Trump to decertify the Iran nuclear deal.

[Thebobo]

Just heard it on CNN - god help us all. He's already got NK to deal with and now this. Diversion for something - again?

http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/05/politics/trump-iran-deal-deadline-plan/index.html

 

[conehead433]

But of course. It has Obama's stamp on it. I think Trump would buy up every book publishing company, if he could, and attempt to completely remove his name from history.

 

[hal2kilo]

Just heard it on CNN - god help us all.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/05/politics/trump-iran-deal-deadline-plan/index.html

Fool's going to get us all killed. Israel must have some Trump hotel business to line up.

 

[woolfe9998]

No, it isn't Israel or even trying to undo Obama. It's Trump's base. Iran is the "enemy" to American conservatives and Trump knows this. As with virtually everything he does, he is trying to please them. The consequences of this decision are of course unimportant because they affect the country as a whole, which is of no significance to him whatsoever.

 

[Puffnstuff]

Everybody knows or at least should know that the R's need someone to direct anger at to drum up support among their base. This recipe has worked for them for many decades so why stop using it now when its proven to be so effective. I still remember that SNL skit with Hillary at the front door with the cue cards one of which said he's going to kill us all.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

fuck all y'all who voted for that bloated orange carcass

 

[Jhhnn]

Meanwhile, the Iranians & the rest of the 5+1 will just sail on... getting down to the business of making money. It's extremely unlikely that Iran will violate the nuclear provisions of the deal... You know, the part that really matters. They built their nuclear weapons capabilities so that they could bargain them away for trade & diplomatic concessions from the West. Obama wisely accepted the offer, made the best deal he could get to prevent nuclear proliferation.

 

[K1052]

Meanwhile, the Iranians & the rest of the 5+1 will just sail on... getting down to the business of making money. It's extremely unlikely that Iran will violate the nuclear provisions of the deal... You know, the part that really matters. They built their nuclear weapons capabilities so that they could bargain them away for trade & diplomatic concessions from the West. Obama wisely accepted the offer, made the best deal he could get to prevent nuclear proliferation.

This basically. The odds that congress will do anything to void the deal are slim.

 

[trenchfoot]

But of course. It has Obama's stamp on it. I think Trump would buy up every book publishing company, if he could, and attempt to completely remove his name from history.

Trump taking over from Obama made Trump look bad right from the get-go simply because Obama was much more of a man and loving father, much more of a real politician, much more presidential and oh so much more of an intellectual of whom broke barriers, won a Nobel Peace Prize and received glowing accolades the world over when he initially took office.

And we all know how Trump reacted to his own inauguration when the comparison was made to Obama's. Yep, right from the get-go and no let-up on Trump's part since.

 

[Jhhnn]

It's interesting how Trump unmasks the insincerity & ineptitude of Repub politicos. He puts them in the position where they have to put up or shut up. About the ACA, immigration, taxes, N Korea & now Iran. They could rave & crazify their base all they wanted when Obama was there to stop them but now... well now it's all different, isn't it?

They thought they'd always be able to control it, but that's not how propaganda induced mass insanity works.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

So much for listening to his generals huh? Speaking of which almost worth a thread on its own of the number of U.S. military leaders, active leaders, who have come out with stated positions contrary to things this admin has said and done.

 

[esquared]

Anything with Obama's name on it makes the fat cheeto in charge see red. Ever since that correspondents dinner
where Obama chided and ridiculed him for his bad behavior, cheeto has been plotting revenge. It's not like he can remove
Obama from the history books but he wants to reverse every achievement Obama did as President.

This bloated sack of crap couldn't carry water for Obama. Damn, he really going to eff this country up just to
spite Obama. What a festering POS he is.

 

[Engineer]

Anything with Obama's name on it makes the fat cheeto in charge see red. Ever since that correspondents dinner
where Obama chided and ridiculed him for his bad behavior, cheeto has been plotting revenge. It's not like he can remove
Obama from the history books but he wants to reverse every achievement Obama did as President.

