What were the worst things Obama did?

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NWRMidnight

Platinum Member
Jun 18, 2001
2,950
2,558
136
Tough guy syndrome is clearly on full display.

Again - think of her competing in a competitive sport such as women's wrestling, boxing, etc... and having to face up to someone who gets testosterone hormone treatments. No amount of "HUR DUR TOUGH GUY I TEACH DAUGHTER GUD" is going to stop someone with far more muscle mass beating the living fuck out of her. Period. End of story.
HUH? How the hell did you get tough guy syndrome out of my daughter kicking ass? Has absolutely nothing to do with tough guy syndrome. It's about teaching her she can accomplish anything and teaching her the skills to do so. All you sound like is a male chauvinist, and think women are weak. Almost to the point that you come across as someone who is abusive towards women. I hope not, but if you are, someday, you will cross the wrong woman and find out how full of shit you are.

Woman have proven that they can do anything a man can do, and can compete against men with no problems in any sport. . And in some cases perform better, that includes all ranges of sports. In boxing, wrestling, hand to hand combat, size, and even strength isn't the determining factor. I always was put up against people twice my size and much stronger, and I rarely lost. It's not different for a woman. All you are doing is showing your prejudice with your "it's not fair for women crap". I bet you believe women belong home barefoot and pregnant too.
 
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Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
14,552
9,929
136
The Dems spent everything they had to try and get healthcare done. They were forced into a compromise and then bludgeoned to death for their attempt. Once congress was lost what could he do?
I completely agree. Obama couldn't get anything real done without having control of congress.

Democrats in general suck at selling Obamacare, and Obama was poor at selling his own successes, which almost cost him in 2012.
 

zzyzxroad

Diamond Member
Jan 29, 2017
3,244
2,260
136
I completely agree. Obama couldn't get anything real done without having control of congress.

Democrats in general suck at selling Obamacare, and Obama was poor at selling his own successes, which almost cost him in 2012.
Before the Dems actually started to work on getting something passed I was hopefully we would follow the rest our peer nations. As soon as the push started my hope quickly sank.

Fear is such a powerful political weapon.
 

Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
14,552
9,929
136
HUH? How the hell did you get tough guy syndrome out of my daughter kicking ass? Has absolutely nothing to do with tough guy syndrome. It's about teaching her she can accomplish anything and teaching her the skills to do so. All you sound like is a male chauvinist, and think women are weak. Woman have proven that they can do anything a man can do, and can compete against men with no problems. And in some cases perform better, that includes all ranges of sports. In boxing, wrestling, hand to hand combat, size, and even strength isn't the determining factor. I always was put up against people twice my size and much stronger, and I rarely lost. It's not different for a woman. All you are doing is showing your prejudice with your "it's not fair for women crap". I bet you believe women belong home barefoot and pregnant too.
This is just bullshit. There is a reason there are different leagues for women and men.

High school male sprinters and mid distance runners can run faster the than woman's world records. Same in swimming, skiing, etc. Even golf, there is a massive disparity between equivalent levels of women vs men.

Please provide links to any woman actively competing against males in any combat sport.

This is not a bash of women's sports, there are many women's sports I enjoy much more than the men's version, but it is accepting reality there are physical differences between men and women and they impact athletic ability.
 

NWRMidnight

Platinum Member
Jun 18, 2001
2,950
2,558
136
This is just bullshit. There is a reason there are different leagues for women and men.

High school male sprinters and mid distance runners can run faster the than woman's world records. Same in swimming, skiing, etc. Even golf, there is a massive disparity between equivalent levels of women vs men.

Please provide links to any woman actively competing against males in any combat sport.

This is not a bash of women's sports, there are many women's sports I enjoy much more than the men's version, but it is accepting reality there are physical differences between men and women and they impact athletic ability.
No where did I ever say that there wasn't physical differences, nor did I say that they don't impact athletic ability. There are physical difference with men vs other men as well, that effect athletic ability. That's why there are different weight classes in boxing, wrestling, etc. The reason men normally run faster than women is because men have larger hearts. That doesn't mean they can't compete against each other. It also doesn't mean that women would always lose. I was on the Wyoming state swim team when I was younger. There where plenty of girls my age, and my size who could out swim me, who had higher stamina and strength.

