Without the right hardware there will be no real "console" like game.
But more and more developers and publisher bring their "console" game to Android - Walking Dead, Trine 2 (preloaded on the Shield tablet) etc.
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The Ultimate Is Coming(Nvidia)
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Without the right hardware there will be no real "console" like game.
But more and more developers and publisher bring their "console" game to Android - Walking Dead, Trine 2 (preloaded on the Shield tablet) etc.
Shield tablet is a brand new tablet with stylus, and details only leaked two days ago, so it would be impossible to give consideration until now (although I have seen many people across forums express interest in the last two days). Anyway, the TK1 powered Xiaomi Mi Pad Android tablet is selling extremely well (they will sell many millions over the course of one year), but Xiaomi is not yet targeting the North American market. Android is a legitimate OS platform for tablets nowadays.
blackened23
Diamond Member
Kindle? really?
I'm sort of dumbfounded that the Kindle would be brought up as a tablet competitor for this device. I mean, has anyone used that thing? Have you used one? It's nothing more than a device to buy into amazon's ecosystem, be it videos, music, and all that sort of thing. It is not a pure android tablet. Personally I think it's an okay device but i'd much rather have a pure Android experience. I don't want a Kindle tablet which begs me 24/7 to buy amazon services. Please.
And if you want to use Kindle to buy books. Hell. You can use Kindle on the ipad. You can buy Kindle books on anything, not just an actual Kindle. Personally I find the Kindle to be the bottom of the totem pole in terms of tablets, with the Google Nexus 7 2013 and iPad air being on the top at this point and time. Kindle? The thinly veiled tablet to buy into amazon's products and services? No thank you.
Now I don't know if this device will be great, but at 299$ for a retina resolution high PPI screen sounds like a pretty good deal. But i'll have to wait and see for reviews and all that sort of thing. As a basis of comparison, the iPad air is 500$ baseline and the iPad mini retina is 400$. The google Nexus 7 2013 is around 250$ and is 1 inch smaller, doesn't have a stylus, and has a less powerful SOC. This tablet is 300$ for a pure android experience, high performance SOC, with the gaming stuff as a bonus. I have to see reviews, but on the surface in terms of specifications it doesn't look bad at all. I view the gaming stuff as icing on the cake really. I'll have to wait and see (again) what reviewers make of it. But i'm interested even not taking the gaming stuff into account, it is REALLY a pretty darn good price for what you're getting.
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It's a more difficult sell over the 8.9" Kindle simply because the Kindle is priced so competitively. But I've already got a decent (not huge, but enough) library of Android purchases that I'm not switching to Apple just for a tablet. If my wife gets an iPhone in the future, I may consider migrating over, but not now. And the Wii U isn't even the same comparison. That is a console. Did you mean a DS?
Anyways, if I wanted a good tablet with the ability to perhaps play some PC ports, or take advantage of Nvidia's excellent streaming capabilities, there is nothing else that will be comparable to the Shield Tablet. Also the Stylus looks great for taking notes and for kids to have some fun with e-painting. Compare it with the Samsung Galaxy tab S 8.4, and the Shield Tablet looks pretty darn good.
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RussianSensation
Elite Member
Blackened, You aren't understanding what I am saying at all. People buy Amazing Kindle and Apple for the eco-system and features. Samsung for their brand name leadership in the Android tablet space and their "can't go wrong" / Swiss knife product brand image. No offense but who the hell is NV in the consumer electronics space? Nobody. You can take a core i7 and throw a 750Ti inside but if MS sells it, not many people care. In the consumer electronics space, hardware specs alone don't sell a product. Look at Surface Pro, PS Vita.
When companies such as HTC struggle with their premium hardware, this market is super competitive. If I tell any of my non-PC gaming friends who want a new tablet that they should look at an Nvidia tablet, they will laugh. It's like if NV released a gaming console way more powerful to compete with Sony, Nintendo, MS. Oh wait they did with Shield v1 and no one cared....besides PC gamers.
If you look at repeat customers for top brands such as Samsung, Apple and Amazon, most of those won't switch to some unknown/unproven firm in this consumer space unless they offer some killer unique features.
Why do companies like Oppo throw top of the line specs but still sell products like Oppo Find 7 for way less than Samsung S5, LG G3, Apple 5S, Sony Xperia Z2? You will get some people to switch but most people won't buy some unknown NV brand against Samsung or Apple or Amazon. You think your parents are going to sit there and compare CPU / GPU tablet specs?
This is the same discussion we have with NV vs. AMD. The average consumer won't take risks with the lesser brand. Problem for NV is that their brand is new in this space. They would have sold a lot more units if they got a K1 design win inside Asus, Lenovo, Amazon's next Kindle device. And one of the greatest flaws of all previous Tegra products is none of them lived up to their advertised battery life in the real world. On paper most of them looked really good though.
