Weight lifters who also run...

[purbeast0]

I've recently started running again, trying to lean up a bit and just for general cardio reasons so when I go on vacation I won't get too tired swimming all day

But what I'm wondering is, how do those of you who lift AND run, run on the days after you lift?

Typically I lift Monday - Thursday, and do my legs on Tuesday. I do a body building routine right now where I do each muscle group once a week.

I try to run Monday, Tuesday, and Thursday. And then on the weekend if I'm up to it I will run once maybe too.

Monday I have no problems running at all and usually have a great run.

Last Tuesday I ran after lifting with my legs, and holy crap I could barely last 10 minutes because of the jello leg feeling.

Then Thursday, my legs were sore as hell. They typically get sorest 2 days after I lift legs, and last for like another day or two. But Thursday it's really tough to run because of the soreness, but I just plowed through it.

So my question is, those of you who lift AND run, is there some trick or secret to making your legs not feel as sore when it comes to running? I feel that my legs get tired way earlier than my actual cardio does. And yesterday when I ran, I had no problems with either my legs or cardio wise.

 

[RagingBITCH]

More from a runner POV - I do a full body weights workout once a week to maintain size, rather than trying to build size. Bottom line - if you hit your legs hard with weights, it's going to have a negative impact on running.

I've had to abandon the heavy squats/deadlifts for that reason - in full marathon training mode, I don't need my legs to crap out halfway through a 20 mile long run. (Which, I had that happen this past year...it made for a dreadful 10 mile finish in the TX heat when the low was 83 that morning)

My recommendation - you might aim to do your legs more towards the end of the week, say on Thursday. Get your Monday/Tuesday runs in as normal. Your Thursday or weekend runs can be a recovery/easy paced run - slow enough where you can have a full conversation with someone.

My assumption is most of your runs are more of an interval/sprint type workout during the week?

 

[Pantlegz]

I don't run but BJJ is pretty taxing on my legs at times. Really with 5x5 I didn't have any issues, doing 5x10 this week my hamstrings were killing me. So I guess the question would be what sort of routine are you doing? And what lifts are you doing with your legs?

 

[blinky8225]

If you're serious about weight lifting, too much running is detrimental and will impede recovery and possibly burn muscle unless you're eating a ton. I keep running to only twice a week. One day of sprints (Tabata style) and a nice jog at about 8-9 min/mile. On days I run, I never do any strength training. Occasionally, I'll do very low-level cardio such as walking on a treadmill while watching a movie on an iPad, which actually helps more than you would think.

It's enough running that I see progress and can feel myself getting better at it from month to month (I can run at least 5 miles at an 8-9 min pace), but you probably won't see me in a marathon anytime soon.

 

[Miramonti]

Back in the day I had a tough time mixing the two, usually at the expense of one or the other, and mostly at the expense of gains while lifting.

If you're legs are sore after working out, maybe you are working them too hard to be able to run on soon after or not working them frequently enough for that type of workout, (and/or you're not getting enough protein.) They are getting torn down and that's not going to bode well for ensuing endurance efforts. I would recommend working them 2x a week instead of one, and not tear them up as much each time, perhaps do more reps w/less weight, but imo you shouldn't be so sore a few days later (atleast not if you've been doing this a while). Because the objective of lifting for strength/size (if I'm not mistaken) is to tear muscles down each time, you're not going to get the best of both worlds tearing them down to the point you're sore, while still trying to run on them afterwards.

 

[darkxshade]

This is somewhat of an issue for me as well. I love to lift and I love to run. Since it's winter now, it's less of an issue since I run less so I'm spending a lot more time lifting. But once it gets warm, I like to run like I'm training for a marathon which makes it hard on lifts. And I wanna do both, not sure how to split them up.

 

[marmasatt]

Hmmm. Am I the only one who uses running as a warm up? Like go do your mileage, recover for 10/15 minutes and then hit the weights?

 

[Vic Vega]

Hmmm. Am I the only one who uses running as a warm up? Like go do your mileage, recover for 10/15 minutes and then hit the weights?

This is what I do... works well for me.

