Torsell too drunk to consent to sobriety test

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: GoPackGo
I feel bad for the driver, because he didn't mean to kill anyone.

But he has ruined many lives and must pay for what he did.

well to be fair if he didnt want to kill anyone he shouldnt have driven drunk. he chose to drive drunk and kill someone. i have no sympathy for him at all.

i hope he sits in jail for a few years and loses everything he has.

Well, his fate is far worse than that actually. He's not going to lose everything he had. He's just a 20 year old kid, and he probably doesn't have anything anyway. His fate is that he is going to lose everything he otherwise could have had, much like Acemcmac did. He's lost his future.

Don't drink and drive, kids.

maybe.

truth is he won't spend much time in prison. so eventually he will get out and enjoy (as much as he can) life. where the guy he killed won't.

not to mention his family can go see (and his boyfriend) in jail.

so do i have sympathy for the guy? HELL NO. if he had left the keys with someone else, had a DD, or just not drank the situation would be happening.

 

[Pacemaker]

Originally posted by: BrokenVisage

Originally posted by: Patt
Thanks for the update ... interesting tactic, but not going to work.

Are you a lawyer? Do you know how easy it is to get people off on a technicality? I hope it doesn't work, but it's moronic to say it won't work just because it sounds lame to you.

I miss the Judges who wouldn't take that kind of crap. I got pulled over for speeding and went to the judge arguing that I was not going the speed it said on the ticket. The judge looked at me and said, "You never said you weren't speeding only that you weren't going the speed listed. Pay the ticket."

If I was the Judge I would tell the jury that the defendant just admited to being drunk that night, and they should make all future judgements based on that information.

 

[Perknose]

Originally posted by: jman19

Originally posted by: Perknose

Originally posted by: jman19
Drunk drivers are scum. Anyone remember the thread a while back where some posters were saying that the currently legal limit is BS beacuse they "can drive fine with a few beers in them?" :roll:

What does that possibly have to do with a .242 alchohol level???

Oh, that's right, NOTHING! :disgust:

Umm, I wasn't talking about the guy with a .242 alcohol level

I'm talking about how people shouldn't be allowed to decide when they are or are not too drunk to drive.

Most people shouldn't, 'tis true, but you heaped scorn on those who think, and I quote, "the currently legal limit is BS".

I disagree vehemently.

The current drive in states to reduce the legal limit from .10 to .08, as they did here in Pa., is almost purely politically driven, and IS bullsh1te.

It's a big sop to the idiot law and order crowd, pandering to the peanut gallery, and will prove mostly to be more of a big revenue producer for local police forces than anything else, imho.

All hail Big Brother and the nanny state! Surely THEY know what's best for us in ALL situations. :disgust:

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: waggy

maybe.

truth is he won't spend much time in prison. so eventually he will get out and enjoy (as much as he can) life. where the guy he killed won't.

not to mention his family can go see (and his boyfriend) in jail.

so do i have sympathy for the guy? HELL NO. if he had left the keys with someone else, had a DD, or just not drank the situation would be happening.

There is a question that has appeared on every job application I've ever filled out -
Have you ever been convicted of a felony? If yes, explain.

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by: bignateyk

Originally posted by: mugs

Five Penn State students and a nonstudent are headed to Centre County Court on charges they provided alcohol consumed by a 20-year-old State College man accused of driving drunk when he struck and killed one pedestrian and critically injured a second.

Furnishing alcohol to a 20 year old is one thing... but it takes a heck of a lot of it to get to .242.

Welcome to every weekend at a public university. The people that gave him the booze arent to blame. There are hundreds of parties going on, and usually by the end of the night, the hosts dont even know half the people who are there. Its just how it works, so dont say something like "they should be carding everyone who shows up at the party and making sure that people dont drink too much"

He drank, he drove, its his responsibility, not anyone elses. He could have gotten that booze at any one of a hundred parties, and he probably wasnt even at one party the whole night.

The fact that he was underage had nothing to do with the accident. There are just as many of-age students who drink and drive around here than underage, probably more.

He should be punished to the max, but not the people who gave him booze.

BS!!! If you throw a party you are responsible for it. And being that the person was 20, under the drinking age, that is delinquency at least if not worse. If there are people at your party you don?t know or don?t want there tell them to leave.

This is the type of BS I hate about most people in the US now. Nobody is to blame except someone else. If a drug company sells you a drug they are responsible, mind you they try the BS of the person choose to take it and live XYZ way etc.... If you serve alcohol at a party then you will take some of the responsibility as well, no matter how immature you act saying its not your fault.

Grow up.

