When will this honeymoon with Obama end?

[yllus]

I'd say many of us aren't foolish enough to think, "This guy has all-new ideas that will solve everything!" His politics are pretty much identical to Senator Clinton's.

The major difference and benefit to him being President is that he stands a chance of uniting a huge bunch of that 51% / 49% split you folks have going into something resembling a supermajority. He'd also force everyone to bypass the personal politics associated with the last name Clinton and focus on ideas. That's the best the U.S. could hope for this election.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: aidanjm
what did people think of Maureen Dowd's description of Obama as "emotionally delicate"?

I was at the zoo looking at elephants and somebody, I think it WAS Maureen Dowd, said, "They are filled with air". All those times I road them and made sure they didn't step on my foot........Geez, what a dummy I am. How the fuck could I have trusted my very own eyes and senses instead of listening to Moron Dowd?

I think Dowd is quite perceptive on matters of human character, although she can be bitchy. at any rate, Dowd paints Obama as a bit of a wimp and lacking in chivalry to boot. she's talking about a quality of "brittleness" - when he's put to the test, will he shatter?

aidanjm.

I think your both overstating and mis-construing MD's opinion.

MD doesn't say that Obama is "emotionally delicate", rather that he is the MORE "emotionally delicate" of the two - Obama and HRC. This is based on his reaction to previous repeated snubs by the "frosty" HRC. IMO, it's more a reflection of personal decency than "emotional delicateness".

A frickin rock is more emotionally delicate than HRC.

She also say Obama takes the race more personaly than HRC, I don't agree with that, the Clintons are so completely ego-centric that's just not possible. The Clintons take EVERYthing personally.

"Brittleness" was not mentiond by MD, that's your (mis)characterization.

Nor did she say he was lacking in chivalry, just that he should've employed it at the SOTU address and it would have hone a lond way (in avoiding the "snub" thingy). She clearly speaks to his chivalry at previous debates etc.

Fern

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: yllus
I'd say many of us aren't foolish enough to think, "This guy has all-new ideas that will solve everything!" His politics are pretty much identical to Senator Clinton's.

The major difference and benefit to him being President is that he stands a chance of uniting a huge bunch of that 51% / 49% split you folks have going into something resembling a supermajority. He'd also force everyone to bypass the personal politics associated with the last name Clinton and focus on ideas. That's the best the U.S. could hope for this election.

As we saw in last night's debate, the differences between them are actually quite large.

Obama is a uniter. He talks about getting things done by getting people together, discussing the issues openly, and getting the sides to agree on a mutually beneficial course of action. He's a true liberal, as concerned about inadvertently causing harm as he is about purposefully doing good. You can see in him a genuine respect for the power of the office that he is seeking.

Hillary OTOH is about ego. She talks about how she worked towards some agenda in the past, and would have succeeded except evil forces stood in her way, and how if she is given power now she will use that power to force that agenda through, no matter who she might run roughshod over in the process. She seems utterly incapable of understanding -- then, now, or ever -- that that it is exactly the attitude, the divisiveness, and not evil forces, that kept her from achieving her agenda in the past, and will likewise prevent her from achieving her agenda in the future.

America is a nation divided. We are deeply wounded from the partisan politics of the recent decades. We cannot continue down that road. We NEED someone who can bring people together, not drive them farther apart.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: yllus
I'd say many of us aren't foolish enough to think, "This guy has all-new ideas that will solve everything!" His politics are pretty much identical to Senator Clinton's.

The major difference and benefit to him being President is that he stands a chance of uniting a huge bunch of that 51% / 49% split you folks have going into something resembling a supermajority. He'd also force everyone to bypass the personal politics associated with the last name Clinton and focus on ideas. That's the best the U.S. could hope for this election.

I think that because of his apparent lack of "baggage" that is what most people are thinking. I would sure hate to have him get the Dem nod and then find out that he was doing more shady deals with the Rezko fellow then we know about.

I alko think that so many of his supposed supporters are going to jump ship like if he gets the Dem nod and then even more of them will revert back to business as usual once he gets to be President. Look how they hounded the Clintons for their whole 8 years.

Moonies comparison of Obama to Honest Abe might be more prophetic then even he realizes. Electing Abe split the country in two, literally. Personally I'm thinking the known quanity (Hildabeast) sends the R's the right message. They had their chance and they blew it, now they need to get ready to "get" as well as they "gave".

Of course if you think people like Pabster are geniuine in their desire to compromise with the liberals, then vote for Obama, cross your fingers, and hope for the best. My opinion is that all they see in Obama is a chance to elect a weaker leader who is more willing to compromise with them.

