Why is it when you get close to the nub of an issue in PFI

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: esquared

Originally posted by: CADsortaGUY

Originally posted by: esquared
Again I say, the constant few who always are posting in PFI, DO NOT speak for the whole forum. I personally think the moderation is fine for the size of these forums as do the rest of the membership.

The only ones that complain are the same people that complain over and over. Some of you should take Olds advice. Seriously, if you don't like it here, there are other forums where you might feel appreciated.

Wasn't this sort of excuse addressed in the other thread?

It not an excuse, the same stuff is being said here in this thread. What don't you guys see about this? The rest of the membership is fine with the way it's being run.

The rest meaning 99%+ of the members. You guys keep flogging this dead horse. It really is old.

don't click then?

No, I don't think you can say that the rest is fine with it. You can assume, but there is sure to be a population of members who just won't speak up. But yes, I understand it's just easier to dismiss those of us who have been targeted, and thus dare question the moderators in question, as "complainers"

Again, you have to realize that "we" may not be talking about ALL or EVERY moderator when we question the consistency - as I'm sure there are many good mods who take great care to moderate in a professional manner. However, when there are some who flagrantly abuse their position - it's not the "complainers" fault just because they dared post about it.

 

[MotionMan]

Originally posted by: MotionMan

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: MotionMan

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: MotionMan

I have added to these forums probably as much as any regular member can. I am not in IT, but I believe I do contribute (both publicly and privately) to the members with my knowledge as a lawyer.

That being said, here is a quote directly from Derek, the man himself:

Moderator Guidelines

From our pool of regular members, we will invite a number to participate on the forums as moderators. These will be upstanding members of the community willing to help us make the forums the most hospitable environment for everyone. Moderators will help assist AnandTech in enforcing our member and posting guidelines, and are expected to use their abilities to manage threads and users with rationality and responsibility.

It is important to remember that moderator discretion is necessary. We cannot rigidly define all moderator actions with a set of rules that could just as easily run as a script. Every situation is different and every member deserves the fairest treatment under the circumstances. As it stands, we need a human touch to treat each situation as fairly as possible.

While flexibility and discretion are important in moderation, we must also have guidelines in place that help promote moderator consistency, fairness, and appropriate treatment of forum members. In addition to helping support and enforce moderator actions, these guidelines will serve to let our members know what they can expect from their moderators.

Moderators have a title listing the forums they moderate. They are able to moderate in other forums, but are encouraged to do so only in extreme and obvious cases of a violation or when a thread needs to be moved. Moderators are expected to remain in good standing with the community and uphold all of our member and posting guidelines.

Senior Moderators, who will also be noted by title, have jurisdiction over all forums. In addition to normal moderation, Senior Moderators are responsible for making decisions concerning permanent bans, advising moderators on actions, reviewing member complaints about moderator activity, and generally making sure moderation at AnandTech is run fairly and efficiently.

It seems to me that the above is what Derek expects from the moderators and wants to see in the forums: Fairness, consistency, rationality, responsibility, appropriateness, clearness of expectations and upholding of all member and posting guidelines.

Is that really too much to ask?

MotionMan

You think we don't try? Hell we tried even before Derek came onboard. It would be nice if we had Derek or a representative of his we could bounce things off when in doubt. I believe honestly that a good 95+% of our decisions adhere to those guidelines which IMO is pretty damn good when you consider the the traffic not to mention the veracity of a few but determined trolls.

I have no doubt that almost all of the moderation team does try and I acknowledge that they do a great job. But, I also believe that things can be better (and I have a sneaking feeling that you do, too).

MotionMan

OK let me ask you this, do you think we handled the last situation which resulted in you getting a time out properly?

Permission to speak freely without risk of vacation or ban for callout, etc.?

MotionMan

Forget it. Even if you give me a pass, there are others who won't, either now or later.

MotionMan

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: MotionMan

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
OK let me ask you this, do you think we handled the last situation which resulted in you getting a time out properly?

