The Kickstarter for "Takedown" has reached its goal, and is now being funded!

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Sulaco

Diamond Member
Mar 28, 2003
3,825
46
91
Nothing wrong with looking forward to them, but they aren't tactical shooters.

This x1000.

For the record, I LOVED R6 Vegas. Some of the best co-op firefights I've ever had. That said, I hated that they used the Rainbow Six moniker for it, since I knew the series would never be the same after that.

Once you begin using health regeneration, any claims to being a "tactical shooter" go totally out the window. It's as much a tactical, realistic shooter as the SP campaign of a CoD game.
 

Dkcode

Senior member
May 1, 2005
995
0
0
It's all in the website if you take the time to read it.

Yeah I should have read the website, I just chucked $15 in and left it.

Anyway I backed another $15, its great that it exceeded the minimum amount in such a short space of time.
 

Zargon

Lifer
Nov 3, 2009
12,218
2
76
I was a bit suspicious as to how it managed to skyrocket in the last few hours, so I looked around a bit. The reason? Turns out Notch tweeted it. :D Notch tweets something, and thousands of dollars roll in. Makes sense. (Not that I'm complaining at all)

I backed $75, which is certainly more then I spend on an average game, but I'm getting a downloadable copy, as well as a DRM-free boxed copy, a t-shirt, my name in the credits, etc, etc.

Now let's just hope they deliver a good product. I'm quite confident that they will.

nice. I upped from 50 to 75 yesterday morning.

I really wanted to spend a 100, but I couldnt think of any way to justify it
 

obidamnkenobi

Golden Member
Sep 16, 2010
1,407
423
136
wow, I was totally surprised when I got the email that this was funded! Checked earlier in the day and it was $30k shy with 5 hrs to go or something.. Crazy.

I'm still don't have much hope that anything will come out of this though, and consider my $15 basically lost.
 

Dankk

Diamond Member
Jul 7, 2008
5,558
25
91
I'm still don't have much hope that anything will come out of this though, and consider my $15 basically lost.

I wouldn't be so pessimistic. Chris Allen is an experienced designer with a big history, and from what I see, everything looks like a go. Consider for a moment that if the game didn't get made, it would absolutely destroy his reputation, and it would destroy Kickstarter's reputation as well. People would begin questioning using Kickstarter for projects that have no guarantee of being completed because they'd remember "the project that didn't deliver, when people got burned".

He also posted an update late last night after the Kickstarter succeeded: http://www.serellan.com/forums/index.php?/topic/319-follow-up-the-next-week/

I think he's a little irritated that people keep saying he's looking for publishers, which he's not. He's looking for investors. Publishers =/= investors. He's clearly said over and over again that he will NOT be signing on with a company like EA, Ubisoft, or Activision.
 
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obidamnkenobi

Golden Member
Sep 16, 2010
1,407
423
136
I wouldn't be so pessimistic. Chris Allen is an experienced designer with a big history, and from what I see, everything looks like a go. Consider for a moment that if the game didn't get made, it would absolutely destroy his reputation, and it would destroy Kickstarter's reputation as well. People would begin questioning using Kickstarter for projects that have no guarantee of being completed because they'd remember "the project that didn't deliver, when people got burned".

well, one project is bound to be the first one that happens to. (And I think that has already happened to some other projects anyway).

I'd love a R6 like game as much as everyone else here, but when they struggled this much to even get 5500 people to pitch in just $15 I just think it's hard to convince investors you can make a game that you can sell for $40+ to a few hundred thousand people. (I have no idea how much it costs to make R6, but imagine at least a few million dollars).
 

Nintendesert

Diamond Member
Mar 28, 2010
7,761
5
0
I don't get Kickstarter, so if someone kicked in 15 bucks, is there some return on their investment?
 

Dankk

Diamond Member
Jul 7, 2008
5,558
25
91
I don't get Kickstarter, so if someone kicked in 15 bucks, is there some return on their investment?

Strictly speaking, no. Indie developers and other creators put their projects up on Kickstarter to get crowdsourced funding from the community, rather than going to big publishers or corporations. This way, indies can create products that wouldn't otherwise be possible or financially viable.

If someone posts a project on Kickstarter with, say, a $100,000 goal, and the project meets that goal, then it shows there's a demand for that project, and the creator ends up recieving all of that money so he can actually make it happen. Usually the creator has to be credible and accountable enough for backers to actually donate money, so the product can be made.

