What if you never had to worry about rent or food?

[werepossum]

Who would build the apartment building that you sit around and watch netflix in all day if everyone is sitting around and watching netflix.

Nobody wants to go out and install waste pipes, electric lines, hang from height as a lineman, etc. Nobody goes, you know what, I bet my passion is septic tanks. No... people get good at it and are happy with that way of life but nobody would choose it over sitting on their ass all day.

I'll go out on a limb and say that if someone's passion is septic tanks, they probably should not be allowed around septic tanks.

Doesn't matter - in brave new world, everyone live in tenement where government can watch.

 

[Mandres]

The problem is that even if machines do all the labor, it doesn't solve the issue of scarcity of resources. There is only so much capacity for the generation of electricity for example. What happens when all of the idle humans consume the available supply and demand more? The price will go up, that's what. Pretty soon, a "comfortable" level of electricity will cost more than the base income provides for, and to maintain a "comfortable" lifestyle those idle humans will have to trade their time/energy/bodies for money to afford it.

That's exactly where we are today. We already have a baseline income guaranteed by the federal and state welfare programs, but it truly only provides for the bare essentials to sustain life. As long as scarcity of resources still exists any baseline income program will only inflate the price of those resources, and leave the average person in the same condition they are in today - having to work / spend time doing something unpleasant in exchange for more resources to be comfortable.

 

[JSt0rm]

The problem is that even if machines do all the labor, it doesn't solve the issue of scarcity of resources. There is only so much capacity for the generation of electricity for example. What happens when all of the idle humans consume the available supply and demand more? The price will go up, that's what. Pretty soon, a "comfortable" level of electricity will cost more than the base income provides for, and to maintain a "comfortable" lifestyle those idle humans will have to trade their time/energy/bodies for money to afford it.

That's exactly where we are today. We already have a baseline income guaranteed by the federal and state welfare programs, but it truly only provides for the bare essentials to sustain life. As long as scarcity of resources still exists any baseline income program will only inflate the price of those resources, and leave the average person in the same condition they are in today - having to work / spend time doing something unpleasant in exchange for more resources to be comfortable.

Thats a fair point but taking your example of electrical use I think we will over come that with solar power in the next 200 years. We should have access to clean "free" power in the not so distant future. There will come a point where we will need to change our economic systems to account for the fact that only maybe 3% of the population can even have a job. None of us will probably be alive at that point but it is interesting.

 

[JSt0rm]

Look at what is about to happen in the transportation sector. 1.8 million truck drivers are about to lose their jobs in the next 20 years for sure. Add all of the taxi drivers and you are at 2 million professional drivers. Add on the fact that most people will only need 1 self driving car per house hold and you are beginning to see the problem.

Every time we automate we are going to lose low skilled jobs. This will make the high skilled jobs pay less as demand increases for those positions. We will also see a "mental inflation" of how smart a human must be to actually be employed. And as we move farther into the future we will lose more and more jobs to robots ever increasing the demand for a ever decreasing amount of jobs. At a certain point you wont be able to blame the individual for not being able to find a job. There just simply wont be any jobs. At that point what do we prefer? People living lives that they want or mass starvation and suffering with only a small elite group living well?

 

[OverVolt]

Look at what is about to happen in the transportation sector. 1.8 million truck drivers are about to lose their jobs in the next 20 years for sure. Add all of the taxi drivers and you are at 2 million professional drivers. Add on the fact that most people will only need 1 self driving car per house hold and you are beginning to see the problem.

Every time we automate we are going to lose low skilled jobs. This will make the high skilled jobs pay less as demand increases for those positions. We will also see a "mental inflation" of how smart a human must be to actually be employed. And as we move farther into the future we will lose more and more jobs to robots ever increasing the demand for a ever decreasing amount of jobs. At a certain point you wont be able to blame the individual for not being able to find a job. There just simply wont be any jobs. At that point what do we prefer? People living lives that they want or mass starvation and suffering with only a small elite group living well?

Lol no they aren't. Automation can't drive in cities and situations that require bending of the law.

You can't have JIT delivery with two trucks sitting across from each other at a stop sign playing "no I insist, you go first, no... I insist, you go first." for literally a week if one of them violates the right of way of the other.

There is no liability system for such automation either. I'd have no problem being a trucker and being confident I will have a job in 20 years. Its donks who sit in an office all day and don't get into the real world who think like that.

 

[JSt0rm]

So you dont think semi drivers are on the chopping block? And the reason you give is because you think 2 autonomous vehicles will sit at a light waiting for the other to go?

What if I told you in the future there will be no stop signs or stop lights? What if I told you in the future all the autonomous vehicles will know where they are in relation to other vehicles and adjust?