Permission to speak freely without risk of vacation or ban for callout, etc.?

MotionMan

Better to PM me. Better yet just forget I asked the question.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

OK let me ask you this, do you think we handled the last situation which resulted in you getting a time out properly?

Yep, because a more rational mod came through(I assume) and thus it was never enforced. The mod quote is still there(last I looked) but there was no actual vacation - just a knee-jerk reaction by a mod to my post.

(yes, I know the question was not addressed to me, but I do want to make sure people realize that I can and do acknowledge correct decisions)

 

[Corn]

Originally posted by: CADsortaGUY
Yep, because a more rational mod came through(I assume) and thus it was never enforced. The mod quote is still there(last I looked) but there was no actual vacation - just a knee-jerk reaction by a mod to my post.

(yes, I know the question was not addressed to me, but I do want to make sure people realize that I can and do acknowledge correct decisions)

Or maybe the mod just forgot to push the button.

 

[Dumac]

Originally posted by: esquared
Again I say, the constant few who always are posting in PFI, DO NOT speak for the whole forum. I personally think the moderation is fine for the size of these forums as do the rest of the membership.

The only ones that complain are the same people that complain over and over. Some of you should take Olds advice. Seriously, if you don't like it here, there are other forums where you might feel appreciated.

Trying to make AnandTech your private club?

Finding a forum you enjoy and are comfortable with isn't as easy as you make it sound.

Honestly a lot of the forum doesn't even visit PFI. I think these threads would be more productive in another venue, but they are often shoveled here.

I suppose that at least here, people generally care about the status of the forums, whether or not their view is positive or negative. However, it is hard to get a feel of how the entire forum population feels from such a small sample.

I would say that the moderation is great is most subforums. Most complaints seem to mainly come from ATOT (this is excluding P&N, where everybody omplains about everything).

 

[Corn]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Not everybody, you stupid fuck, just self hating assholes like you.

I just want to know whether or not I can post similar to the above quote with the same impunity. If not, then I'd like to know why not because I'm really beginning to tire of the kinder gentler Corn act I've had to protray since the last few vacations for utterances of the same vein or less. My vivacious personality is itching to effervesce to the surface.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: Corn

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Not everybody, you stupid fuck, just self hating assholes like you.

I just want to know whether or not I can post similar to the above quote with the same impunity. If not, then I'd like to know why not because I'm really beginning to tire of the kinder gentler Corn act I've had to protray since the last few vacations for utterances of the same vein or less. My vivacious personality is itching to effervesce to the surface.

Don't like being in touch with your sweet inner germ?

 

[Corn]

Originally posted by: esquared
It not an excuse, the same stuff is being said here in this thread. What don't you guys see about this? The rest of the membership is fine with the way it's being run.

The rest meaning 99%+ of the members. You guys keep flogging this dead horse. It really is old.

Lets put your money where your mouth is, shall we? Let me know how you feel about allowing me to pose this question in the form of a poll in P&N and we'll see if your 99% claim holds true. I'll be sporting and spot you a margin of error of 10% on your claim.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Corn

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Not everybody, you stupid fuck, just self hating assholes like you.

I just want to know whether or not I can post similar to the above quote with the same impunity. If not, then I'd like to know why not because I'm really beginning to tire of the kinder gentler Corn act I've had to protray since the last few vacations for utterances of the same vein or less. My vivacious personality is itching to effervesce to the surface.

Corn, Corn, Corn
You know dang right well that Moonbeam was being funny. The context of that makes it obvious. I don't use that kind of language cuz my grandma would rise up from the dead and lecture me for days... :Q He does and others do but to me the adjectives, nouns and verbs are only offensive when they are uttered with a mal heart.

I recall or dreamed of a fellow UltraSilent or like that who cussed me up one side and down the other a few years back. We talked and he never again did that. I simply didn't use that kind of language back to him when I had so many other nice words I could use.

