News Trump: Mar-a-Lago just raided by FBI

[ivwshane]

Far better to question him in open court and get stuff out in the open.

Lol! Good one!

 

[rommelrommel]

Fossil fuels don't get much worse than tar sands.

Sure, but for the most part they are still being extracted. They just go by truck or train.

I look forward to not burning fossil fuels, but until we do they should be used as safely as possible.

 

[you2]

Rather him have a non fatal one so he's a drooling idiot. Okay that's more a stroke, but anything that incapacitates him so he suffers for another decade and being a laughing stock. But thing is, if he's forced to wear adult diaper for the rest of his life, Melania and kids definitely won't be around to help him. He can suffer with Steven Miller and any clowns that still wish to associate with him.

Hum... if he were a 'drooling idiot'; well more of a drooling idiot than currently - would the replublicans be more likely to vote for him ?

 

[hal2kilo]

Looks like one of Mr. Smith's first moves is to get Judge Cannon out of the equation entirely. Bye bye Special Master.

“They are going to slam this judge”: Experts say appeals court will shut down Trump judge’s “circus” | Salon.com

 

[interchange]

Looks like one of Mr. Smith's first moves is to get Judge Cannon out of the equation entirely. Bye bye Special Master.

“They are going to slam this judge”: Experts say appeals court will shut down Trump judge’s “circus” | Salon.com

Jack Smith took over but this move was well underway when he did.

 

[Amol S.]

Now since the special master selection is done....... things will take their slowwwwwwww pace as they do with anything related to high profile court cases.

 

[woolfe9998]

Extremely unimpressed with Garland's decision to appoint a special prosecutor. It's nothing more than him kicking this political can over to someone else. Chickenshit. It accomplishes nothing. It's not as if Trump's supporters aren't going to say the prosecution was politically motivated because it's being handled by a special prosecutor appointed by DoJ rather than DoJ itself. All this does is insulate Garland himself from criticism over the decision. Garland has claimed in interviews that politics would be no part of the decision. This move proves that was a lie.

I had hoped Garland had more integrity than this, but apparently not. This will only cause further delay. Biden should have appointed someone more likely to be aggressive, like Adam Schiff. The GOP would behave exactly the same way in either case but the end result could well have been different.

 

[fskimospy]

Extremely unimpressed with Garland's decision to appoint a special prosecutor. It's nothing more than him kicking this political can over to someone else. Chickenshit. It accomplishes nothing. It's not as if Trump's supporters aren't going to say the prosecution was politically motivated because it's being handled by a special prosecutor appointed by DoJ rather than DoJ itself. All this does is insulate Garland himself from criticism over the decision. Garland has claimed in interviews that politics would be no part of the decision. This move proves that was a lie.

I had hoped Garland had more integrity than this, but apparently not. This will only cause further delay. Biden should have appointed someone more likely to be aggressive, like Adam Schiff. The GOP would behave exactly the same way in either case but the end result could well have been different.

I don’t get this line of reasoning - what makes anyone think this was done out of concern for how GOP partisans would react? All this after a midterm performance that was caused precisely by independent voters coming over to vote for the democrats in droves.

 

[Indus]

Now since the special master selection is done....... things will take their slowwwwwwww pace as they do with anything related to high profile court cases.

I think the dems honestly want to slow walk this as much as possible so Trump runs again!

 

[woolfe9998]

I don’t get this line of reasoning - what makes anyone think this was done out of concern for how GOP partisans would react? All this after a midterm performance that was caused precisely by independent voters coming over to vote for the democrats in droves.

Because this is the usual reason this is done, always in relation to politicians and never anyone else. Because the putative defendant is a politician and the charging authority wants to avoid the perception that the prosecution was politically motivated. And specifically because they worry over character assassination in places like Fox News. What motivated Comey to send that letter to Congress back in 2016? It's the exact same brand of political cowardice.

Let's turn your question around. If you don't think this was the reason, then what was the reason?

 

[fskimospy]

Because this is the usual reason this is done, always in relation to politicians and never anyone else. Because the putative defendant is a politician and the charging authority wants to avoid the perception that the prosecution was politically motivated. And specifically because they worry over character assassination in places like Fox News. What motivated Comey to send that letter to Congress back in 2016? It's the exact same brand of political cowardice.

Let's turn your question around. If you don't think this was the reason, then what was the reason?