 

[JSt0rm]

There is no liability system for such automation either. I'd have no problem being a trucker and being confident I will have a job in 20 years. Its donks who sit in an office all day and don't get into the real world who think like that.

responding to your ninja edit:

There would be liability. The maker of the vehicle would carry insurance. You must work in that sector to get triggered about it.

 

[OverVolt]

So you dont think semi drivers are on the chopping block? And the reason you give is because you think 2 autonomous vehicles will sit at a light waiting for the other to go?

What if I told you in the future there will be no stop signs or stop lights? What if I told you in the future all the autonomous vehicles will know where they are in relation to other vehicles and adjust?

What if I told you there are still intersections in the city with dummy timers from 1960. Good luck with that. A truck usually has to break several traffic laws to back into its final destination. I'm sure you've seen one at least once blocking the whole road.

Something like the google car will probably be programmed to suicide itself if its only crash avoidance has pedestrians around and its dicey. Pedestrians are sacrosanct.

Oh and the pedestrian was a bush, sorry there was dirt on the sensor.

Seriously, no thanks.

 

[JSt0rm]

im not talking about today. You keep referring to the challenges of right now as to why we wont have some tech in the future.

 

[JSt0rm]

Oh and GM and ford both see the writing on the wall and are moving into this space. Along with uber and google. The cost savings of removing humans from driving and the convenience to those of us who commute can not be ignored.

 

[BoberFett]

Look at what is about to happen in the transportation sector. 1.8 million truck drivers are about to lose their jobs in the next 20 years for sure. Add all of the taxi drivers and you are at 2 million professional drivers. Add on the fact that most people will only need 1 self driving car per house hold and you are beginning to see the problem.

Every time we automate we are going to lose low skilled jobs. This will make the high skilled jobs pay less as demand increases for those positions. We will also see a "mental inflation" of how smart a human must be to actually be employed. And as we move farther into the future we will lose more and more jobs to robots ever increasing the demand for a ever decreasing amount of jobs. At a certain point you wont be able to blame the individual for not being able to find a job. There just simply wont be any jobs. At that point what do we prefer? People living lives that they want or mass starvation and suffering with only a small elite group living well?

There's going to come a point at which the human race needs to stop expanding, and actually decrease the population. No politician would ever say that however, which is part of the problem. We'll just keep making more people even though we don't have anything for them to do.

 

[BoberFett]

What if I told you there are still intersections in the city with dummy timers from 1960. Good luck with that. A truck usually has to break several traffic laws to back into its final destination. I'm sure you've seen one at least once blocking the whole road.

Something like the google car will probably be programmed to suicide itself if its only crash avoidance has pedestrians around and its dicey. Pedestrians are sacrosanct.

Oh and the pedestrian was a bush, sorry there was dirt on the sensor.

Seriously, no thanks.

 

[MongGrel]

There's going to come a point at which the human race needs to stop expanding, and actually decrease the population. No politician would ever say that however, which is part of the problem. We'll just keep making more people even though we don't have anything for them to do.

There comes a point where you will type "LOL, Democrats" again also.

Some things are inevitable, though I have made that point myself in the past.

 

[HeXen]

Let's spend money on a study that has data already available on the very subject via welfare recipients. I could do the same study and not spend a dime outside of gas costs. I'd drive around the hood and knock on doors and aks dem doze kiands of quetchen's....presto, instant data, assuming I don't get shot first but I'm pretty good and black english and trailer talk so they might relate to me. Then I could use the rest of the funding for my own food so I could watch netflix all day. See how well efficiency works?

 

[Shaun_Brannen]

There's going to come a point at which the human race needs to stop expanding, and actually decrease the population. No politician would ever say that however, which is part of the problem. We'll just keep making more people even though we don't have anything for them to do.

It's probably much farther off than you -- or anyone, at this point -- can estimate, though. Barriers have already shown up in the past, and have been knocked down. I mean, people have estimated things capping out at 10 billion because of food constraints... but vertical farming is becoming and will increasingly become a bigger thing.

I'm not particularly concerned about it. Still, I'm only planning on 1-2 kids.

 

[JSt0rm]

Let's spend money on a study that has data already available on the very subject via welfare recipients. I could do the same study and not spend a dime outside of gas costs. I'd drive around the hood and knock on doors and aks dem doze kiands of quetchen's....presto, instant data, assuming I don't get shot first but I'm pretty good and black english and trailer talk so they might relate to me. Then I could use the rest of the funding for my own food so I could watch netflix all day. See how well efficiency works?

D:

horrible humans around here.

 

[JSt0rm]

It's probably much farther off than you -- or anyone, at this point -- can estimate, though. Barriers have already shown up in the past, and have been knocked down. I mean, people have estimated things capping out at 10 billion because of food constraints... but vertical farming is becoming and will increasingly become a bigger thing.

I'm not particularly concerned about it. Still, I'm only planning on 1-2 kids.

He is right. We should try to get the population to be a stable 4 billion tops. We are killing this place.