<puts flame suit on>

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Of course if you think people like Pabster are geniuine in their desire to compromise with the liberals, then vote for Obama and cross your fingers. My opinion is that all they see in Obama is a weaker leader who is more willing to compromise with them.

I don't believe that Pabster is being genuine in any regard except pragmatism.

If however, you see the willingness and ability to bring people together and compromise as a sign of weakness in a leader of a free democracy, well... that's just nuts.

 

[yllus]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Moonies comparison of Obama to Honest Abe might be more prophetic then even he realizes. Electing Abe split the country in two, literally. Personally I'm thinking the known quanity (Hildabeast) sends the R's the right message. They had their chance and they blew it, now they need to get ready to "get" as well as they "gave".

Yeah! Give to 'em! Teach 'em a lesson! And when that's done with eight years later and the roles switch, watch out because it's payback time! Yeah!

When your choice of political leaders is based on the logic of a second grader, it's likely a sign that you need to reexamine your beliefs.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Of course if you think people like Pabster are geniuine in their desire to compromise with the liberals, then vote for Obama and cross your fingers. My opinion is that all they see in Obama is a weaker leader who is more willing to compromise with them.

I don't believe that Pabster is being genuine in any regard except pragmatism.

If however, you see the willingness and ability to bring people together and compromise as a sign of weakness in a leader of a free democracy, well... that's just nuts.

So your saying the righties won't compromise with Hildabeast but will with Obama? Then screw them!! Like I said, they had their chance and look what they did. The NeoCons are in full retreat and I for one don't want to call the dogs off them just yet.

I want to strike that compromise from the strongest position possible and I think Hillary is the one that can do that and the one they need to deal with.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Moonies comparison of Obama to Honest Abe might be more prophetic then even he realizes. Electing Abe split the country in two, literally. Personally I'm thinking the known quanity (Hildabeast) sends the R's the right message. They had their chance and they blew it, now they need to get ready to "get" as well as they "gave".

Yeah! Give to 'em! Teach 'em a lesson! And when that's done with eight years later and the roles switch, watch out because it's payback time! Yeah!

When your choice of political leaders is based on the logic of a second grader, it's likely a sign that you need to reexamine your beliefs.

LOL, try walking a mile in my shoes first, then get back to me.

 

[yllus]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Moonies comparison of Obama to Honest Abe might be more prophetic then even he realizes. Electing Abe split the country in two, literally. Personally I'm thinking the known quanity (Hildabeast) sends the R's the right message. They had their chance and they blew it, now they need to get ready to "get" as well as they "gave".

Yeah! Give to 'em! Teach 'em a lesson! And when that's done with eight years later and the roles switch, watch out because it's payback time! Yeah!

When your choice of political leaders is based on the logic of a second grader, it's likely a sign that you need to reexamine your beliefs.

LOL, try walking a mile in my shoes first, then get back to me.

No need. Your desire to see everyone else suffer as some kind of payment back on the unimaginable suffering you personally have gone through is well documented. Unfortunately I'm not nearly a big enough douchebag to share that kind of sentiment.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
So your saying the righties won't compromise with Hildabeast but will with Obama? Then screw them!! Like I said, they had their chance and look what they did. The NeoCons are in full retreat and I for one don't want to call the dogs off them just yet.

I think you're doing a wonderful job representing Hillary and her supporters.

Please continue.

Fern

 

[FoBoT]

again, this kind of sentiment proves the Bush-Clinton dynasty theory ,

they need to get ready to "get" as well as they "gave".

Clinton == Bush

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Of course if you think people like Pabster are geniuine in their desire to compromise with the liberals, then vote for Obama and cross your fingers. My opinion is that all they see in Obama is a weaker leader who is more willing to compromise with them.

I don't believe that Pabster is being genuine in any regard except pragmatism.

If however, you see the willingness and ability to bring people together and compromise as a sign of weakness in a leader of a free democracy, well... that's just nuts.

So your saying the righties won't compromise with Hildabeast but will with Obama? Then screw them!! Like I said, they had their chance and look what they did. The NeoCons are in full retreat and I for one don't want to call the dogs off them just yet.

I want to strike that compromise from the strongest position possible and I think Hillary is the one that can do that and the one they need to deal with.

No, Unabomber, I'm not saying that they (the "righties") won't compromise with "Hildabeast," I'm saying that Hildabeast won't even try to compromise with them. And that, in so doing, she will squander all of the left's hard-won political clout on the altar of her ego, and in so doing will not achieve her (or your) agenda.