But! That doesn't mean "Well crap, I've already donated $25 on Kickstarter to make this product happen, and now I have to spend another $60 retail price when it's actually released." That's usually not the case at all. With most Kickstarter projects, the norm is to give the product for free to people who pledged a certain amount of money, so once they've pledged, they've already secured their order for the product.

With Takedown, every supporter who donated at least $15 will be receiving a digital copy of the game... period. People who donated more money will be getting even cooler stuff. Because I supported at the $75 level, I will be getting a digital download of the game, AND a boxed DRM-free copy, AND a t-shirt.

Even better is the fact that Takedown will probably cost more than $15 when it is released in retail (think $50 or $60, average price for a new game). So when you backed the game on Kickstarter for $15, then you essentially just scored a huge discount on an AAA title when it releases. That's your reward. The prizes you get for donating might be considered an "ROI" so to speak. :)

well, one project is bound to be the first one that happens to. (And I think that has already happened to some other projects anyway).

I'd love a R6 like game as much as everyone else here, but when they struggled this much to even get 5500 people to pitch in just $15 I just think it's hard to convince investors you can make a game that you can sell for $40+ to a few hundred thousand people. (I have no idea how much it costs to make R6, but imagine at least a few million dollars).

That's an understandable concern, but considering how transparent Chris Allen has been about it (not just on the KS page, but on the forums and with the rest of the community) I'm convinced it looks really solid. A couple things:

1) Before the Kickstarter even met it's goal, Chris specifically said "We have VC investors who are automatically prepared to fund us if we reach the $200,000 goal." Or something to that extent. Keyword being VC investors, NOT publishers. VC investors fund the game and get a cut when it releases, but have no say in the design or the product itself... which is absolutely critical so the developers have full creative control. (No "dumbing down" to worry about)

2) Apparently the Kickstarter has gained him attention from even more investors than before. From the update he posted last night, next week he'll be flying all over the country and having meetings with a ton of different people.

*shrug*
 
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KaOTiK

Lifer
Feb 5, 2001
10,877
8
81
I don't get Kickstarter, so if someone kicked in 15 bucks, is there some return on their investment?

No, there are different level of rewards. Each projects rewards and price level is up to the project that is putting it up.

For games that we've seen thus far, it seems the first level of reward is a digital copy of the game itself. So in essence you are doing a preorder for the game way in advance to actually fund the games development. Other reward tiers offer other stuff, all depends on what the project putting the kickstarter up sets stuff at.
 

Dankk

Diamond Member
Jul 7, 2008
5,558
25
91
Well, it's been a little over a year, and I now have an early alpha copy of Takedown: Red Sabre sitting in my Steam library.

Did anyone else here get an early access code? They started rolling out alpha keys to backers over the past couple weeks... supposedly starting with the biggest backers, and then trickling down to the smaller tiers. I just got my key today but I won't be able to try it until I get home from work.
 

pontifex

Lifer
Dec 5, 2000
43,804
46
91
got my code also. i was on the lowest tier that got a copy of the game with your donation.

downloading now. looking forward to playing it!


dang, it's hard by yourself! there's not much you can edit right now and you have to do direct ip connections to join a game, which is going to be hard to do unless you have friends who also have it.
 
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Bateluer

Lifer
Jun 23, 2001
27,730
8
0
I'd glad they got their funding, but even though its not my type of game, I think it'll get lost in the cookie cutter Call of Duty/Halo/Battlefield shooters that flood the channels annually. :(
 

pontifex

Lifer
Dec 5, 2000
43,804
46
91
I'd glad they got their funding, but even though its not my type of game, I think it'll get lost in the cookie cutter Call of Duty/Halo/Battlefield shooters that flood the channels annually. :(

they're not trying to compete with those games. they made this game because they are tired of those games and want something more tactical, not a run and gun shooter. the way people here complain about CoD, it seems like this game would be right up their alley.
 

pontifex

Lifer
Dec 5, 2000
43,804
46
91
Game released today...and it's shit...

I have not had much luck with new games lately...RoTT was terrible at launch although they seemed to have fixed it so at least it's playable now.

this feels like an alpha version for Takedown.

