UPDATED: Splitting off YACTs -- 2 Month Test Forum Coming

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dullard

Elite Member
May 21, 2001
25,476
3,976
126
Originally posted by: RapidSnail
You're essentially suggesting that all forums in a specific category be grouped together but with the exception that an individual can choose to view a specific sub-forum in that category by selecting a tag filter, correct? I was going to say exactly that until I read your post. In my opinion, that's the best option.
Basically. Put a little tag on the threads for each post. If you only want to see the YACT threads, you'll only see the ones with that tag. If you are like me and you want to see all social threads, it'll show all of them.

 

dullard

Elite Member
May 21, 2001
25,476
3,976
126
Originally posted by: BD2003
Autos are *NOT* a social topic...at least no more than home theater is. Anandtech doesnt cover HT, yet it has its own forum, and if you go in there, people actually know what theyre talking about. Do the same with autos. Please. Mature discussion is a lost art around here.
Autos can very well be a social topic. When I post that someone did a hit and run on my rear bumper while it was parked, I want to moan about it with other people. I don't want dyno graphs of my civic engine in that case. I want to rant.

If you want to keep car threads to be serious, there is no place for my rant thread. If you could have a serious only sub-forum AND allow YACTs in the regular off topic without the "wrong forum" police all over you, then we can both have a place for our threads. But, I'd still like to have the ability to see multiple sub-forums at once.
 

BD2003

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
16,815
1
81
Originally posted by: dullard
Originally posted by: BD2003
Autos are *NOT* a social topic...at least no more than home theater is. Anandtech doesnt cover HT, yet it has its own forum, and if you go in there, people actually know what theyre talking about. Do the same with autos. Please. Mature discussion is a lost art around here.

Autos can very well be a social topic. When I post that someone did a hit and run on my rear bumper while it was parked, I want to moan about it with other people. I don't want dyno graphs of my civic engine in that case. I want to rant.

If you want to keep car threads to be serious, there is no place for my rant thread. If you could have a serious only sub-forum AND allow YACTs in the regular off topic without the "wrong forum" police all over you, then we can both have a place for our threads.

Well, thats exactly what I'm saying. Theres only going to be problems if they start forcing topics around. The auto forum shouldnt be for all auto *posts*, it should be for auto *people*. It shouldnt be about the topic per se, but the audience.

But, I'd still like to have the ability to see multiple sub-forums at once.

Its an interesting idea, but I think technically unfeasible for at least a while.
 

Raduque

Lifer
Aug 22, 2004
13,140
138
106
I say general YACTs stay in OT, and a "Highly Technical Automotive" section be spun off.


Edit: Hate to be off topic here, but since there doesn't seem to be a vote-for-it thread in software/apps/games I take it that the separate console/pc forums are non-negotiable? Because IMO, you should do the split "Applications" and "Gaming".
 

BD2003

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
16,815
1
81
Originally posted by: Raduque
I say general YACTs stay in OT, and a "Highly Technical Automotive" section be spun off.


Edit: Hate to be off topic here, but since there doesn't seem to be a vote-for-it thread in software/apps/games I take it that the separate console/pc forums are non-negotiable? Because IMO, you should do the split "Applications" and "Gaming".

I would think it'd be immensely easier for them if they were to poll BEFORE creating the new forums.
 

DerekWilson

Platinum Member
Feb 10, 2003
2,920
32
81
Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Originally posted by: Eli
Originally posted by: BoomerD
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Perhaps a specific forum for highly technical automotive repair questions and leave the "what car should I buy" and "New Camaro unveiled" type of threads in ATOT?

It would be nice to have a technical forum for the more specific questions, but the others definitely belong in OT I think.

ZV

:thumbsup:
I agree.

BTW, leave the YAGT crap in its own forum...let the 15 year old kids answer themselves, or go to MySpace where they belong.

I also agree with this.

I am not opposed to having a dedicated automotive forum, but do not force us to post all car related topics there.

I should have been more specific in my stance, this is what I think should occur as well.

EDIT: I realize that I never even considered those other car threads because I only went to the Automotive - Mechanical subforum.
I certainly see where you guys are coming from. If it was possible to effectively do something like this, we might consider it.

But there'd be a lot of difficulty in making this work right.

As is readily apparent, people don't always post in the right forum now. This is despite fairly clearly delineated categories. Having a forum for some car threads and allowing others in OT would also lead to member confusion.

