This place used to be quite different, no?

[Noah Abrams]

If you want something slightly more to the right, try the Democratic Underground.

Oh and here I was thinking you were serious. I actually went to that place and that makes this forum look like Fox News! FU

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Calls for decorum, names calls at the drop of hat. Lol.

When in Rome....

 

[Pipeline 1010]

I think that we've become so radicalized in our political sports teams that we reject any legitimate oversight. When one party controls all major branches all attempt of oversight is thrown out the window. I think our system is being tested right now and we need to figure out some sort of way to inoculate it for the future.

Yeah I've also come to think of it as a sports team type mentality. It would be far better if we would reject things our team does that we wouldn't accept from the other team. Because some day that side will be in power and use those things too.

 

[MavericK96]

If you want something slightly more to the right, try the Democratic Underground.

Or, if you prefer to go to a computer hardware forum for your political discussion, Hardforum Soapbox is extremely right-wing.

 

[emperus]

Really? And you didn’t even specify which debate. Or do you mean to say that the left has all the answers and anyone who disagrees is akin to a flat earth believer?

You made a suggestion that there is no varied/nuanced debate on this forum. You didn't specify a topic or issue but generalized like somehow just the absence of varied/nuanced views signify a partisan view. And so I gave you an example to counter that.

And since you asked, we can't even have a nuanced/varied debate because we seem to be have a hard time in this country (to the delight of some) even figuring out what the reality or the facts are in which we are to use to debate.

 

[Genx87]

This forum has always leaned more towards the left, and nothing wrong with that. But I seem to remember that there used to be a much more robust presence of right leaning people. I am not talking just the usual right wingers - who are just as tiring to listen to as their left wing counterparts, both parroting the party lines ad nauseam.

If I remember correctly, there used to be some libertarian types here. And/or other people with more varied, and nuanced views. But now frankly, to use a crude term, it seems like a liberal circle jerk. Or is my memory playing tricks with me?

You are correct. And I suspect people grow tired of the echo chamber. This isnt the only board that has succumbed to this neither. I have seen libertarian boards run off authoritarians both left and right. It is the nature of the beast.

 

[Thebobo]

You are correct. And I suspect people grow tired of the echo chamber. This isnt the only board that has succumbed to this neither. I have seen libertarian boards run off authoritarians both left and right. It is the nature of the beast.

lol succumbed

 

[Blackjack200]

I don't see many leftists here besides myself, lots of liberals and democrats though I would consider them to be center-right as they believe in "market solutions" in many cases where I don't.

Do you see many threads advocating for jobs guarantees, disengorgement of the ultra-wealthy, public ownership or nationalization of major industries, public housing, union protections, etc.?

Those are leftist ideals. I barely see any of that around here.

 

[Noah Abrams]

You are correct. And I suspect people grow tired of the echo chamber. This isnt the only board that has succumbed to this neither. I have seen libertarian boards run off authoritarians both left and right. It is the nature of the beast.

Back in my liberal days, I used to be zealously anti religion. Hated it cause I believed it to be intolerant and repressive. Only over time I came to realize that it is not this or that, but human nature itself which is that way. Now we see the intolerance of the secular left in the mainstream culture. Anyone who dares to utter an opinion which is not deemed to be politically correct, they are labelled and immediately banished. The worst part is that the universities have become the same - the very places which are supposed to be about free exchange of ideas. One can only imagine what kind of close minded people would be emerging from these institutions.

So now we have the people who have fought intolerance for so long (and many of them worthy fights) become repressive and intolerant themselves. Such is human nature

 

[GagHalfrunt]

I consider myself fairly pragmatic and middle of the road. I lean left on some issues, right on others and quite frankly I view anyone that is fully onboard with either party to be a brain dead asshole. Make up your own mind instead of slavishly following somebody else's platform. I identify, or at least used to identify, more as a Republican than with the Democrats. But in the last 10 years or so I can't even call myself a Republican. I'm what used to be a Republican back when the party had a shred of sense, but that message has been so co-opted by the batshit crazy far right wing that moderate Republicans like me don't want anything to do with them anymore. They're as dead to me as ISIS and the Hare Krishnas. The Tea Party and the Trump-ettes have made it impossible to root for that side even when you loathe Hilary and her ilk.

