The new evil... pizza and corproations

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: glutenberg

Originally posted by: Vic
Which is worse? Feeding kids pizza or cutting PE classes and not letting kids run during recess?

This whole thread has the usual P&N bi-polar stupidity.


edit:

Originally posted by: Genx87
She should turn her attention to what state run schools offer in the lunch room if she is really worried about nutrtion. But I have a feeling this is another big govt type attacking business.

When I was a kid in the 70s and 80s, school lunches considered ketchup to be a vegetable. Has that even changed? But woops, pay no attention to the hypocrisy behind the curtain!

Are there any statistics out there showing that kids aren't allowed to run around during recess? The schools where I grew up and where I currently live have kids running around playing basketball, handball, tag, tetherball along with playing on the jungle gyms and other such typical playground activities.

I will say, though, that the food that's being offered is still generally not very adequate (some sort of junk entree with milk and a cup of fruit soaked in syrup). I don't think that the school's inadequacies in offering a balanced lunch for students should open up the door to offering even worse food for children.

Check your middle and high schools. You will find outside of 1 gym class requirement over a 4-6 year period. There is no more recess.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
But here's something to chew on (besides your fat-laden pizza, that is), at least government can claim to be looking out for people's best interests, whereas corporations can hardly make the same claim.

Haha, that's funny. Government is looking out for people's best interests? Fcking hilarious!

I'll give you a hint. Government looks out for governments best interests, just like a corporation does. Why? They're both comprised of people. People who look out for their own interests above those of others. You fools who believe government is some benevolent force which only exists for the good of the governed are severely deluded.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Vic
The point is that Pizza Hut is probably of a better nutritional value than what's on the school lunch menu. And PE classes were cut due to budget constraints, even though this year's budget is larger than last year's. Those evil corporations, it's all their fault that kids are so fat!! :|

:roll:

What are you talking about? MN has seen massive budget cuts in education, at least according to the teach unions. We only expanded education spending by 35% over the past 6 years when they wanted 70%. Dont you see where the cuts are?

Better cut out the last gym requirement in lieu of a 6th principal at 100K+ because we cant afford it.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: glutenberg
Are there any statistics out there showing that kids aren't allowed to run around during recess? The schools where I grew up and where I currently live have kids running around playing basketball, handball, tag, tetherball along with playing on the jungle gyms and other such typical playground activities.

I will say, though, that the food that's being offered is still generally not very adequate (some sort of junk entree with milk and a cup of fruit soaked in syrup). I don't think that the school's inadequacies in offering a balanced lunch for students should open up the door to offering even worse food for children.

Read this recent thread.

That's just the tip of the iceberg.

And while you're correct that 2 wrongs don't make a right, you are incorrect that Pizza Hut pizza would be "even worse food." School lunches are barely above prison food in quality.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDocThe threshold for how often an adult should eat junk food is ZERO.

Oh look, a health nazi. I'm shocked. :roll:

 

[glutenberg]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Check your middle and high schools. You will find outside of 1 gym class requirement over a 4-6 year period. There is no more recess.

My middle and high schools offer two break periods (one 15 minute, one 10 minute) along with a 40 minute lunch. In both middle and high school, you go through 2 years and 4 years of PE (or if you play a particular sport in high school, you can bypass that requirement). The PE course spans from footbal to soccer to track and field to basketball. In middle school, PE class required us to run about a mile every other day and a mile and half on every other Friday (this is still in effect as my cousins attend my middle and high school).

During lunch, kids have the option to play tennis, basketball, handball, or pretty much anything else they want. Neither of the schools are or were private schools. Just public schools in Southern California.

Lastly, I don't know if my definition of addiction is vastly different from the worlds and I doubt you would either.

 

[glutenberg]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: glutenberg
Are there any statistics out there showing that kids aren't allowed to run around during recess? The schools where I grew up and where I currently live have kids running around playing basketball, handball, tag, tetherball along with playing on the jungle gyms and other such typical playground activities.

I will say, though, that the food that's being offered is still generally not very adequate (some sort of junk entree with milk and a cup of fruit soaked in syrup). I don't think that the school's inadequacies in offering a balanced lunch for students should open up the door to offering even worse food for children.

Read this recent thread.

That's just the tip of the iceberg.

And while you're correct that 2 wrongs don't make a right, you are incorrect that Pizza Hut pizza would be "even worse food." School lunches are barely above prison food in quality.

I guess my schools were just good for their times. There were always healthy alternatives that were offered at my schools though there were also the unhealthy foods there.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Genx87
Check your middle and high schools. You will find outside of 1 gym class requirement over a 4-6 year period. There is no more recess.

Yep. There barely is PE at my local schools anymore. Yet when I was in school, daily PE was a requirement for every single year but my senior year in high school, and I took it for that year anyway as an elective.

