We all know Newt is unelectable...

[SilthDraeth]

Also, I just do not get why people get so mad and think that the USA staying out of other countries business is a good thing. We are allies with Israel, yet Israel wants us out of their business. But the USA is like the mob, collecting protection money from Israel, ie, tell us what you are going to do, run your plans by us, and if we approve, you can do it. Otherwise we may sanction you, blah blah blah...

But somehow Ron Paul's views of letting other countries take care of themselves, etc, is a bad thing? Have you ever thought that, lets say at a local level, you put a policeman in every persons house... eventually some people would get pissed off enough and go attack the police head quarters, and become terrorists?

Well that is essentially what the USA is doing to the world.

 

[SilthDraeth]

LOL online polls. You do understand why they are completely and totally worthless, right? The fact that one was 'secure' makes it only modestly less worthless. (but still undeniably worthless)

I asked the question before, and it was presented that, due to fraud, and potential for people outside of the country to vote, and people who can't vote to vote in the poll, aren't even registered to vote, etc etc.

Also, the University poll may have been open to all students, and not just independents/republican, so democrats may have voted for Paul in the poll, there by exaggerating his numbers.

But, all that is conjecture just meant to discredit it, fact is, at Duke at least, the student body that voted believes he won the debate. And it makes that poll a lot more substantial than the other poll based on the August 13 debate.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

http://www.thestatecolumn.com/iowa/ron-paul-wins-drake-university-straw-poll/
Secure online poll just for the university students. Ron Paul wins...
http://www.examiner.com/libertarian...wins-iowa-debate-only-consistent-conservative
"...As of this morning 72.5% of those polled after last night's debate said they wanted to hear more from Ron Paul, 74% feel Ron Paul came out on top during the debate."

http://www.topix.com/issue/fox/gop-debate-aug11

Ron Paul with almost 90%, of course, it is the largest online GOP gallup poll... So I know everyone will jump in and say it doesn't matter at all. They will claim that some Ron Paul supporters voted 30 thousand times out of the 47 thousand votes.

Ron Paul wins Iowa debate, only consistent conservative

Karl Dickey, West Palm Beach Libertarian Examiner

Karl Dickey has been a resident of Boca Raton since 1979. During his early years and throughout his life he always had an entrepreneurial spirit and a strong commitment to the environment. Karl has worked on various libertarian committees.

Imagine that, Ron Paul is seen as the only consistent conservative by a Libertarian. As I said before Ron Paul is viewed by most GOP supporters as being a Libertarian, this is why he lags behind in all GOP polling and will not be the GOP nominee.

 

[werepossum]

Also, I just do not get why people get so mad and think that the USA staying out of other countries business is a good thing. We are allies with Israel, yet Israel wants us out of their business. But the USA is like the mob, collecting protection money from Israel, ie, tell us what you are going to do, run your plans by us, and if we approve, you can do it. Otherwise we may sanction you, blah blah blah...

But somehow Ron Paul's views of letting other countries take care of themselves, etc, is a bad thing? Have you ever thought that, lets say at a local level, you put a policeman in every persons house... eventually some people would get pissed off enough and go attack the police head quarters, and become terrorists?

Well that is essentially what the USA is doing to the world.

The converse of that is the aftermath of the Great War. Few if any of the nations to whom America made loans paid them back, and Europe rejected Wilson's vision for a strong and free Germany, so we took our ball and went home, retreating back into our treasured isolation. Consequently when we did take on Germany and Japan in World War 2, we did so after each had secured the resources of many nations for use in their own war machines, while we began the war relatively weak.

I find Paul's isolationism to be very appealing, which means I have to take great care to remember the down side as well. Very few things are all good or all bad, and while I like the idea of pulling back, I also acknowledge the great risk isolationism poses.

 

[Thump553]

Also, I just do not get why people get so mad and think that the USA staying out of other countries business is a good thing. We are allies with Israel, yet Israel wants us out of their business. But the USA is like the mob, collecting protection money from Israel, ie, tell us what you are going to do, run your plans by us, and if we approve, you can do it. Otherwise we may sanction you, blah blah blah...

But somehow Ron Paul's views of letting other countries take care of themselves, etc, is a bad thing? Have you ever thought that, lets say at a local level, you put a policeman in every persons house... eventually some people would get pissed off enough and go attack the police head quarters, and become terrorists?

Well that is essentially what the USA is doing to the world.

Gross factual misstatement. We have financially supported Israel to the tune of trillions of dollars for decades now-the fact you claim we extract "protection money" from them is simply ridiculous. Simple common sense suggests that we have some say into Israel's affiars as the country would not exist without USA's arms and money.

 

[airdata]

Imagine that, Ron Paul is seen as the only consistent conservative by a Libertarian. As I said before Ron Paul is viewed by most GOP supporters as being a Libertarian, this is why he lags behind in all GOP polling and will not be the GOP nominee.

And yet he wins the republican debate... Good luck w\ that GOP field you've got there, fella.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

And yet he wins the republican debate... Good luck w\ that GOP field you've got there, fella.

Those sour grapes must taste really bad.

 

[airdata]

Those sour grapes must taste really bad.

Not sure what that's supposed to mean. In no way does that apply to my post. I'm just pointing out how you admit Ron Paul is better than the GOP candidates without just saying it.

You say he's libertarian, etc... and have no legitimate comment about him winning a debate w\ the pathetic 2012 GOP field.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Not sure what that's supposed to mean. In no way does that apply to my post. I'm just pointing out how you admit Ron Paul is better than the GOP candidates without just saying it.