 

[MotionMan]

Originally posted by: LunarRay

Originally posted by: Corn

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Not everybody, you stupid fuck, just self hating assholes like you.

I just want to know whether or not I can post similar to the above quote with the same impunity. If not, then I'd like to know why not because I'm really beginning to tire of the kinder gentler Corn act I've had to protray since the last few vacations for utterances of the same vein or less. My vivacious personality is itching to effervesce to the surface.

Corn, Corn, Corn
You know dang right well that Moonbeam was being funny. The context of that makes it obvious. I don't use that kind of language cuz my grandma would rise up from the dead and lecture me for days... :Q He does and others do but to me the adjectives, nouns and verbs are only offensive when they are uttered with a mal heart.

I recall or dreamed of a fellow UltraSilent or like that who cussed me up one side and down the other a few years back. We talked and he never again did that. I simply didn't use that kind of language back to him when I had so many other nice words I could use.

See my 09/18/2009 08:10 AM (at least that is the time it shows me) post in the other thread.

MotionMan

 

[LunarRay]

MotionMan,
I read that back then. The first one refers to the Mod not able to tell if folks were joking etc.
One speaks to Kvetching, what ever that is.
And I probably can see your point. Different folks see the same events differently. Although the one about not backing down is beyond the pale, I can see why you included it.
You are advocating for the impossible, I think. Right, wrong or indifferent we can't achieve what meets the criteria you suggest to be fair.

I have a feeling that a high percentage of members will say, 'all is well as is'. I'm not advocating for change as much as I am for understanding of what I see as the evolving reality of the one place I spend most of my time, P&N. [Edit] It would be nice if I put in what that understanding might be... and it is that some folks will never be satisfied until a robot could Mod the place... IOW, take the human aspect out and if the Bot sees a curse word boom.. it boots you and others want the asperations you posted as rules to be fixed and equally and with out deviation enforced. However, let some one run a foul of them and they'll debate the minutest aspect of difference to their position.. a no win scenario for the Mod. The very folks who 'flame' to start a para expect that to be their right and they are wrong on many levels. That person A did and nothing happened but person B got time off is what I see a mitigation. A normal and rewarding concept for past action.

Before the change to showing who was a MOD I knew a few by virtue of their 'slip up' while inserting a comment or two in a thread. How they punctuated etc there and while posting. Some felt all elite were Mods but it never stopped the dialogs. Folks slung crap left and right. I think [because I was interested in knowing] that in P&N there were but a few Mods. I think I counted 5 different folks. Which means to me that the fewer the Mods the narrower the conduit of Moderation. Maybe that is about the only way to reduce what you refer to as inconsistent Moderation.

I guess it was OT then P&N [EDIT]

 

[Corn]

Originally posted by: LunarRay
Corn, Corn, Corn
You know dang right well that Moonbeam was being funny. The context of that makes it obvious.

Silly me for thinking the same thing, got me a week off.

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: Corn

Originally posted by: LunarRay
Corn, Corn, Corn
You know dang right well that Moonbeam was being funny. The context of that makes it obvious.

Silly me for thinking the same thing, got me a week off.

Wah, wah, fucking wah. I once got a week off for posting "Doh!" in response to someone that was flaming someone else! Big deal, it's the internet.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Corn

Originally posted by: LunarRay
Corn, Corn, Corn
You know dang right well that Moonbeam was being funny. The context of that makes it obvious.

Silly me for thinking the same thing, got me a week off.

Corn,
That thread was/is insane. I can see your rhetorical as being tongue in cheek but humor... hard to find that there.

You know... Everyone would hate me if I had the Mod role.. I'd lock/delete/whatever every thread as soon as I could to obviate the baiting and uncalled for flaming... Nothing would be open if there was even a hint of potential for that kind of posting.
Using terms or adjectives/nouns/verbs that are foul are not really the issue to me. It would be trying to incite hate or total disharmony. Some person called me a MF cuz I used a few ellipses in a paragraph... My first thought was 'poor guy... must be really upset over something' I take no offense at words themselves but the real or perceived intention of the usage makes the communication vile at times.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: Corn

Originally posted by: LunarRay
Corn, Corn, Corn
You know dang right well that Moonbeam was being funny. The context of that makes it obvious.