To appeal to independent voters.

I think it has literally zero to do with concerns about Fox News being mean to them or whatever.

 

[woolfe9998]

To appeal to independent voters.

I think it has literally zero to do with concerns about Fox News being mean to them or whatever.

If true, that would be just a different form of political motivation, which Garland claimed was not in play here.

I think it's more than just a concern over generic "meanness" from conservatives. Based on past history, they will go after him, go after his family, and if they can't find anything, they'll just report allegations from Parler, Reddit, or Truth Social as if they were true. I think Garland would rather have that happen to a Special Prosecutor than to himself.

I also think DoJ has dragged its feet over 1/6. They have been way behind the committee on gathering evidence, They are offering up the records case as a safer way to prosecute, for a much lower penalty, because they worry too much over failing to convict Trump. Yet they have probable cause to indict Trump under multiple statutes. They can let a jury decide if Trump had the requisite intent or not. Trump should have been indicted over 1/6 at least 6 months ago. As it stands, he likely never will be. For the most damaging criminal misconduct in American history.

 

[fskimospy]

If true, that would be just a different form of political motivation, which Garland claimed was not in play here.

Yeah but that's stupid - everyone knew from the start that politics would play a role in how this was prosecuted. How could it not?

I think it's more than just a concern over generic "meanness" from conservatives. Based on past history, they will go after him, go after his family, and if they can't find anything, they'll just report allegations from Parler, Reddit, or Truth Social as if they were true. I think Garland would rather have that happen to a Special Prosecutor than to himself.

I also think DoJ has dragged its feet over 1/6. They have been way behind the committee on gathering evidence, They are offering up the records case as a safer way to prosecute, for a much lower penalty, because they worry too much over failing to convict Trump. Yet they have probable cause to indict Trump under multiple statutes. They can let a jury decide if Trump had the requisite intent or not. Trump should have been indicted over 1/6 at least 6 months ago. As it stands, he likely never will be. For the most damaging criminal misconduct in American history.

I agree that the DOJ has dragged its feet in regards to 1/6 and they have not prosecuted senior conspirators remotely fast enough. I don't think that has anything to do with this though, and I think it's a politically smart move. My only complaint is if they were going to go this route they should have appointed a special prosecutor back in August.

 

[eelw]

I also think DoJ has dragged its feet over 1/6. They have been way behind the committee on gathering evidence, They are offering up the records case as a safer way to prosecute, for a much lower penalty, because they worry too much over failing to convict Trump. Yet they have probable cause to indict Trump under multiple statutes. They can let a jury decide if Trump had the requisite intent or not. Trump should have been indicted over 1/6 at least 6 months ago. As it stands, he likely never will be. For the most damaging criminal misconduct in American history.

Yes they started way too late, but DOJ has gotten more people from the administration to testify for their grand jury than house committee has. And there isn’t any evidence by appointing the special counsel will slow things down.

 

[woolfe9998]

Yes they started way too late, but DOJ has gotten more people from the administration to testify for their grand jury than house committee has. And there isn’t any evidence by appointing the special counsel will slow things down.

I don't think the special counsel is a super important issue in and of itself. Had DoJ not been slow to pursue 1/6 in regards to Trump, it would bother me less. I am reacting to it this way because I see it as of a piece with DoJ being overly cautious in prosecuting Trump over 1/6 to begin with. I may change my tune if he's charged. But right now I highly doubt it. I think if this DoJ, or any special counsel they appoint, will not prosecute Trump out of political caution, history will not view it well at all.

 

[fskimospy]

I don't think the special counsel is a super important issue in and of itself. Had DoJ not been slow to pursue 1/6 in regards to Trump, it would bother me less. I am reacting to it this way because I see it as of a piece with DoJ being overly cautious in prosecuting Trump over 1/6 to begin with. I may change my tune if he's charged. But right now I highly doubt it. I think if this DoJ, or any special counsel they appoint, will not prosecute Trump out of political caution, history will not view it well at all.

I do not think Trump will be indicted for 1/6, even though I agree he should be. I get how the DOJ thinks (correctly IMO) that if they do indict Trump they MUST get a conviction. For that reason I think they are just going to stick with the MAL documents case as that will be by far the easiest to win.