Nutrition is only one half of the health equation. Without a proper exercise and fitness routine, you're still not going to be healthy no matter how well you eat. And OTOH, if you do have a proper fitness routine, then you can easily afford to indulge in the occasional junk food and still remain healthy.
And I'm a freakin' health nut, people. I know what I'm talking about. I watch what I eat and hit the gym 5 days a week.

 

[shrumpage]

My daughter has earned a couple of pizza's through this program.

At most a child can get one pizza a month, and it is a personal pan. Not sure about other people but we don't go out to eat all the time or have pizza all the time so a kid having a pizza hut pizza once a month (and bringing the family along) isn't going to turn them into a fatty.

 

[glutenberg]

Originally posted by: shrumpage
My daughter has earned a couple of pizza's through this program.

At most a child can get one pizza a month, and it is a personal pan. Not sure about other people but we don't go out to eat all the time or have pizza all the time so a kid having a pizza hut pizza once a month (and bringing the family along) isn't going to turn them into a fatty.

You don't find it sad that children have to be bribed to read these days?

 

[shrumpage]

Originally posted by: glutenberg

Originally posted by: shrumpage
My daughter has earned a couple of pizza's through this program.

At most a child can get one pizza a month, and it is a personal pan. Not sure about other people but we don't go out to eat all the time or have pizza all the time so a kid having a pizza hut pizza once a month (and bringing the family along) isn't going to turn them into a fatty.

You don't find it sad that children have to be bribed to read these days?

You can argue that i am bribed to go to work every day, but i prefer looking at the paycheck as something i earn.

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
But here's something to chew on (besides your fat-laden pizza, that is), at least government can claim to be looking out for people's best interests, whereas corporations can hardly make the same claim.

Haha, that's funny. Government is looking out for people's best interests? Fcking hilarious!

I'll give you a hint. Government looks out for governments best interests, just like a corporation does. Why? They're both comprised of people. People who look out for their own interests above those of others. You fools who believe government is some benevolent force which only exists for the good of the governed are severely deluded.

Interesting that you have so much distrust of gov't, yet have no such distrust of corporations. IMHO, we should have a healthy distrust of both. And yet, I still see more motive for gov't to act in a benevolent way and no such motive for corporations. One could argue that seat-belt laws or helmet laws are stupid gov't invasion of our personal choices, etc., but how many people are still alive after an accident because of them?

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: Vic
The point is that Pizza Hut is probably of a better nutritional value than what's on the school lunch menu. And PE classes were cut due to budget constraints, even though this year's budget is larger than last year's. Those evil corporations, it's all their fault that kids are so fat!! :|

:roll:

Why do you insist on mixing up these issues? Of course kids should be encouraged to exercise and be physically fit, no question. Of course we should try and make kid's lunches more nutritious. Up until you introduced those two topics, however we were discussing this Pizza Hut program specifically.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
But here's something to chew on (besides your fat-laden pizza, that is), at least government can claim to be looking out for people's best interests, whereas corporations can hardly make the same claim.

Haha, that's funny. Government is looking out for people's best interests? Fcking hilarious!

I'll give you a hint. Government looks out for governments best interests, just like a corporation does. Why? They're both comprised of people. People who look out for their own interests above those of others. You fools who believe government is some benevolent force which only exists for the good of the governed are severely deluded.

Oversimplification from the six year old wing.

Government absolutely looks out for the public interest - to the extent that the public elects people who have that agenda. The problem is far less government looking out for "government's" interest than looking out for special interests, mostly corporate, who have made money too big a part of getting elected. So, sometimes govenment looks out for the public interest - consider the seat belt laws - and others for private interests against the public - consider the ban on price negotiation in the medicare drug bill.

Similarly, corporations sometimes work in the public interest - say, when they make the car with the seat belt above - and others, in their private interest against the public interest - say, when they are polluting public lands if they can get away with it because it's cheaper for them to put the cost of their industry's pollution onto the public.

Other times it's a mix - selling cigarettes can be spun as both terrible for the public and 'providing a service giving the people what they are asking for'; then again, they're doing even more wrong when they have used nicotine carefully for addiction, lied about it, and marketed to children because they need to to get them hooked later as adults.

But the ideology expressed by bobberfelt is anti-democracy, anti-American, pro-fascist.

The very idea of democracy is to put the power historically held by warlords and kings into the hands of the people through elected representatives (the only way any real democracy has been implemented at a national level, before someone brings up the 'republic' nit picking, democracy includes republics). Bobberfelt is doing nothing less than denying any value to the entire idea of democracy, claiming it's equally 'corrupt' to the private sector.

Why even have elections at all then, Bobberfelt, simply let the rich and corporations operate without any laws and oversite from the public through government.

