs. Fairly sure they have more than bananas.

I bet 20 years from now there will be tons of stories about people who fvcked themselves up royally on Atkins. My theory on why its accepted as much as it is that starving the brain of the glucose it needs gives some people a buzz.

Grapefruits have approximately 8g CHO per 100g whereas bananas have approximately 23g CHO per 100g.

 

[yukichigai]

Originally posted by: Regs

Originally posted by: hdeck

Originally posted by: notfred
Because some people think that there might be a problem with a diet that allows you to drink bacon grease but not eat a peanut butter sandwich.

nicely put =)

Hah, And if you go off the diet for one day you are pretty much screwed for the whole week. Plus once you are off the diet you gain the weight back quickly.

No kidding. In 2 days I gained 20 pounds.

 

[Riprorin]

Bananas have a high GI too.

 

[Riprorin]

Originally posted by: yukichigai

Originally posted by: Regs

Originally posted by: hdeck

Originally posted by: notfred
Because some people think that there might be a problem with a diet that allows you to drink bacon grease but not eat a peanut butter sandwich.

nicely put =)

Hah, And if you go off the diet for one day you are pretty much screwed for the whole week. Plus once you are off the diet you gain the weight back quickly.

No kidding. In 2 days I gained 20 pounds.

It's a lifestyle change. If you're not willing to change your lifestyle, don't bother.

 

[fs5]

Originally posted by: yukichigai
The key problem with the Atkins diet isn't the glucose/sugar thing really, so much as the effect it has on your renal system. (Kidneys, bladder, etc.) The Atkins diet initiates a state of Ketosis, which means you start to get rid of a lot of water. A good deal of the weight you lose in the first few weeks is water weight. The problem with this is that it taxes your kidneys pretty hard, possibly leading to renal (kidney) failure. There are some genetic backgrounds that can handle this -- Germans and Eskimos most noteably -- as historically they have existed in a meat-rich, carb-low environment. The rest of the world is kind of iffy on that unfortunately.

Aside from that you have to make sure you get the proper vitamins and a lot of exercise. Assuming the Atkins diet is indeed what early man survived on it should be a package deal, excercise and all, not to mention the fact that most farm-raised cattle and other meat sources don't have as vitamin-rich a diet as wild animals would. (Vitamins and such would be passed on by eating meat of animals with diets rich in these things) If you just sit on your tookus all day it's not going to be the best thing in the world for you.

yo, what he said.

 

[Riprorin]

Maybe that's why Atkins advices excercise and vitamins and drinking plenty of water.

Anyway, that's good advice for everyone.

p.s. being overweight ain't so hot for you either.

 

[yukichigai]

Originally posted by: Riprorin
Maybe that's why Atkins advices excercise and vitamins and drinking plenty of water.

Anyway, that's good advice for everyone.

p.s. being overweight ain't so hot for you either.

Kidney failure is worse.

 

[Riprorin]

Do you have any data on the number of people that properly followed the Atkins diet that have had kidney failure?

 

[yukichigai]

Originally posted by: Riprorin
Do you have any data on the number of people that properly followed the Atkins diet that have had kidney failure?

Not any hard numbers I can link to, no, but I have seen one kid who was in the hospital for kidney failure because of the Atkins diet. Apparantly he followed it okay, his body just couldn't handle it. Like I said, only certain genetic backgrounds can handle it. Anyway, I can ask my little brother's nutritionist about it; apparantly she has some hard facts on it.

P.S. Ironically my little brother was going to the nutritionist for a problem that turned out to be caused by low protein, since he's a vegetarian.

 

[Quixfire]

I was on the diet back in 1998 before it was a fad, and like all things people hear only what they want to hear. My doctor approves the diet only if you have read the book and follow the guidelines, he says most of the people he sees for complaints related to the Atkins diet didn't do either.

I lost 50lbs in 1998 and had no trouble. I have lost 20 lbs in the last month and still have no trouble.

I don't approve of the Atkins food products, because you can make or buy the same food already.

You can have fruits and breads on this diet, just in modernation and after the Ketosis phase, first two weeks.

 

[Wingznut]

Rip, I think you know the answer to your question. The people who knock it, don't understand it. They read a little here and there, and then spread the misconceptions. For example:

Originally posted by: hdeck

Originally posted by: notfred
Because some people think that there might be a problem with a diet that allows you to drink bacon grease but not eat a peanut butter sandwich.

nicely put =)

"Nicely put", maybe... Wholly inaccurate, definitely.