 

[woolfe9998]

I do not think Trump will be indicted for 1/6, even though I agree he should be. I get how the DOJ thinks (correctly IMO) that if they do indict Trump they MUST get a conviction. For that reason I think they are just going to stick with the MAL documents case as that will be by far the easiest to win.

Well that is the mentality of prosecutors in general. They don't like to lose. But in this case I think the failure to prosecute is at least as bad as a failure to convict, if not worse. The people need to have their day in court here. They need to see Trump either testifying and lying his ass off, or cowardly refusing to testify in his own defense. And they need to see all the evidence laid out in front of a jury. Most importantly, they need to see that this conduct cannot go unprosecuted. It's a far worse precedent to not bother prosecuting than to prosecute and not convict.

That said, I agree he will not be prosecuted over 1/6. A decision which I do not think will play well historically.

 

[Pens1566]

Welp:

That's bad news for TFG

 

[hal2kilo]

Watching live readings of ruling on MSNBC. Just one slam after the other. Nothing to link yet.

 

[eelw]

Well there’s going to be a week delay once this gets appealed to SCOTUS. But standard procedure, let DOJ file their brief and they will review both side’s arguments

 

[Dave_5k]

Watching live readings of ruling on MSNBC. Just one slam after the other. Nothing to link yet.

Here's the actual ruling:

https://docs-cdn-prod.news-engineering.aws.wapo.pub/publish_document/5c87d9b8-631f-41c7-92e8-129f412d0e0f/published/5c87d9b8-631f-41c7-92e8-129f412d0e0f.pdf

"The district court improperly exercised equitable jurisdiction in this case. For that reason, we VACATE the September 5 order on appeal and REMAND with instructions for the district court to DISMISS the underlying civil action."

This isn't just a reversal of the special master, it is a complete reversal and dismissal of Cannon's inane attempt to seize jurisdiction over a criminal case with zero legal or rational justification, other than Cannon's mantra "Trump is my God, thou shalt have no other gods before him".

 

[akugami]

Any other ruling would have been insane. Cannon clearly was licking Trump's boots. To the point where even laymen like me were wondering what the hell Cannon was thinking or doing.

I think MeidasTouch has a good analysis of the ruling.

BREAKING: Appeals Court STRIKES DOWN Judge Aileen Cannon Jurisdiction in Trump Stolen Document Case - YouTube

 

[Moonbeam]

I am sitting on my contempt for the slow pace of justice and hoping Trump is held accountable for something that finally ends him politically. I think that part of the reason the DOJ is so slow is that it is internally divided itself and hopes to avoid blowing up publicly.

 

[VRAMdemon]

Any other ruling would have been insane. Cannon clearly was licking Trump's boots. To the point where even laymen like me were wondering what the hell Cannon was thinking or doing.

I think MeidasTouch has a good analysis of the ruling.

BREAKING: Appeals Court STRIKES DOWN Judge Aileen Cannon Jurisdiction in Trump Stolen Document Case - YouTube

Trump, to Judge Cannon: “The cops came and executed a lawful warrant for search and seizure on me! Sure, they do this every single day all over the country, but since I was a president, I should be treated in a special, different way!”

Judge Cannon: “You bet! What legal norms can I violate for you? How about a special master? That will slow them down!”

DOJ: “Hang on a minute. This isn’t the way the law works. Hey, Eleventh Circuit, I'm not sure how your going to rule, so I’m going to carve out this little piece of the case relating to classified materials that I’m pretty sure even you guys are not willing to ignore, and see how this goes with you.”

Trump, to the Eleventh Circuit: “This is Garlands witch hunt! Fix this for me!”

Eleventh Circuit, to Trump: “No. And Judge Cannon, the DOJ is correct. Release those classified items to the DOJ and try again.”

Judge Cannon: “Hold my beer!”

DOJ: “You Eleventh Circuit people aren’t as far gone as I worried you might be. Screw this, let’s appeal the entire case!”

Trump: “I have no legal arguments to make, but it’s just not fair that I am being treated like everyone else in the country!, I am a victim!”

The Court, to Trump: “fuck off". This is legal principle on which the constitution is based, and we’re going to make this crystal fucking clear in our ruling so regular people will regain some faith in our legal system. Oh, and Judge Cannon, you’re full of shit.”

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

This is one where overturning on Appeal is not enough. This Judge needs to be formally sanctioned, if not removed.