You'd have people deliberately posting threads that should be in the car threads in OT when they know they should be in the car forum, and you'd have people who didn't understand where the line is drawn (or that there even is another forum outside OT) posting threads in OT.

I really like the idea of this, but I just don't think it would work out right.

 

olds

Elite Member
Mar 3, 2000
50,071
744
126
Originally posted by: mobobuff
As you take topics out of Off-Topic, those topics will see less readers and, correspondingly, less posters. This can be good or bad. The replies may be in less numbers but at the same time they could be more informative. Though I think most of us are quite capable of ignoring the useless replies and focusing on the good ones.

It would also mean more work on the part of the moderators. They'll have to be on a constant look-out for topics that should be moved to where they belong, or will be confused on whether or not to move them at all.

If you segregate topic subjects, there will be less readers and less posters, and moderators will have to work harder.

Or, new people will join the forums because they see specific topics that they are interested in.
 

BD2003

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
16,815
1
81
I certainly see where you guys are coming from. If it was possible to effectively do something like this, we might consider it.

But there'd be a lot of difficulty in making this work right.

As is readily apparent, people don't always post in the right forum now. This is despite fairly clearly delineated categories. Having a forum for some car threads and allowing others in OT would also lead to member confusion.

You'd have people deliberately posting threads that should be in the car threads in OT when they know they should be in the car forum, and you'd have people who didn't understand where the line is drawn (or that there even is another forum outside OT) posting threads in OT.

I really like the idea of this, but I just don't think it would work out right.

Well, what is the rationale behind *forcing* topics into forums? Why the insistence behind such hard and fast lines? I dont think it bothers people too much in the OS or Gen hardware forums when people ask questions that technically belong in tech support (we answer them anyway).

IMO, don't think of the forums as a filing cabinet in which posts much be filed under their correct category. Think of the forums as a set of rooms, populated by many different types people.

OT is a general hang out where everyone screws around, and thats why we like it.

P&N is like walking into a room full of know it all pundit maniacs, and they have their fun. Plenty of P&N gets posted in OT, and it has a much lighter tone, and thats how it should be. You only hear "WRONG FORUM" get yelled when the P&N crowd spills out to OT and it gets venomous like it typically does in P&N.

The YAGT forums are quickly becoming the Dr. Phil and Dear Abby therapy rooms, but theres a lot less "Pics!" and "I'd hit it", and I think the users there are digging that.

The hardware/software forums are pretty technical, and people generally know what theyre talking about, and thats why they work well.

Even just looking at the new CE forums you can see it's a lot more informative and less immature than posting a topic in OT used to get you.

And likewise, the auto forum would be populated by people who actually know and care about cars. I doubt the general non-auto nerd OT population will really care for the kind of threads I'd expect to see in there.

If you don't force topics into it, it'll police itself. If people come in with stupid rants, theyll get ushered out by the members responses like they do in other forums. Just let it grow its own personality like many of the other forums...I really just dont understand the insistence about *forcing* topics into a specific category...who is it hurting?
 

olds

Elite Member
Mar 3, 2000
50,071
744
126
Originally posted by: BD2003
I certainly see where you guys are coming from. If it was possible to effectively do something like this, we might consider it.

But there'd be a lot of difficulty in making this work right.

As is readily apparent, people don't always post in the right forum now. This is despite fairly clearly delineated categories. Having a forum for some car threads and allowing others in OT would also lead to member confusion.

You'd have people deliberately posting threads that should be in the car threads in OT when they know they should be in the car forum, and you'd have people who didn't understand where the line is drawn (or that there even is another forum outside OT) posting threads in OT.

I really like the idea of this, but I just don't think it would work out right.

Well, what is the rationale behind *forcing* topics into forums? Why the insistence behind such hard and fast lines? I dont think it bothers people too much in the OS or Gen hardware forums when people ask questions that technically belong in tech support (we answer them anyway).

IMO, don't think of the forums as a filing cabinet in which posts much be filed under their correct category. Think of the forums as a set of rooms, populated by many different types people.

OT is a general hang out where everyone screws around, and thats why we like it.

P&N is like walking into a room full of know it all pundit maniacs, and they have their fun. Plenty of P&N gets posted in OT, and it has a much lighter tone, and thats how it should be. You only hear "WRONG FORUM" get yelled when the P&N crowd spills out to OT and it gets venomous like it typically does in P&N.

The YAGT forums are quickly becoming the Dr. Phil and Dear Abby therapy rooms, but theres a lot less "Pics!" and "I'd hit it", and I think the users there are digging that.

