The Real Lessons of the AMD's launch

[apoppin]

AMD *bungled* this launch and i feel bad for Barcelona if this is their MO
--there is NO 'excitement' for HD2900xt ...
. . . from studying the "attitude" of several forums ... especially this one ... AMD has indeed "failed" this launch

they have actually succeeded in pissing off their fans ... with their FUD ... their excuses and their delay ... where IS the "family"?
Even the reviewers have an "attitude" ... they are dismissing it and picking on faults [of course]

So ... since i do not have a HD2900xt ... i cannot conscientiously tell others to buy the damn thing

nothing has changed in my *feeling* for the product ... i still think it will be the eventual dark horse winner over the 640M GTS ... but i WILL feel bad i someone buys it and it is $100 cheaper next month ... which looks like where it is heading

therefore - except for this one - i am dropping out of r600 threads ... i am not now likely to get one but will observe reviews and trends ... and take notes ... much more quietly
[you can call me a fanboy behind my back now


... and i Hope to Hell that AMD learns something from this ... and can manage to pull off the next one MUCH better

it is mission critical that they Learn how to generate excitement for a really cool product

good luck AMD ... we all *need* you to do better

*UPDATE* Sapphire has a Brand-New "promotion"

what is it? well, it's called

***** GO Vertical with Vista! ************

what do you get?

maybe a single HD 2900xt ?
:Q

a brand new xfire system?
:shocked:

nope ... their brain dead PR decide that YOU would LOVE

What can I win?

A comprehensive performance package to push Vista - Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate Edition, AMD Athlon X2 5000+, Cooled by ZEROtherm BFT90. [/b]
great ... a dead end system with no mention of the HD2900xt


Sapphire is No1 AMD Graphics Partner

WtF are they thinking?
[nothing]


sign up to Wiiiiin:

http://www.sapphiretech.com/us/vista/



*i* could do waaay better

 

[Wreckage]

:disgust: :| :Q :frown: :heart: :brokenheart: :beer: :music: :wine: :lips: :camera: :gift:

:evil: :clock: :light: :sun: :moon: :roll: :laugh: :shocked: :thumbsup: :thumbsdown:

 

[apoppin]

awesome dude ... you made up for all the ones i thought of - but left out

i had to translate something for someone a few posts back ... and didn't ant to do it again

this took some soul searching
-a minute at least

i figured, if AMD can't do THEIR job - WtF should i volunteer to do it for them
and SHOW them how ?

i really DON'T care ... let it sort itself out without me

i'll pick something .. eventually ... it may well be the XT on a firesale

--or not

 

[apoppin]

maybe *massive rejection* is what they need

tough love

if they 'do' barcelona this way, forget it

 

[Paratus]

While this is the first launch of ATI/AMD the R600 is still very much an ATI chip and very similar to the R520 launch.

Our only hope, (on the GPU front) is that AMD cleans up ATIs act and they turn it around for the next launch.

I expect that Barcelona will be a strong competitor to C2D based Anands interviews with AMD folks and certain comments from Kyle over at [ H ]. So I'm not too worried on the CPU front.

What we really need is ATIs execution to be cleaned up.

 

[Bill Brasky]

I truly think that AMD could've avoided some of the bitter attitude by being more honest during the r600 delays. At least I'm a little bitter since they treated us like fools. Hello, AMD! We knew something was wrong...

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Paratus
While this is the first launch of ATI/AMD the R600 is still very much an ATI chip and very similar to the R520 launch.

Our only hope, (on the GPU front) is that AMD cleans up ATIs act and they turn it around for the next launch.

I expect that Barcelona will be a strong competitor to C2D based Anands interviews with AMD folks and certain comments from Kyle over at [ H ]. So I'm not too worried on the CPU front.

What we really need is ATIs execution to be cleaned up.

eXactly

but it isn't ATi's fault ... although i bet most of those 400 fired were from ATi PR and Marketing
*this* launch is ALL AMD ... kinda like the Sony PS3 launch where they ASSUMED their fans would "love" them again and rush out to buy armloads of product

these SoBs LIED to us ... for months
-they delayed the product and "spun" a tall tale about a "family launch" all the while saying there were no Hw problems

THEN Ruiz comes clean and expects all is forgiven ... i guess i forgave him ... but i was NEVER his fan ... not at all 'typical'

BASIC LESSON of marketing ... IF you don't have mega bucks like intel to blow on massive ads ... you must generate a "buzz" ... real excitement about upcoming product ... like for a GAME ... they release screenshots, videos, and EARLY REVIEWS ... people talk about it all over the forums - "i have the beta and it is AWESOME!"

