Well there you have it: Assault weapons ban

[FerrelGeek]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Hey if I lived in a rural area I'd love to have an assault rifle because they are cool to shoot but for home defense, a pistol would more than suffice. The problem with allowing assault rifles is that it would flood the market with them allowing criminals easier access to them than if it was cost prohibitive like having to buy imported illegal Assault Rifles from some criminal org..

scary black guns are already expensive. that's why common criminals don't use them, even though they're legal.

Not if you steal them.

I guess I'm confused here, I thought Assault rifles were the same as what is used in War Zones like the M16, the Uzi and the afore mentioned Street Sweeper not some 22 caliber dressed up to look like it's straight from a Hollywood Production of Rambo.

I don't mean to be snide here, but yes, you are confused. The average American cannot buy the type of weapon that the Mexican .gov is whining about, i.e., fully automatic weapons, such as the M16 that you mentioned. One can buy them if one has the propper permit and pays for it, but it is by no means what the average 'gun luvin' ' American would do. You can, however, by semi-automatic weapons, such as an AR-15. The difference? - one shot per trigger pull - period. You can't hold down the trigger on an AR-15 and hose down the neighbors. The advantage of a semi- auto? - you don't have to manually cycle a bolt, pump, lever, etc. to chamber your next round. A fair number of semi-auto 'assault' weapons do look very much like their military full-auto counterparts which feeds the 'oooo, evil scary weapon' perception, but that's basicaly what it is - perception.

Here's an example; take a look at this picture -
http://www.keepshooting.com/pr...ger10_22carbinebig.jpg

Now, take a look at this one -
http://gunbucket.com/gunblog/w...2007/02/main_image.jpg

They are essentially the same weapon, the Ruger 10/22, a semi-auto .22 riffle.

Perception.

These creeps from Mexico are NOT buying full-auto weapons (and grenades) from border-town gunshops in the US. Full-auto weapons are already well regulated by existing US law. Mexico needs to deal with their own problems and/or ask us to help. Restricting the rights of law-abiding US citizens is not the answer.

 

[Pliablemoose]

And FerrelGeek didn't mention, that not 1 legal, fully automatic weapon sold to a collector in the US has ever been used in a crime.

The cartel weapons claim is just to sell the ban, those guys can and do buy the best weapons in the world, all full auto and high powered stuff, they could give a shit less about a semi auto crap from the states.

 

[palehorse]

As a result of the ridiculous comments made by AG Holder, I just ordered a complete AR15 kit this morning - minus the barrel - from Essential Arms. I don't care if he was speaking out of turn, or simply testing the waters for his boss, I'm not going to take any chances. My new rifle is going to be the scariest looking gun on the block!

Fuck the gun grabbers. :|

 

[Genx87]

Dont even own a gun and getting one because of this.

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: jpeyton
Just a word of advice; don't pin your hopes on straw man issues.

You already tried that 4 months ago. Has the bitter taste of defeat been forgotten already?

We'll give you a winnar ban if we get this troll.



Takers?

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Not if you steal them.

I guess I'm confused here, I thought Assault rifles were the same as what is used in War Zones like the M16, the Uzi and the afore mentioned Street Sweeper not some 22 caliber dressed up to look like it's straight from a Hollywood Production of Rambo.

i have to wonder just how many scary black guns are stolen each year. i'll bet the number is minuscule.

i will bet dollars to donuts that the amount of crime involving use a scary black gun is a much lower portion of overall gun crime than the proportion of scary black guns to other guns in society.

 

[JD50]

Originally posted by: Ocguy31

Originally posted by: jpeyton
Just a word of advice; don't pin your hopes on straw man issues.

You already tried that 4 months ago. Has the bitter taste of defeat been forgotten already?

We'll give you a winnar ban if we get this troll.



Takers?

Heck, I'll even throw in a Butterbean permaban.

 

[Rustler]

I just bought a single action 45LC.......gonna buy another AR15 this week.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Not if you steal them.

I guess I'm confused here, I thought Assault rifles were the same as what is used in War Zones like the M16, the Uzi and the afore mentioned Street Sweeper not some 22 caliber dressed up to look like it's straight from a Hollywood Production of Rambo.

i have to wonder just how many scary black guns are stolen each year. i'll bet the number is minuscule.

i will bet dollars to donuts that the amount of crime involving use a scary black gun is a much lower portion of overall gun crime than the proportion of scary black guns to other guns in society.