These "righties" aren't mythical beasts, or faraway threats like the terrorists. They are 50% of the voters in America. They are us. Much as you extremists try to paint this otherwise, all this partisanship has been nothing less than a civil war. If the Dems try to play ego now, like you propose to do, and seek revenge on half of America for being politically misguided, before you've even won the election FFS, then they will throw away everything the Dems have fought and suffered for in the last 8 years. If you do that, if you sacrifice your agenda to your ego, then you will prove beyond all doubt that you are no better than the right who did exactly the same, and that all your good intentions talk was nothing but bullsh!t.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
So your saying the righties won't compromise with Hildabeast but will with Obama? Then screw them!! Like I said, they had their chance and look what they did. The NeoCons are in full retreat and I for one don't want to call the dogs off them just yet.

I think you're doing a wonderful job representing Hillary and her supporters.

Please continue.

Fern

So says the person who supported Bush, Scooter, and Gonzales right to the bitter end. Now it's all about compromise?? OHHH THE IRONY!!

:laugh:

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Of course if you think people like Pabster are geniuine in their desire to compromise with the liberals, then vote for Obama and cross your fingers. My opinion is that all they see in Obama is a weaker leader who is more willing to compromise with them.

I don't believe that Pabster is being genuine in any regard except pragmatism.

If however, you see the willingness and ability to bring people together and compromise as a sign of weakness in a leader of a free democracy, well... that's just nuts.

So your saying the righties won't compromise with Hildabeast but will with Obama? Then screw them!! Like I said, they had their chance and look what they did. The NeoCons are in full retreat and I for one don't want to call the dogs off them just yet.

I want to strike that compromise from the strongest position possible and I think Hillary is the one that can do that and the one they need to deal with.

No, Unabomber, I'm not saying that they (the "righties") won't compromise with "Hildabeast," I'm saying that Hildabeast won't even try to compromise with them. And that, in so doing, she will squander all of the left's hard-won political clout on the altar of her ego, and in so doing will not achieve her (or your) agenda.

These "righties" aren't mythical beasts, or faraway threats like the terrorists. They are 50% of the voters in America. They are us. Much as you extremists try to paint this otherwise, all this partisanship has been nothing less than a civil war. If the Dems try to play ego now, like you propose to do, and seek revenge on half of America for being politically misguided, before you've even won the election FFS, then they will throw away everything the Dems have fought and suffered for in the last 8 years. If you do that, if you sacrifice your agenda to your ego, then you will prove beyond all doubt that you are no better than the right who did exactly the same, and that all your good intentions talk was nothing but bullsh!t.

Unlike you i don't run scared at the thought of upseting any of the fools who got us into this mess. I will survive no matter what. Will you?

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: FoBoT
again, this kind of sentiment proves the Bush-Clinton dynasty theory ,

they need to get ready to "get" as well as they "gave".

Clinton > Bush

Fixed

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Moonies comparison of Obama to Honest Abe might be more prophetic then even he realizes. Electing Abe split the country in two, literally. Personally I'm thinking the known quanity (Hildabeast) sends the R's the right message. They had their chance and they blew it, now they need to get ready to "get" as well as they "gave".

Yeah! Give to 'em! Teach 'em a lesson! And when that's done with eight years later and the roles switch, watch out because it's payback time! Yeah!

I have no problems giving them a taste of their own medicine. It's the way politics in this country has always worked. Get used to it

When your choice of political leaders is based on the logic of a second grader, it's likely a sign that you need to reexamine your beliefs.

[/quote]
Where is your logic that Hillary would be any worse the Obama? I guess logic has nothing to do with it. You can compromise if you want, but I don't think it's time to run scared. I think Hillary can beat them and would do a better job of running the country then Obama. Can you prove otherwise?


Yeah, i didn't thinks so.

LOL, try walking a mile in my shoes first, then get back to me.

No need. Your desire to see everyone else suffer as some kind of payment back on the unimaginable suffering you personally have gone through is well documented. Unfortunately I'm not nearly a big enough douchebag to share that kind of sentiment.

Got me all figured out huh. The thing is you're the same as me, you think your better, but in reality your not, you just don't know it yet. Just continue dumping on me for having a different opinion and life experience then you if it makes you "feel" better. I don't subscribe to the "he who dies with the most toys.... wins" philosphy but I do believe in the "it's not who was right, but who is left" philosphy.

This is about who we feel is the right person for the POTUS, not what kind of person you all THINK I am. I think Hillary is the better choice and nothing any of you has said has done a thing to change that opinion.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: FoBoT
again, this kind of sentiment proves the Bush-Clinton dynasty theory ,

they need to get ready to "get" as well as they "gave".

Clinton > Bush

Fixed

Sorry, but you sound just like them.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: FoBoT
again, this kind of sentiment proves the Bush-Clinton dynasty theory ,

they need to get ready to "get" as well as they "gave".

Clinton > Bush

Fixed

Sorry, but you sound just like them.

Why, because I'm not afraid to see some R blood flow?