The reason there are different leagues isn't because of athletic ability, but because sports have been designed around men. Remember WW2, the outcry and how upsetting it was when the first all women baseball team was created? It is all tied to the same line of thinking, that girls don't belong in sports, and that they aren't capable of doing it. Yet, we see news articles where women are competing in men's sports against men, like football, etc. and doing just as well. Not at the professional level because the majority are still stuck in thinking that men and women can't compete, much like yourselves. It's the same wrong thinking that goes with the "women can't be combat jet pilots" or "women can't be seal team members" etc. Guess what, they are proving that line of thinking wrong. The issue is deeply rooted in our culture, and society, world wide. That way of thinking has nothing to do with athletic ability. If you go back and read my earliert post, I said that once it all balances out with transgenders, there would be guidelines and regulations put in place to make if fair and balanced. Just like there are currently in boxing, like weight classes and such.

Don't get me wrong, every sport that could have women vs men won't always be evenly matched. But in all reality, there are a lot of men vs men or women vs women that aren't always evenly matched either. But that is why we have different divisions, weight classes etc.

As for examples, I've watched women and men compete in boxing, martial arts, wrestling, swimming, motocross, running, football, baseball, the list goes on and on. And it was always a toss of up who would win. Of course, because of how society and our culture currently exist. NON of those exist at the professional, or even minor levels.
 
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Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
14,552
9,929
136
No where did I ever say that there wasn't physical differences, nor did I say that they don't impact athletic ability. There are physical difference with other men as well that effect athletic ability. That's why there are different weight classes in boxing, wrestling, etc. The reason men normally run faster than women is because men have larger hearts. That doesn't mean they can't compete against each other. It also doesn't mean that women would always lose. I was on the Wyoming state swim team when I was younger. There where plenty of girls my age, and my size who could out swim me, who had higher stamina and strength.

The reason there are different leagues isn't because of athletic ability, but because sports have been designed around men. Remember WW2, the outcry and how upsetting it was when the first all women baseball team was created? It is all tied to the same line of thinking, that girls don't belong in sports, and that they aren't capable of doing it. Yet, we see news articles where women are competing in men's sports against men, like football, etc. and doing just as well. Not at the professional level because the majority are still stuck in thinking that men and women can't compete, much like yourselves. It's the same wrong thinking that goes with the "women can't be combat jet pilots" or "women can't be seal team members" etc. Guess what, they are proving that line of thinking wrong. The issue is deeply rooted in our culture, and society, world wide, and that way of thinking, and has nothing to do with athletic ability. Because of the way our culture is, and how many in society view it, I can't give you any active examples of women vs men combat sports because society is still stuck in "woman can't do it" phase, and they don't really exist in the sports world yet. But I can give you real live non sports examples: Women seal team members. Police officers (they are trained to take down bigger and stronger). Do you think they are trained to only go up against women? Get out of here. One sports example I can give you is Motocross racing, not professional, but there are many clubs around the nations that have races that include both genders. it is a very physical sport that requires strength, and stamina. Guess what, women win the races all the time. (I have a niece who competes in such races and beats those so called tougher men). If you go back and read my first post, I said that once it all balances out with transgenders, there would be guidelines and regulations put in place to make if fair and balanced. Just like there are currently in boxing, like weight classes and such.
Find any example, outside of ultra distance running and maybe figure skating, where women and men are equivalent in a sport. Of course, there are women that could beat most men at any given sport. But you can't compare a pro woman against an amateur man and claim parity.

But you are basically claiming the reason women can't hang with men is because they have been trained to be soft by society and don't put in the effort. But I have news for you, the female Olympic runners are putting in a shit ton more effort, with much more sophisticated training than the 17 year-old boy at my local high school that could beat them. Serena Williams puts in a ton of effort and has some of the best coaches in the world, yet a nobody male could (and has) beaten her.

Obviously I am not talking about motor sports. I see no reason why women couldn't compete in motor sports if given equal opportunity. I am talking about human powered sports.

A random example, 2016 100M Butterfly. The woman set a world record, would've been forth from last place against the men*. 400M Dash, the woman would've been second from last against the men*. Marathon, the woman would've finished 92nd.

