What Atheists and Agnostics Know About Religion

[Hayabusa Rider]

My sense is that there's no way to cite the facts of the origins of the fairy tales and indisputable evidence of the atrocities committed by the religions in a way that makes the believers happy. The more evidence that is presented on the atheists side the louder the wannabelievers will scream. It doesn't make us trolls and "pardon me, but I humbly submit the following list of the 10s of millions of people killed by your religion in the name of your god" will not be greeted with any more intelligent debate that "yo, your pedophile leaders are a bunch of murderers". The objections are to the message itself, not how politely it's delivered.

Child, why don't you explain how Mao and Stalin killing millions because of their religion among other things is so wonderful? They were atheists who felt just like you. The problem is not with the religious or atheist but those who cannot master themselves, and your demeanor suggests that it's beyond you. You are part of the problem.

 

[zinfamous]

To be fair, too many atheists try to blame everything on religion even when actions have nothing to do with the idea rallied behind.
Let's use the Iraq war as an example. I think Bush's official reason for going in there and starting a war was about spreading freedom. Obviously that's bullshit, but that's what he said. Does that mean we can rally against freedom and say that people trying to spread freedom of evil? Of course not. You need to look deeper at what is causing things. Lots of people hide behind religion because they don't have the balls to say what they really mean.

Witch hunting is a good example. It's stupid to say Christianity is evil because of witch hunting. Christianity is not the cause of witch hunting. Nowhere in the bible does it say anything about witches. People hunt witches because they are stupid as fuck. Forget destroying Christianity; we need to kill everyone who is stupid as fuck. That would do a lot more good, actually.

yup. No war has ever, ever, ever been started b/c of religion. Every war has been for power, influence, wealth. Religion is used by those in power to convince the ignorant masses to toss themselves into the cause.


It is never the real reason, but it is often conscripted into the cause.

 

[DrPizza]

To be fair, too many atheists try to blame everything on religion even when actions have nothing to do with the idea rallied behind.
Let's use the Iraq war as an example. I think Bush's official reason for going in there and starting a war was about spreading freedom. Obviously that's bullshit, but that's what he said. Does that mean we can rally against freedom and say that people trying to spread freedom of evil? Of course not. You need to look deeper at what is causing things. Lots of people hide behind religion because they don't have the balls to say what they really mean.

Witch hunting is a good example. It's stupid to say Christianity is evil because of witch hunting. Christianity is not the cause of witch hunting. Nowhere in the bible does it say anything about witches. People hunt witches because they are stupid as fuck. Forget destroying Christianity; we need to kill everyone who is stupid as fuck. That would do a lot more good, actually.

If you're referring to the witch hunts in Salem back in the 1600's or whenever it was that they occurred, it's not likely at all that those particular witch hunts had anything to do with religion or even witches. (Except the execution part.)

 

[chusteczka]

Religion serves more than just faith. It serves as a source of peace and happiness that people may rely upon to provide confidence and stability in their lives. It can also serve as a cornerstone of a society where everyone has a common background and understanding of each other.

Here in America, we have separated the church from society. Therefore, America relies on other aspects of life to bring people together, such as inane sports. In a sense, sports have become the religion of America because Americans have no other common denominator. Sports goes well with capitalism to define individual competitiveness that creates a strong "me first" attitude. The social aspect of society is lost.

Other societies have a moral teaching, faith, and understanding of their neighbors that binds the people into a tight union of dependability and social togetherness.

 

[Leros]

Religion serves more than just faith. It serves as a source of peace and happiness that people may rely upon to provide confidence and stability in their lives. It can also serve as a cornerstone of a society where everyone has a common background and understanding of each other.

Here in America, we have separated the church from society. Therefore, America relies on other aspects of life to bring people together, such as inane sports. In a sense, sports have become the religion of America because Americans have no other common denominator. Sports goes well with capitalism to define individual competitiveness that creates a strong "me first" attitude. The social aspect of society is lost.

Other societies have a moral teaching, faith, and understanding of their neighbors that binds the people into a tight union of dependability and social togetherness.

How about the common denominator of we're all humans? We all want to eat, be safe, be happy, etc.

There is no need for an institution like religion.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

Religion serves more than just faith. It serves as a source of peace and happiness that people may rely upon to provide confidence and stability in their lives. It can also serve as a cornerstone of a society where everyone has a common background and understanding of each other.