 

[zinfamous]

"My client was too intoxicated to understand his situation. Please throw out the evidence of his intoxication." Another reason that lawyers are scum. Put him in jail too as a lesson to all those other lawyers.

 

[Mrfrog840]

 

[OutHouse]

Originally posted by: bignateyk

Originally posted by: mugs

Five Penn State students and a nonstudent are headed to Centre County Court on charges they provided alcohol consumed by a 20-year-old State College man accused of driving drunk when he struck and killed one pedestrian and critically injured a second.

Furnishing alcohol to a 20 year old is one thing... but it takes a heck of a lot of it to get to .242.

Welcome to every weekend at a public university. The people that gave him the booze arent to blame. There are hundreds of parties going on, and usually by the end of the night, the hosts dont even know half the people who are there. Its just how it works, so dont say something like "they should be carding everyone who shows up at the party and making sure that people dont drink too much"

He drank, he drove, its his responsibility, not anyone elses. He could have gotten that booze at any one of a hundred parties, and he probably wasnt even at one party the whole night.

The fact that he was underage had nothing to do with the accident. There are just as many of-age students who drink and drive around here than underage, probably more.

He should be punished to the max, but not the people who gave him booze.

bullsh*t. the people who threw the party are responsible too. they allowed a underage kid get totally smashed at THEIR party. if they were responsible people they would have monitored the situation by two ways.

1. Dont serve under age kids
2. make everybody fess up their car keys when they enter the door.

 

[Aharami]

Originally posted by: GoPackGo
I feel bad for the driver, because he didn't mean to kill anyone.

But he has ruined many lives and must pay for what he did.

i feel no sympathy for him. i recall reading that he had prior DUIs. I hope he rots in jail

 

[Tobolo]

Thanks for the update. I hope they get him and all that helped him.

 

[jman19]

Originally posted by: Perknose

Originally posted by: jman19

Originally posted by: Perknose

Originally posted by: jman19
Drunk drivers are scum. Anyone remember the thread a while back where some posters were saying that the currently legal limit is BS beacuse they "can drive fine with a few beers in them?" :roll:

What does that possibly have to do with a .242 alchohol level???

Oh, that's right, NOTHING! :disgust:

Umm, I wasn't talking about the guy with a .242 alcohol level

I'm talking about how people shouldn't be allowed to decide when they are or are not too drunk to drive.

Most people shouldn't, 'tis true, but you heaped scorn on those who think, and I quote, "the currently legal limit is BS".

I disagree vehemently.

The current drive in states to reduce the legal limit from .10 to .08, as they did here in Pa., is almost purely politically driven, and IS bullsh1te.

It's a big sop to the idiot law and order crowd, pandering to the peanut gallery, and will prove mostly to be more of a big revenue producer for local police forces than anything else, imho.

All hail Big Brother and the nanny state! Surely THEY know what's best for us in ALL situations. :disgust:

Yes I agree that there is a lot of politics behind it all, and that nanny statism is a load of crap, but there has to be a limit regardless. I'm sure some people can drive OK when they've had something to drink but there are some people who can't hold their liquor for sh!t. I wouldn't like my GF to drive even after a single glass of wine, to be honest In the end there has to be a hard number assigned to it. .08 or .1, it doesn't matter that much does it really? No one should be driving after boozing. IMHO, of course.

 

[jman19]

Originally posted by: GoPackGo

Originally posted by: jman19
Drunk drivers are scum. Anyone remember the thread a while back where some posters were saying that the currently legal limit is BS beacuse they "can drive fine with a few beers in them?" :roll:

It is BS. The only thing the current laws do are collect money for the state.

What should the law be, then? I don't disagree that a lot of laws are just revenue generators for cities/states, though.

 

[ahurtt]

Originally posted by: jman19

Originally posted by: Perknose

Originally posted by: jman19

Originally posted by: Perknose

Originally posted by: jman19
Drunk drivers are scum. Anyone remember the thread a while back where some posters were saying that the currently legal limit is BS beacuse they "can drive fine with a few beers in them?" :roll:

What does that possibly have to do with a .242 alchohol level???

Oh, that's right, NOTHING! :disgust:

Umm, I wasn't talking about the guy with a .242 alcohol level

I'm talking about how people shouldn't be allowed to decide when they are or are not too drunk to drive.

Most people shouldn't, 'tis true, but you heaped scorn on those who think, and I quote, "the currently legal limit is BS".

I disagree vehemently.

The current drive in states to reduce the legal limit from .10 to .08, as they did here in Pa., is almost purely politically driven, and IS bullsh1te.