You say he's libertarian, etc... and have no legitimate comment about him winning a debate w\ the pathetic 2012 GOP field.

The only ones claiming he's won any debates are either supporters or libertarians. One would think if he was winning the debates he would be the front runner in the national polls, not 3rd or 4th.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

There is an intrinsic difficulty in saying who "won" a multi-party debate - it's all in the eye of the beholder, and what tends to stand out are the really bad moments (e.g., Perry's locking up when naming the 3 agencies he wanted to eliminate) rather than the really good ones. Paul has certainly not made major gaffes, but obviously he is under less scrutiny and has had less face time to either excel or sink. I think he's done fine, but I don't know that it's fair to say he has "won" any of them.

 

[Ausm]

False. See also: Reagan

Fixed.

 

[fskimospy]

I asked the question before, and it was presented that, due to fraud, and potential for people outside of the country to vote, and people who can't vote to vote in the poll, aren't even registered to vote, etc etc.

Also, the University poll may have been open to all students, and not just independents/republican, so democrats may have voted for Paul in the poll, there by exaggerating his numbers.

But, all that is conjecture just meant to discredit it, fact is, at Duke at least, the student body that voted believes he won the debate. And it makes that poll a lot more substantial than the other poll based on the August 13 debate.

Those are only a few of the problems and they are by no means the largest one. The largest problem with an online poll is selection bias, ie: people with strong feelings are vastly more likely to participate than those with more modest ones, leading to a hugely biased and unrepresentative sample. This is particularly important when it comes to people like Ron Paul as he does not have large numbers of followers, but those who do like him like him very much.

This is why Ron Paul wins basically every internet poll and loses basically every real one.

 

[Ausm]

This thought just occurred to me...

How come when a woman cheats on her husband several times, they call her a "whore"? But when a man does it the GOP calls him "frontrunner".

 

[Londo_Jowo]

This thought just occurred to me...

How come when a woman cheats on her husband several times, they call her a "whore"? But when a man does it the GOP calls him "frontrunner".

I don't know, why don't you ask Slick Willy how he pulled this off as a Democrat?

 

[werepossum]

Gross factual misstatement. We have financially supported Israel to the tune of trillions of dollars for decades now-the fact you claim we extract "protection money" from them is simply ridiculous. Simple common sense suggests that we have some say into Israel's affiars as the country would not exist without USA's arms and money.

To be fair, we've also supported the Islamic nations around Israel to a higher total. Egypt especially has been a huge benefactor of American largesse. And we've gotten a huge amount back from Israel - including the Pentium Pro and the Core 2 series of Intel chips.

 

[Spikesoldier]

Those are only a few of the problems and they are by no means the largest one. The largest problem with an online poll is selection bias, ie: people with strong feelings are vastly more likely to participate than those with more modest ones, leading to a hugely biased and unrepresentative sample. This is particularly important when it comes to people like Ron Paul as he does not have large numbers of followers, but those who do like him like him very much.

This is why Ron Paul wins basically every internet poll and loses basically every real one.

Or the blackout and convenient takedown of polls he does win. Goes back to the MSM blackout and censorship revolving around his campaign.

 

[Ausm]

I don't know, why don't you ask Slick Willy how he pulled this off as a Democrat?

But he was already President when he was playing with his cigars.....

 

[Londo_Jowo]

But he was already President when he was playing with his cigars.....

You actually think it started then? Most believe it started when he was the Governor of Arkansas and continued into his Whitehouse years.

 

[fskimospy]

Or the blackout and convenient takedown of polls he does win. Goes back to the MSM blackout and censorship revolving around his campaign.

Can you point me to a national level scientific poll where Ron Paul is winning? There might be one somewhere at some point in time, I genuinely don't know. What I do know is that he generally polls in the single digits, which is why he is ignored.

 

[woolfe9999]

Gross factual misstatement. We have financially supported Israel to the tune of trillions of dollars for decades now-the fact you claim we extract "protection money" from them is simply ridiculous. Simple common sense suggests that we have some say into Israel's affiars as the country would not exist without USA's arms and money.

I don't disagree with anything else you've written here, but can you please source the "trillions of dollars" claim?

 

[freegeeks]

as an outsider, US politics come close to Italian politics
what is scary is that the GOP can not come up with a better lineup then the morons that are running now

why anyone would ever vote for someone like Perry or Bachman is something that I can not understand. This is not about left or right or liberal or conservative. The current GOP lineup is 95% morons

 

[Ausm]

You actually think it started then? Most believe it started when he was the Governor of Arkansas and continued into his Whitehouse years.

Do you think Newt has only fucked around with 3 women?

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Do you think Newt has only fucked around with 3 women?

I thought we're not supposed to worry about their private lives, that what I heard all the time when it came to Slick Willy.

 

[werepossum]

I don't disagree with anything else you've written here, but can you please source the "trillions of dollars" claim?

I took that to be intentional hyperbole. I believe our aid to Israel is roughly $3 to $4 billion, our aid to Egypt about the same.

 

[airdata]

The only ones claiming he's won any debates are either supporters or libertarians. One would think if he was winning the debates he would be the front runner in the national polls, not 3rd or 4th.

It was unanimously decided he won this recent debate. They even did a segment at the end asking candidates what they learned from others and they had to give him props.. I don't see why this is so hard to understand.

All of the other candidates are pretty much on the defensive for their horrible life decisions or just ignorance of things they should know.