imported_jb
Member
anyone else think that we should build a GIANT telescope on the moon ?
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Things We Can Do To The Moon
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MetalStorm
Member
That's just stupid!
I say we build a crazy golf course with refreshments bar on the moon, who's with me?
LOL!
Who wants to start a SourceForge project for the Vaccum Cleaning & Tin Foil Unrolling bots? I like the idea of mining Ore on the moon so we should build robots that first go and mine Ore and then builds more robots to unroll the freshly manufactured foil.... come to the point wouldn;t it be easier to pour the liquid metal on the surface after polishing and sanding it down?
BTW 1km^3 of Foil, is that a lot? Don't we pour more concrete than that to build dams and stuff?
Who wants to start a SourceForge project for the Vaccum Cleaning & Tin Foil Unrolling bots? I like the idea of mining Ore on the moon so we should build robots that first go and mine Ore and then builds more robots to unroll the freshly manufactured foil.... come to the point wouldn;t it be easier to pour the liquid metal on the surface after polishing and sanding it down?
BTW 1km^3 of Foil, is that a lot? Don't we pour more concrete than that to build dams and stuff?
DrPizza
Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
To put 1 cubic kilometer in perspective for you, concerning dams..
Have you heard of the 3 gorges dam?
The total volume of water in the reservoir will be about 35 to 40 cubic kilometers.
Construction of Hoover Dam: 3.25 million cubic yards. Sounds like a lot!
That's .003 cubic kilometers. It would take all the concrete in over 300 Hoover Dams to equal a cubic kilometer of concrete.
The Three Gorges Dam will use approximately 28 million cubic yards of concrete..
That's .028 cubic kilometers.
I've been trying to find some estimate on the total volume of concrete produced world-wide in a typical year. I'm guessing the annual world-wide concrete production is less than a cubic kilometer.
cmdrmoocow
Golden Member
Evadman
Administrator Emeritus<br>Elite Member
I don't see why we could not just build a factory on the moon for making foil. The first hurdle would be making Fusion a reality. The moon's crust (and dust that you want to 'vacuum' away) are ruch in Helium 3, which is essential for fusion. Since it is just 'lying around' it would be relitively easy to move it to power generation. A bonus, is that one person walking around with a shovel would probably be all the manpower you need, as a metric ton of helium 3 would be enough to power the US for a year.
This huge amount of power would be required for the sepearation of aluminum from boxite, which requires HUGE amounts of power. In fact, most aluminum plants are built right next door to a power plant, and all the power plant does is supply the aluminum plant with power.
Reynolds plants make between 200 and 350 thousand tons of aluminum per year which is about 120 million cubic meters, which equates into about 10 plants for a cubic kilometer if we wanted to accomplish this feat within a year. Supprisingly, that is slightly less than how much aluminum Canada manufactured last year.
In order to get that amount of foil applied to the surface of the moon in a decenly efficient process, the foil would have to be modified. The foil would have to have reenforced edges in order to withstand the stress of being unrolled quickly. This could be done by modifying the rolling press to quadruple the tickness of the edges. The foil would basicly have to look concave when viewed on edge as any quick changes in thickness would lead to stress points which would tear the foil.
Now, current aluminum plants make foil in rolls that are less than 3 meters wide. If we scale up the size of the rolls to 10 meters wide we would have less of a problem with waste, since now we do not have to overlap the foil as much at the edges to make sure that the surface doesn't show though in rings. Having a striped moon would suck. In additon, a 10 meter wide roll is just about at the limit for easy alignment from an operators standpoint. (reference - farming)
Assuming we set a goal of 10 years for this project, we would need to unspool the foil at roughly 12,000 meters per second; assuming start from completion of the factories and fusion plants. The capacity of 2 plants would be more than enough to keep up with the unspooling rate, but the unspooling is the bottleneck, so we ould want enough capacity at the plants so that if a plant goes down, the unspooling process could continue with increased output at the other plants.
In order to get 12,000 square meters out per second, a 10 meter roll would have to be unfurled at about 1,200 m/s or about 2200 miles per hour. This is unacceptable from a ground point. While it could be done using a satalite unfurling foil, the logistics of changing a roll in midflight nearly daily would be a nightmare, along with having to change the unfurling speed in milisecond intervals to account for ground height variations. craters can be steep, and a motor on the satilite would be unlikely to keep pace with the contours under it.