Most of the people in this thread who are interested in this product are those who already love NV and/or used their products for many years. It is a lot more difficult to get new consumers to buy into your product.
When companies such as HTC struggle with their premium hardware, this market is super competitive. If I tell any of my non-PC gaming friends who want a new tablet that they should look at an Nvidia tablet, they will laugh. It's like if NV released a gaming console way more powerful to compete with Sony, Nintendo, MS. Oh wait they did with Shield v1 and no one cared....besides PC gamers.
If you look at repeat customers for top brands such as Samsung, Apple and Amazon, most of those won't switch to some unknown/unproven firm in this consumer space unless they offer some killer unique features.
Why do companies like Oppo throw top of the line specs but still sell products like Oppo Find 7 for way less than Samsung S5, LG G3, Apple 5S, Sony Xperia Z2? You will get some people to switch but most people won't buy some unknown NV brand against Samsung or Apple or Amazon. You think your parents are going to sit there and compare CPU / GPU tablet specs?
This is the same discussion we have with NV vs. AMD. The average consumer won't take risks with the lesser brand. Problem for NV is that their brand is new in this space. They would have sold a lot more units if they got a K1 design win inside Asus, Lenovo, Amazon's next Kindle device. And one of the greatest flaws of all previous Tegra products is none of them lived up to their advertised battery life in the real world. On paper most of them looked really good though.
Most of the people in this thread who are interested in this product are those who already love NV and/or used their products for many years. It is a lot more difficult to get new consumers to buy into your product.
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Your post went from "but if one wanted to play games" (speaking about consumers in general) to "I don't see why I would get this over XXX" (speaking about your own preference). If you would personally rather have a Kindle or iPad for the ecosystem, have at it. If you would rather have a Samsung because SAMSUNG, have at it. Nvidia won't win over too many people with that frame of mind. Then again, neither will Lenovo, Microsoft, Dell, HTC, Xaomi, or any other tablet maker.
Since I don't iApple anything and am indifferent to the Samsung brand (their phones are sh!t), to me it comes down to the Kindle HDX or Shield Tablet. If I was buying strictly for my 6-9 year old kid, I'd likely get the Kindle HDX. If I was buying for me, I'd take the Shield Tablet in a heartbeat because of the more powerful hardware and streaming capabilities.
Since I don't iApple anything and am indifferent to the Samsung brand (their phones are sh!t), to me it comes down to the Kindle HDX or Shield Tablet. If I was buying strictly for my 6-9 year old kid, I'd likely get the Kindle HDX. If I was buying for me, I'd take the Shield Tablet in a heartbeat because of the more powerful hardware and streaming capabilities.
So if a company is not Apple, Samsung, or Amazon, they should just take their ball and go home? Ok, whatever, but what does that have to do with the technical merits of the leaked Shield tablet? And FWIW, Xiaomi is completely new to the tablet market, and they sold 150,000 TK1 powered Mi Pad's in less than 15 min time in total. The worldwide market for tablets is expanding, not contracting, and Shield tablet is just one of what should be several really good tablets that are powered by TK1 that will be available between now and year end (and that should include at least one new Nexus tablet and possibly even a high end Kindle tablet too).
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RussianSensation
Elite Member
I am asking someone to sell this device. I am not even in the market for a tablet. I tried gaming on a tablet and it's just too casual compared to consoles/PC gaming. Reading will be a lot more comfortable on a lighter and thinner iPad Mini (7.5mm vs. 9.2) and the next gen Mini could get even thinner. For reading clarity, both the Kindle HDX, Xiaomi Mi Pad and iPad Mini crush this thing. For older people with poor vision the 10-12 inch tablet could be more preferable.
Using Xiaomi Mi Pad as an example that Shield will sell well doesn't translate well since Mi Pad throws even better specs and costs way less:
1) $240 price and $270 for 64GB version vs. $299/399!
2) 2048x1536 screen vs. 1920x1200 of this Shield.
http://www.zdnet.com/xiaomi-launches-the-240-7-9-inch-mi-pad-tablet-7000029539/
3) 8-MP back camera, a 5-MP front camera, better than Shield's setup
4) 360 grams vs. 390 grams for Shield
5) 8.5 mm thick vs. 9.2 mm thick Shield
Again, Mi Pad beats the Shield in nearly everything. If anything it makes the Shield look overpriced. For consumers chasing specs and bang for the buck, the Mi Pad is even better for less $. Unless one needs Stylus or PC Streaming, what's the killer stand out feature for the average consumer?