I think I identify with with the Clintons because I feel I have been in the same pressure cooker they found themselves in, courtesy of the NeoCon's AND everybody who supported thOSE ASSHOLES. It's made me hard, but a diamond is nothing more then a hard piece of coal.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Unlike you i don't run scared at the thought of upseting any of the fools who got us into this mess. I will survive no matter what. Will you?

As a partisan hack, you're one of the fools who got us into this mess, and who is -- quite transparently -- trying to keep us in this mess, all for the sake of keeping up your little partisan bickering. You're like children: "he hit me first, wahh!"

I have no idea why you would say that I am running scared or won't survive, except that it seems you'll falling back on your usual when-all-else-fails-then-hurl-nonsensical-insults tactic again.

I think Hillary is the better choice and nothing any of you has said has done a thing to change that opinion.

Yet just last week you said you were backing Obama. Do I need to search for that post?

In the meantime, are you ever going to bother framing some kind of actual INTELLIGENT reply to my posts? I've long ago grown weary of dealing with your little petty bitterness and emotionalism.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
So your saying the righties won't compromise with Hildabeast but will with Obama? Then screw them!! Like I said, they had their chance and look what they did. The NeoCons are in full retreat and I for one don't want to call the dogs off them just yet.

I think you're doing a wonderful job representing Hillary and her supporters.

Please continue.

Fern

So says the person who supported Bush, Scooter, and Gonzales right to the bitter end. Now it's all about compromise?? OHHH THE IRONY!!

:laugh:

And you realize that he and everyone just like him is still going to vote this year, right? And I'm sure they'd love to vote Dem if it wasn't for assholes like you trying to chase them back to the Republican fold.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: FoBoT
again, this kind of sentiment proves the Bush-Clinton dynasty theory ,

they need to get ready to "get" as well as they "gave".

Clinton > Bush

Fixed

Sorry, but you sound just like them.

Why, because I'm not afraid to see some R blood flow?

I think I identify with with the Clintons because I feel I have been in the same pressure cooker they found themselves in, courtesy of the NeoCon's AND everybody who supported thOSE ASSHOLES. It's made me hard, but a diamond is nothing more then a hard piece of coal.

And that's 51% of America. Meaning yours (and Hillary's) agenda will cause the Dems to lose this fall.

That's why this election CANNOT be about revenge, or your poor little bitter ego. Why don't you do all the Democrats a favor and log off until December, eh?

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: FoBoT
again, this kind of sentiment proves the Bush-Clinton dynasty theory ,

they need to get ready to "get" as well as they "gave".

Clinton > Bush

Fixed

Sorry, but you sound just like them.

Why, because I'm not afraid to see some R blood flow?

I think I identify with with the Clintons because I feel I have been in the same pressure cooker they found themselves in, courtesy of the NeoCon's AND everybody who supported thOSE ASSHOLES. It's made me hard, but a diamond is nothing more then a hard piece of coal.

And that's 51% of America. Meaning yours (and Hillary's) agenda will cause the Dems to lose this fall.

That's why this election CANNOT be about revenge, or your poor little bitter ego. Why don't you do all the Democrats a favor and log off until December, eh?

Your living in the past. GWB barely squeaked by both times. If he wasn't "wagging the dog" with Iraq he never would have been re-elected. And it's gotten much worse since then.

Why don't YOU do the Dems a favor and grow a set, Hillary's are bigger then yours.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
So your saying the righties won't compromise with Hildabeast but will with Obama? Then screw them!! Like I said, they had their chance and look what they did. The NeoCons are in full retreat and I for one don't want to call the dogs off them just yet.

I think you're doing a wonderful job representing Hillary and her supporters.

Please continue.

Fern

So says the person who supported Bush, Scooter, and Gonzales right to the bitter end. Now it's all about compromise?? OHHH THE IRONY!!

:laugh:

Dude, you're just trolling.



Fern

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
So your saying the righties won't compromise with Hildabeast but will with Obama? Then screw them!! Like I said, they had their chance and look what they did. The NeoCons are in full retreat and I for one don't want to call the dogs off them just yet.

I think you're doing a wonderful job representing Hillary and her supporters.

Please continue.

Fern

So says the person who supported Bush, Scooter, and Gonzales right to the bitter end. Now it's all about compromise?? OHHH THE IRONY!!

:laugh:

Dude, you're just trolling.



Fern

No, I'm just defending myself and supporting Hillary. I think she will do a beter job and spend less money doing it, with the exception of healthcare which has been talked to death for years and now needs to come to the forefront and either be acted on or dropped.

 

[Drift3r]

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: Drift3r
This will end when the "Bradley Effect" kicks on the day people vote.

There is no "Bradley Effect".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bradley_effect