AMD = Dead Silence ... they have a VERY NICE product ... but FAIL to tell us "why" we should buy it ... nevermind 'compel' someone to grab the CC and hold his breath as he types in his number

those morons should have had benches ... months ago ... in-depth PREreviews .. 'inside the architecture'

failure to launch ... just like the PS3 .. only IF AMD doesn't get into hi-gear correcting this - and i think they are too late - then they do have big discounts to give them some cash for the refresh

but if the excitement is weak . ... it won't succeed either ... and barcelona is in the same danger if AMD doesn't learn

seriously ... i could teach them something

 

[v8envy]

Well, the reviewers may not be in awe of the HD2900, the denizens of message boards aren't too enthusiastic, BUT!

Newegg is up to $430 for 3 versions of the HD2900. Other vendors are likewise raising prices over MSRP.

What does this tell us? The HD2900 is selling very well, at least today. *shrug*. Guess we geeks really are irrelevant.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: v8envy
Well, the reviewers may not be in awe of the HD2900, the denizens of message boards aren't too enthusiastic, BUT!

Newegg is up to $430 for 3 versions of the HD2900. Other vendors are likewise raising prices over MSRP.

What does this tell us? The HD2900 is selling very well, at least today. *shrug*. Guess we geeks really are irrelevant.

or the supply is not that good ... or the died-in-the-wool fans are buying them

i *hope* you are right


ANYWAY .. i am dropping out of the multi-threaded r600 debates

--perhaps later ... when my money is where my mouth is

 

[v8envy]

49 of the sapphire, 31 of the diamond and 86 of the HIS available at the moment. While typing this, two of the Sapphires sold -- at $30 over MSRP. So, it doesn't look like a supply issue, more of a demand one.

 

[TanisHalfElven]

Originally posted by: apoppin
AMD *bungled* this launch and i feel bad for Barcelona if this is their MO
--there is NO 'excitement' for HD2900xt ...
. . . from studying the "attitude" of several forums ... especially this one ... AMD has indeed "failed" this launch

they have actually succeeded in pissing off their fans ... with their FUD ... their excuses and their delay ... where IS the "family"?
Even the reviewers have an "attitude" ... they are dismissing it and picking on faults [of course]

So ... since i do not have a HD2900xt ... i cannot conscientiously tell others to buy the damn thing

nothing has changed in my *feeling* for the product ... i still think it will be the eventual dark horse winner over the 640M GTS ... but i WILL feel bad i someone buys it and it is $100 cheaper next month ... which looks like where it is heading

therefore - except for this one - i am dropping out of r600 threads ... i am not now likely to get one but will observe reviews and trends ... and take notes ... much more quietly
[you can call me a fanboy behind my back now


... and i Hope to Hell that AMD learns something from this ... and can manage to pull off the next one MUCH better

it is mission critical that they Learn how to generate excitement for a really cool product

good luck AMD ... we all *need* you to do better

what are you ?
some sort of forum celebrity whose endorsement is needed before a graphics card is used.

 

[apoppin]

if it were a total success - like the 8800 launch ... they'd be ALL sold out --by now

--like the Wii

did you notice a lack of positive *buzz* ?
for the last 9 months ...

 

[vaccarjm]

Originally posted by: v8envy
49 of the sapphire, 31 of the diamond and 86 of the HIS available at the moment. While typing this, two of the Sapphires sold -- at $30 over MSRP. So, it doesn't look like a supply issue, more of a demand one.

Its amazing how loyal people can be even after getting let down and kicked around.

