The joy of religion - part xxxxxxxxx

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sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
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I can understand you wanting to adhere to one law that "requires no God"; but would you say then that if someone kills your wife and takes your personal belongings its ok to then murder another and take their things as well?

The 10 C's are there for a reason. They spell out absolute limits to personal behavior which is reiterated by most secular laws, but divine punishment also awaits those who thieve and murder. :oops:

Secular laws(Code of Hamurabi(sp) for eg) existed prior to the 10Cs.
 
Nov 29, 2006
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I can understand you wanting to adhere to one law that "requires no God"; but would you say then that if someone kills your wife and takes your personal belongings its ok to then murder another and take their things as well?

t2MQ5i7.png
 

MagickMan

Diamond Member
Aug 11, 2008
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Is that supposed to be English?

Here's your "R", being such a pea-brain, it isn't surprising that you couldn't understand the sentence without it.

Look, you can piss and moan and stomp your feet all you want. You don't have a counterargument or else you'd have made it.

That you're trying to explain the nonexistence of an alleged extra-physical being with freshman logic? Very compelling. :whiste:

Yes, indeed.

No, not even a little.

I'm not gathering anything meaningful from this link.

Because you're stupid...

Do you understand that even if there is a boundary in the past of the universe (which it does not appear that there is) that it does not mean that there is any boundary in the future? Nor does it mean that total energy of the universe is finite.

very stupid.

Did you have anything... y'know... of substance?

You first? Doubtful? Yeah, it's unlikely you do.
 

disappoint

Lifer
Dec 7, 2009
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You know, that is exactly my problem with scientific advancements :).

We just keep discovering things and create physics laws for something that was already there since the age of earth itself (with changes, of course), then we call that world a god-less place and attribute that discovery to our bright minds.

I mean, we ain't inventing anything outside of what is available around us. We're merely outlining the equations on how to utilize available recourses and deal with such nature.
I know it's much more complicated than that, but isn't it part of the truth?

PREACH IT Brother OMAR! You tell em!

Those damned dirty scientists!!! If they would just pray with us more defibrillators and cancer treatment supplies would fall out of the sky for us! Because God loves us and wants us to live longer with less suffering!

How dare these scientists and their new fangled equations muck everything up in the face of God! All shall be humbled in the presence of the almighty one playing hide and seek! ALL!!!
 
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disappoint

Lifer
Dec 7, 2009
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Hello! Earth to "disappoint"! I am disappoint that you see a difference between science and religion when many scientists are religious and organized religion helped to preserve and promote it! Over millennia, Catholics kept and preserved math and science in oral and written form.

Funny you don't feel the need to preach your exaltations for science to Omar. Is that because he's on "your team"?

I'm all for religious folks that promote science. Even when it disagrees with their world view. How open minded of them. How can I find fault with future atheists like that? ;)
 

Cerpin Taxt

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
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That you're trying to explain the nonexistence of an alleged extra-physical being with freshman logic? Very compelling. :whiste:
My argument stands, and you've not refuted it nor rebutted it. All you've done is attempt to dismiss it for reasons that clearly show that you do not understand it.


No, not even a little.



Because you're stupid...



very stupid.
I don't think anyone will be convinced that I'm the stupid one when you can't even defend your own preposterous assertions other than throwing a couple random links around.

You first? Doubtful? Yeah, it's unlikely you do.
Except for that proof that you've done everything in your power to pretend doesn't exist. It's still there, waiting for you to deal with it. Strange that you seem so impotent to refute what you've called "freshman logic."

Why is not my conclusion justified? You have never been able to answer that.
 

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
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You'd rather that false witnesses must be put to death? What if they were forced to do it? You'd still have them put to death? And you "WISH" for that?

The fuck is wrong with y-Ah, you follow the OT.

Never mind the fact that Yahweh controls each and every one of us, so if someone does give false testimony, that's Yahweh making us do so.

Proverbs 16:9 - "The heart of man plans his way, but the Lord establishes his steps."
Your example does not adhere to the verses that you are using! Why? Because you are not using the verses in the context of the chapter!!

Plus God does not make you lie or do things that are wrong...you are so out of touch with reality!!
 
Nov 29, 2006
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Am I stupid? You are the one who misunderstood. The aggressor acted first against his neighbor, applying that very same "do unto others" philosophy because he expects it to happen to him.

Your faulty logic led you to assume otherwise.

I dont think you understand what that "do unto others what you would have them do unto you." means LOL

Examples:
Would you have your neighbors come over and kill and rape your wife in front of you? No? Well then you shouldnt do that to other people.

Would you like your neighbor to come over and welcome you to the neighborhood with a pie? Why yes that sounds nice. Thus you should do that to others.
 