Originally posted by: Ranger X
It's a diet to eliminate carbs and I'm not sure if fruits were included in the Atkins diet.

No, you are completely wrong. It is NOT a diet to "eliminate carbs". I intake about 40 carbs a day. (And yes, that includes fruit.)

Originally posted by: yukichigai
If you just sit on your tookus all day it's not going to be the best thing in the world for you.

For some reason, people think that exercise isn't needed. Well, apparently these "experts" forgot to read the chapter entitled: Exercise: It's non-negotiable

Originally posted by: yukichigai
The key problem with the Atkins diet isn't the glucose/sugar thing really, so much as the effect it has on your renal system. (Kidneys, bladder, etc.) The Atkins diet initiates a state of Ketosis, which means you start to get rid of a lot of water. A good deal of the weight you lose in the first few weeks is water weight. The problem with this is that it taxes your kidneys pretty hard, possibly leading to renal (kidney) failure.

I believe there were a couple of cases where people with pre-existing kidney conditions had complications. But I have yet to find a single example of anyone on a low carb diet suffering from renal problems caused by this nutritional plan. If you happen to have any (factual) findings, please direct me towards them, as I have yet to see them.

Oh btw, if done properly, you intake enough water to keep up.

Originally posted by: agnitrate
Because it's not healthy for your body. You need vegetables/fruits to make a balanced diet. Certain people take it to the extreme and decide to eat pounds of meat a day, no fruits or vegetables, and claim they are healthy.

You are correct... Vegetables and fruit are good for you. Which is why vegetables are ALWAYS recommended, and fruits are recommended after Induction.


The gist is that many people on ATOT simply talk out of their @ss. They have no clue... They haven't done any research... They have zero experience with it... Yet they speak as if they are experts.

 

[Blackened]

Carb depletion is unnecessary in the great majority of people. I would say for those that are borderline diabetic and/or insulin resistant its a good diet to use, but otherwise there is no reason to eliminate carbs. Just be smart about what TYPE of carbs you eat. Obviously you'll get fat if you snack
on simple sugars all day, but complex carbohydrates are fine for most people.

 

[DaiShan]

Originally posted by: minendo
Long term effects are unknown. Many people think the philosophy as you stated is to elimante sugar, carbs, etc, but glucose is required for the brain to function.

Mike nailed it, the brain CANNOT use fat for energy, only glucose. If your body is deprived of glucose it can go into a form of toxic shock called ketosis.

 

[Blackened]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: guapo337
the diet's rules basically go against ALL previous rules of how to eat healthy. it's a fad. some people pick it up, and watch the initial weight loss, and claim how great it is. that initial weight loss is water loss.

not eating fruits and vegetables and eliminating carbs (which give you energy) and eliminating glucose (a simple carb which makes the brain function) seems worthless to me. however, the initial weight loss from water loss is obviously enough to make people love it.

another person who doesn't have any clue what the diet is.

He is right on one thing - the initial weight lost on atkins is subcutaneous water. I'm always amused by those that think they lost 10 pounds after 2 weeks on atkins, but they regain it all after 1 carb meal...wonder why.

 

[Wingznut]

Originally posted by: DaiShan

Originally posted by: minendo
Long term effects are unknown. Many people think the philosophy as you stated is to elimante sugar, carbs, etc, but glucose is required for the brain to function.

Mike nailed it, the brain CANNOT use fat for energy, only glucose. If your body is deprived of glucose it can go into a form of toxic shock called ketosis.

OMG... this is exactly what I was talking about.

Hey DaiShan... How about doing some research before opening your mouth??? (At the very least, look up the definition of "Ketosis"... HINT: It's not any kind of toxic shock.)

 

[Blackened]

Originally posted by: DaiShan

Originally posted by: minendo
Long term effects are unknown. Many people think the philosophy as you stated is to elimante sugar, carbs, etc, but glucose is required for the brain to function.

Mike nailed it, the brain CANNOT use fat for energy, only glucose. If your body is deprived of glucose it can go into a form of toxic shock called ketosis.

Uhh, heard of ketones or glucagon?

 

[minendo]

Originally posted by: Wingznut
Hey DaiShan... How about doing some research before opening your mouth??? (At the very least, look up the definition of "Ketosis"... HINT: It's not any kind of toxic shock.)

What is the problem with my statement? Where am I wrong?