The hardware/software forums are pretty technical, and people generally know what theyre talking about, and thats why they work well.

Even just looking at the new CE forums you can see it's a lot more informative and less immature than posting a topic in OT used to get you.

And likewise, the auto forum would be populated by people who actually know and care about cars. I doubt the general non-auto nerd OT population will really care for the kind of threads I'd expect to see in there.

If you don't force topics into it, it'll police itself. If people come in with stupid rants, theyll get ushered out by the members responses like they do in other forums. Just let it grow its own personality like many of the other forums...I really just dont understand the insistence about *forcing* topics into a specific category...who is it hurting?

So, basically you are saying that splitting off the forums increases the maturity level of the posts?
 

BD2003

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
16,815
1
81
Originally posted by: oldsmoboat
Originally posted by: BD2003
I certainly see where you guys are coming from. If it was possible to effectively do something like this, we might consider it.

But there'd be a lot of difficulty in making this work right.

As is readily apparent, people don't always post in the right forum now. This is despite fairly clearly delineated categories. Having a forum for some car threads and allowing others in OT would also lead to member confusion.

You'd have people deliberately posting threads that should be in the car threads in OT when they know they should be in the car forum, and you'd have people who didn't understand where the line is drawn (or that there even is another forum outside OT) posting threads in OT.

I really like the idea of this, but I just don't think it would work out right.

Well, what is the rationale behind *forcing* topics into forums? Why the insistence behind such hard and fast lines? I dont think it bothers people too much in the OS or Gen hardware forums when people ask questions that technically belong in tech support (we answer them anyway).

IMO, don't think of the forums as a filing cabinet in which posts much be filed under their correct category. Think of the forums as a set of rooms, populated by many different types people.

OT is a general hang out where everyone screws around, and thats why we like it.

P&N is like walking into a room full of know it all pundit maniacs, and they have their fun. Plenty of P&N gets posted in OT, and it has a much lighter tone, and thats how it should be. You only hear "WRONG FORUM" get yelled when the P&N crowd spills out to OT and it gets venomous like it typically does in P&N.

The YAGT forums are quickly becoming the Dr. Phil and Dear Abby therapy rooms, but theres a lot less "Pics!" and "I'd hit it", and I think the users there are digging that.

The hardware/software forums are pretty technical, and people generally know what theyre talking about, and thats why they work well.

Even just looking at the new CE forums you can see it's a lot more informative and less immature than posting a topic in OT used to get you.

And likewise, the auto forum would be populated by people who actually know and care about cars. I doubt the general non-auto nerd OT population will really care for the kind of threads I'd expect to see in there.

If you don't force topics into it, it'll police itself. If people come in with stupid rants, theyll get ushered out by the members responses like they do in other forums. Just let it grow its own personality like many of the other forums...I really just dont understand the insistence about *forcing* topics into a specific category...who is it hurting?

So, basically you are saying that splitting off the forums increases the maturity level of the posts?

For the most part, yeah. Compared to OT, at least. Try it yourself. Cross post a Vista question in OT and in OS. If the mods don't lock it, I bet youd see a vast difference in maturity and actual usefulness between responses.

Check out iamwiz's linked post further up...the difference between quality and relevance of posts before and after the auto forums is night and day.
 

duragezic

Lifer
Oct 11, 1999
11,234
4
81
Originally posted by: BD2003
I think its perfectly fine if "YAGT: 2007 Camry or Altima?", or "OMG I almost got killed on I95" stay in OT. But you just can't ask a serious car question here without having total morons pollute the topic.

Iamwiz's linked post demostrates it perfectly. I really could do without responses like "It's the vapor in the blinker manifold." (coming from an elite, no less) or "I would check your Flux Capacitor."
Exactly. I completely agree with this (edit: and the few posts above from BD2003, as well as Zenmervolt and others).

In spite of the current vote, please split auto off into a single forum due to precisely this reason.

It is annoying to have the same old people pop into every thread in OT and post the same old useless crap. It's usually whatever the current internet fad is like "O RLY?" or chuck norris, ssssnakes, !!!!cos(0)111!!, OMG-BBQ-insert anything moronic that makes zero sense, etc... how is that even funny after the first couple times unless you are 12? It just clutters up OPs that are intended to have serious responses.

Iamwiz's thread demonstrated how stupid some of the things people post in topics that are obviously seeking serious and helpful responses.