 

[trenchfoot]

Seems to me it's a case of the GOP not having a plan or an ideology to defend any more seeing as if 1) - most if not all of their core beliefs have been shown to be mere vapid hypocritical talking points ie - "deficit reduction/small gov't (by design not by mismanagement) family values and religious fidelity 2) - They have a president who has absolutely no plan, no clearly deliniated course of action for their party let alone the nation to take other than what Hannity "suggests" he do on a daily hourly basis.

Every one of the foundation core beliefs of the Repub Party have been violated, nay, completely ignored by the party in defense of their president and their legislators who have clearly shown they neither practice what their ideology preaches nor even dare to quote those "cherished values" anymore that their party allegedly stands for in fear of being exposed as the hypocritical opportunists that they actually are.

edit - So the question is: "What does the party stand for other than desperately attempting to cling to power any and every which way they can, ideology be damned?"

 

[WHAMPOM]

This forum has always leaned more towards the left, and nothing wrong with that. But I seem to remember that there used to be a much more robust presence of right leaning people. I am not talking just the usual right wingers - who are just as tiring to listen to as their left wing counterparts, both parroting the party lines ad nauseam.

If I remember correctly, there used to be some libertarian types here. And/or other people with more varied, and nuanced views. But now frankly, to use a crude term, it seems like a liberal circle jerk. Or is my memory playing tricks with me?

After their man President Trump openly commits the crimes they accused President Obama of, the dichotomy of political dogma left them unable to post their "opinions" due to a blown brain fuse.

 

[HomerJS]

^ Case in point.

lighten up Francis Making a joke

 

[fskimospy]

I think this place has changed in a similar way to American politics as a whole.

1) People generally seek to talk more with only those they agree with.

2) Conservatism has radicalized to an extent that there’s no longer much overlap between the parties.

Because of that I’m not surprised that fewer conservatives post here. That being said, I haven’t found you to be that interested in discussion either when you face informed pushback on your ideas.

 

[brycejones]

Or, if you prefer to go to a computer hardware forum for your political discussion, Hardforum Soapbox is extremely right-wing.

Oh yeah they even have their own version of incorruptible.

 

[Noah Abrams]

I. That being said, I haven’t found you to be that interested in discussion either when you face informed pushback on your ideas.

Utterly false. Case in point. The debate about illegal immigration where you continued to insist that it is conservatives ALONE who have blocked a solution, referring to last Senate immigration bill. When in fact that bill clearly gave amnesty to all illegals. Anybody can read that thread and see for themselves. How that conversation went.

You are correct that the right has gone to an extreme. What the mainstream doesn’t acknowledge is that left has too. Social issues like abortion, other issues like illegal immigration. And on and on. It wasn’t that long ago that there were differing views on these and other issues on the left.

 

[Noah Abrams]

1) People generally seek to talk more with only those they agree with.
.

The thing is, people with differing viewpoints no longer talk WITH each other. They talk AT each other

And this is not this forum or politics even. I think politics has just followed the decline of decency in the society. The crassness and all. Disregard and lack of respect for others

Heck I’ve been cursed at in this forum by more than one person, for just stating a different viewpoint. Without any provocation

And this is not right or left. This is America itself which has increasingly become a crass shallow society

 

[fskimospy]

Utterly false. Case in point. The debate about illegal immigration where you continued to insist that it is conservatives ALONE who have blocked a solution, referring to last Senate immigration bill. When in fact that bill clearly gave amnesty to all illegals. Anybody can read that thread and see for themselves. How that conversation went.

This is a good example of what I talked about. Whether or not a bill represents your preferences is irrelevant in that case. What is relevant however is in that bill (and prior bills stretching back years) there was a compromise agreed to by both Democrats and moderate Republicans. In all of those cases conservatives torpedoed the bills.

Now you might be happy that those bills were shot down but that simply means you agree with the conservatives on that issue. There’s nothing wrong with that, but that conservatives were the ones blocking them is a simple statement of fact. People interested in debate should be able to admit that.

You are correct that the right has gone to an extreme. What the mainstream doesn’t acknowledge is that left has too. Social issues like abortion, other issues like illegal immigration. And on and on. It wasn’t that long ago that there were differing views on these and other issues on the left.

