"Tom Brady prefer his balls to feel a certain way" - balls underinflated

[Phoenix86]

All that is fine and good, but for basis of case it doesn't really matter. It's all about whether the commissioner has the authority to do as he did.

Exactly. If anything the NFLPA was absolutely inept in allowing Goodell to be judge, jury and executioner. Then they doubled down on that moronic move by letting him be the one to handle any challenges to his own decisions.

 

[waggy]

Exactly. If anything the NFLPA was absolutely inept in allowing Goodell to be judge, jury and executioner. Then they doubled down on that moronic move by letting him be the one to handle any challenges to his own decisions.

I think that will change. The NFLPA learned that giving him all the power is silly.

 

[emperus]

Exactly. If anything the NFLPA was absolutely inept in allowing Goodell to be judge, jury and executioner. Then they doubled down on that moronic move by letting him be the one to handle any challenges to his own decisions.

You assume that the NFLPA could have done better. On one side you have 32 billionaire owners who can wait out a season and on the other you have maybe 2000 young football players who generally grew up poor and who have time (bodies breaking down) to worry about and who the average only play 4 seasons. Owners will always get the better of that deal. That's why there should be more legal barriers to letting these type of arbitration provisions happen. How is it justice if one person makes the decision and then also decides the appeal?

 

[Genx87]

Without a season NFL owners own paper. Owners arent going to give up billions in wealth so Goodell can be judge, jury, and executioner. This will get fixed the next time negotiations come up. For the life of me, I cant figure out why the NFLPA every allowed this to happen.

 

[SP33Demon]

The phone destruction was AFTER he was told it was not needed. Brady also furnished a complete list of everyone he texted or Emailed and the NFL had already seized all of the Patriots phones so any relevant text or email would already be in their possession. I have never claimed "Brady knew nothing!" but what I have claimed was this should have been a $200K fine and done with. How can anyone rationally think the Pats or Brady were treated in a fair fashion right from the start?. How can the Vikings ball-boys be on camera heating up game-balls with a sideline bench warmer and the punishment be a verbal warning to cease the behavior. It would ( IMO) be a MUCH bigger advantage to be throwing a toasty-warm ball on a frigid 3 degree day then the supposed .3 PSI below 12.5. The fact that Brady's performance got BETTER in the 2nd half of that game speaks for itself, his play in the following SB speaks for itself. The NFL's handling was so abysmal that many who hated the Pat's were pulling for a win in court, "leaking" false data to Mort Anderson so ESPN could then make the Pats look bad, refusing to retract said information and issue a statement of the REAL ball PSI measurements. Then 2 days AFTER Goodell gets hammered in court we have ESPN publishing a 10,000 word "smear" campaign against the Pats from "unnamed sources" claiming dumpster-diving, serving warm Gatorade, accusations of bugging the opponents locker-room. If I were Kraft at this point I would seriously consider going full-on Al Davis if Goodell actually enforces the suspension.

Wells informed Schoenfield, Jastremski, and McNally that he was going to have a 3rd party (Brad Maryman) execute search terms on their phones' text messages. There was nothing to stop them from deleting the texts prior to the search. Furthermore, AT&T's letter to Brady explicitly said the incoming and outgoing text messages from 9/1/14 through 3/15/15 could not be retrieved. So if any evidence did exist, it was either deleted before Maryman's search or lost forever since AT&T can't retrieve texts within 72 hours. Use common sense, if you're Schoenfield, Jastremski, and McNally you are going to delete any evidence off the phone within a minute of it being sent to protect your superstar. Nobody is dumb enough to leave that on their phone.

Not to mention that Brady claimed he always destroys his old cell phones yet still had his phone from 2014, prior to 9/1/14. His story simply didn't add up and they didn't have the evidence from the time of the incident since the phone with evidence from 9/1/14-3/15/15 was missing. 2nd Circuit judges wouldn't be admonishing Brady if the story added up. The evidence simply doesn't exist that Brady is innocent.

 

[smackababy]

Without a season NFL owners own paper. Owners arent going to give up billions in wealth so Goodell can be judge, jury, and executioner. This will get fixed the next time negotiations come up. For the life of me, I cant figure out why the NFLPA every allowed this to happen.