Silly me for thinking the same thing, got me a week off.

Wah, wah, fucking wah. I once got a week off for posting "Doh!" in response to someone that was flaming someone else! Big deal, it's the internet.

I'm sorry but does "Doh!" have some meaning aside from an exclamation? My Grandson used it alot and I asked him what it meant cuz I asked if his homework was done before watching TV. He said "Doh!" and then said, "it is in the dictionary look it up but it means like 'dang how dumb of me'."

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: Corn

Originally posted by: LunarRay
Corn, Corn, Corn
You know dang right well that Moonbeam was being funny. The context of that makes it obvious.

Silly me for thinking the same thing, got me a week off.

Wah, wah, fucking wah. I once got a week off for posting "Doh!" in response to someone that was flaming someone else! Big deal, it's the internet.

It seems to be a big deal to you. You keep responding with threats, insults, and curses.

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: LunarRay

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: Corn

Originally posted by: LunarRay
Corn, Corn, Corn
You know dang right well that Moonbeam was being funny. The context of that makes it obvious.

Silly me for thinking the same thing, got me a week off.

Wah, wah, fucking wah. I once got a week off for posting "Doh!" in response to someone that was flaming someone else! Big deal, it's the internet.

I'm sorry but does "Doh!" have some meaning aside from an exclamation? My Grandson used it alot and I asked him what it meant cuz I asked if his homework was done before watching TV. He said "Doh!" and then said, "it is in the dictionary look it up but it means like 'dang how dumb of me'."

No other meaning that I know of.

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: Corn

Originally posted by: LunarRay
Corn, Corn, Corn
You know dang right well that Moonbeam was being funny. The context of that makes it obvious.

Silly me for thinking the same thing, got me a week off.

Wah, wah, fucking wah. I once got a week off for posting "Doh!" in response to someone that was flaming someone else! Big deal, it's the internet.

It seems to be a big deal to you. You keep responding with threats, insults, and curses.

My threats are hollow and I always insult and curse.

 

[sandorski]

The last thread wasn't coming close to anything. This thread isn't either. I vote Lock with no more attempts to dredge this crap up again. Got OT if you want to Nef.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Whats interesting is the same people complaining are the same people who push the envelope or do stoopid things that get them banned. 99% of the members on these forums do not push the envelope and understand that P&N is a different animal and for the sake of debate, often heated debate has different or modified rules.

Peoples past history does need to be taken into account when rwarning or banning people.

I have been known at times to pushg the envelope and I have been waned, but that`s the nature of P&N.

It is my opinion that the Mods are the best of any mods anywhere. The mods also try to be very fair.

I would move to lock this thread. Nothing needs to be done and if it was a problem at all it stands to reason there should be 100`s of posts instead of a few by a few people who are on the fringe!

 

[MotionMan]

Originally posted by: JEDIYoda
Whats interesting is the same people complaining are the same people who push the envelope or do stoopid things that get them banned. 99% of the members on these forums do not push the envelope and understand that P&N is a different animal and for the sake of debate, often heated debate has different or modified rules.

Peoples past history does need to be taken into account when rwarning or banning people.

I have been known at times to pushg the envelope and I have been waned, but that`s the nature of P&N.

It is my opinion that the Mods are the best of any mods anywhere. The mods also try to be very fair.

I would move to lock this thread. Nothing needs to be done and if it was a problem at all it stands to reason there should be 100`s of posts instead of a few by a few people who are on the fringe!

I am such a rebel!!!