Of course any of these women would kick the shit out of the vast majority of males, but they are not at parity with equivalent level males, and it is not from a training difference or societal difference. In reality, Olympic sports probably get a higher level of female athlete than male athlete, since many other male sports provide easier paths to college and high earning professional sports.

*The men's time here were qualifying heat times, which are slower than the times during the finals, so it isn't a real apples to apples.

I also don't believe there have ever been any female Navy Seals at the moment. Not that they can't get there, but again it isn't parity there either.

BTW: Accepting reality isn't being sexist. I think women should be given every opportunity to compete and train. And I think male leagues should be open, so if a woman was able to compete with them she should be allowed to. But I also think woman should have female leagues where they can compete against people with the same biological advantages and disadvantages.

Also, if any promoter thought their female boxer could win against a professional male, they'd make it happen. The PPV for it would be massive. The most famous UFC person was a woman for a long time, but they never even put her up a worst ranked male. Of course she could easily beat the shit out of me, though.
 
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NWRMidnight

Platinum Member
Jun 18, 2001
2,950
2,558
136
Find any example, outside of ultra distance running and maybe figure skating, where women and men are equivalent in a sport. Of course, there are women that could beat most men at any given sport. But you can't compare a pro woman against an amateur man and claim parity.

But you are basically claiming the reason women can't hang with men is because they have been trained to be soft by society and don't put in the effort. But I have news for you, the female Olympic runners are putting in a shit ton more effort, with much more sophisticated training than the 17 year-old boy at my local high school that could beat them. Serena Williams puts in a ton of effort and has some of the best coaches in the world, yet a nobody male could (and has) beaten her.

Obviously I am not talking about motor sports. I see no reason why women couldn't compete in motor sports if given equal opportunity. I am talking about human powered sports.

A random example, 2016 100M Butterfly. The woman set a world record, would've been forth from last place against the men*. 400M Dash, the woman would've been second from last against the men*. Marathon, the woman would've finished 92nd.

Of course any of these women would kick the shit out of the vast majority of males, but they are not at parity with equivalent level males, and it is not from a training difference or societal difference. In reality, Olympic sports probably get a higher level of female athlete than male athlete, since many other male sports provide easier paths to college and high earning professional sports.

*The men's time here were qualifying heat times, which are slower than the times during the finals, so it isn't a real apples to apples.

I also don't believe there have ever been any female Navy Seals at the moment. Not that they can't get there, but again it isn't parity there either.

BTW: Accepting reality isn't being sexist. I think women should be given every opportunity to compete and train. And I think male leagues should be open, so if a woman was able to compete with them she should be allowed to. But I also think woman should have female leagues where they can compete against people with the same biological advantages and disadvantages.

Also, if any promoter thought their female boxer could win against a professional male, they'd make it happen. The PPV for it would be massive. The most famous UFC person was a woman for a long time, but they never even put her up a worst ranked male. Of course she could easily beat the shit out of me, though.

They just made it legal for a woman to be a Navy Seal in late 2015. They have only had 2 candidates. The first dropped out. The second passed the rigorous training, but was not selected to be a seal. There is not information why she wasn't selected. Point is, she passed, something that many people said couldn't be done.

I never said anything about putting a pro against and armature. You see what you want to see. Culture and society is what is holding it back. But you don't want to see that. There is always someone better be it a man, or a woman. You are ignoring the FACT that they have divisions, classes, etc even between just the men, just for the very things you are trying to use as your argument. NO where did I say that women are better or even equal to men in every sport. But you keep throwing out examples of where they fail. I already told you why men perform better in running and such.. But you ignored that too. Your examples of women's record vs men is flawed. It's a proven fact that people will only perform to the level of your competition, if you don't have the competition to push you, you won't gain anything. This goes for professionals as well. At this time, because of our culture and society, men are not the competition and are not there to push women to be faster or better. I've had first hand experience watching evenly matched men and women compete, and the outcome isn't what you say.. They both win some and they both lose some. (I gave you a long list of various sports that I have watched). But you ignored that, or you somehow correlated it to a professional against an armature, which is not what I said. You keep saying they would make it happen at the profession level if they could compete with each other, that isn't true because of the very culture we live in. It will happen someday. Just as women's rights, and rights to vote came about. You seem to be oblivious of the reality we live in. Women are still fighting for basic equal rights such as the simple thing as equal pay, and fairness in the work place. Yet, you think that sports, which has been designed around men is going to make it happen. Many people, mostly men, in society can't accept them as equal outside of sports, so what makes you think that sports will be the exception?