Over the last 20 years? I'm sure regular guns have been used more but gang bangers seemed to use automatic weapons a lot in drive byes. I bet most of those were stolen, if not from ordinary citizens then by those who had access to them in the Services and sold them to the Gang Bangers.

I guess I'm going to retract what I've been saying in this thread , I don't see a problem with an ordinary gun (or a gun that works exactly like a regular gun) that looks like something out of a Rambo Movie

 

[Zebo]

Red -

You have to have at least $16,000 (cost of M16), pay a $200 tax stamp, and submit to a thorough FBI check like one you have to have for secret clearance, and get local police department to sign off before you can get an M16.

You really think guy above is going to go ape shit on his neighbor, never has happened in history of NFA.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
I guess I'm going to retract what I've been saying in this thread , I don't see a problem with an ordinary gun (or a gun that works exactly like a regular gun) that looks like something out of a Rambo Movie

It's always nice to see logic prevail... thank you RD, for paying attention! Too many others still can't/won't define the term "assault rifle," and they wrongfully still believe that all black scary guns are automatic machine guns.

Common sense wins the day!

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Zebo
Red -

You have to have at least $16,000 (cost of M16), pay a $200 tax stamp, and submit to a thorough FBI check like one you have to have for secret clearance, and get local police department to sign off before you can get an M16.

You really think guy above is going to go ape shit on his neighbor, never has happened in history of NFA.

So all those reports of drive byes with Uzi's was just Left Wing Propaganda?

 

[spidey07]

Red,

We've already told you what an "assault rifle" is. And you can bet your ass people that actually DO have automatic weapons (again, not what is being called an assault rifle) they are under heavy lock and key because they are worth 20-50,000 dollars. You don't keep a rifle like that laying around.

Oh - and I'll be buying another AR-15 or two and 5000 more rounds. Screw it better to have it now while I still can.

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Over the last 20 years? I'm sure regular guns have been used more but gang bangers seemed to use automatic weapons a lot in drive byes. I bet most of those were stolen, if not from ordinary citizens then by those who had access to them in the Services and sold them to the Gang Bangers.

do you have a news story or something about gang bangers using automatic weapons? i'm pretty sure something like that would make the national news and i haven't seen it.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Originally posted by: Zebo
Red -

You have to have at least $16,000 (cost of M16), pay a $200 tax stamp, and submit to a thorough FBI check like one you have to have for secret clearance, and get local police department to sign off before you can get an M16.

You really think guy above is going to go ape shit on his neighbor, never has happened in history of NFA.

You forgot to mention that the local law enforcement may or may not sign off on the stamp (usually the county sheriff, and that just depends on the sheriff, many won't sign off on one for you), and that everything, including the gun, must be paid for prior to the application.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Zebo
Red -

You have to have at least $16,000 (cost of M16), pay a $200 tax stamp, and submit to a thorough FBI check like one you have to have for secret clearance, and get local police department to sign off before you can get an M16.

You really think guy above is going to go ape shit on his neighbor, never has happened in history of NFA.

So all those reports of drive byes with Uzi's was just Left Wing Propaganda?

No; but, those guns were more than likely not being sold by, or stolen from, legitimate gun owners or retail outlets. Most automatic machine-pistols in the streets, like the Uzi's you keep referring to, are imported via standard black market smuggling channels -- like drugs and underage hookers -- or they've been extensively modified by a highly skilled machinist.

Very rarely is such a weapon traced back to a legitimate owner of any sort. The black market arms world is huge, even in the U.S...

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Over the last 20 years? I'm sure regular guns have been used more but gang bangers seemed to use automatic weapons a lot in drive byes. I bet most of those were stolen, if not from ordinary citizens then by those who had access to them in the Services and sold them to the Gang Bangers.

do you have a news story or something about gang bangers using automatic weapons? i'm pretty sure something like that would make the national news and i haven't seen it.

You didn't see the movie Colors??

