This place used to be quite different, no?

[Hayabusa Rider]

OP opens up a circle jerk while complaining about a circle jerk. Clearly OP is ambidextrous.

The people on the right were chased out. This isn't "fair and balanced here" and it's never been. I really don't care but at least be honest.

 

[dawp]

I think that we've become so radicalized in our political sports teams that we reject any legitimate oversight. When one party controls all major branches all attempt of oversight is thrown out the window. I think our system is being tested right now and we need to figure out some sort of way to inoculate it for the future.

listened to this this morning, I thought it was interesting
https://www.npr.org/2018/04/23/6048...of-the-west-tackles-ills-of-identity-politics

 

[Jhhnn]

I think politics has just followed the decline of decency in the society.

Like the way that conservatives deal with immigration, with the dreamers & the Salvadoran refugees, their American kids & families? The way they deal with poor people, as if those people are morally afflicted?

63 million conservatives voted for the embodiment of indecency, Donald Trump, & lost all claim to the moral high ground.

 

[Younigue]

Really? And you didn’t even specify which debate. Or do you mean to say that the left has all the answers and anyone who disagrees is akin to a flat earth believer?

What the right has become? Yes, they are equal to flat earthers. I for one would appreciate if they made different choice but being intentionally stupid appears to be a Siren's call to them they have an easy way to resist but opt not to.

Before this Era (in my life time) I stuck to thinking some of their ideas or beliefs were stupid now I think they are stupid in their entirety and reveling in it.

Trump is stoking the fires in making stupid [to the Republican party] look like the best way to become a billionaire and maybe one day even become president with their very own porn star, hooker, assault, treason, corruption, criminal, indecent behavior, gluttony, hate infused scandals. As long as hate wins, they're in!

 

[Commodus]

The forum has been left-leaning for a while, but at the same time I see the demographic shift as a reflection of the polarization of the right.

Trump has served as a wedge in conservatism: he pushed some people away from mindless support of right-wing ideology, and others deeper into it. So it looks like there are fewer conservatives overall, but the ones who are conspicuously conservative are often (not always) rabidly so -- to the point where they support dogwhistle racism and xenophobia.

I wouldn't be surprised if a few conservatives got themselves banned, since the more extreme examples sounded like they were about five minutes away from committing crimes.

 

[Capt Caveman]

WWYBYWB?

 

[brianmanahan]

nope, P&N has always been a cesspool

 

[ivwshane]

The people on the right were chased out. This isn't "fair and balanced here" and it's never been. I really don't care but at least be honest.

Is that kind of like "facts have a liberal bias"?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Is that kind of like "facts have a liberal bias"?

Facts are facts and they have no ideology. Like many forums a bias develops and it did here. Eventually the right lost its collective mind and they packed it in.

 

[Bitek]

From what I’ve seen the right prefer an echo chamber. You don’t see many left leaning people posting YouTube videos from neck beards to make their arguments for them. The sources cited for basis of opinions are also severely contrasted.

We had a media bias chart posted a few months ago. It spoke volumes. The ones in the bat shit category on the left were never seen on this site as sources. The ones on the right were regularly posted sites.

To add to that, the media bias thread also exposed where conservatism has gone to. "Intellectual" conservatism is dying and is being replaced by conspiracy theories and loose collections of grievances. It has few adherents in popular media, but there is a robust hard policy media on the left.

What that translates to here is that there are few conservative policy threads backed by deep, fact based analysis... because there are few deep, fact based conservative policies that are being widely articulated.

Doesn't make much for discussion threads. Instead they just have to defend Trumpian policy pinball in between handwaving away gross corruption, treason and affairs with porn stars.

After so many intellectual asskickings, no wonder most of the R-wingers quit.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

From what I’ve seen the right prefer an echo chamber. You don’t see many left leaning people posting YouTube videos from neck beards to make their arguments for them. The sources cited for basis of opinions are also severely contrasted.

We had a media bias chart posted a few months ago. It spoke volumes. The ones in the bat shit category on the left were never seen on this site as sources. The ones on the right were regularly posted sites.