So, I think it's time to agree to disagree.
 
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ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
37,768
18,046
146
HUH? How the hell did you get tough guy syndrome out of my daughter kicking ass? Has absolutely nothing to do with tough guy syndrome. It's about teaching her she can accomplish anything and teaching her the skills to do so. All you sound like is a male chauvinist, and think women are weak. Almost to the point that you come across as someone who is abusive towards women. I hope not, but if you are, someday, you will cross the wrong woman and find out how full of shit you are.

Woman have proven that they can do anything a man can do, and can compete against men with no problems in any sport. . And in some cases perform better, that includes all ranges of sports. In boxing, wrestling, hand to hand combat, size, and even strength isn't the determining factor. I always was put up against people twice my size and much stronger, and I rarely lost. It's not different for a woman. All you are doing is showing your prejudice with your "it's not fair for women crap". I bet you believe women belong home barefoot and pregnant too.

He's just here to scream his projection as loud as possible
 

nickqt

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2015
7,544
7,688
136
XX should play in different physical sports leagues than XY.

It isn't about one being "better" than another. It's about having a meaningful division so that XX and XY are able to compete with people of similar genetics, since sportsball is basically genetics + training. There's my "conservative" point of view of the day.\

Next topic that is relevant to anything that affects real life.
 
Nov 8, 2012
20,828
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You're right. We will have to agree to disagree.

Zorba is using facts, logic, statistics, and reasoning.

You are using moronic anecdotes and your feelings.


Men and women aren't equal. Saying such is preposterously moronic. One produces large amounts of hormones that helps build muscle mass - the other produces hormones that hinder muscle mass. But you know... Anything a man can do a woman can because #equality. Facts be damned. But everyone has to do their part and virtue signal with baseless bullshit social justice statements.

Hell, the point earlier of a shit ranked male tennis player beating the shit out the williams sisters should tell you all you need to know to come to a logical and rational conclusion.
 
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Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
14,552
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They just made it legal for a woman to be a Navy Seal in late 2015. They have only had 2 candidates. The first dropped out. The second passed the rigorous training, but was not selected to be a seal. There is not information why she wasn't selected. Point is, she passed, something that many people said couldn't be done.

I never said anything about putting a pro against and armature. You see what you want to see. Culture and society is what is holding it back. But you don't want to see that. There is always someone better be it a man, or a woman. You are ignoring the FACT that they have divisions, classes, etc even between just the men, just for the very things you are trying to use as your argument. NO where did I say that women are better or even equal to men in every sport. But you keep throwing out examples of where they fail. I already told you why men perform better in running and such.. But you ignored that too. Your examples of women's record vs men is flawed. It's a proven fact that people will only perform to the level of your competition, if you don't have the competition to push you, you won't gain anything. This goes for professionals as well. At this time, because of our culture and society, men are not the competition and are not there to push women to be faster or better. I've had first hand experience watching evenly matched men and women compete, and the outcome isn't what you say.. They both win some and they both lose some. (I gave you a long list of various sports that I have watched). But you ignored that, or you somehow correlated it to a professional against an armature, which is not what I said. You keep saying they would make it happen at the profession level if they could compete with each other, that isn't true because of the very culture we live in. It will happen someday. Just as women's rights, and rights to vote came about. You seem to be oblivious of the reality we live in. Women are still fighting for basic equal rights such as the simple thing as equal pay, and fairness in the work place. Yet, you think that sports, which has been designed around men is going to make it happen. Many people, mostly men, in society can't accept them as equal outside of sports, so what makes you think that sports will be the exception?

So, I think it's time to agree to disagree.
Okay. I posted facts. There are obvious biological differences. I think it's bizarre that you think woman with access to the most elite training in the world are still just being held back by society. Not to mention most top female athletes train with men.

Random amateur level really doesn't mean much because there are vast differences in training, genes, and experience at those levels.

I agree, we can agree to disagree, obviously we are way off the main topic of this thread.
 

repoman0

Diamond Member
Jun 17, 2010
4,480
3,322
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I don't think assault weapon bans impact statistics much. In general I think the Dems hurt their party by taking such a hard stand on guns. Universal background checks and safety training should be a no brainer though.