A better plan would be to use multiple ground vehicles to unfirl the foil over flatter terain, and use small crews to do steeper secions. A 3 man crew and vehicle would be able to transport a roll to a crater, and basicly roll the foil down a steep crater side to the bottom and secure it. This would be the most labor intensive piece of the project.
Probably the best way to look at the logisticls of covering the moon is to assume it is flat, and take the crews out of the math when figuring how many vehicle teams we would need to cover the moon. Now, this is not entirely true as the logistics of getting a ridge covered before a vehicle team gets there to do the flat areas would have to be worked out, but that can be done by adding more 3 man teams to the steeper secions.
Assuming that, and assuming a safe and sane speed of 36 kph on the moon (22 mph; remember we are driving on what amounts to dust with electricly powered vehicles) we would need 100 vehicle teams unfurling 24/7/365 for 10 years to get the moon covered. Obviously, we would need more than 100 teams, as even slave labor from Cananda would have to sleep. If we are good masters, we would require 10 days work time, 2 15 minute breaks and a 1 hour lunch. This takes our workforce from 100 to 240, but I believe the downtime is worth it since we can not expect many children to be born and usable durring a 10 year span to replace overworked workers.
Therefore, we wold be looking at about 15 years to cover the moon in foil. 2 years to scout and plan, 2 years to build the factories and infrastructure, a year of built up raw materials, and 10 years to lay the foil.
This huge amount of power would be required for the sepearation of aluminum from boxite, which requires HUGE amounts of power. In fact, most aluminum plants are built right next door to a power plant, and all the power plant does is supply the aluminum plant with power.
Reynolds plants make between 200 and 350 thousand tons of aluminum per year which is about 120 million cubic meters, which equates into about 10 plants for a cubic kilometer if we wanted to accomplish this feat within a year. Supprisingly, that is slightly less than how much aluminum Canada manufactured last year.
In order to get that amount of foil applied to the surface of the moon in a decenly efficient process, the foil would have to be modified. The foil would have to have reenforced edges in order to withstand the stress of being unrolled quickly. This could be done by modifying the rolling press to quadruple the tickness of the edges. The foil would basicly have to look concave when viewed on edge as any quick changes in thickness would lead to stress points which would tear the foil.
Now, current aluminum plants make foil in rolls that are less than 3 meters wide. If we scale up the size of the rolls to 10 meters wide we would have less of a problem with waste, since now we do not have to overlap the foil as much at the edges to make sure that the surface doesn't show though in rings. Having a striped moon would suck. In additon, a 10 meter wide roll is just about at the limit for easy alignment from an operators standpoint. (reference - farming)
Assuming we set a goal of 10 years for this project, we would need to unspool the foil at roughly 12,000 meters per second; assuming start from completion of the factories and fusion plants. The capacity of 2 plants would be more than enough to keep up with the unspooling rate, but the unspooling is the bottleneck, so we ould want enough capacity at the plants so that if a plant goes down, the unspooling process could continue with increased output at the other plants.
In order to get 12,000 square meters out per second, a 10 meter roll would have to be unfurled at about 1,200 m/s or about 2200 miles per hour. This is unacceptable from a ground point. While it could be done using a satalite unfurling foil, the logistics of changing a roll in midflight nearly daily would be a nightmare, along with having to change the unfurling speed in milisecond intervals to account for ground height variations. craters can be steep, and a motor on the satilite would be unlikely to keep pace with the contours under it.
A better plan would be to use multiple ground vehicles to unfirl the foil over flatter terain, and use small crews to do steeper secions. A 3 man crew and vehicle would be able to transport a roll to a crater, and basicly roll the foil down a steep crater side to the bottom and secure it. This would be the most labor intensive piece of the project.
Probably the best way to look at the logisticls of covering the moon is to assume it is flat, and take the crews out of the math when figuring how many vehicle teams we would need to cover the moon. Now, this is not entirely true as the logistics of getting a ridge covered before a vehicle team gets there to do the flat areas would have to be worked out, but that can be done by adding more 3 man teams to the steeper secions.
Assuming that, and assuming a safe and sane speed of 36 kph on the moon (22 mph; remember we are driving on what amounts to dust with electricly powered vehicles) we would need 100 vehicle teams unfurling 24/7/365 for 10 years to get the moon covered. Obviously, we would need more than 100 teams, as even slave labor from Cananda would have to sleep. If we are good masters, we would require 10 days work time, 2 15 minute breaks and a 1 hour lunch. This takes our workforce from 100 to 240, but I believe the downtime is worth it since we can not expect many children to be born and usable durring a 10 year span to replace overworked workers.