Because they didn't really have a choice. They can't strike, it hurts the players more than the owners / league. They wanted concessions and the league said "okay, but with the commissioner having ridiculous power or tough shit no deal."

 

[smackababy]

.

The evidence simply doesn't exist that Brady is innocent.

So, then, please point to the evidence that exists that demonstrate Brady had any involvement other than throwing the balls in question. What? Doesn't exist either? Clearly, he should be punished then...

Your argument is literally the equivalent of every Christian arguing "you can't prove God doesn't exist, therefore he does."

 

[Phoenix86]

You assume that the NFLPA could have done better. On one side you have 32 billionaire owners who can wait out a season and on the other you have maybe 2000 young football players who generally grew up poor and who have time (bodies breaking down) to worry about and who the average only play 4 seasons. Owners will always get the better of that deal. That's why there should be more legal barriers to letting these type of arbitration provisions happen. How is it justice if one person makes the decision and then also decides the appeal?

Of course they could have done better. I understand your point that owners tend to get better deals in this process, but they don't wield absolute power. That's kind of the whole reason the players collectively bargain...

I don't know the details on the law surrounding these types of deals, but I was a bit surprised the court OK'd one guy having so much power in the process. It's not as simple as "yup, you gave him the power so of course he can do it".

Without a season NFL owners own paper. Owners arent going to give up billions in wealth so Goodell can be judge, jury, and executioner. This will get fixed the next time negotiations come up. For the life of me, I cant figure out why the NFLPA every allowed this to happen.

I don't think that's until 2020... Tons of time for this to blow up again and again.

 

[Phoenix86]

The evidence simply doesn't exist that Brady is innocent.

What evidence exists that the balls were tampered with? How about you start with a "crime" before you worry about the investigation process. Isn't that a bit more important?

Except it isn't, because for you this is a witch hunt. Crying "WITCH!! WITCH!!" is all you need.

 

[emperus]

NFLPA added Ted Olson to defense team.

http://espn.go.com/boston/nfl/story...le-attorney-help-tom-brady-deflategate-appeal

 

[SP33Demon]

What evidence exists that the balls were tampered with? How about you start with a "crime" before you worry about the investigation process. Isn't that a bit more important?

Except it isn't, because for you this is a witch hunt. Crying "WITCH!! WITCH!!" is all you need.

You still don't get it. The judges don't give a shit about the balls, but what Brady did with evidence. Wake up.

 

[SP33Demon]

NFLPA added Ted Olson to defense team.

http://espn.go.com/boston/nfl/story...le-attorney-help-tom-brady-deflategate-appeal

They could add Johnnie Cochrane (RIP) and it still won't mean a thing if the entire 2nd Circuit doesn't want to hear the case. And good luck getting the SCOTUS to hear it.

 

[Phoenix86]

You still don't get it. The judges don't give a shit about the balls, but what Brady did with evidence. Wake up.

I know it's hard when you're frothing at the mouth, but keep up. I already said that.

CBA only, this had nothing to do with the investigation, ball pressure, instruments, method of checking at all.

What I'm responding to, is, ya know a different thread of the conversation. YOU brought it up and I even quoted it for you.

The evidence simply doesn't exist that Brady is innocent.

If you can't follow your own conversations, why bother?

 

[SP33Demon]

I know it's hard when you're frothing at the mouth, but keep up. I already said that.



What I'm responding to, is, ya know a different thread of the conversation. YOU brought it up and I even quoted it for you.



If you can't follow your own conversations, why bother?

There is no evidence to exonerate Brady because the evidence doesn't exist. He destroyed it. Hence he fucked himself in the sense that it casts reasonable doubt on his story. All the judges need is doubt, I'm sure you're aware of how the judicial process operates. He and his lawyers have to prove his innocence and that evidence does not exist, hence Brady winning this case will never exist. He needs to just cut his losses at this point.

 

[CZroe]

There is no evidence to exonerate Brady because the evidence doesn't exist. He destroyed it. Hence he fucked himself in the sense that it casts reasonable doubt on his story. All the judges need is doubt, I'm sure you're aware of how the judicial process operates. He and his lawyers have to prove his innocence and that evidence does not exist, hence Brady winning this case will never exist. He needs to just cut his losses at this point.