This post of his illustrates the radical, nonsensical, anti-democracy ideology these people buy into without even realizing it as they wave flags and scream "DEMOCRACY!!!"

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: cwjerome

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Wow, venture into hyperbole much? Quite obviously, you're over-reacting to this whole thing. No one is telling these kids that they cannot eat pizza. Obviously they're free to eat whatever crap they want on their own time, however not "rewarding" kids for reading with a fat-laden pizza is not about restricting their choice, rather its an attempt to teach by example. Obesity and diabetes among school-age children is an epidemic in this country.

I can think of about a dozen rewards for reading that don't involve eating anything whatsoever. How about if the kids meet their reading goals, they get to go on a field trip to a local museum? Or how about allowing them a "DVD day" where the kids can choose an age-appropriate/school-appropriate movie to watch one day a month in class if they meet their goals?

Seems like the only whiny pussies are the ones in here bitching and moaning about a whole lot of nothing.

A whole lot of nothing? You mean we're defending a reading programs against a bunch of food-nazis, and WE'RE the one bitching and moaning?? :roll: You never cease to amaze me with your spins. LOL, you say we're over-reacting and then warn us that obesity and diabetes is epidemic in our young... ban the evil pizza reward!

If Pizza Hut wants to do it, the school wants to do it, and the parents want to do it, them let them eat a freakin pizza every once in a while.

Sure, they're free to do whatever they want, but that doesn't make them immune from criticism. The bottom line is that an ever-increasing number of kids are fat and diagnosed with type II diabetes and here you are insisting that they get their fat-laden snacks instead of trying to do something about the problem.

 

[glutenberg]

Originally posted by: shrumpage

Originally posted by: glutenberg

Originally posted by: shrumpage
My daughter has earned a couple of pizza's through this program.

At most a child can get one pizza a month, and it is a personal pan. Not sure about other people but we don't go out to eat all the time or have pizza all the time so a kid having a pizza hut pizza once a month (and bringing the family along) isn't going to turn them into a fatty.

You don't find it sad that children have to be bribed to read these days?

You can argue that i am bribed to go to work every day, but i prefer looking at the paycheck as something i earn.

Point taken. It's open season for bribery! Come get yours before we're all out!

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey

Originally posted by: Vic
The point is that Pizza Hut is probably of a better nutritional value than what's on the school lunch menu. And PE classes were cut due to budget constraints, even though this year's budget is larger than last year's. Those evil corporations, it's all their fault that kids are so fat!! :|

:roll:

Why do you insist on mixing up these issues? Of course kids should be encouraged to exercise and be physically fit, no question. Of course we should try and make kid's lunches more nutritious. Up until you introduced those two topics, however we were discussing this Pizza Hut program specifically.

I'm not mixing up any issues. You're oversimplifying a complex problem in order fearmonger the classic corporate scapegoat. My argument is that if you really did give a sh!t about the children like you pretend to, you'd widen your scope to the larger picture and the bigger problem, instead of looking for easy scapegoats to pick on.

 

[fskimospy]

Lets be honest here. How many pizzas is the average kid really eating because of the books he read? In addition, its not like he's eating these pizzas instead of that Delicious Nutritious dinner that I'm sure his mom had prepared a lot of the time.

Kids don't get fat in lurches... they get steadily fat based on a lifetime of inactivity and high calorie foods. The presence or absence of book pizza won't do much to change that. You have to encourage them to change their lifestyle, and people that have the lifestyle to become fat will do so with our without Pizza Hut's help.

One other thing, is anyone really surprised that Pizza Hut is giving away pizza for reading? I mean.. it's a pretty naked marketing ploy. What did you expect them to do?

PS. Of course corporations are self absorbed sociopathic institutions, that's what we created them to be. They create great wealth.. and they can also create great harm. It's like an axe. It can be used to cut wood to heat your house, or it can be used to chop someone's head off. They are not good or evil but tools, and it is how we use them that is important.

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: DealMonkey

Originally posted by: Vic
The point is that Pizza Hut is probably of a better nutritional value than what's on the school lunch menu. And PE classes were cut due to budget constraints, even though this year's budget is larger than last year's. Those evil corporations, it's all their fault that kids are so fat!! :|

:roll:

Why do you insist on mixing up these issues? Of course kids should be encouraged to exercise and be physically fit, no question. Of course we should try and make kid's lunches more nutritious. Up until you introduced those two topics, however we were discussing this Pizza Hut program specifically.

I'm not mixing up any issues. You're oversimplifying a complex problem in order fearmonger the classic corporate scapegoat. My argument is that if you really did give a sh!t about the children like you pretend to, you'd widen your scope to the larger picture and the bigger problem, instead of looking for easy scapegoats to pick on.