Therefore, we wold be looking at about 15 years to cover the moon in foil. 2 years to scout and plan, 2 years to build the factories and infrastructure, a year of built up raw materials, and 10 years to lay the foil.
CrispyFried
Golden Member
Rats, my brain leaked out reading it.. must.. find.. it..
This has to be my favorite thread in a long time, so I have to resurrect it.
The Discovery Science Channel has been showing a program this week called "If We Had No Moon". It has more to do with what Earth would be like if its moon had never formed at all, but I found it quite interesting. I was, however, disappointed that they didn't cover current theories on what would happen if the moon was destroyed now, or what would happen if it was covered in aluminum foil.
It's going to be on again on Sunday at 6pm EST.
The Discovery Science Channel has been showing a program this week called "If We Had No Moon". It has more to do with what Earth would be like if its moon had never formed at all, but I found it quite interesting. I was, however, disappointed that they didn't cover current theories on what would happen if the moon was destroyed now, or what would happen if it was covered in aluminum foil.
It's going to be on again on Sunday at 6pm EST.
Sushifiend3000
Member
That's no moon. It's a space station.
MetalStorm
Member
A space station made of cheese?! I think that's unlikely!
Sushifiend3000
Member
I'm sorry, I meant spacesaver. The cheese is inside.
The moon is extremely valuable to the earth?s ecosystems.
It keeps the Tides, the ebb and flow of the oceans is necessary globally for organisms to live, and continue the necessary cycle of life.
If the moon is altered then it will have server consequences on the Earth, and You.
EDIT: WE have enough explosives to destroy the earth many times over, yes we can "destroy" the moon. Im sure the effects of pollution on the earth will destroy us b4 we can fire a rocket at the moon.
It keeps the Tides, the ebb and flow of the oceans is necessary globally for organisms to live, and continue the necessary cycle of life.
If the moon is altered then it will have server consequences on the Earth, and You.
EDIT: WE have enough explosives to destroy the earth many times over, yes we can "destroy" the moon. Im sure the effects of pollution on the earth will destroy us b4 we can fire a rocket at the moon.
soccerballtux
Lifer
The tin foil idea would be rather foolish actually.....it would get all dusty again from space dust falling onto it every year.
If we covered the entire surface in rotating mirrors, we could focus all the sun's power either into solar panels on earth or at evil people like Bill Gates or the Chinese.
Boiling the ocean would also be an option; that could be used to keep the climate more stable....eliminate any drouts.
Or the government could rent off the mirrors, say 50 at a time, and you could have extra lighting at your house. That could be used for tanning, making sure your plants get enough light all day, or for heating your water tank.
I think what would be really could would be to put a ton of rockets on it and blast it into the sun. Throw some orbiting web cams around the sun and we could have a blast forcefeeding the sun cheese. Then we could just find an asteroid to replace the moon......and mine it.
If we covered the entire surface in rotating mirrors, we could focus all the sun's power either into solar panels on earth or at evil people like Bill Gates or the Chinese.
Boiling the ocean would also be an option; that could be used to keep the climate more stable....eliminate any drouts.
Or the government could rent off the mirrors, say 50 at a time, and you could have extra lighting at your house. That could be used for tanning, making sure your plants get enough light all day, or for heating your water tank.
I think what would be really could would be to put a ton of rockets on it and blast it into the sun. Throw some orbiting web cams around the sun and we could have a blast forcefeeding the sun cheese. Then we could just find an asteroid to replace the moon......and mine it.
Borealis316
Member
The worlds largest cheese curd. mmmmmmm
AbsolutDealage
Platinum Member
blahblah99
Platinum Member
I say we attach some rocket boosters to the moon and boost it out of orbit.
The wonks at Google are totally humorless. That image you see of moon, once zoomed, is real, it is very real. I infiltrated Google years ago and discovered their budget expenditures for pigeon feed were enormous and expected to grow exponentially. It has. It drove the company to go public ahead of schedule.
While researching the feasiblity of covering the moon, I spoke to Cristo. He hung that laundry up in Central Park and surrounded the islands in Biscayne Bay. He would do it with donations. That's the good news. The bad is that he is convinced that the moon should be shrouded with moon colored fabric.
I strongly advise against the recombinant DNA mouse idea. In no time, the moon would be reduced to an enormous ball of rat poo and dead rats. That is not what you want the visitors from outer space to have as their first impression of approaching earth.
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