I have been attacked as a corporatist shill opposing progress for personal gain. The idea that the Left is superior in not being an echo chamber isn't something I could agree with. Generally better than Republicans true, but if something outside of orthodoxy or disagreeing with a favored leader? Dragons aplenty. Naturally I don't give a shit

 

[darkswordsman17]

The forum has been left-leaning for a while, but at the same time I see the demographic shift as a reflection of the polarization of the right.

Trump has served as a wedge in conservatism: he pushed some people away from mindless support of right-wing ideology, and others deeper into it. So it looks like there are fewer conservatives overall, but the ones who are conspicuously conservative are often (not always) rabidly so -- to the point where they support dogwhistle racism and xenophobia.

I wouldn't be surprised if a few conservatives got themselves banned, since the more extreme examples sounded like they were about five minutes away from committing crimes.

I think that's part of it.

I do think that some have started to see how toxic the modern conservative ideology really is. Its basically casting off any pretense of actually caring about people, and has become openly antagonistic towards the People. I think a lot of that though is just the mounting evidence. Some of it is historic (and actually isn't a Republican issue, the US has many failures that transcends party politics, the thing is, one group is far more willing to admit and want to work towards solutions of those issues, the other wants to act like they somehow simultaneously didn't even happen, but weren't problems at all but would be great to implement even more strictly). But the past couple of years has made it impossible to ignore how openly hateful conservativism has become. Its kinda like with topics like sexual harassment and assault, where people had blinders on, but then it was like suddenly people are going "whoa, holy shit, this is a serious problem". I don't think its a coincidence that people seeing how toxic the rhetoric that conservatives are spewing is happening at the same time as people wake up to some other serious problems. People have been knocked out of their stupor, and its sobering.

Quite a few of the "missing conservatives" on here though are just chickenshits that got tired of people calling them out for their bullshit and so have been out seeking "safe spaces" where people would just parrot their, often outright wrong basic facts (let alone when discussing topics with lots of depth, like Middle East relations) instead of, you know, reading even the articles they themselves were using to support their idiocy and going "you know the article actually doesn't even support your opinion?" type of stuff. Like rudeguy (I recall him going in OT and losing his mind over Obama taking selfies with some other world leaders at a celebration event after Mandela's funeral, because he couldn't accept that it was for celebrating Mandela, and not a somber event with Obama being so disrespectful). And that's before you get to the morons that just push completely nutter-butter conspiracy garbage where there's been a pushback against that.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

I have been attacked as a corporatist shill opposing progress for personal gain. The idea that the Left is superior in not being an echo chamber isn't something I could agree with. Generally better than Republicans true, but if something outside of orthodoxy or disagreeing with a favored leader? Dragons aplenty. Naturally I don't give a shit

Hey I’m not saying both are perfect but it’s not on balance. Not even close. I will happily engage in a contrary position that is reasoned and fact based. It’s hard to argue that’s been something plentiful around here from the right.

I try very hard to see both sides of things. Play devils advocate. But considering the first thread I ever posted in on here was a very long birther thread.... maybe my opinion is askew.

Let’s be honest here. The amount of conspiracy level bullshit with the last president was a high hill to get over. I am remembering countless threads with little basis in supportable fact here.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Hey I’m not saying both are perfect but it’s not on balance. Not even close. I will happily engage in a contrary position that is reasoned and fact based. It’s hard to argue that’s been something plentiful around here from the right.

I try very hard to see both sides of things. Play devils advocate. But considering the first thread I ever posted in on here was a brother thread.... maybe my opinion is askew.

There are lots of way crazy people for sure and I'm not generally amused by them however there are times when there's a "train wreck in progress" thing which I confess I just have to watch.

The whole damn nation has pretty much gone in the toilet with exceptions but I find them fewer over time.

 

[darkswordsman17]

I have been attacked as a corporatist shill opposing progress for personal gain. The idea that the Left is superior in not being an echo chamber isn't something I could agree with. Generally better than Republicans true, but if something outside of orthodoxy or disagreeing with a favored leader? Dragons aplenty. Naturally I don't give a shit

That's odd logic. "They are 'generally' better, but I can't disagree that they are better."

