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Why do we hate Putin again?

desura

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2013
4,627
129
101
I've watched a few videos here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5GxjjZLvf8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX_HuMiP8v8&t=1754s

Honestly, I never even paid attention to Russia until this year. Before, I mainly paid attention to China, and before that America. But the Russia haters really don't make a coherent case here. It's like a grab-bag of liberal bad guys. Like, Anne Applebaum describes Russia as wanting to create a colonial relationship with Ukraine, the wording of which is just incredibly hypocritical coming from an American.
 

FIVR

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2016
3,753
906
106
Who hates him?


I find him quite avuncular and charming.
 

desura

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2013
4,627
129
101
Honestly, a lot of that stuff feels like smoke to me. It verges on infowars-like coverage. So I don't know who poisoned the guy, I assume it was a political rival.
 

UberNeuman

Lifer
Nov 4, 1999
16,939
3,078
126
Honestly, a lot of that stuff feels like smoke to me. It verges on infowars-like coverage. So I don't know who poisoned the guy, I assume it was a political rival.
Hope the troll money stocks you up nicely with Krokodil...
 

Mai72

Lifer
Sep 12, 2012
10,188
930
126
I've watched a few videos here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5GxjjZLvf8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX_HuMiP8v8&t=1754s

Honestly, I never even paid attention to Russia until this year. Before, I mainly paid attention to China, and before that America. But the Russia haters really don't make a coherent case here. It's like a grab-bag of liberal bad guys. Like, Anne Applebaum describes Russia as wanting to create a colonial relationship with Ukraine, the wording of which is just incredibly hypocritical coming from an American.
If you would had asked this question 30 years ago, you would had been labeled a commie lover. How we have fallen. Sad really. Reagan is rolling around in grave.
 

MrSquished

Diamond Member
Jan 14, 2013
7,535
2,426
136
Russia is an authoritarian state whose values contradict ours. Putin is the dictator of said state. Russia may be waning in power but is still one of most powerful nations in the world, and any rise in their strength is a potential threat to American interests. It's not the same as some tin pot dictator taking charge of some virtually irrelevant state in Central or South America. Although we get involved in those as well. But that's another discussion.
 

UglyCasanova

Lifer
Mar 25, 2001
19,275
1,354
126
I've never stopped hating him. Watch the Frontline episode regarding him, his is quite literally a murderous crime boss trapped in power because if he ever steps down his past catches up with him and he's a dead man.

I find the Putin chearleading by some on the right absolutely misguided and loathesome, but I find those chearleading for a new Cold War even more so because it quite literally puts us and the world in a more dangerous posture (and I think Trump's rubbing China on Taiwan does the same).
 
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Monk5127

Member
Mar 22, 2015
98
6
71
America is an authoritarian state whose values contradict ours. Obama is the dictator of said state. America may be waning in power but is still one of most powerful nations in the world, and any rise in their strength is a potential threat to none American interests. It's not the same as some tin pot dictator taking charge of some virtually irrelevant state in Central or South Europe. Although we get involved in those as well. But that's another discussion.

China is an authoritarian state whose values contradict ours. Xi Jinping is the dictator of said state. China may be waning in power but is still one of most powerful nations in the world, and any rise in their strength is a potential threat to American interests. It's not the same as some tin pot dictator taking charge of some virtually irrelevant state in Central or South Asia. Although we get involved in those as well. But that's another discussion.

this is fun
 

Meghan54

Diamond Member
Oct 18, 2009
9,478
2,285
136
Amazing how many Russian sympathizers/shills we have popping out here....case in point:

America is an authoritarian state whose values contradict ours. Obama is the dictator of said state. America may be waning in power but is still one of most powerful nations in the world, and any rise in their strength is a potential threat to none American interests. It's not the same as some tin pot dictator taking charge of some virtually irrelevant state in Central or South Europe. Although we get involved in those as well. But that's another discussion.

China is an authoritarian state whose values contradict ours. Xi Jinping is the dictator of said state. China may be waning in power but is still one of most powerful nations in the world, and any rise in their strength is a potential threat to American interests. It's not the same as some tin pot dictator taking charge of some virtually irrelevant state in Central or South Asia. Although we get involved in those as well. But that's another discussion.

this is fun
 

Commodus

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 2004
7,867
4,865
136
Putin has political opponents and critics killed. The only acceptable position is to hate him.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
70,096
18,864
136
I've watched a few videos here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5GxjjZLvf8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX_HuMiP8v8&t=1754s

Honestly, I never even paid attention to Russia until this year. Before, I mainly paid attention to China, and before that America. But the Russia haters really don't make a coherent case here. It's like a grab-bag of liberal bad guys. Like, Anne Applebaum describes Russia as wanting to create a colonial relationship with Ukraine, the wording of which is just incredibly hypocritical coming from an American.
He's a dictator that has his critics routinely killed, he has stolen billions of dollars from the country he leads, he has repeatedly invaded his neighbors, he oppresses gay people for being gay, and he's actively seeking to undermine the current international order.

I'm frankly baffled as to why anyone WOULDN'T hate that thug. One of the most revealing things about just how sick partisanship is in America is the sudden warming to Putin by conservatives.
 

Bitek

Diamond Member
Aug 2, 2001
9,012
2,897
136
It would also be worth your time to take a review of world history of the last ~500 years.

For ~275 of the last 300+ yrs, the Russian Empire (superceded by the Soviet Union) has controlled Eastern Europe (from Finland down thru Poland to the Balkans), Caspian Sea regions (Georgia, parts of Iran/Persia) all the way into Central Asia (all those Stans north of Afghanistan), Mongolia up to the Chinese border and all the way to the Pacific islands north of Hokkaido in Japan.

They were the largest modern Empire in history save the British Empire.

Only since the collapse of the Soviet Union did many of these areas become autonomous and Russia shrink to limited size and power it is today.


But they ARE expansionists, they have a proud history, and they ARE on the move again to capture fallen glory.

They have invaded Crimea, Ukraine and Georgia. They are pushing influence in the ME. They have always been especially sympathetic to Slavic areas.

Their intentions are not at all clear, nor the red lines/borders they will not cross with their armies.


The comparisons to America (and China) are foolish. While America has had its wars, mostly mercantile in nature, we have no designs on capture and control of territory for Empire building.

It is a dangerous time. Russia's ambitions and actions could signal an end of the era of relative peace and border integrity in Europe we've had since the end of WWII. The age of Empires died in WWII, but perhaps not.
 

Bitek

Diamond Member
Aug 2, 2001
9,012
2,897
136
Also consider the signals this is sending.

If Russia won't be confronted by the great powers on the door step of Europe, what does China make of this?

The race for territories and influence is back on? If the world won't confront a weak Russia in Europe, who will stop a powerful China in Asia?

Nobody.

Then the world gets really dangerous.
 

pauldun170

Diamond Member
Sep 26, 2011
7,160
2,345
136
I was tempted to start listing info documenting his rise to power, the stuff that went on during the second Chechen war, Crimea, Ukraine all the political assassinations. Assessments by US intelligence all the years. How Putin has locked down the media, locked down government and effectively turned the Russia into a dictatorship.
There is no debate. Changes occurring in Russia and Putin's rise have been well documented for decades.
Of course it was never as headline worthy as this stuff unfolded.

However, I came to my senses and realized it's a pretty pointless waste of my time.
All I can recommend to folks who are actually interested Russia and Putins rise is to first start using sources older than 2016 before Trump started spreading pro Putin narratives in the media.

And for F&4K sake, random assholes on youtube and blogs are not a source.
 
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