Wow. Never heard of "innocent until proven guilty," I take it?

You are a backwards person.

 

[SP33Demon]

Wow. Never heard of "innocent until proven guilty," I take it?

You are a backwards person.

Ever heard of trying to win a case against Roger Goodell? Hell, even the 2nd Circuit judges agreed with Goodell on this one. Maybe you didn't read my other post about the phones. It was a slam dunk since Brady still had other phones from the past (2014) but claimed he destroys them before he gets new ones. Added to the fact that all the stakeholders could've deleted their texts which would never be recovered (and they were notified in advance). Not to mention that there was no way for AT&T to recover Brady's texts from the destroyed phone. Too many holes in his story and not enough evidence to prove him innocent in Goodell's court of law. Hence Goodell and the 2nd circuit agreed he's guilty. Nothing more needs to be said other than Brady trying to act petty and prolong this thing. He lost, deal with it. This ruling also settles Montana will always be > than Brady now.

 

[Jimzz]

Wow. Never heard of "innocent until proven guilty," I take it?

You are a backwards person.

This is not a criminal case, you do know that right?
Also he was already found "guilty" and given his sentence of a 4 game suspension. This is an appeal, not the original case.

 

[CZroe]

This is not a criminal case, you do know that right?
Also he was already found "guilty" and given his sentence of a 4 game suspension. This is an appeal, not the original case.

Of course I know that. The problem is SP33's 100% unshakable assumption of Tom Brady's guilt. Why you think that has anything to with it being an appeal versus the original case is beyond me. I'm mocking him for his failure to grasp a pretty simple base concept/American value.

 

[BUTCH1]

Wells informed Schoenfield, Jastremski, and McNally that he was going to have a 3rd party (Brad Maryman) execute search terms on their phones' text messages. There was nothing to stop them from deleting the texts prior to the search. Furthermore, AT&T's letter to Brady explicitly said the incoming and outgoing text messages from 9/1/14 through 3/15/15 could not be retrieved. So if any evidence did exist, it was either deleted before Maryman's search or lost forever since AT&T can't retrieve texts within 72 hours. Use common sense, if you're Schoenfield, Jastremski, and McNally you are going to delete any evidence off the phone within a minute of it being sent to protect your superstar. Nobody is dumb enough to leave that on their phone.

Not to mention that Brady claimed he always destroys his old cell phones yet still had his phone from 2014, prior to 9/1/14. His story simply didn't add up and they didn't have the evidence from the time of the incident since the phone with evidence from 9/1/14-3/15/15 was missing. 2nd Circuit judges wouldn't be admonishing Brady if the story added up. The evidence simply doesn't exist that Brady is innocent.

If that's the case why didn't they delete the text's the Well's team DID wind up finding. I'm not possessing the technical knowledge to know if a deleted text is really gone or (like a hard drive) could still be there until that portion of the phone's memory is written over.

 

[emperus]

Ever heard of trying to win a case against Roger Goodell? Hell, even the 2nd Circuit judges agreed with Goodell on this one. Maybe you didn't read my other post about the phones. It was a slam dunk since Brady still had other phones from the past (2014) but claimed he destroys them before he gets new ones. Added to the fact that all the stakeholders could've deleted their texts which would never be recovered (and they were notified in advance). Not to mention that there was no way for AT&T to recover Brady's texts from the destroyed phone. Too many holes in his story and not enough evidence to prove him innocent in Goodell's court of law. Hence Goodell and the 2nd circuit agreed he's guilty. Nothing more needs to be said other than Brady trying to act petty and prolong this thing. He lost, deal with it. This ruling also settles Montana will always be > than Brady now.

Huh?
Reading that gave me a headache.

I'm not sure what you are arguing at this point. It's like convicting a guy for murder when the person he supposedly killed is alive and breathing sitting in the court house. And you argue, if he didn't destroy his cell phone there would have been enough to prove him innocent of murder.

Again, very smart scientists have proven that the balls deflation probably happened by the change in temperature. The NFL had every opportunity to test out that theory this season and they didn't. Think about that. The NFL chose not to definitely prove Brady cheated. Why do you think they didn't/

Honestly, I see why you are a Trump supporter. Facts seem to fall on deaf ears with you. It's exhausting.