It's a big sop to the idiot law and order crowd, pandering to the peanut gallery, and will prove mostly to be more of a big revenue producer for local police forces than anything else, imho.

All hail Big Brother and the nanny state! Surely THEY know what's best for us in ALL situations. :disgust:

Yes I agree that there is a lot of politics behind it all, and that nanny statism is a load of crap, but there has to be a limit regardless. I'm sure some people can drive OK when they've had something to drink but there are some people who can't hold their liquor for sh!t. I wouldn't like my GF to drive even after a single glass of wine, to be honest In the end there has to be a hard number assigned to it. .08 or .1, it doesn't matter that much does it really? No one should be driving after boozing. IMHO, of course.

Agreed. IMO, .00 should be the only legally acceptable limit. But then there are asshats who think .10 is too low. So there has to be some middle ground. The fact of the matter is, once you've had even 1 serving of alcohol and then get behind the wheel, IF there is an accident you cannot rule out that that alcohol might have played a factor, regardless of your BAC level. The only way to be sure it never will is not to drink AT ALL if you are going to drive.

 

[bignateyk]

Originally posted by: Citrix

Originally posted by: bignateyk

Originally posted by: mugs

Five Penn State students and a nonstudent are headed to Centre County Court on charges they provided alcohol consumed by a 20-year-old State College man accused of driving drunk when he struck and killed one pedestrian and critically injured a second.

Furnishing alcohol to a 20 year old is one thing... but it takes a heck of a lot of it to get to .242.

Welcome to every weekend at a public university. The people that gave him the booze arent to blame. There are hundreds of parties going on, and usually by the end of the night, the hosts dont even know half the people who are there. Its just how it works, so dont say something like "they should be carding everyone who shows up at the party and making sure that people dont drink too much"

He drank, he drove, its his responsibility, not anyone elses. He could have gotten that booze at any one of a hundred parties, and he probably wasnt even at one party the whole night.

The fact that he was underage had nothing to do with the accident. There are just as many of-age students who drink and drive around here than underage, probably more.

He should be punished to the max, but not the people who gave him booze.

bullsh*t. the people who threw the party are responsible too. they allowed a underage kid get totally smashed at THEIR party. if they were responsible people they would have monitored the situation by two ways.

1. Dont serve under age kids
2. make everybody fess up their car keys when they enter the door.

Obviously you didnt go to a big university, or didnt take part in the party scene if you did. Most of the parties that go on here arent little get-togethers where everyone knows each other.

Most of them are animal house style parties, where you have multiple apartments, several kegs, and hundreds of people packed into a few rooms. Usually the host only actually invites about 5 people, each one of those people tells about 5 more. Noone cares about underage drinking, the cops just turn a blind eye.

99% of the people doing the drinking live in town, which means it is only a few block walk to any one of 30 bars or hundreds of parties. The people throwing the party should be responsible for what others drink. And as I said before, he could have been (and probably was) at other parties before he even got to that one.

I'm not trying to condone anything. Its a culture of drinking, and its not going to change. In fact, absolutely nothing has changed since the accident (and the one after that). If you lay the blame on the host, then you may as well lay the blame on the liquor store, the cops, and the university itself.

In reality, its HIS responsiblity, and HE should take 100% of the punishment for it. If you are going to punish those 6 students, then you might as well punish the other THOUSANDS of students who have thrown parties, and who binge drink every weekend. Sorry, its just ridiculous.

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

This is the type of BS I hate about most people in the US now. Nobody is to blame except someone else. If a drug company sells you a drug they are responsible, mind you they try the BS of the person choose to take it and live XYZ way etc.... If you serve alcohol at a party then you will take some of the responsibility as well, no matter how immature you act saying its not your fault.

Grow up.

WTF. Did you even read what I said? Noone is to blame but HIM. You're the one condoning passing the blame to everyone else. He drank, he drove. Noone forced him to.

 

[SarcasticDwarf]

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: bignateyk

Originally posted by: mugs

Five Penn State students and a nonstudent are headed to Centre County Court on charges they provided alcohol consumed by a 20-year-old State College man accused of driving drunk when he struck and killed one pedestrian and critically injured a second.

Furnishing alcohol to a 20 year old is one thing... but it takes a heck of a lot of it to get to .242.

Welcome to every weekend at a public university. The people that gave him the booze arent to blame. There are hundreds of parties going on, and usually by the end of the night, the hosts dont even know half the people who are there. Its just how it works, so dont say something like "they should be carding everyone who shows up at the party and making sure that people dont drink too much"

He drank, he drove, its his responsibility, not anyone elses. He could have gotten that booze at any one of a hundred parties, and he probably wasnt even at one party the whole night.