 

[vaccarjm]

double post

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: tanishalfelven

Originally posted by: apoppin
AMD *bungled* this launch and i feel bad for Barcelona if this is their MO
--there is NO 'excitement' for HD2900xt ...
. . . from studying the "attitude" of several forums ... especially this one ... AMD has indeed "failed" this launch

they have actually succeeded in pissing off their fans ... with their FUD ... their excuses and their delay ... where IS the "family"?
Even the reviewers have an "attitude" ... they are dismissing it and picking on faults [of course]

So ... since i do not have a HD2900xt ... i cannot conscientiously tell others to buy the damn thing

nothing has changed in my *feeling* for the product ... i still think it will be the eventual dark horse winner over the 640M GTS ... but i WILL feel bad i someone buys it and it is $100 cheaper next month ... which looks like where it is heading

therefore - except for this one - i am dropping out of r600 threads ... i am not now likely to get one but will observe reviews and trends ... and take notes ... much more quietly
[you can call me a fanboy behind my back now


... and i Hope to Hell that AMD learns something from this ... and can manage to pull off the next one MUCH better

it is mission critical that they Learn how to generate excitement for a really cool product

good luck AMD ... we all *need* you to do better

what are you ?
some sort of forum celebrity whose endorsement is needed before a graphics card is used.

absolutely not ... i am doing exactly what 50 *other* posters are doing right now ... starting ANOTHER r600 thread ... don't like it? ... please don't draw attention to it

i have been active in many r600 threads . ... and i am tired of saying the same thing over and over ... and over again

so i am not going to be active in ANY HD2900xt threads ....

i am not going to recommend the card nor will i debate nvidia nor AMD fans about it ...
i am giving my final PoV before becoming active in OTHER issues

it isn't worth arguing over ... read the reviews and decide for yourself what you 'think' about HD2900XT

 

[Paratus]

The one hope I see in this series is in the low end for HTPCs. While thats a small market, a low wattage silent 99$ card that can completely run all HD formats with HDMI & Audio & HDCP is a very nice card regardless of performance.

(That still doesn't cover the old ATI launch day (or month ) shuffle)

 

[Pugnate]

OKaaay.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: tanishalfelven

Originally posted by: apoppin
AMD *bungled* this launch and i feel bad for Barcelona if this is their MO
--there is NO 'excitement' for HD2900xt ...
. . . from studying the "attitude" of several forums ... especially this one ... AMD has indeed "failed" this launch

they have actually succeeded in pissing off their fans ... with their FUD ... their excuses and their delay ... where IS the "family"?
Even the reviewers have an "attitude" ... they are dismissing it and picking on faults [of course]

So ... since i do not have a HD2900xt ... i cannot conscientiously tell others to buy the damn thing

nothing has changed in my *feeling* for the product ... i still think it will be the eventual dark horse winner over the 640M GTS ... but i WILL feel bad i someone buys it and it is $100 cheaper next month ... which looks like where it is heading

therefore - except for this one - i am dropping out of r600 threads ... i am not now likely to get one but will observe reviews and trends ... and take notes ... much more quietly
[you can call me a fanboy behind my back now


... and i Hope to Hell that AMD learns something from this ... and can manage to pull off the next one MUCH better

it is mission critical that they Learn how to generate excitement for a really cool product

good luck AMD ... we all *need* you to do better

what are you ?
some sort of forum celebrity whose endorsement is needed before a graphics card is used.

Oh stop it.. It's kind of cute.

Oh, apoppin. Make sure that when you buy your 2900XT, you give it at least a week to tell us all how great it is. (hope you get the joke).

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: vaccarjm

Originally posted by: v8envy
49 of the sapphire, 31 of the diamond and 86 of the HIS available at the moment. While typing this, two of the Sapphires sold -- at $30 over MSRP. So, it doesn't look like a supply issue, more of a demand one.

Its amazing how loyal people can be even after getting let down and kicked around.

I say God bless 'em!!! The more they buy, the more money AMD makes. And the more money AMD makes, the longer they'll stay in biz. Good for us. If it takes blind/deaf/dumb/mutant zealots (talking price/performance/downsides for 2900) to keep AMD's high end graphics biz in shape, then by all means. If I were a bit richer, I'd buy one myself. Just for the "dark-horse" factor I heard about somewhere.

 

[v8envy]

Originally posted by: Paratus
The one hope I see in this series is in the low end for HTPCs. While thats a small market, a low wattage silent 99$ card that can completely run all HD formats with HDMI & Audio & HDCP is a very nice card regardless of performance.

(That still doesn't cover the old ATI launch day (or month ) shuffle)

Homebrew DVRs are a small segment compared to everything else -- gaming, mobile, video encoding on the desktop, etc. If there was a profitable market for this niche it'd be better served by dedicated video playback hardware vs. coopting gaming hardware.