Ah yes, "both sides!!!" Yeah, you not giving a shit about spouting nonsense is pretty apparent. I mean, not sure why you're acting like holier than thou, you called someone a rapist for disagreeing with you.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

Things change, always, anything, including message forums. I've seen enough change, disappear, etc, etc. Everything evolves into something throughout their existence..

 

[UberNeuman]

It takes a toll on those poor rightwingers to have to defend the indefensible. oh, well.

 

[Jaskalas]

New I don't see many leftists here besides myself, lots of liberals and democrats though I would consider them to be center-right as they believe in "market solutions" in many cases where I don't.

I believe in market solutions. After we tax 25% for Basic Income, another 15% for Healthcare, and somewhere between 5-10% for the rest. Once the economic safety net is in full force and no one need hunger or go homeless for any reason ever again. The "market" is the best place for the other half of our productivity.

 

[Noah Abrams]

To add to that, the media bias thread also exposed where conservatism has gone to. "Intellectual" conservatism is dying and is being replaced by conspiracy theories and loose collections of grievances. It has few adherents in popular media, but there is a robust hard policy media on the left.

quit.

Serious conservatives are still there. They do have thoughtful ideas including on health care. They just don’t get featured in mainstream sources

 

[GagHalfrunt]

"Liberal...party lines" are a right-wing authoritarian way of saying objective, observable reality.

And Libertarians are the toddlers of politics.

"No, I don't wanna" isn't how you operate a government.

If you think that's what Libertarians want the biggest toddler is this thread is you. And given some of the participants, that's not something to be proud of.

And grow up zippy, "I don't wanna" is already a way government operates. A whole shitload of laws are passed on the principle of "I don't wanna do this, so other people should not have the right" and "I do wanna do this, so it should be mandatory." In that regard, governments run a whole hell of a lot like churches and home owners associations.

 

[UberNeuman]

Libertarians are nothing like toddlers. Toddlers grow up.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

That's odd logic. "They are 'generally' better, but I can't disagree that they are better."

Ah yes, "both sides!!!" Yeah, you not giving a shit about spouting nonsense is pretty apparent. I mean, not sure why you're acting like holier than thou, you called someone a rapist for disagreeing with you.

Did I hand your ass to you? Yeah, because you entirely didn't understand anything in that discussion. You got pissed because I called out a guy who doesn't believe that people should be able to defend themselves against rapists or other violent crime. That the right of self-defense doesn't and shouldn't exist. You decided to be just fine with that even if it didn't have anything to do with guns. But did that offend you? Oh no, I provoked with a word and you bit "rapey" send you over the top. I wondered who would be more offended by that than by one who endorsed helplessness.
Congrats you won.

 

[brandonbull]

This forum has always leaned more towards the left, and nothing wrong with that. But I seem to remember that there used to be a much more robust presence of right leaning people. I am not talking just the usual right wingers - who are just as tiring to listen to as their left wing counterparts, both parroting the party lines ad nauseam.

If I remember correctly, there used to be some libertarian types here. And/or other people with more varied, and nuanced views. But now frankly, to use a crude term, it seems like a liberal circle jerk. Or is my memory playing tricks with me?

I'm sure several of the non left leaning posters have been bullied off the forum either by constant reports to ban or the idiotic trolling by the resident progressheviks.

 

[brandonbull]

Like the way that conservatives deal with immigration, with the dreamers & the Salvadoran refugees, their American kids & families? The way they deal with poor people, as if those people are morally afflicted?

63 million conservatives voted for the embodiment of indecency, Donald Trump, & lost all claim to the moral high ground.

Stereotype much?

 

[Jhhnn]

It takes a toll on those poor rightwingers to have to defend the indefensible. oh, well.

Surely you don't mean their tax plan, their trickle down economics plan, their healthcare plan, their infrastructure plan, their immigration plan, their maximum sentencing to privatized prisons plan, their sell more military grade firepower plan, their FYGM plan for ordinary Americans who trust them for leadership...