 

[Shaun_Brannen]

He is right. We should try to get the population to be a stable 4 billion tops. We are killing this place.

The world's not ready for that yet. Still too much international drama to negotiate something like that. Heck, even on a national level, things are too messed up.

 

[werepossum]

Look at what is about to happen in the transportation sector. 1.8 million truck drivers are about to lose their jobs in the next 20 years for sure. Add all of the taxi drivers and you are at 2 million professional drivers. Add on the fact that most people will only need 1 self driving car per house hold and you are beginning to see the problem.

Every time we automate we are going to lose low skilled jobs. This will make the high skilled jobs pay less as demand increases for those positions. We will also see a "mental inflation" of how smart a human must be to actually be employed. And as we move farther into the future we will lose more and more jobs to robots ever increasing the demand for a ever decreasing amount of jobs. At a certain point you wont be able to blame the individual for not being able to find a job. There just simply wont be any jobs. At that point what do we prefer? People living lives that they want or mass starvation and suffering with only a small elite group living well?

Taxi drivers, sure. I can see them losing their jobs in twenty years. No way for semi drivers, way too much liability. They might not be steering in twenty years, but they will still be sitting there waiting to take over at a second's notice. (Not sure how much good a man watching porn will be in that split second, but he'll be there.)

We are not yet anywhere near the singularity. Each such innovation invariably spawns a LOT of new jobs, and self-driving cars will not be any different.

Let's spend money on a study that has data already available on the very subject via welfare recipients. I could do the same study and not spend a dime outside of gas costs. I'd drive around the hood and knock on doors and aks dem doze kiands of quetchen's....presto, instant data, assuming I don't get shot first but I'm pretty good and black english and trailer talk so they might relate to me. Then I could use the rest of the funding for my own food so I could watch netflix all day. See how well efficiency works?

Man, I hope that doesn't come up on one of those Alzheimer test email 'cause "aks dem doze kiands of quetchen's" took me a LONG time to figure out.

 

[1prophet]

All these people receiving housing and food money better hope that farmers don't suddenly decide to do the same... otherwise they would once again have to worry about food.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencet...ettuce-day-increase-half-million-5-years.html

A Japanese firm plans to grow 30,000 heads of lettuce a day with an entire staff of robots in 2017.
By automating steps of the planting process, robots will 'chop personnel costs by about half and decrease energy expenses by one third'.
Spread believes this move will also allow its group of human farmers to focus on developing sustainable farming methods and learn how to produce better quality vegetables.

 

[Zaap]

Never posted in this section, but do read topics at times.

Is there no one in this thread with an intense hobby?...

Just curious. How many here see the great unwashed masses of most continents on Earth as problems and liabilities?

We just need a final solution to all those inferiors.

Was this post tongue in cheek, cause it kind of amazes me (especially in THIS ancient topic ie: "gee, what if special me were just provided with all I need cradle to grave to persue my specialness... and if only all those undesirables taking up space were simply dissappered for me!") that anyone thinks this 'self as center of all that matters' thought process is anything new.

 

[JSt0rm]

Taxi drivers, sure. I can see them losing their jobs in twenty years. No way for semi drivers, way too much liability. They might not be steering in twenty years, but they will still be sitting there waiting to take over at a second's notice. (Not sure how much good a man watching porn will be in that split second, but he'll be there.)

We are not yet anywhere near the singularity. Each such innovation invariably spawns a LOT of new jobs, and self-driving cars will not be any different.


Man, I hope that doesn't come up on one of those Alzheimer test email 'cause "aks dem doze kiands of quetchen's" took me a LONG time to figure out.

once self driving vehicles are mature enough you wont have a steering wheel to grab. The vehicle can react 1000x faster then a driver.

 

[1prophet]

http://money.cnn.com/2016/01/27/tec....html?iid=ob_homepage_tech_pool&iid=obnetwork

The Silicon Valley organization, known for its elite accelerator program, said that it's looking to fund a study on basic income.

The idea is to cover the costs of basic necessities -- like food and rent -- and then see what people do with that financial freedom.

Will people sit around all day watching Netflix and playing video games -- or will they start businesses? Will they be happy?


um.. isn't this already happening in America with freeloaders soaking in govt $?
welfare, food stamps, Section 8 housing, disability payments, etc

We see every day what people who have no worries over basic necessities do with that financial freedom and I ain't talking about the welfare crowd.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rsL6mKxtOlQ

 

[OverVolt]

Self-driving cars and trucks would require capital expenditures that no one is going to want to pay. :/

 

[JSt0rm]

Self-driving cars and trucks would require capital expenditures that no one is going to want to pay. :/

lmao. Are you kidding? 2 million x 70k is 140 billion (with a B) in payroll ONLY. Now add unemployment and health benefits? That is quite the drain on society by low skilled low iq workers. lol.