Here in America, we have separated the church from society. Therefore, America relies on other aspects of life to bring people together, such as inane sports. In a sense, sports have become the religion of America because Americans have no other common denominator. Sports goes well with capitalism to define individual competitiveness that creates a strong "me first" attitude. The social aspect of society is lost.

Other societies have a moral teaching, faith, and understanding of their neighbors that binds the people into a tight union of dependability and social togetherness.

Yeah, but I don't see where other large-scale societies that have a diverse mix of creeds and ethnic groups are more peaceful than in the USA.

 

[chusteczka]

How about the common denominator of we're all humans? We all want to eat, be safe, be happy, etc.

There is no need for an institution like religion.

The core of humanity does not care for itself, as shown by the variance of cultures and societies seen on this planet. People like being a part of a small but special group, separate from the rest.

There is a need for religion for some people, cultures, and societies as I described. Something to bring people together in common belief and togetherness. Religion may be outdated but something better has not yet been developed.

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

The core of humanity does not care for itself, as shown by the variance of cultures and societies seen on this planet. People like being a part of a small but special group, separate from the rest.

There is a need for religion for some people, cultures, and societies as I described. Something to bring people together in common belief and togetherness. Religion may be outdated but something better has not yet been developed.

Sounds like football! :biggrin:

 

[MJinZ]

The core of humanity does not care for itself, as shown by the variance of cultures and societies seen on this planet. People like being a part of a small but special group, separate from the rest.

There is a need for religion for some people, cultures, and societies as I described. Something to bring people together in common belief and togetherness. Religion is outdated and the internet has already been developed.

Fixed

 

[chusteczka]

The 6 Dimensions of Religion

• Doctrine
• Mythology
• Ritual
• Ethical
• Social
• Experiential - How all the dimensions cooperate for a unique experience.

America's belief in sports contains all six of these dimensions and would make an excellent research paper for someone desiring to explore this further. This shows that religion does not require a god or gods. Even though some coaches are revered as such.

If you do not like the belief in a god, then develop something that comprises the above 6 dimensions and you will be richer with more power than anyone else. The world is ready and you are all waiting for someone to do so.

 

[MJinZ]

The 6 Dimensions of Religion

• Doctrine
• Mythology
• Ritual
• Ethical
• Social
• Experiential - How all the dimensions cooperate for a unique experience.

America's belief in sports contains all six of these dimensions and would make an excellent research paper for someone desiring to explore this further. This shows that religion does not require a god or gods. Even though some coaches are revered as such.

If you do not like the belief in a god, then develop something that comprises the above 6 dimensions and you will be a richer with more power than anyone else. The world is ready and you are all waiting for someone to do so.

You forgot that people already revere Steve Jobs and Apple products.

The religion of Consumerism (and in some ways, Capitalism) has consumed modern societies.

The death of humanity is near.

 

[chusteczka]

You forgot that people already revere Steve Jobs and Apple products.

The religion of Consumerism (and in some ways, Capitalism) has consumed modern societies.

The death of humanity is near.

This is well said and you are correct. By removing religion as the common denominator of social cohesion, Americans naturally search for something to replace it. This leaves business to define what it is that binds Americans to each other. They have learned to do this well through marketing.

Hollywood sees this happening and also tries to provide direction with each studio and each director providing their own understanding.

This leaves many Americans very confused about who they are and what is important in their lives. This is far different from the security those with religion have in their life.

Sports and consumerism seem to be the main aspects of our society working in this direction. These are the same aspects of our society that other cultures with strong religious beliefs dislike about America and its people.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Fixed

Wait- Al Gore is God?!?!?!

 

[child of wonder]

That's how I grew up: indoctrinated at a young age into Protestant Christianity. Was indifferent to it as a teenager but never thought to question it until I was about 17 or 18 years old.

When I abandoned my upbringing, I began to study other religions to find what suited me. I explored Wicca, Neo-Paganism, Buddhism, Baha'i, Universalism, Deism, Taoism, The Urantia Society, and others then came back around around and looked at Christianity again with a skeptical eye.

Today I'm a strong agnostic atheist and know more about the religion of my upbringing than I ever did before leaving it. I'm more knowledgeable about it than my parents are.