 

[emperus]

If that's the case why didn't they delete the text's the Well's team DID wind up finding. I'm not possessing the technical knowledge to know if a deleted text is really gone or (like a hard drive) could still be there until that portion of the phone's memory is written over.

I"m not sure whether carriers save the texts on their servers, but they would have the logs of what time messages were sent to what numbers. It would be easy to check to see if Brady did send texts to certain numbers and see if any are missing from either Brady's phone or the other parties phone. Brady and his team offered to do that. The NFL chose not to take him up on that offer. I guess implying obstruction suited their propaganda purposes better than actually possessing those texts.

 

[Phoenix86]

There is no evidence to exonerate Brady because the evidence doesn't exist. He destroyed it. Hence he fucked himself in the sense that it casts reasonable doubt on his story. All the judges need is doubt, I'm sure you're aware of how the judicial process operates. He and his lawyers have to prove his innocence and that evidence does not exist, hence Brady winning this case will never exist. He needs to just cut his losses at this point.

Still waiting on the evidence of wrongdoing to warrant an investigation...

 

[BudAshes]

Ever heard of trying to win a case against Roger Goodell? Hell, even the 2nd Circuit judges agreed with Goodell on this one. Maybe you didn't read my other post about the phones. It was a slam dunk since Brady still had other phones from the past (2014) but claimed he destroys them before he gets new ones. Added to the fact that all the stakeholders could've deleted their texts which would never be recovered (and they were notified in advance). Not to mention that there was no way for AT&T to recover Brady's texts from the destroyed phone. Too many holes in his story and not enough evidence to prove him innocent in Goodell's court of law. Hence Goodell and the 2nd circuit agreed he's guilty. Nothing more needs to be said other than Brady trying to act petty and prolong this thing. He lost, deal with it. This ruling also settles Montana will always be > than Brady now.

Actually, I believe the niners cheated the salary cap when Montana was dominating.

 

[BUTCH1]

Ever heard of trying to win a case against Roger Goodell? Hell, even the 2nd Circuit judges agreed with Goodell on this one. Maybe you didn't read my other post about the phones. It was a slam dunk since Brady still had other phones from the past (2014) but claimed he destroys them before he gets new ones. Added to the fact that all the stakeholders could've deleted their texts which would never be recovered (and they were notified in advance). Not to mention that there was no way for AT&T to recover Brady's texts from the destroyed phone. Too many holes in his story and not enough evidence to prove him innocent in Goodell's court of law. Hence Goodell and the 2nd circuit agreed he's guilty. Nothing more needs to be said other than Brady trying to act petty and prolong this thing. He lost, deal with it. This ruling also settles Montana will always be > than Brady now.

Yea, Joe sure played some tough competition in his SB wins, the Bengals (twice) and a 55-10 romp over the Elway-led Broncos. He also beat Miami but the Dolphins entered that SB with one of the weakest defenses ever, tied for LAST in rush defense and ranked #19 in YPG. Meanwhile Brady had to win his in the salary-cap era and never had anyone with the talent of Rice (with the exception of Moss for 2 yrs) and Brady STILL holds the highest winning % for NFL QB's in the ENTIRE history in the league. Think JM could have absorbed the punishment meted out by the Seattle defense and still come up with two 4th Qtr game-winning drives at age 38?..I DON'T, JM was done at 37 and he missed almost 2 entire seasons with an "elbow injury". Meanwhile Brady has the reputation as one of if not THE toughest QB's EVER, last season he was playing behind a laughingstock OL and absorbed brutal hit after hit but got up off the carpet after every one and kept playing. I'd like to see JM take just ONE of the staggering hit's Bennett was punishing Brady with in that SB at age 38, he'd be taken out on a stretcher.

 

[SP33Demon]

I"m not sure whether carriers save the texts on their servers, but they would have the logs of what time messages were sent to what numbers. It would be easy to check to see if Brady did send texts to certain numbers and see if any are missing from either Brady's phone or the other parties phone. Brady and his team offered to do that. The NFL chose not to take him up on that offer. I guess implying obstruction suited their propaganda purposes better than actually possessing those texts.

No, there was ZERO evidence or texts or logs from AT&T. What part of that don't you understand?