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MajinCry

Platinum Member
Jul 28, 2015
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Your example does not adhere to the verses that you are using! Why? Because you are not using the verses in the context of the chapter!!

Plus God does not make you lie or do things that are wrong...you are so out of touch with reality!!

Ah, so murder, rape and slavery is just fine in certain contexts? Please. You do know that the commandments of the OT, sans the sacrificial commandments outlined in Leviticus 1-6, are to be followed until the new covenant is enabled (Jeremiah 31:31-34) by everyone being a devout worshipper of Yahweh.


As another argument, you say that I quoted the commandments out of context (impossible, due to them being god damn commandments, also known as The Law), but you don't take issue with the lad that brought in the ten commandments? Even though he quoted them completely out of context?

Don't know why I'm expecting consistency from religious lads.
 
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disappoint

Lifer
Dec 7, 2009
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Your example does not adhere to the verses that you are using! Why? Because you are not using the verses in the context of the chapter!!

Plus God does not make you lie or do things that are wrong...you are so out of touch with reality!!

Hehehe wait which reality is the real one? His version of reality or your version of reality? Would the real reality please stand up?

So how do you know which reality is the right one?

I'll give you an example. He sees a picture of a dress and says it's black and blue, you see the pic and say it's gold and white. On the one hand you have the one that's right, on the other hand you have the one that's left. How do you determine which one is right?
 

WHAMPOM

Diamond Member
Feb 28, 2006
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C'mon you guys! You know it is "rob, rape and murder" 'cause "murder, rape and rob" makes you a really sick puppy. Did I forget "covet your neighdor's ass" in there somewhere/
 
Nov 30, 2006
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I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it. - George Bernard Shaw
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
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Your example does not adhere to the verses that you are using! Why? Because you are not using the verses in the context of the chapter!!

Plus God does not make you lie or do things that are wrong...you are so out of touch with reality!!


God made your brain. He knew when he created your brain exactly how it would run..... just like when I write a software program I know exactly how it will run. Since God made your brain, he OBVIOUSLY is the reason that you lie or do things that are wrong.... he is the CREATOR after all. You are simply a creation running the program that GOD put into you. God cannot be surprised when his creations do wrong, he knows what they will do wrong millions of years before he even creates them.

The question is why would he create them, KNOWING APRIORI THAT THEY WILL SIN AND go to Hell? The only plausible explanation that I can come up with is that he is a twisted sadistic entity who gets his jollies from creating things to torture for infinity....... that or some goat herding bronze agers came up with a myth....
 

WHAMPOM

Diamond Member
Feb 28, 2006
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Hehehe wait which reality is the real one? His version of reality or your version of reality? Would the real reality please stand up?

So how do you know which reality is the right one?

I'll give you an example. He sees a picture of a dress and says it's black and blue, you see the pic and say it's gold and white. On the one hand you have the one that's right, on the other hand you have the one that's left. How do you determine which one is right?

Depends on one's color perception and it may be both if made out of high tech color changing fabric.
 

WHAMPOM

Diamond Member
Feb 28, 2006
7,628
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God made your brain. He knew when he created your brain exactly how it would run..... just like when I write a software program I know exactly how it will run. Since God made your brain, he OBVIOUSLY is the reason that you lie or do things that are wrong.... he is the CREATOR after all. You are simply a creation running the program that GOD put into you. God cannot be surprised when his creations do wrong, he knows what they will do wrong millions of years before he even creates them.

The question is why would he create them, KNOWING APRIORI THAT THEY WILL SIN AND go to Hell? The only plausible explanation that I can come up with is that he is a twisted sadistic entity who gets his jollies from creating things to torture for infinity....... that or some goat herding bronze agers came up with a myth....

What a boring Universe, better to set up a situation where no one knows how the chips will fall. Write a program that you know exactly how it will run, send that resume to Microsoft they need you Yesterday.
 

MagickMan

Diamond Member
Aug 11, 2008
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My argument stands, and you've not refuted it nor rebutted it. All you've done is attempt to dismiss it for reasons that clearly show that you do not understand it.

Refute what? It didn't hold water from the outset.

I don't think anyone will be convinced that I'm the stupid one when you can't even defend your own preposterous assertions other than throwing a couple random links around.

I care what "anyone" thinks? Here? That's so cute.

Except for that proof that you've done everything in your power to pretend doesn't exist. It's still there, waiting for you to deal with it. Strange that you seem so impotent to refute what you've called "freshman logic."

It doesn't exist because it's entirely irrelevant.

Why is not my conclusion justified? <sic> You have never been able to answer that.