 

[Pantlegz]

Running before lifting depletes your glycogen stores and will lower your lifts

 

[marmasatt]

Running before lifting depletes your glycogen stores and will lower your lifts

Oh, so that's why I can't build any muscle. I've been doing this for 20 years...

 

[Pantlegz]

Oh, so that's why I can't build any muscle. I've been doing this for 20 years...

Where did I say that? I didn't even suggest not to, simply providing information. But you would be lifting more now if you hadn't been running before lifting for 20 years.

 

[purbeast0]

well right now i'm around 210lbs down from like 213-215 a few weeks ago. i'm trying to go at the 1lb/week of weight loss, and get to 205 and see how i feel and look, and maybe try to get to 200lbs. depends how much strength i lose while losing weight, because i hate doing that. so far i haven't really lost much at all which is good.

as far as my actual running, right now i'm just going for like 10-15 minutes on the treadmill between 6-7mph. once it gets nicer outside i'm going to be doing interval training at the local track after i lift, where i will walk around the curve of the track, and spring the straight part, and just do that until i can't do it anymore.

i also play football in the spring/fall so i like to have some wind at those times, and the interval training helps a lot for the speed of a football game. but i also want to just continue to have good cardio since i have asthma and it's just good overall for me.

today i did a little bit of interval training after i did my abs/leg routine, and holy shit it was hard lol. i couldn't really sprint because my legs were so jello'y, but i was running at a pretty fast pace. there is this weak ass 11-lap-per-mile track at my gym and i just jogged 2 laps, ran 1, walked one, then did it again. i was going to try and do it a 3rd time but i nearly fell over on my last sprint lol.

i don't want to do any distance running nor run longer than 15 minutes because i really don't want to lose too much size. im just trying to cut up a bit through 3 days of moderate cardio and my diet.

 

[purbeast0]

oh and RagingBitch, i have thought about doing that as far as legs towards the end of the week.

the only problem is i try to spread chest/tri and shoulder days as far apart as i can because my chest/triceps need a good 3 days to recover. so chances are i would probably not do legs on thursday because that would mean only 2 days between shoulders and chest.

and i just have issues going to the gym on the weekend lol. i work hard and workout hard all week, and i just like to relax on my weekends. especially when it starts to get nice out i will be playing football out or fishing.

i just didn't know if others also have this issue, or if there is some trick to not be as sore or make it hurt as much lol.

 

[marmasatt]

Where did I say that? I didn't even suggest not to, simply providing information. But you would be lifting more now if you hadn't been running before lifting for 20 years.

I didn't mean it like that. Perhaps I should have chosen this

I was insinuating that I *was* doing it wrong for 20 years..and so that's why I can't put on any muscle...But I can see how you think I took umbrage now that I read it again....

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Running before lifting depletes your glycogen stores and will lower your lifts

What? That is completely untrue. You'd have to burn over 1000cal before you burned all your muscle glycogen (because you don't just burn carbs during cardio). In addition to that, I don't know what kind of lifts you do, but I don't get very glycolytic while I lift. Most lifts utilize the phosphagen pathway almost exclusively (unless you're on a 20 rep squat program). It can lower your lifts due to excess blood flow and slackening of the connective tissue, but that's only if you're going for quite a while. Running before lifting also ramps up your AMPK pathways and may hinder mTOR expression, but that hasn't really been studied yet. Overall, running to warm up is a great idea.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

I didn't mean it like that. Perhaps I should have chosen this

I was insinuating that I *was* doing it wrong for 20 years..and so that's why I can't put on any muscle...But I can see how you think I took umbrage now that I read it again....

You're not gaining muscle because you're not eating enough Eat more, eat hardy, eat healthy... eat everything. That's pretty much what's required.

 

[Pantlegz]

What? That is completely untrue. You'd have to burn over 1000cal before you burned all your muscle glycogen (because you don't just burn carbs during cardio).

I didn't say it would burn it all but your glycogen stores are lowered by running, right?

In addition to that, I don't know what kind of lifts you do, but I don't get very glycolytic while I lift. Most lifts utilize the phosphagen pathway almost exclusively (unless you're on a 20 rep squat program).