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toyota
Lifer
exaggerate much? the original Shield launched at 300 bucks so how is 360 bucks for Shield tablet and controller "double the price"? if anything this is a hell of deal compared to the original. you get a real 8 inch tablet with great specs that blow away trying to use a dinky 5 inch screen. you can then choose to use like a regular tablet or like the Shield setup by have the controller and putting the tablet right front of you.
I totally get that you are asking someone to sell the device, but you are all over the place with your arguments against. The Mi Pad does have an obviously better value - but will it be available in North America? If not, are you willing to go blind-turkey and having to deal with warranty hassle should your screen, power button, or battery fail? What about long term OTA update support? Will Xaomi be as committed as Nvidia to supporting their product? If it does come stateside, I'd love to see side-by-side comparisons on build quality. I won't agree the value on paper for the Mi Pad is substantially better.
If you just want to read, get a Kindle or Nook e-reader. That will be even more comfortable than the iPad mini, and cheaper. If you just want to surf the web, get a $100 tablet from Best Buy. If you aren't into tablet gaming, or high-quality streaming from PC to tablet/TV doesn't interest you, then that should really be the end of your participation and discussion about Shield Tablet.
RussianSensation
Elite Member
You finally hit the nail in the head. For example the average consumer will see an 8.4 inch 2560x1600 SuperAMOLED 6.6mm, 298 grams Samsung Tab S 8.4 and compare it to the Shield which is heavier, has worse screen, waaaaay thicker, lacks the prestigious Samsung brand. We also don't know how open will Nv be with upgrades to the OS but we know Samsung releases new versions.
http://www.phonearena.com/phones/Samsung-Galaxy-Tab-S-8.4_id8663
And then NV will have to compete with Samsung's multi-million dollar marketing machine:
http://www.phonearena.com/news/New-...suggest-your-tablets-LCD-screen-sucks_id58368
I commend Nv for trying but it is going to take a lot more than marketing this for gaming to get more than 5% global market share long term.
toyota
Lifer
what are you talking about? is this bizarro world day? devices using Nvidia always let you update to latest OS where I have never seen a Samsung device do so and I own Samsung phones and tablets.
and btw the way, the "average consumer" does not have a clue about specs or what they mean. and neither due most employees at stores that sell these type of products.
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He is not making any sense. Since when do tablet owners care first and foremost about reading e-books, when game purchases actually make up the biggest amount of revenues in the Google play store? And why would consumers cross shop between a $400 iOS tablet with no stylus support vs. a $300 Android tablet with stylus support and >2x faster graphics performance in comparison? And since when did Xiaomi start selling and targeting the North American market? If they did, I would seriously consider their tablet, but they are not doing so this year. As for the difference in weight and depth, my goodness, there is less than 10% difference between Mi Pad and Shield tablet! Talk about grasping for straws. And FWIW, a higher res screen is not always a better choice because platform power consumption is higher (all else equal) and gaming framerate at native panel res is lower and less smooth (all else equal).
If he can suggest a better pure Android tablet for $299 for the North American market based on technical merits, then he should do so, because otherwise he is just blowing hot air here.
If he can suggest a better pure Android tablet for $299 for the North American market based on technical merits, then he should do so, because otherwise he is just blowing hot air here.
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I'm not trying to minimize your argument, but that website doesn't have the correct specs. The tab 8.4 isn't as thin nor is it as light as the specs indicate on the site you provided.
http://www.samsung.com/us/mobile/galaxy-tab/SM-T320NZWAXAR
But again, if all you're doing is web browsing, then $20 more for this tablet might be what you want. Or perhaps a few $$$ more for an iPad mini. I personally really, really dislike Samsung's Android skins and would pay extra to NOT have their craptastic interface. If a person has Android gaming or PC streaming inclinations, then the Shield is a better tablet for that person.
Agreed here. I didn't say nor do I think the Shield tablet will sell tens of millions.
Gikaseixas
Platinum Member
Gameboy / PSP on the left and Ipad Air / Samsung Tab S on the right.
What i mean is that Nvidia wants to create something that appeals to different kind of audiences. This should give you outstanding performance for everyday tasks and at the same time provide a better than average gaming experience.
Marketing will dictate it's success IMO. Time will tell, let's see how Nvidia presents this to the public.
What i mean is that Nvidia wants to create something that appeals to different kind of audiences. This should give you outstanding performance for everyday tasks and at the same time provide a better than average gaming experience.