The fact that he was underage had nothing to do with the accident. There are just as many of-age students who drink and drive around here than underage, probably more.

He should be punished to the max, but not the people who gave him booze.

BS!!! If you throw a party you are responsible for it. And being that the person was 20, under the drinking age, that is delinquency at least if not worse. If there are people at your party you don?t know or don?t want there tell them to leave.

This is the type of BS I hate about most people in the US now. Nobody is to blame except someone else. If a drug company sells you a drug they are responsible, mind you they try the BS of the person choose to take it and live XYZ way etc.... If you serve alcohol at a party then you will take some of the responsibility as well, no matter how immature you act saying its not your fault.

Grow up.

Wait what? Your statement conflicts with itself. What you are saying is that you should not blame someone else, yet you are saying someone OTHER than the guy that comitted the crime is at fault?

 

[NuroMancer]

Originally posted by: zinfamous
"My client was too intoxicated to understand his situation. Please throw out the evidence of his intoxication." Another reason that lawyers are scum. Put him in jail too as a lesson to all those other lawyers.

Right, the lawyer doing his best to represent his client is scum.....

Also a massive generalization. Seriously, go grow up.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: SarcasticDwarf

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: bignateyk

Originally posted by: mugs

Five Penn State students and a nonstudent are headed to Centre County Court on charges they provided alcohol consumed by a 20-year-old State College man accused of driving drunk when he struck and killed one pedestrian and critically injured a second.

Furnishing alcohol to a 20 year old is one thing... but it takes a heck of a lot of it to get to .242.

Welcome to every weekend at a public university. The people that gave him the booze arent to blame. There are hundreds of parties going on, and usually by the end of the night, the hosts dont even know half the people who are there. Its just how it works, so dont say something like "they should be carding everyone who shows up at the party and making sure that people dont drink too much"

He drank, he drove, its his responsibility, not anyone elses. He could have gotten that booze at any one of a hundred parties, and he probably wasnt even at one party the whole night.

The fact that he was underage had nothing to do with the accident. There are just as many of-age students who drink and drive around here than underage, probably more.

He should be punished to the max, but not the people who gave him booze.

BS!!! If you throw a party you are responsible for it. And being that the person was 20, under the drinking age, that is delinquency at least if not worse. If there are people at your party you don?t know or don?t want there tell them to leave.

This is the type of BS I hate about most people in the US now. Nobody is to blame except someone else. If a drug company sells you a drug they are responsible, mind you they try the BS of the person choose to take it and live XYZ way etc.... If you serve alcohol at a party then you will take some of the responsibility as well, no matter how immature you act saying its not your fault.

Grow up.

Wait what? Your statement conflicts with itself. What you are saying is that you should not blame someone else, yet you are saying someone OTHER than the guy that comitted the crime is at fault?

Yeah, I had the same reaction.

I feel it is 100% the drivers fault. To start blaming other people merely serves to indicate that it wasn't 100% the drivers fault, it's like apportioning the blame among numerous people. Or, "Ohhhh the poor driver, those other people let him drink too much". "THEY should have taken his keys away" etc.

Fern

 

[bignateyk]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: SarcasticDwarf

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: bignateyk

Originally posted by: mugs

...

....

...

Wait what? Your statement conflicts with itself. What you are saying is that you should not blame someone else, yet you are saying someone OTHER than the guy that comitted the crime is at fault?

Yeah, I had the same reaction.

I feel it is 100% the drivers fault. To start blaming other people merely serves to indicate that it wasn't 100% the drivers fault, it's like apportioning the blame among numerous people. Or, "Ohhhh the poor driver, those other people let him drink too much". "THEY should have taken his keys away" etc.

Fern

Seriously. I live out of town now, but I still regularly go in town to party, but ya know what? I TAKE THE BUS. Why? Because IM FVCKING RESPONSIBLE. Not the bar that I go and get hammered at. Not my friends for buying rounds of shots and calling me a big fvcking pussy if I dont drink one. Not the bottle shop that I stopped by at 2am after the bar closed because I blacked out and thought it would be smart to get another 40. Not the host of the party I randomly wandered into at 4 in the morning and decided to do a keg stand. Not the cop that saw me stumbling down the sidewalk, but decided to turn a blind eye. And nope, not even the girl who wasnt quite pretty enough to fvck while sober. Well, go ahead and blame her, thats the real reason I was drinking.

I ALONE AM RESPONSIBLE FOR EVERY ONE OF MY ACTIONS WHEN I DRINK! Thats why I take the bus or get a cab.