This bloated sack of crap couldn't carry water for Obama. Damn, he really going to eff this country up just to
spite Obama. What a festering POS he is.

I thought of exactly the same when I read this. Cheeto Von Tweeto has a hard on for anything Obama and it's damn obvious.

 

[kage69]

What a fucking moron.

 

[Jhhnn]

I thought of exactly the same when I read this. Cheeto Von Tweeto has a hard on for anything Obama and it's damn obvious.

It's just all the stuff Repub politicos said they'd do all during Obama's presidency, all the stuff they've been preaching to keep their base nicely irrational, but not too irrational. And then Trump...

 

[FIVR]

I wonder if Bibi realizes that america won't fight this war for him?


If Trump scraps the deal, it will be a countdown of about 6-9 months before they produce their first bomb. They have all the scientific knowhow and manufacturing capacity to do it.

The only way to stop Iran from getting the bomb will be an invasion with ground troops. Their enrichment facilities are >1km underground and cannot be penetrated by conventional weapons (even supersonic bunker-busters). You would need to use tactical nuclear weapons or ground troops to do it.

Israel has no stomach for the fight. They might contribute some troops (<10k) or the might not and just ask the US soldiers to go die for them. They did that with Iraq and Syria for years.

 

[FIVR]

Oh, and any invasion of Iran is going to have Vietnam-style casualties. Maybe even worse. It would be like fighting the taliban if the taliban had all the armor and weapons the US did plus aircraft and PGMs and heavy artillery. Obviously they won't have the quantity of stuff that we do, but this won't be like Iraq. Iran also has much more dangerous territory in terms of mountains that basically make it a defender or guerilla's paradise.

 

[Sonikku]

Fun Fact: Iran had democracy before the US overthrew it and replaced it with a dictatorship. They've held a grudge ever since.

I wonder why?

 

[R0H1T]

Maybe someone can make him an offer he simply cannot refuse? Is there a hotline to hell, the devil should chime in!

 

[Jhhnn]

I wonder if Bibi realizes that america won't fight this war for him?


If Trump scraps the deal, it will be a countdown of about 6-9 months before they produce their first bomb. They have all the scientific knowhow and manufacturing capacity to do it.

The only way to stop Iran from getting the bomb will be an invasion with ground troops. Their enrichment facilities are >1km underground and cannot be penetrated by conventional weapons (even supersonic bunker-busters). You would need to use tactical nuclear weapons or ground troops to do it.

Israel has no stomach for the fight. They might contribute some troops (<10k) or the might not and just ask the US soldiers to go die for them. They did that with Iraq and Syria for years.

Bullshit fear mongering. Iran isn't about to violate their side of the non-proliferation deal. What really happened is that the nuclear deal forced us to abandon our policy of regime change, to grant their govt legitimacy in diplomacy & trade. That's what they wanted all along, not nuclear weapons.

 

[Moonbeam]

I believe that Trump can only be understood by understanding self hate. My understanding of self hate goes like this:

We were all put down as children, made to feel the worst in the world and the only way we survived that was by developing a protective ego. The ego is our false construction, identification with something external on which we hang a new substitute sense of self worth. The ego protects us from the pain we would feel if we got in touch with out true feelings, that we are actually worthless. But those feelings are a lie. There is nothing wrong with us. And we would know that if we were capable of suffering, of remembering our original humiliation. Thus it is that while the ego saved us from childhood despair, it now prevents us from knowing our real inner truth, the one thing and the only way we can return to real mental health, to feel what we really feel and see it was all a lie we had to buy into to survive. Now, the secret and the mystery of our condition, then, is that we desire to be whole again, that we want to return to our original state of unity and joy to be alive, but we can't do it consciously because we fear the pain it would bring. The result is that our self hate becomes an unconscious desire to destroy ourselves, to break our ego attachment by real world fuck up and failure. We see this all the time with men of power and respect who do something like get a blow job from a intern and have it come out on a blue dress.