 

[DaiShan]

Oh, I almost forgot, just because you are skinny does not mean you are healthy. I have a friend that is a runner, and literally he eats 1 pound of bacon a day, every day. Also for snacks sometimes he will just fry up some hamburger meat and eat it straight out of the pan. Yes he is very skinny, will he live past 35? Nope. Saturated fat and cholesterol have this tendency to build up in your arteries causing them to harden and to shrink slowing effective blood flow to a crawl. Red meat is notorious for saturated fat content as is pork, which according to atkins are acceptable ways to lose weight. If you really want to lose weight do it by diet and excercise. Watch your caloric intake as well as that of saturated fat and cholesterol, make sure caloires out > calories in and you will lose weight, guaranteed.

 

[xyion]

Originally posted by: Wingznut
The gist is that many people on ATOT simply talk out of their @ss. They have no clue... They haven't done any research... They have zero experience with it... Yet they speak as if they are experts.

But thats exactly the problem. People who are on this diet without knowing exactly what they should be doing, which is what makes this dangerous. This can be said about any subject at all, cars, computers, TV's, anything. My bet is that anybody that is looking to "loose weight quick!" is just going to go by what they hear, and not do any research. Thus the controversy.

 

[imported_Papi]

Originally posted by: notfred
Because some people think that there might be a problem with a diet that allows you to drink bacon grease but not eat a peanut butter sandwich.

haha that's funny! lmfao

 

[DaiShan]

Originally posted by: royaldank
Most people are uneducated on the subject. They believe everything the school system told them about the food pyramid and balaced diets.

Ah yes totally uneducated. The major problem beyond the ketosis thing is the saturated fat intake, but I suppose you have indisputable evidence to negate the years of studies that have linked diets high in saturated fat to arterial clogging and eventual heart failure? See everyone that out right defends the diet only looks at the short term, yes sugars are high in calories hence dropping them from your diet will cut a significat source of calories, and you probably will lose weight, but it is not a good policy to eat a diet mostly of meat, because as soon as you stop with the carb cutting you will gain it back just as fast, never mind the fact that you have done damage to your arteries from the buildup.

 

[yukichigai]

Originally posted by: Wingznut

Originally posted by: yukichigai
The key problem with the Atkins diet isn't the glucose/sugar thing really, so much as the effect it has on your renal system. (Kidneys, bladder, etc.) The Atkins diet initiates a state of Ketosis, which means you start to get rid of a lot of water. A good deal of the weight you lose in the first few weeks is water weight. The problem with this is that it taxes your kidneys pretty hard, possibly leading to renal (kidney) failure.

I believe there were a couple of cases where people with pre-existing kidney conditions had complications. But I have yet to find a single example of anyone on a low carb diet suffering from renal problems caused by this nutritional plan. If you happen to have any (factual) findings, please direct me towards them, as I have yet to see them.

Oh btw, if done properly, you intake enough water to keep up.

Dehydration is not what causes renal failure, though it can hurt you otherwise. What starts impacting your kidneys is how much they have to work to filter all the fluid your body is draining. Some people have kidneys that can keep up at that rate, but other folks don't. But you're right, perhaps saying kidney failure was misleading. With most people it's doubtful that it will cause your kidneys to fail unless you do it for an extended period of time, but it can still damage your kidneys while you're undergoing ketosis. Since there are other things that can damage your kidneys or aggrivate existing kidney damage it may not be what does your renal system in, but it'll have played a part, potentially a large one.

 

[DaiShan]

Originally posted by: Riprorin
Some fruits are lower in carbs that others. The lower carb fruits should be eaten regularly and the higer carb fruits should be eaten occasionally.

Personally, I eat a lot of apples, strawberries, blueberries, melons, nectarines, grapefruits and peaches and avoid high carb fruits like bananas.

Not an athlete eh?

 

[The Sauce]

Why is there controversy over Atkins?

Simple. (1) There is still no good scientific data to prove that it actually offers any benefit over known beneficial weightloss strategies and (2) there is a likelihood of serious long-term medical problems as a result of subjecting your body to prolonged starvation.

By scientific data, I mean what we consider to be necessary for anything else in medicine - sufficiently powered, prospective, randomized, double-blinded, placebo-controlled trials.

 

[isekii]

Hm... fruits are allowed on the atkins diet ?

which fruits ?

damn I have a can of Mixed Fruit salad and it's so tempting.

I don't limit my carb intake but I do a minimal amount daily, and I do eat a lot of red meat but vegetables as well.

Lots of water is a must.