 

[GoPackGo]

Originally posted by: jman19

Originally posted by: GoPackGo

Originally posted by: jman19
Drunk drivers are scum. Anyone remember the thread a while back where some posters were saying that the currently legal limit is BS beacuse they "can drive fine with a few beers in them?" :roll:

It is BS. The only thing the current laws do are collect money for the state.

What should the law be, then? I don't disagree that a lot of laws are just revenue generators for cities/states, though.

It should be an additional fine/prison time if you commit another crime.

.08 is so random one beer can make one person intoxicated while another is just fine.

 

[Gamingphreek]

.242!!?!?!? How in the hell did he not have alcohol poisoning- He must have been barely conscious.

This is such a sad story, and it all could have been avoided if people would not drink and drive . It's times like these that really make me hate being a college student (Even though I don't drink).

And for you guys who think that the BAC limit should be 0...well they can't do that. What if you have a beer, or a glass of wine with dinner/football game and you drive back. 1 beer will not affect you to endanger the drive back as it will be significantly less than .08 (~.02)

-Kevin

 

[miniMUNCH]

I did drive drunk* one time a long time ago... I feel like sh1t for doing it and I won't ever do it again. In fact, I basically don't drink anymore...maybe half a beer every other week.

*When I say drunk I mean I was over the legal limit but I was not hammered. I was driving in a completely unfamiliar area, following complicated directions from memory while consulting a map on occasion, and I didn't get lost once... so I was coherent but I still should not have been driving.

 

[GoPackGo]

Originally posted by: Aharami

Originally posted by: GoPackGo
I feel bad for the driver, because he didn't mean to kill anyone.

But he has ruined many lives and must pay for what he did.

i feel no sympathy for him. i recall reading that he had prior DUIs. I hope he rots in jail

DUI's? did the guy even have a license?

How can you have multiple DUI's, be under 21 and still be allowed to drive?

 

[Jeff7]

Originally posted by: allisolm
That's some circular reasoning there. We'd like you to take a sobriety test to determine if you're drunk but, if you're drunk, the test doesn't count because you're drunk and so can't consent to the test.

Sounds like a good deal. Cop pulls you over for drinking, so instead of trying those BS ways of getting the alcohol out of your breath, just take a few shots of hard liquor.
"Whooops, sorry sir there, I'm too drunk for the breath test. Ooh my pants are wet now."

I think the fact that this is the best argument he can come up with kind of shows that he really can't make a case.

Originally posted by: zinfamous
"My client was too intoxicated to understand his situation. Please throw out the evidence of his intoxication." Another reason that lawyers are scum. Put him in jail too as a lesson to all those other lawyers.

I guess it kind of has to suck for them too. The Bill of Rights guarantees that everyone must have the right to a lawyer, and that lawyer must attempt to defend his or her client. Were that not the case, our justice system would break down, because the lawyers would be the ones to pass judgment - "Nope, I won't represent him. He's guilty." Oh, well then, case closed. Suddenly lawyers would be the judge and jury of the legal system.

I imagine that they must have to go home to think, "I defended a man guilty of vehicular homocide. I actually had to try to defend him, to keep him out of jail."
I would not want to have to do that.

I think the guy's Facebook spoke for itself. He was a member of multiple alcohol-related groups, and his one quote was from a friend, "You ready to drive?" The reply, "Yeah, let me finish my beer." Real responsible attitude there. Shortly after the accident, his Facebook profile was gone.

 

[Kromis]

Originally posted by: mugs

Originally posted by: waggy

maybe.

truth is he won't spend much time in prison. so eventually he will get out and enjoy (as much as he can) life. where the guy he killed won't.

not to mention his family can go see (and his boyfriend) in jail.

so do i have sympathy for the guy? HELL NO. if he had left the keys with someone else, had a DD, or just not drank the situation would be happening.

There is a question that has appeared on every job application I've ever filled out -
Have you ever been convicted of a felony? If yes, explain.

Thank God applications have that question on them...

That guy is screwed for life...

 

[jman19]

Originally posted by: GoPackGo

Originally posted by: jman19

Originally posted by: GoPackGo

Originally posted by: jman19
Drunk drivers are scum. Anyone remember the thread a while back where some posters were saying that the currently legal limit is BS beacuse they "can drive fine with a few beers in them?" :roll:

It is BS. The only thing the current laws do are collect money for the state.

What should the law be, then? I don't disagree that a lot of laws are just revenue generators for cities/states, though.

It should be an additional fine/prison time if you commit another crime.

.08 is so random one beer can make one person intoxicated while another is just fine.

And that is exactly why .08 is the legal limit.