I'm not fear-mongering, I'm simply pointing out that it sends the wrong message and teaches by poor example. I think you'd find if you started a thread entitled, "We need to step up and get school kids to exercise and overhaul their lunch programs with healthy foods," that I'd sign on and attach my name to that worthy cause as well.

 

[Train]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Interesting that you have so much distrust of gov't, yet have no such distrust of corporations. IMHO, we should have a healthy distrust of both.

Maybe because if a corporation does a ****** job it usually loses its funding (its customers go elsewhere) whereas if a govt does a ****** job they still get paid the same, which is usually why the govt sucks compared to corps.

And yet, I still see more motive for gov't to act in a benevolent way and no such motive for corporations.

such as?

One could argue that seat-belt laws or helmet laws are stupid gov't invasion of our personal choices, etc., but how many people are still alive after an accident because of them?

Why is it I am reminded so often of the movie "Demolition Man" when I read this forum?

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Shivetya

Originally posted by: sandorski
Have Schools improved with Government Funding?

fixed it

Good point. Although at one time Government Funding certainly did improve Schools. Perhaps something else is wrong with the Schools besides the Funding source? I just think that Corporate Funding just adds another layer of distraction and beurocracy(sp) into Schools.

 

[fornax]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Playboy is considered obscene, not in the same ball park as food. We reserve the right to view that material to adults.
Cigarettes as I am told by every lawyer and do gooder is addictive and causes cancer from direct use and secondary use. Again not in the same ball park as eating pizza after reading a book.

I'd say the benfits are the kids actuallly read. Clearly our public institutions are not upto even this most basic task.

Nope, Playboy is not considered obscene. If it were, you won't be able to buy it openly or subscribe for it.

Absolutely, there is the benefit that kids read. The question, as several people mentioned already, is: should we award good behavior with bad food? We took a perfectly good, nutritional food (Italian pizza is made with not that much cheese, a lot of vegetables, and sometimes Proscuito) and turned it into a fat-loaded, artery-clogging piece of junk. Many pizzas sold here also have partially-hydrogenated oils, for which the safe amount is zero.

 

[LumbergTech]

there is some point to both sides of this..

on the one hand, we can and should be able to eat whatever we want, even if it isnt the healthiest..

on the other hand, if you think for a minute that this book it program is not mostly motivated by the fact that the adults will purchase a pizza of their own when they go to get the bookit reward, you are quite naive..

I do have a problem with corporate sponsors to schools
i dont like corporate sponsors in government either..

I don't really believe that bookit is actually helping to create educated individuals either..

my school hosted reading competitions and also the local library did a similar thing in which you could win prizes (not corporate sponsored prizes)

some corporations are ok, but i dont feel comfortable with letting them sponsor my children in a way that promotes a lifetime purchasing of a product which is probably one of the least healthy variations of a group of competitors. (i refer to the pan pizza particularly)

 

[cwjerome]

Originally posted by: glutenberg

Originally posted by: shrumpage
My daughter has earned a couple of pizza's through this program.

At most a child can get one pizza a month, and it is a personal pan. Not sure about other people but we don't go out to eat all the time or have pizza all the time so a kid having a pizza hut pizza once a month (and bringing the family along) isn't going to turn them into a fatty.

You don't find it sad that children have to be bribed to read these days?

You're right... incentives in education are very VERY sad :roll:

Give me a break. This is really starting to look like a bunch of whiny, cynical leftwingers who just can't control their cynical suspicion and deep hatred for big business.

 

[cwjerome]

Originally posted by: LumbergTech
there is some point to both sides of this..

on the one hand, we can and should be able to eat whatever we want, even if it isnt the healthiest..

on the other hand, if you think for a minute that this book it program is not mostly motivated by the fact that the adults will purchase a pizza of their own when they go to get the bookit reward, you are quite naive..

I do have a problem with corporate sponsors to schools
i dont like corporate sponsors in government either..

I don't really believe that bookit is actually helping to create educated individuals either..

my school hosted reading competitions and also the local library did a similar thing in which you could win prizes (not corporate sponsored prizes)

some corporations are ok, but i dont feel comfortable with letting them sponsor my children in a way that promotes a lifetime purchasing of a product which is probably one of the least healthy variations of a group of competitors. (i refer to the pan pizza particularly)

Target has a program that returns money to schools. A large grocery chain in Phoenix wants kids to collect cereal boxtops so their school can receive things like benches or swings. Those companies are looking to create a name image and get people to shop at their stores... so what exactly is wrong with that?

Apparently to the liberal mindset, a lot. For them, private business is a negative force that cynically manipulates people. Government on the other hand is never cynical and never manipulates... they are the all-knowing all-caring experts that we must all follow lock-step.