I know of some OMG's that have been busted trading in fully automatic weapons, the Mongols for one. ATF Agent Billy Queen infiltrated them and was able to put some of them away for it and they weren't selling them for anywhere near 10K, more like several hundred dollars.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: palehorse

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Zebo
Red -

You have to have at least $16,000 (cost of M16), pay a $200 tax stamp, and submit to a thorough FBI check like one you have to have for secret clearance, and get local police department to sign off before you can get an M16.

You really think guy above is going to go ape shit on his neighbor, never has happened in history of NFA.

So all those reports of drive byes with Uzi's was just Left Wing Propaganda?

No; but, those guns were more than likely not being sold by, or stolen from, legitimate gun owners or retail outlets. Most automatic machine-pistols in the streets, like the Uzi's you keep referring to, are imported via standard black market smuggling channels -- like drugs and underage hookers -- or they've been extensively modified by a highly skilled machinist.

Very rarely is such a weapon traced back to a legitimate purchase of any sort.

Alright.

 

[Modelworks]

The only time I can think of criminals using assault weapons was a few years back when that group that were well armored were fighting the police in the streets.

If you think banning them will keep them out of the hands of criminals, that is just sad. You can buy an AK-47 in any state of the union and that isn't from gun dealers.

 

[nobodyknows]

Originally posted by: ayabe

Originally posted by: nobodyknows
Do you live in Mexico? What does their border issue have to with the a US citizen's right to own a semi-automatic rifle?

Grow a pair already.

Wut?
I don't know what you're talking about. Only thing I've been able to garner from your post is that you're a bed wetter.

Thanks and these appear to be your only hope.

Text

Comprehension is obviously not your string suit, is it!

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: Farang
The argument seems to be this bullet is especially tailored to pierce armor, whereas others are not, so saying all bullets kill is sort of missing the point.

Except that those bullets aren't "especially tailored to pierce armor". Any bullet that is capable of reliable use for hunting deer is also capable of penetrating armor. A blanket ban on "cop-killer" bullets would ban essentially every hunting cartridge above a .22 and would certainly eliminate all options for big game hunting (in this case, "big game" would be anything larger than a coyote).

ZV

 

[nobodyknows]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: Ocguy31

Originally posted by: jpeyton
Awesome.

Obama is hitting on all cylinders here.

Democrats elected him into office by a huge margin, and he's taking care of the Democratic agenda point-by-point.

It's going to be a great 8 years.

Yes, because guns are a true R/D issue. LOL.


All of those Southern Democrats that Obama got last year...gone.

Cling to God and guns much?

Besides, Obama is surrounded by the best political team in history. They know the public reaction before we do.

He'll only lose the few NRA members who didn't vote McCain last November.

Are you talking ab out his teram that helped pick all the tax cheaters for cabinet level positions?

:laugh:

Some geniuses they are!!!!!!!! Birds of a feather, I guess.

 

[BrunoPuntzJones]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Over the last 20 years? I'm sure regular guns have been used more but gang bangers seemed to use automatic weapons a lot in drive byes. I bet most of those were stolen, if not from ordinary citizens then by those who had access to them in the Services and sold them to the Gang Bangers.

do you have a news story or something about gang bangers using automatic weapons? i'm pretty sure something like that would make the national news and i haven't seen it.

You didn't see the movie Colors??

I know of some OMG's that have been busted trading in fully automatic weapons, the Mongols for one. ATF Agent Billy Queen infiltrated them and was able to put some of them away for it and they weren't selling them for anywhere near 10K, more like several hundred dollars.

Civilian machineguns haven't been made in almost 25 years. As stated before, there haven't been any incidents occur with those. Prices from from $5k to several hundred thousand.

What you're referring to are illegally manufactured or imported. They aren't based off any available off the shelf firearm.

 

[FerrelGeek]

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
And FerrelGeek didn't mention, that not 1 legal, fully automatic weapon sold to a collector in the US has ever been used in a crime.

The cartel weapons claim is just to sell the ban, those guys can and do buy the best weapons in the world, all full auto and high powered stuff, they could give a shit less about a semi auto crap from the states.

Didn't think I had to, but thanks for the backup.

 

[FerrelGeek]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
I guess I'm going to retract what I've been saying in this thread , I don't see a problem with an ordinary gun (or a gun that works exactly like a regular gun) that looks like something out of a Rambo Movie

Sincere appreciation for having an open mind on this subject. My opinion of you just went up considerably.