Marketing will dictate it's success IMO. Time will tell, let's see how Nvidia presents this to the public.
blackened23
Diamond Member
That's a fine tablet but it's also more expensive. Also, I really don't think NV is attempting to sell millions upon millions of tablets here. If they were, they would try to get a major design win such as the Google Nexus. By default, the Shield is not going to be a million unit mover, I think that's pretty obvious. I don't think NV has that capability since it is designed in house, and NV also mentioned that they changed their focus with the Tegra SOC during their last financials press conference: they're not creating it as a commodity level item. They're trying to get it into professional environments, automotive and all that sort of thing, for higher margins in areas that can leverage their graphics IP. Oh yeah, gaming. Seeing as most commodity level tablets don't really focus on gaming, that's probably why NV created the Shield 2..
Personally i'm not 100% sold on android gaming. Not yet. I can see android gaming being good in the coming years, but it's not quite there just yet. And I don't care that much. But the PC streaming feature is nice and this tablet is going to be a great one for the price. Even ignoring the gaming stuff, it's a good tablet judging by the specifications. I just don't see how you can continually bad mouth it when it is, in fact, a pretty darn good tablet for 300 bucks.
The nearest competition that I would consider relevant are the iPad mini (100$ more), iPad air (200$ more) and the Google Nexus 7 (50$ less, but smaller and has less features). Samsung also has some good stuff, but more pricey of course. I don't consider the Kindle tablet really in the same area since it is basically a thinly veiled amazon services device designed to sell amazon services and not a pure Android one. All considered the Shield II is a pretty darn good tablet for the price IMHO - hopefully we'll get reviews soon to see how the other metrics fare. I don't think it's going to be the BEST tablet, but it's going to be great for the price. I'll go ahead and say that I use my ipad air every day and I love it. I don't think any tablet ever will replace it anytime soon as a favorite - but if I want android, the shield II looks pretty darn good for 300 bucks. And since a lot of folks don't really care for iOS, I could see this being a viable alternative to some of the other tablets you mention. It's just not going to be a million unit mover though, I really don't see NV trying to overtake samsung or anything along those lines.
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Cloudfire777
Golden Member
So this was posted in Nvidia`s facebook page (UK) few days back.
Seems to be videocard related because they made a picture where it says "Nvidia Geforce GTX"....
Seems to be videocard related because they made a picture where it says "Nvidia Geforce GTX"....
There's "intended use", and then there's "what I want to do with it." eg, I don't use my other PS3 to play games with.
blackened23
Diamond Member
64 bit android does not yet exist. 64 bit ARM SOCs are still in the development stage as well. So to answer your question, the K1 is a 32 bit SOC and I understand the successor with the Denver CPU will be 64 bit. But this tablet i'm sure is 32 bit. There is no 64 bit android tablet at this time. Android 64 bit is not released yet and will not be released until this holiday season - it is available as a developer preview, but is not available. So, seeing as this tablet will be released soon, it will be 32 bit.
VulgarDisplay
Diamond Member
I really think its a mistake for nvidia to make these products to push their chip designs. They don't have the brand recognition in the mobile space for it to be worth their while. This may appeal to certain people on these forums who will buy anything nvidia puts a logo on, but the vast majority of people who know what nvidia even is (PC gamers) could care less about android gaming.
As a console I would rather run HDMI to my TV and get good games. As a tablet I would just buy cheap bang for the buck products because mobile chips and display tech are changing at such an alarming pace.
This will be another flop like the shield. They need to get out of the hardware market and put that effort into design wins. Better yet would be funding an actual triple a game ecosystem on tablets.
As a console I would rather run HDMI to my TV and get good games. As a tablet I would just buy cheap bang for the buck products because mobile chips and display tech are changing at such an alarming pace.
This will be another flop like the shield. They need to get out of the hardware market and put that effort into design wins. Better yet would be funding an actual triple a game ecosystem on tablets.
Grooveriding
Diamond Member
Except nvidia has no choice but to literally resort to making their own products to put Tegra chips in. They failed for years to get enough design wins to get it going and recently ended up leaving the smartphone market and pursuing 'high performance tablets and gaming devices'
The issue for them is there is no such market. Tablets and smartphones are not sold on hardware prowess. These are huge mass market items that near everyone buys. They are mostly sold on brand recognition and more as a fashion accessory than anything else. It's dominated by Apple and Samsung and some other smaller players like HTC. Nvidia has no brand recognition outside of PC gamers and professionals who use their pro cards. They command no premium even with the performance of their SOC, in fact, looking at this Shield tablet they are giving more hardware for less than the big players are because they have to.
If I cared about tablets I'd probably get one of these because of specs alone, but most people only care about seeing iPad or Galaxy on the box and have no inkling of what is under the hood beyond a 'retina display' which most don't likely know just means a high resolution.
A small number of PC gamers and tech geeks will get one of these and that will be it. The original Shield saw multiple price cuts and discount coupon deals and still has done poorly. Give it a bit and this tablet probably drops $100 over time. I think these are just products to try and dump the SOCs because no one is buying them.
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