Can't save load outs, movement is clunky, AI is super dumb (stands there and does nothing) or super hard (super accurate accurate). No specific graphics customization, just low, medium, or high. lots of people complaining about MP (Can;t join, get kicked out, no admin options, etc). They even fucked up the DLC, you can;t enter the code (they are sending a text file or something that you will add to the game folder to unlock it????).
 
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Zargon

Lifer
Nov 3, 2009
12,218
2
76
dang.

hopefully the core game is good and the rest gets ironed out

it is a really REALLY small team
 

obidamnkenobi

Golden Member
Sep 16, 2010
1,407
423
136
So...? This is kinda a mess?
I backed it and forgot I did. Realized I don't really feel like, or have time to play it so regretted it a bit, but whatever. I'll be more careful about my kickstarters from now on.

Got the steam key and downloaded but haven't tried it out yet. Best to just wait? Guess I can give it 20 min and see for myself.
 

Dankk

Diamond Member
Jul 7, 2008
5,558
25
91
The biggest concern I have right now is that the game just feels very feature-incomplete. At it's core, the gameplay is pretty good (if meager). But I was under the impression there would be more planning options and organization during briefing before the mission actually starts, and more tools for coordination. You can choose your insertion point, and of course your loadout, but that's as far as you can go.

I think they're going to patch in more features and fix the bugs over time, but the whole "release now and patch later" mentality is really bad. They could have staved off a lot of criticism by releasing it as an Early Access title, but they didn't.
 

Stringjam

Golden Member
Jun 30, 2011
1,871
33
91
A game like this needs:

1. Superior weapons handling and movement mechanics

2. Advanced AI behaviors


It would appear this game has neither. It is very clunky. The transition to optics is basically a circle in the middle of the screen surrounded by black. Terrible. Animations are rigid and unrealistic, and the AI is inane.

The graphic quality is nothing short of awful...almost as if they designed this game by intent to look a decade old. The sound engineering is equally wretched.

There's no excuse for any of this. They licensed Unreal, so it's not like they have to develop any of this stuff. They just had to model, script, and animate, and they failed on pretty much every count.
 
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ImpulsE69

Lifer
Jan 8, 2010
14,946
1,077
126
Personally, there are way too many alpha/beta/early access on Steam now. 90% (probably more) of gamers do not want that. They want a finished product that isn't bug ridden.
 

BrightCandle

Diamond Member
Mar 15, 2007
4,762
0
76
I have learnt my lesson with preordering and early access. Its not a good idea to play a game before its ready, you end up with a lasting impression that is bad for the most part.
 

Stringjam

Golden Member
Jun 30, 2011
1,871
33
91
I have learnt my lesson with preordering and early access. Its not a good idea to play a game before its ready, you end up with a lasting impression that is bad for the most part.


I can hardly see this getting better, though. The basic game mechanics should be in place with a build this far along. It just feels horrible, and maybe its just me, but when looking through the ACOG it almost seems like the audio doesn't even line up with the recoil.

Animations are so incredibly bad it just ruins the whole immersive aspect a game like this is supposed to have.
 

Zargon

Lifer
Nov 3, 2009
12,218
2
76
The biggest concern I have right now is that the game just feels very feature-incomplete. At it's core, the gameplay is pretty good (if meager). But I was under the impression there would be more planning options and organization during briefing before the mission actually starts, and more tools for coordination. You can choose your insertion point, and of course your loadout, but that's as far as you can go.

I think they're going to patch in more features and fix the bugs over time, but the whole "release now and patch later" mentality is really bad. They could have staved off a lot of criticism by releasing it as an Early Access title, but they didn't.

agree, there is ALOT missing that was promised and I hope it comes to fuition, we were promised a rebirth of Rainbow 6

A game like this needs:

1. Superior weapons handling and movement mechanics

2. Advanced AI behaviors


It would appear this game has neither. It is very clunky. The transition to optics is basically a circle in the middle of the screen surrounded by black. Terrible. Animations are rigid and unrealistic, and the AI is inane.

The graphic quality is nothing short of awful...almost as if they designed this game by intent to look a decade old. The sound engineering is equally wretched.

There's no excuse for any of this. They licensed Unreal, so it's not like they have to develop any of this stuff. They just had to model, script, and animate, and they failed on pretty much every count.

I didnt think the weapons handling and movement was bad. they are supposed to move like silent operators, not run around like COD supersoldiers or even Battlefielders