I know that there are other automotive forums out there, but there are a number of people on AT that are very knowledgeable with cars. It's bad enough that some of the best members who helped out in the car threads pretty much left due to so many asshats in OT who don't appreciate the serious reponses. I myself know little about cars, whether it is the latest car news or about car maintenance, but I read YACTs strictly to learn more as a hobby. I don't want to wade through posts about blinker fluid or flux capacitors in threads seeking help from knowledgeable folks like Vic, Zenmervolt, Harvey, Marlin, and a whole bunch of others I'm forgetting (sorry guys it's just a brain fart!).

I can't believe people act like removing YAGT and YACT means OT has nothing left to talk about. There is absolutely no way you can claim that is true. And as Derek said, there is no other plans to separate other OT topics in subforums. YAGT and YACT made a very small fraction of OT threads. It's just that we coined those terms and they did appear frequently enough. To me, most automobile threads are for trying to get serious responses, but in OT that is too hard with the grommy responses everyone loves so much.

I do agree some car-related topics should be left to OT. I guess the problem is deciding what fits where. Like what Zenmervolt said sounds good, just I bet it would be hard to actually moderate and you'd get people complaining to the mods about their moved thread.

I guess to sum up my poorly written rant, I'd like a automotive thread for serious discussion of technical specs like how engines work questions, maintenance, electrical, modifications, etc. Possibly even car purchasing and new car discussion, because a separate forum might get rid of posts like "pfft ford junk, buy a honda". I guess I just want a more serious discussion of automobiles, as they seem to generally warrant that, with some exceptions like the ricer who put his car in the ditch and got owned with photoshops. :D
 

Eli

Super Moderator | Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
50,419
8
81
Originally posted by: iamwiz82
I do not recall this fervor when Highly Technical was created. It was created to keep the stupidity out of intelligent threads. Why are those of you campaigning to keep things as one not screaming for HT to be re-integrated?
Because Car threads are a core part of ATOT, IMO.

HT worked because it is loosely enforced. It was up to the poster to decide whether their question needed to be posted in HT or not.

If they chose to post it in OT, there were no consequences - the post wouldn't be moved just because it was a "Highly Technical" question.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,006
5,892
126
I don't see why anything was changed from how it was before. The only new addition that seems would fit is a seperate programming forum.

The diversity of ATOT is what made it great. Reading random YAGT or YACT was good in there. It's "off topic" to the technology that this website is about.

The more and more you split up forums, the less and less active OT will become, which is going to take away from a lot of good discusisons. It's already obviously slower in ATOT than it was pre-update.

Not to mention, if someone wants some really technical car stuff, they should probably go to a car forum instead of a technology forum.

It's like me going to the forums over at VWVortex and asking them a question about C++.
 

iamwiz82

Lifer
Jan 10, 2001
30,772
13
81
Originally posted by: purbeast0
I don't see why anything was changed from how it was before. The only new addition that seems would fit is a seperate programming forum.

The diversity of ATOT is what made it great. Reading random YAGT or YACT was good in there. It's "off topic" to the technology that this website is about.

The more and more you split up forums, the less and less active OT will become, which is going to take away from a lot of good discusisons. It's already obviously slower in ATOT than it was pre-update.

Not to mention, if someone wants some really technical car stuff, they should probably go to a car forum instead of a technology forum.

It's like me going to the forums over at VWVortex and asking them a question about C++.

The people at VWVortex don't have a clue about the technical aspects of cars. It's a magazine racers forum. They probably would be able to answer your C++ question, though.
 

Miramonti

Lifer
Aug 26, 2000
28,651
100
91
Keep them imo, however you can gladly move the YA GunThreads to the Love, Relationships, and Masturbating With Your Toys forum. :p
 

oogabooga

Diamond Member
Jan 14, 2003
7,806
3
81
Originally posted by: Fingolfin269
One thing that made ATOT great was that the majority of topics were truly off topic. If we continue to pull everything out into its own forum then we will eventually end up with nothing that is off topic.

sums up the ATOT experience pretty well, I'd like to see YAGT and Car come home to OT :)
 

halik

Lifer
Oct 10, 2000
25,696
1
0
Originally posted by: Tommouse
Originally posted by: CorCentral
With the amount of Car type threads submitted into OT, I believe there should be another seperate forum for this.

The problem is guys, is that there are so many car threads being posted, it's taking up too much space in the OT forum........................ Hence the "THOUGHT" of having it's own forum. Most of you car people should be happy about this.

I'd like to just hit the CAR forum where I can post a car question and get a god damn car answer without a bunch of idiots responding like they usually do!

Example:
How do i replace a starter?
With a wrench?