:roll:

MotionMan

 

[Agentbolt]

Criiipes lock this thread, like the old one. Everyone is just saying the same things over and over again. Both sides have made excellent points and it's very very very likely that the true situation is that we're somewhere in between "the mods are unfair assholes and run like this place like 1920's Chicago" and "absolutely nothing is wrong here like 3 or 4 people have a problem and they should be melted down into their component elements and used to insulate low income housing"

Maybe some century Derek or Anand will pop in and see this thread and make a decision one way or the other, but till then are we really accomplishing anything anymore?

<----- Is fully aware I've posted a shitload in both threads and will stop now.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Corn

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Not everybody, you stupid fuck, just self hating assholes like you.

I just want to know whether or not I can post similar to the above quote with the same impunity. If not, then I'd like to know why not because I'm really beginning to tire of the kinder gentler Corn act I've had to protray since the last few vacations for utterances of the same vein or less. My vivacious personality is itching to effervesce to the surface.

To be able to post stuff like that and get away with you you need to spend years posting undecipherable Gobbly ***** like Moonie does so no Mods bother reading your posts . Honestly, I never read the horse crap he posts so if he were to post something like that I wouldn't know unless it was pointed out.

 

[DrPizza]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Corn

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Not everybody, you stupid fuck, just self hating assholes like you.

I just want to know whether or not I can post similar to the above quote with the same impunity. If not, then I'd like to know why not because I'm really beginning to tire of the kinder gentler Corn act I've had to protray since the last few vacations for utterances of the same vein or less. My vivacious personality is itching to effervesce to the surface.

To be able to post stuff like that and get away with you you need to spend years posting undecipherable Gobbly ***** like Moonie does so no Mods bother reading your posts . Honestly, I never read the horse crap he posts so if he were to post something like that I wouldn't know unless it was pointed out.

If I ran across a comment like that, my reaction would depend on
1. Context
2. Who posted it

My possible reactions:
1. Ignore it
2. Edit it to something cleaner
3. Slap the poster with a vacation & insert a mod comment under that post

Reaction #1 is probably the least common to something like that, but let me give you an example of where you might see that reaction: in one of those conspiracy threads such as 9/11 was a government operation. After the OP's of those types of threads run through 20 "facts", and every one of them is thoroughly refuted, they tend to start recycling through those "facts" as if the 2nd or 3rd or 4th time around, somehow the evidence to show that they are false is no longer going to be around. There is a huge sense of frustration on the part of the sane people in the thread when this starts to happen. I look at a post like that as: "ignorant fuck" - accurate.

Reaction #2: Long time poster here with a very clean record, answers people's questions in various forums, tries to be helpful. Someone posts something out of the blue that's completely idiotic or semi-inflammatory in one of the threads that the person is participating in. I'll simply edit the comment & send a PM to the poster to keep it a little cleaner. Maybe, if I notice that it's becoming a common occurrence for that poster, I'll put a brief note in their notes mentioning that maybe next time, they need a vacation for the point to sink in.

Reaction #3: Someone who's generally a pain in the ass in the forums, who seems to exist here for no reason other than to irritate or upset the masses. Everyone seems a little happier when those trolls go on vacation.

These aren't the only reactions - there are a whole lot of in between reactions to something such as what you quoted above. That's the reason that no script is going to work, and I believe that it's even pointed out in the forum rules.

p.s. and we don't read every single thread, thus sometimes people get lucky & get away with something.

 

[thepd7]

Originally posted by: MotionMan
Maybe the moderation team should start a list of the people the members should not bother complaining about since they have carte blanche on AT?

MotionMan

Althought this would be nice the other thread was informative and had run it's course because we saw people admitting this. At least for me, that's all I wanted to hear. Knowing that I can act in a different way now.

Originally posted by: LunarRay
Mod Pizza said something really profound in that other thread. It hit me hard... Made me ask myself just what do I add to this forum?...

Did the same thing for me. I love Dr. Pizza, in fact I had a dream recently where I quit my job and went to live with him in NY and be handy. Is that weird?