 

[MJinZ]

That's how I grew up: indoctrinated at a young age into Protestant Christianity. Was indifferent to it as a teenager but never thought to question it until I was about 17 or 18 years old.

When I abandoned my upbringing, I began to study other religions to find what suited me. I explored Wicca, Neo-Paganism, Buddhism, Baha'i, Universalism, Deism, Taoism, The Urantia Society, and others then came back around around and looked at Christianity again with a skeptical eye.

Today I'm a strong agnostic atheist and know more about the religion of my upbringing than I ever did before leaving it. I'm more knowledgeable about it than my parents are.

Born and raised Atheist here and turned Agnostic as my discipline is in Science.

Basically, Science is elucidative but not enlightening. It's good at answering "how" but rarely have any answers for "why" except "just the way the Universe is".

At the same time, the idea of a single all loving God professed by any of the major Western religions is patently ridiculous. No sane God would be all loving 'cuz of all the fuckers out in the world. Also, why is there only one God? Shit, it takes two to Tango.

 

[Zorkorist]

I read the Bible, and realized what a Fucj God is.

-John

 

[Flipped Gazelle]

This is well said and you are correct. By removing religion as the common denominator of social cohesion, Americans naturally search for something to replace it. This leaves business to define what it is that binds Americans to each other. They have learned to do this well through marketing.

Hollywood sees this happening and also tries to provide direction with each studio and each director providing their own understanding.

This leaves many Americans very confused about who they are and what is important in their lives. This is far different from the security those with religion have in their life.

Sports and consumerism seem to be the main aspects of our society working in this direction. These are the same aspects of our society that other cultures with strong religious beliefs dislike about America and its people.

I'm sorry, but that is utter bullshit. I'm not anti-religion, but millions of people who had "religion in their [lives]" have, across the millennia, worked to subjugate and/or destroy societies different than their own. And they've used their religion as justification.

 

[Nik]

Good article. Describes me exactly.

Same here :thumbsup:

 

[Zorkorist]

Ya'll can read the Bible yourself, if you have questions.

-John

 

[chusteczka]

I'm sorry, but that is utter bullshit. I'm not anti-religion, but millions of people who had "religion in their [lives]" have, across the millennia, worked to subjugate and/or destroy societies different than their own. And they've used their religion as justification.

Any gathering of people has the potential for elitism with disrespect for those in outside groups. Leaders will naturally develop and these leaders will realize the power given them by their followers. Power naturally corrupts and will lead to the desire for more power. Economics and limited resources also play a role.

Your thoughts are in a different direction from what I was saying.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Child, why don't you explain how Mao and Stalin killing millions because of their religion among other things is so wonderful? They were atheists who felt just like you. The problem is not with the religious or atheist but those who cannot master themselves, and your demeanor suggests that it's beyond you. You are part of the problem.

ROFL!! Let me explain this to you in a simple way so that hopefully you can understand it. You won't, but I can dream.

The worst atheists killed for many reasons, power, fear, greed, control, deception, whatever. But they never did any of that in the name of atheism. Compare that to the atrocities committed by men of god in gods name for gods glory and the advancement of gods word. Are you really so dense that you don't see the difference or are you just trying to pick a fight on a shaky premise because, like the believers, you lack any sort of knowledge on which to base your arguments?

 

[Zorkorist]

They are simply better killers, Gag.

They have no respect for life.

Once you lose respect for life, and put your faith in an afterlife, you are no longer human. You are just another animal.

-John

 

[Perknose]

????

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eucharist#Catholic_Church


I don't remember the wine, but the crackers taste like fuck. I only went to church maybe 4 times ever and it sucked every single time.

You can quote Wikipedia all you want, but those 4 times you went to church during your 12 years of Catholic school, tell me, did YOU ever drink wine even once?

No?

Case closed.

Only the priest gets to slurp, whereas YOU said in post 4, and I quote:

The conclusion is that many catholics do not understand that its supposed to literally be the blood of jesus they are drinking.

Doesn't happen, which you should know.

 

[Zorkorist]

Communion is definately people eating the body, and drinking Jesus blood.

-John

 

[IHateMyJob2004]

I laugh at what Warren Buffett said. He is an atheist by the way. He said that he read the bible 3 times (middle school, or high school) and just could not agree with anything it has to say. how many religious people have read the entire bible once?