Anything NUMBNUT like this in the AUTO forum should just be deleted.
If you want a lot of specific answers to auto questions you should ask it on a car forum. I know the carlounge is big, or go to a make specific site, VWVortex, Audizine, or Audiworld OR go to a make specific site such as passatworld. There are ample places to get good car help online, ATOT is not one of them, and thats why I enjoy it. I read plenty of car stuff on those forums but car enthusiasts are a small percentage of the population, so I enjoy reading ATOTs responses as the user base is wider giving me a more interesting, yet not as useful, set of responses. That and the humor, which is why I come to ATOT. So please leave the YACTs and YAGTs as well, they are some of the best entertainment on ATOT.


QFT

I enjoy reading OT because of the wide variety of topics covered; there are plenty of forums that are specific to the subject (women, cars etc.) in case people are interested exclusively in the subject. Theres no point in creating a separate auto forum, when I can go to the car lounge / vwvortex etc
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,006
5,892
126
Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Originally posted by: purbeast0
I don't see why anything was changed from how it was before. The only new addition that seems would fit is a seperate programming forum.

The diversity of ATOT is what made it great. Reading random YAGT or YACT was good in there. It's "off topic" to the technology that this website is about.

The more and more you split up forums, the less and less active OT will become, which is going to take away from a lot of good discusisons. It's already obviously slower in ATOT than it was pre-update.

Not to mention, if someone wants some really technical car stuff, they should probably go to a car forum instead of a technology forum.

It's like me going to the forums over at VWVortex and asking them a question about C++.

The people at VWVortex don't have a clue about the technical aspects of cars. It's a magazine racers forum. They probably would be able to answer your C++ question, though.

you are joking right?

i've found answers on those forums that my mechanic couldn't even give me.

that forum has a bunch of gear heads that know a hell of a lot about cars.
 

BD2003

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
16,815
1
81
Originally posted by: purbeast0
I don't see why anything was changed from how it was before. The only new addition that seems would fit is a seperate programming forum.

The diversity of ATOT is what made it great. Reading random YAGT or YACT was good in there. It's "off topic" to the technology that this website is about.

The more and more you split up forums, the less and less active OT will become, which is going to take away from a lot of good discusisons. It's already obviously slower in ATOT than it was pre-update.

Not to mention, if someone wants some really technical car stuff, they should probably go to a car forum instead of a technology forum.

It's like me going to the forums over at VWVortex and asking them a question about C++.

But the problem is that OT itself takes away from good discussion. It wasnt like this a few years ago, but OT is now so full of rampant idiots and retarded threads that not only does a somewhat mature thread get lost in the mix of the stupidity, the thread itself gets polluted by stupidity.

QFT

I enjoy reading OT because of the wide variety of topics covered; there are plenty of forums that are specific to the subject (women, cars etc.) in case people are interested exclusively in the subject. Theres no point in creating a separate auto forum, when I can go to the car lounge / vwvortex etc

But by that same reasoning, theres plenty of other "off-topic" forums that AT doesnt need its own OT section.

AT is HUGE. There are probably more people here interested in cars than there are at some car boards.

Not to mention the vast majority of car sites I've been around are full of ricers and other idiots.

The simple fact is that moving it to it's own forum WILL increase the *quality* of posts. Maybe not the quantity. The people that just don't care, and HAVE to respond to every thread with a one sentence stupid answer probably don't care enough to visit the car forum. Those that do care, can always click the new forum and participate. No one is being left out, but it's just too damn crowded in OT.

Tabbed browsing...it's an amazing thing you know.
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: illusion88
I would like to see a automotive forum. Not because I think ATOT is too crowded, but because I think we will get a higher quality response to automotive threads if they have their own forum.

I don't post Auto threads if I want a response like OMG RICE!!! or something equally irrelevant. I want advice, suggestions or guides on how to fix my current problem.

Exactly.

Real auto info gets lost in the "OMG Rice!!!" stuff.

You can still have te "Rice" YACT threads in OT but have real auto & transportation questions and info in it's own forum area.

Especially now with Hybrids and other modes of Transportation getting more important everyday.

Would also be a good area to focus on the never ending speeding ticket and other ticket issues as Government looks to tickets for more revenue to make up for higher fuel costs.
 

BD2003

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
16,815
1
81
Would also be a good area to focus on the never ending speeding ticket and other ticket issues as Government looks to tickets for more revenue to make up for higher fuel costs.

Eh, that belongs in P&N...have a field day with it.