And you bitch about my English. For shame. :\
 

MagickMan

Diamond Member
Aug 11, 2008
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C'mon you guys! You know it is "rob, rape and murder" 'cause "murder, rape and rob" makes you a really sick puppy. Did I forget "covet your neighdor's ass" in there somewhere/

I did that earlier today, but she has an amazing ass.
 

Omar F1

Senior member
Sep 29, 2009
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That's bad/unimpressive because?

It's almost as if you are blind to what is right in front of your eyes. The car you use to move you places quickly, planes that fly overhead, the variety of food at your grocery store, the medicine you or people around you use to prolong their lives, the Internet we are using right now, the electricity that flows through your walls, and countless other things we use daily are all the result of these discoveries made by Science. Yet you are more impressed by claims of wonders written in ancient books.

There are wonders all around you and not one of them are the result of the actions of god(s). Forgive me for saying this, but your arguments for god(s) are silly. You may as well be arguing for the existence of Superman.
You didn't get my point at all, in fact you didn't even think about it for a second.


We've been utilizing both natural resources and our mind-abilities to advance in every category out there, since the beginning of our human race.

Our minds, which is proven the most critical part of our species - while everyone else clearly lacked such sophistication - is proof enough for me that we were guided intentionally to become what we're right now. And those natural resources weren't founded arbitrary either by Mother Nature, they did exist for a reason.

That huge crude-oil reserve lying under the Arabian Peninsula, it was right under our feet for the whole time.
Normally, it's considered just another human discovery, while in fact we believe it's another one of the God's graces given to his elected human race to be discovered in the right time.

"It is He Who has made the sea subject, that ye may eat thereof flesh that is fresh and tender, and that ye may extract therefrom ornaments to wear; and thou seest the ships therein that plough the waves, that ye may seek (thus) of the bounty of Allah and that ye may be grateful."

Uranium is another example. It was there perhaps for the whole known history of humans, waiting to be discovered and utilized in the right age.
Now you would attribute those technological advancements out of Uranium and give credit only to some brilliant scientists, but the question begs though; why we have such unlimited scope of thinking while everyone else was kept at bay and got severely crippled in his way of thinking - absolutely no trace of intentional guidance, of course.
Beside developing their normal habits of finding food, shelter, surviving other predators and getting accustomed to their own environment circumstances; when was the last time an animal had invented something useful?

Of course, I'm in no way denying human scientists their credit - in fact I always call for them to be recognized, their efforts acknowledged and thanked pretty well for the countless hours spent behind their achievements.
And I know for sure that Accuray's Cyberknife machine, which helped saving countless of desperate lives, did not fall right from above.


He gave us our free minds - much more of a responsibility than convenience - in order to work it hard and be different from all the other animals surrounding us.
 

MajinCry

Platinum Member
Jul 28, 2015
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He gave us our free minds - much more of a responsibility than convenience - in order to work it hard and be different from all the other animals surrounding us.

Gonna ignore the rest of your ego-babble, but this? That right there is inherently bollocks.

Remember that verse which stated that Yahweh controls each and every one of us?

He didn't give us free minds at all; according to the book, we're just his automatons.
 

Omar F1

Senior member
Sep 29, 2009
491
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PREACH IT Brother OMAR! You tell em!

Those damned dirty scientists!!! If they would just pray with us more defibrillators and cancer treatment supplies would fall out of the sky for us! Because God loves us and wants us to live longer with less suffering!

How dare these scientists and their new fangled equations muck everything up in the face of God! All shall be humbled in the presence of the almighty one playing hide and seek! ALL!!!
Whoa, wait a second. You have probably noticed that none of us did try to promote his own religion into this thread. It's a matter of acknowledgment of a god existence, more than anything else.
Personally at least, I tried to promote that through a couple of simple observations, I didn't even try to talk spirituality here which is totally another different subject.

If I cited a verse from Quran that's because it's the scripture I'm knowledgeable in. Personally, I never read Moses' Tourah, David's Zabour or Jesus' Enjeel - but I'm sure they're full of similar examples.


We're in debt of those who sacrificed considerable part of their normal lives in order to set for long hours in a lab to achieve something that would make our lives better and our life much easier. Nobody can deny them that credit, and you absolutely have no idea how much grateful personally I am.
However, we also must acknowledge the One who have created us all in the first place. He demand this and has the right to.
He only showed himself once to Moses, left the rest of us to wandering after that about his true identity.


Then how do you explain ring species?

ensatina.png


This objective data demonstrating the fact that your objection is observed in extant species in the world today. You can literally trace the evolutionary line through the existing species.
I promise to look for some reference/article about the subject of ring species.
But one of my argument points was that we shouldn't run quickly into conclusions, that's all what I'm asking for.