Slowly but surely, I think, Trump is also trying to cure his narcissism by taking it to unsustainable limits. He is trying unconsciously to destroy himself.

The problem, of course, is that because he is unaware of what is happening, he does this in a way that is dangerous to all Americans. My personal feeling is that this unconscious destructiveness is coming to a head, that he may be simply too obviously dangerous to be allowed to continue to simply ruin himself, too dangerous that is to people with the power to stop him. I would much rather he destroy himself on his own by becoming too preposterously insane for the house and senate to continue to sit on their asses and they finally act to impeach him. It is what he wants to happen, I think.

 

[FIVR]

Bullshit fear mongering. Iran isn't about to violate their side of the non-proliferation deal. What really happened is that the nuclear deal forced us to abandon our policy of regime change, to grant their govt legitimacy in diplomacy & trade. That's what they wanted all along, not nuclear weapons.

So you think if Trump unilaterally withdrawals from this deal and starts making threats, that Iran will just hand over their nuclear material and submit to his demands?

Of course Iran wanted those things more than nuclear weapons. If Trump does this, they will get both. Europe will not sanction them again, and US sanctions alone are completely ineffective. They will re-start their enrichment. Why wouldn't they? They would be foolish not to.

The US will not invade a country with nuclear weapons. And conversely, the US will invade any country that refuses to be subject to its control if it doesn't have nuclear weapons. It is not "fear mongering" to state the likely outcome of unilateral withdrawal from the nuclear agreement.


I don't think the US or Israel have the stomach for a real war. Nor do I believe they are insane enough to use tactical nuclear weapons. So most likely, it will be threats from Trump and maybe some ineffective airstrikes. Then, a year or so later, Iran will test their own warhead secretly and maybe a few months later our intelligence services get wind that they are now nuclear capable.

By the way, the US passed new sanctions on Iran after the deal. Which is itself a violation of the deal and a provocation. Iran did not protest because they never had any trade to begin with. But Iran has not received the things Obama promised them (trade and detente)

 

[feralkid]

What a fucking moron.

That's what Tillerson said.

 

[Jhhnn]

So you think if Trump unilaterally withdrawals from this deal and starts making threats, that Iran will just hand over their nuclear material and submit to his demands?

Of course Iran wanted those things more than nuclear weapons. If Trump does this, they will get both. Europe will not sanction them again, and US sanctions alone are completely ineffective. They will re-start their enrichment. Why wouldn't they? They would be foolish not to.

The US will not invade a country with nuclear weapons. And conversely, the US will invade any country that refuses to be subject to its control if it doesn't have nuclear weapons. It is not "fear mongering" to state the likely outcome of unilateral withdrawal from the nuclear agreement.


I don't think the US or Israel have the stomach for a real war. Nor do I believe they are insane enough to use tactical nuclear weapons. So most likely, it will be threats from Trump and maybe some ineffective airstrikes. Then, a year or so later, Iran will test their own warhead secretly and maybe a few months later our intelligence services get wind that they are now nuclear capable.

By the way, the US passed new sanctions on Iran after the deal. Which is itself a violation of the deal and a provocation. Iran did not protest because they never had any trade to begin with. But Iran has not received the things Obama promised them (trade and detente)

Dandy conspiracy theory. The US won't do anything other than tighten sanctions that the ROTW will blow out their ass. What the 5+1 wanted & received was an inspection regimen they could trust wrt proliferation & for the Iranians to dispose of nearly all their stocks of LEU. Iran values the deal more than they do nuclear weapons so they'll keep it & so will the rest of the 5+1.

If we want to cut ourselves out of the deal, out of the business opportunities, they'll all do fine without us.

 

[HomerJS]

BREAKING NEWS...

President Obama's bill passed in 2015 that ends cancer, Trump has revoked it. Asked for comment Trump said "ending cancer is unconstitutional and an illegal act by an out of control administration"