After that the focus should be on helping poor communities with high violent crime rates fix the root cause.

I agree 100% and was having this same discussion with a friend the other day. How many people vote republican purely because dems won’t let them have their toys? All it takes is 2% and Republicans never have a national majority again. Plus the bans are pointless, cat is out of the bag. Accept it and stop losing elections for no reason.
 

MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
21,277
19,768
136
XX should play in different physical sports leagues than XY.

It isn't about one being "better" than another. It's about having a meaningful division so that XX and XY are able to compete with people of similar genetics, since sportsball is basically genetics + training. There's my "conservative" point of view of the day.\

Next topic that is relevant to anything that affects real life.
I'm in the same boat, except in cases of actual intersex people, that should be discussed more. I also feel that some shouldn't be encouraging kids to transition without more studies. It's a really stressful confusing part of life already to compound it with making those kinds of decisions.
 

Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
37,516
8,103
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Being born black.
maxresdefault.jpg
 
Nov 8, 2012
20,828
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The whole "Can someone get me a glass water" during the Flint shit was worthy of a punch to the dick. Every single American in Flint should have been booing and throwing shit at him for being such a fucking asshat during that.
 

zzyzxroad

Diamond Member
Jan 29, 2017
3,244
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The whole "Can someone get me a glass water" during the Flint shit was worthy of a punch to the dick. Every single American in Flint should have been booing and throwing shit at him for being such a fucking asshat during that.
You're out of touch with reality.


 

brandonbull

Diamond Member
May 3, 2005
6,330
1,203
126
Obama had a supermajority in reality for a total of...5 months. Not 2 years, and definitely not 4.

Add in the fact that the Democratic Party is a Big Tent party that doesn't march in lockstep...and those 5 months weren't some monolithic time period of Democratic tyrrany.

That said, all US Presidents are elected Emperors and kill people because Empires gotta Empire. Obama wasn't nearly as bad as some, but he still murdered people using your tax dollars. They all do.
The current Democratic party is an authoritarian collective that doesn't deviate from the approved message. Don't give us some nonsense about big tents and not in lockstep. I pity the person that doesn't follow the strict teachings of the Progresshevik religion.
 

nickqt

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2015
7,544
7,688
136
The current Democratic party is an authoritarian collective that doesn't deviate from the approved message. Don't give us some nonsense about big tents and not in lockstep. I pity the person that doesn't follow the strict teachings of the Progresshevik religion.
You're screaming hysterically at a mirror.

I hope you feel better.
 
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MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
21,277
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The current Democratic party is an authoritarian collective that doesn't deviate from the approved message. Don't give us some nonsense about big tents and not in lockstep. I pity the person that doesn't follow the strict teachings of the Progresshevik religion.

You make Imported_tajmahal seem almost sentient and coherent. And that's really really hard. Intellectually that guy is closer to a baboon than a human so it's quite impressive.
 

zzyzxroad

Diamond Member
Jan 29, 2017
3,244
2,260
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The current Democratic party is an authoritarian collective that doesn't deviate from the approved message. Don't give us some nonsense about big tents and not in lockstep. I pity the person that doesn't follow the strict teachings of the Progresshevik religion.

Did you post in the wrong thread? What the hell are you mumbling about?
 

zzyzxroad

Diamond Member
Jan 29, 2017
3,244
2,260
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Tying heath insurance to employers. It never should have been this way.
The GM bailout was another bad call as well.
I posted the below earlier but it probably got lost in the shuffle. You seem like an honest person so I am actually interested in your response if you have time.

The healthcare compromise is on the republican. We like all our peers in the word should have national healthcare.

You will have to explain how the GM bailout wasn't a good idea.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
36,060
27,793
136
The current Democratic party is an authoritarian collective that doesn't deviate from the approved message. Don't give us some nonsense about big tents and not in lockstep. I pity the person that doesn't follow the strict teachings of the Progresshevik religion.
Pro life Senator Bob Casey elected in office 2006 and still Senator. He campaigned with Obama in 2008 when he ran. I saw them in person. There are 2 others which just happens to be the SAME number of pro choice Republican senators