I guess I don't know what getting glycolytic feels like. But I know that, for me at least, lifting after longer cardio(I don't do it any more really) that my lifts all went to shit. I did some reading and found that most people agreed that the lower glycogen levels were most likely the cause.

Overall, running to warm up is a great idea.

I agree, as a warm up. 5-10 min slow paced jog to get the blood flowing is great. Running 2-3 miles before lifting, not so much imo.

Again I'm not trying to be argumentative just want to verify what I've understood from what I've read.

 

[Sixguns]

I used to run before I would lift and it seemed like my lifts would suffer. Now I am running after it seems like I have more energy for my runs. I am only running 1.5 milesa day. I am not looking to run a 5k or anything just a little something to keep my heart strong. I have noticed that since I switched to running after that I am not as sore as I used to be.

 

[Sid59]

I miss running since starting my weight lifting. Used to run 30-50 miles a month, not a large amount but the open road, clearing my mind, and zoning out was great.

Last month, I did set squats, Overhead press, deadlifts, and decided to run 3 miles. Nothing scorching, 3 miles in 28 minutes but my legs went to jello and the next two days weren't fun.

I lift MWF and thought about running Tues/Thurs but i definately need those days off because I'm doing squats MWF. It seems Sunday would be an ideal day to run.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

Were you the guy that didn't believe in cardio?

Anyways I think you should squat more. Maybe once every 4-5 days. I don't think you should be that sore at your advanced lifting stage (if you're the guy I'm thinking of.) You'd be less sore with a more consistent leg workout.

I run before, after, on off days. No rhyme or reason.
If my legs are jello I don't run (As in where my legs want to collapse.)
If they hurt but I can still keep a halfway decent pace I'll run. Especially if I've eaten too much.

 

[Sid59]

Were you the guy that didn't believe in cardio?

Nope, that's not me.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

Nope, that's not me.

I was talking about OP. I know there are a few here that believe lifting is sufficient cardio work.

I believe both are equally important. I workout to achieve a good balance that translates to real world usefulness.

 

[Pantlegz]

I don't think that lifting is sufficient cardio work, but I don't do any real cardio work because I don't want to. And I would argue that all my lifting translates to the real world very well, I have yet to run in to a situation that I'm like damn I should have done more cardio this last year, in the real world. When I have a belt test, like the one coming up, or I'm sparring with someone I'll normally think at some point that it would be easier if I had done some more cardio. And if it was me you were thinking of in the post above(it probably is I'm vocal about my dislike of cardio in general), I'm down to back squats once a week and light front squats once a week for the next ~3 months.

 

[purbeast0]

I was talking about OP. I know there are a few here that believe lifting is sufficient cardio work.

I believe both are equally important. I workout to achieve a good balance that translates to real world usefulness.

um no, definitely not me. cardio and lifting are for 2 totally different goals.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

I didn't say it would burn it all but your glycogen stores are lowered by running, right?

I guess I don't know what getting glycolytic feels like. But I know that, for me at least, lifting after longer cardio(I don't do it any more really) that my lifts all went to shit. I did some reading and found that most people agreed that the lower glycogen levels were most likely the cause.

I agree, as a warm up. 5-10 min slow paced jog to get the blood flowing is great. Running 2-3 miles before lifting, not so much imo.

Again I'm not trying to be argumentative just want to verify what I've understood from what I've read.

I imagine it does lower your glycogen, but that has nothing to do with lifts. It doesn't DEPLETE glycogen. Even if it did, serious lifting dominantly uses the phosphagen pathway, which doesn't require glycogen or glucose metabolism during the movement.

It shouldn't feel all that different, but the timing and intensity kind of dictate which pathways you utilize. Lifting tends to be short bouts.

The actual reason is likely from connective tissue laxity, swell of fluid into the interstitium, neural fatigue, central nervous system contributions, etc. It doesn't have all that much to do with metabolism. Running 2-3 miles can be fine. If you're lifting to be huge and get as strong as possible, it's not ideal. If not and that's the only time you can do both, it's fine.