Plus you have to lop off the fairly sizeable portion of homebrew DVRs running mythtv. There is no support for video playback acceleration for any ATI card, and no support for the HD series at all at the moment. There have been 100% reporoduceable video overlay bugs for ATI cards for years now. Heck, supporting accelerated video playback is a low priority for the nvidia guys for their 8 series cards, which just shows you how small the HTPC market is.

So in summary, I don't think homebrew DVRs will impact DAAMIT's bottom line nearly as much as a competitive mainstream gaming card would.

 

[Gstanfor]

nothing has changed in my *feeling* for the product ... i still think it will be the eventual dark horse winner over the 640M GTS

Look, there is no use in having features like a Tesselator, Programmable AA etc available if the dominant API does not make use of them at this point in time, or in the near (within product lifespan) future.

All they have done is complicate R600 unnecessarily. Such things are in the future of directx for sure, just not right now and not within R600's useful lifespan. Had the transistors spent of this stuff been used for ROPS and texturing units instead, G80 may have faced formidable opposition.

 

[imported_thefonz]

wtf do you need hype/excitement to sell a video card?

It's about performance and it performs well in its price bracket, along with 3 good games. And if it is $100 cheaper in a month as you predict I will defiantly be picking 1 up.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Gstanfor

nothing has changed in my *feeling* for the product ... i still think it will be the eventual dark horse winner over the 640M GTS

Look, there is no use in having features like a Tesselator, Programmable AA etc available if the dominant API does not make use of them at this point in time, or in the near (within product lifespan) future.

All they have done is complicate R600 unnecessarily. Such things are in the future of directx for sure, just not right now and not within R600's useful lifespan. Had the transistors spent of this stuff been used for ROPS and texturing units instead, G80 may have faced formidable opposition.

i'm NOT debating you on this Gstanfor

i *still* think AMD has a very nice product that competes very well with it's target
- you know this ... i have given umpteen reasons why ... already

you are entitled to you PoV as i am to mine ... i will not attempt to *convince* you - if that were even humanly possible .. short of at shotgun point or with wads of cash

so i will just say

*time will tell*



... and yeah, Keys ... i'll at least take the wrapper off, plug it in and boot it up ...
run a couple of games and 3DMarkXX ... THEN post all about it

 

[Gstanfor]

so i will just say

*time will tell*

You are right, these features will become a standard part of the 3D toolkit (perhaps not in their current form though) - eventually, and when there is explicit API support for them, not before.

Unfortunately the R600 will be far from top of the line when this occurs.

ATi may believe they can get some mileage out of xenos ports - nvidia thought the same thing with nv3x...

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: thefonz
wtf do you need hype/excitement to sell a video card?

It's about performance and it performs well in its price bracket, along with 3 good games. And if it is $100 cheaper in a month as you predict I will defiantly be picking 1 up.

when it's a "hundred dollars cheaper in a month" ... AMD has no profit margin ... the Parners make no money ...

... and glad you asked about hype/excitement

think of how the Publishers/devs "presell' a game ...

first they let everyone know they are 'working' on something NEW ... few tidbits

as it nears alpha ... and into Beta, they post screen shots ... they have videos ... they have interviews and we learn something about the game ... then there are the *beta testers* who say "my god, i can't say much but this GAME is AWESOME" ... then there are Previews and FINALLY ... reviews and it launches to great sales as the *buzz* goes out that it is a GREAT game

with AMD ... we had silence and FUD and obvious lies ... and delay and more lies and fud and spin ... then a *confirmed* launch that got canceled ... and more delays, lies and FUD

pretty hard to get a *buzz* going with that one, eh?

they said almost nothing about the architecture, there were no previews worth looking, no leaked benches ... just pics of a foot-long fire-breathing monster was supposed to be the "finished product"

and a Product Launch in Tunis for the Journalists that was a PR DISASTER ...
--then DT comes along with a horrible "review" that shows r600 to be a PoS
[i guess they weren't on the guest list]

and still, *nothing* from AMD ... and that G-D NDA was the most stupid thing i have EVER seen ... nobody cared about it ... except the people who might like the card were forced to be quiet by AMD's lawyers

*everything* was NEGATIVE ... right UP till the day of the launch

it is like having a *bad taste* in you mouth before you write a restaurant review

that's a D- in my book for a launch ... still B+ for the product, though