That’s because, again, there’s no #bothsides to this issue. Democratic platform views on abortion are comfortably in the American mainstream, Republican platform views are not. Plenty of polling to support that.

As for the radicalization present it is true that Democrats have moved left they have done so only at a fraction of the degree Republicans have moved to the right. If you’re not familiar with it I would look at each party’s mean first order DW-NOMINATE scores. It’s an objective measure of relative ideological extremity and it paints a damning picture of how radical republicans have become.

So in short it’s good the mainstream hasn’t acknowledged that because it’s not true as per the best factual information we have. Again, if you’re open to debate it’s okay to admit this.

 

[fskimospy]

The thing is, people with differing viewpoints no longer talk WITH each other. They talk AT each other

And this is not this forum or politics even. I think politics has just followed the decline of decency in the society. The crassness and all. Disregard and lack of respect for others

Heck I’ve been cursed at in this forum by more than one person, for just stating a different viewpoint. Without any provocation

And this is not right or left. This is America itself which has increasingly become a crass shallow society

I think you may be guilty of this more than you realize. See my above post.

 

[Noah Abrams]

fskimospy - You make some valid points and I will reply them in more detail.

But do you seriously believe that the left has no problem of intolerance? Do you see the modern culture as accommodating or respectful of views and people who do not fall into the liberal or ultra liberal category?

 

[MomentsofSanity]

From what I’ve seen the right prefer an echo chamber. You don’t see many left leaning people posting YouTube videos from neck beards to make their arguments for them. The sources cited for basis of opinions are also severely contrasted.

We had a media bias chart posted a few months ago. It spoke volumes. The ones in the bat shit category on the left were never seen on this site as sources. The ones on the right were regularly posted sites.

 

[fskimospy]

fskimospy - You make some valid points and I will reply them in more detail.

But do you seriously believe that the left has no problem of intolerance? Do you see the modern culture as accommodating or respectful of views and people who do not fall into the liberal or ultra liberal category?

You would have to define what views you are referring to? There are certainly some more traditional conservative views that have fallen out of favor (which I view as a sign of progress) but plenty remain. For example the elevated status of police and the military is clearly a conservative cultural view that people resist at their own peril. (See Kaepernick, Colin) So like with anything else it’s a mix.

As for whether the left is guilty of intolerance, sure. That’s not unique to any movement. Nobody claimed the left was perfect though, just that movement of the left isn’t the primary cause for the schism we see.

 

[Thebobo]

From what I’ve seen the right prefer an echo chamber. You don’t see many left leaning people posting YouTube videos from neck beards to make their arguments for them. The sources cited for basis of opinions are also severely contrasted.

We had a media bias chart posted a few months ago. It spoke volumes. The ones in the bat shit category on the left were never seen on this site as sources. The ones on the right were regularly posted sites.

Well we do but it's mostly in the one thread ~ P&Ns middle name is and

 

[umbrella39]

OP opens up a circle jerk while complaining about a circle jerk. Clearly OP is ambidextrous.

OP is yet another poor victim of P&N who clearly deserves reparations... When oh when will the victimization of the poor, fat, white, male, conservative ever reach its peak in this country? Those poor snowflakes. Run out of here so many times and banished to their safe spaces. Every so often one dusts themselves off and tries to put their big boy pants on again and comes back to declare that their new sock is what a winner really looks like!!!!

No arguments, no truths, no balls any more... just the foot stomping and breath holding of petulant children who can't back up their talking points and only come here to fling poop from their diapers, light it on fire and claim victory..

I've been watching this shit for over 10 years now. Pathetic. Boring.

Benghazi

EDIT: Oh, and I see the "I was a liberal" card has already been played again... Yawn and plonk.

 

[nickqt]

This forum has always leaned more towards the left, and nothing wrong with that. But I seem to remember that there used to be a much more robust presence of right leaning people. I am not talking just the usual right wingers - who are just as tiring to listen to as their left wing counterparts, both parroting the party lines ad nauseam.

If I remember correctly, there used to be some libertarian types here. And/or other people with more varied, and nuanced views. But now frankly, to use a crude term, it seems like a liberal circle jerk. Or is my memory playing tricks with me?

"Liberal...party lines" are a right-wing authoritarian way of saying objective, observable reality.

And Libertarians are the toddlers of politics.

"No, I don't wanna" isn't how you operate a government.