Techreport 7950 vs. GTX 660 Ti "Smoothness" videos

[Final8ty]

Some good Investigation going on over that OCN.
Even NV owners are saying that Fraps can not be trusted.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1337206/the-tech-report-does-the-radeon-hd-7950-stumble-in-windows-8/260

 

[wand3r3r]

<------ confused. Wouldn't it be a very "good" thing when a company "tweaks" drivers for smoother gameplay? Isn't that a thing somebody would want? Just curious.

Wouldn't people want higher performance, isn't it ok to tweak for higher performance? Ironic considering your negative speculation about AMD driver tweaks (unfair or somehow wrong when AMD tweaks their drivers in your opinion, but totally fair and downright intelligent when NV does it).

Either way, in my opinion, reviews should explain any driver tweaks that apply to the specific game otherwise they are achieving their attempt to fudge numbers and mislead. People assume the performance or quality apply more broadly then it really does if they only tweak a few games/benchmarks that reviewers use.

We've run a number of other benchmarks and need to add, for the sake of fairness, that Nvidia's advantage is only evident if its driver is optimized for smooth frame rates rather than raw performance. The company takes certain apps, like synthetic benchmarks and commonly-tested games, and tweaks them to yield higher numbers at the expense of consistency.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-geforce-stutter-crossfire,2995-5.html

At least Toms mentions that.

 

[Final8ty]

Looking at the Skyrim video it looked like hitching,tearing and not Micro strutter as in fact without slow motion on that video you would not be able to see micro-stutter on Youtube which is 30fps.

 

[Final8ty]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgM2O8Ci4SU&feature=related
From the vid.

Solved: Replaced Keyboard.
bought a new logitech USB keyboard as my old one was ugly and replaced my PS2 Keyboard.
why there was lag i have no idea.
Thank you all for your helpful comments and hope you all resolve your issues too- i cant believe i built practically a new PC&#65279; and it was the damned keyboard >.>

But some people are still getting it regardless of the keyboard.

http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1733539

 

[Leadbox]

http://techreport.com/review/24051/geforce-versus-radeon-captured-on-high-speed-video

Should make for some lively discussion

Slightly off topic here and I apologize for that, but does anyone else notice just how much sharper and crisper it all looks on the radeon? Better AF and AA maybe?

 

[Keysplayr]

Wouldn't people want higher performance, isn't it ok to tweak for higher performance? Ironic considering your negative speculation about AMD driver tweaks (unfair or somehow wrong when AMD tweaks their drivers in your opinion, but totally fair and downright intelligent when NV does it).

Either way, in my opinion, reviews should explain any driver tweaks that apply to the specific game otherwise they are achieving their attempt to fudge numbers and mislead. People assume the performance or quality apply more broadly then it really does if they only tweak a few games/benchmarks that reviewers use.


http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-geforce-stutter-crossfire,2995-5.html

At least Toms mentions that.

Sure, people LOVE higher performance, but not at the expense of quality. This has always been the case. More performance is always welcomed but not at the expense of anything else. And if and when NV does it, I expect a thread or 10 about it here. :thumbsup:

 

[Keysplayr]

Slightly off topic here and I apologize for that, but does anyone else notice just how much sharper and crisper it all looks on the radeon? Better AF and AA maybe?

Kind of looks the same to me.

 

[Final8ty]

Sure, people LOVE higher performance, but not at the expense of quality. This has always been the case. More performance is always welcomed but not at the expense of anything else. And if and when NV does it, I expect a thread or 10 about it here. :thumbsup:

They already have with the GTX 560 Ti / 570 with very high latencies but not a word from NV or AMD users, but seeing as such a fuss has been made by NV users now about AMD, when NV does it again im sure there will be.

 

[Keysplayr]

They already have with the GTX 560 Ti / 570 with very high latencies but not a word from NV or AMD users, but seeing as such a fuss has been made now, when NV does it again im sure there will be.

If you say so. But I'd wait for a site like TR or H to post an article on it.

 

[Final8ty]

If you say so.

Im only saying what others have said and the Techreport showed.

 

[Keysplayr]

Im only saying what others have said and the Techreport showed.

Ok.

 

[Final8ty]

The more im seeing and the more im reading is bring up more questions.

Hardware compatibility with Keyboards effecting frame rates and smoothness leading to lag, hitching and juddering, i first came across reading about that in trackmania, with a particular saitek KB and i think FEAR was effect by some makes of KB as well.

Im also reading lately the polling rate which AB is set at is effecting some users in some games.

Originally Posted by Amidar View Post
As for the stuttering try changing the "Hardware Polling Period" in Afterburner from 1000ms to something higher, worked for me on both my GTX 680 & 7970.

Also fraps itself causing stuttering.

 

[Keysplayr]

The more im seeing and the more im reading is bring up more questions.

Hardware compatibility with Keyboards effecting frame rates and smoothness leading to lag, hitching and juddering, i first came across reading about that in trackmania, with a particular saitek KB and i think FEAR was effect by some makes of KB as well.

Im also reading lately the polling rate which AB is set at is effecting some users in some games.



Also fraps itself causing stuttering.

Sigh.... Anything but the cards. Now it's keyboard incompatibility. Well, I guess there is always a chance. I think you should email TechReport about this. They seem to be very responsive to member requests about this issue, even a far as follow up articles. Ask them if they used the same keyboard (go the extra mile and ask about the mouse to) when testing the 7950 and the 660Ti.

 

[Final8ty]

Sigh.... Anything but the cards. Now it's keyboard incompatibility. Well, I guess there is always a chance. I think you should email TechReport about this. They seem to be very responsive to member requests about this issue, even a far as follow up articles.

It was not specifically about TechReport case, its was about how many potential things can effect smoothness.

But this one is.

It seems that the people on this thread who have tested this themselves with a 7950 are getting frame times more in line with the results Tech report got back in August (around 16ms average). I would guess that Tech report has borked their driver installation or something, the frame times in their latest review certainly aren't representative of the frame times most users are getting with their 7950's by the looks of users' graphs.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1337751/...aptured-on-high-speed-video/350#post_18836692

 

[Keysplayr]

It was not specifically about TechReport case, its was about how many potential thing can effect smoothness.

But this one is.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1337751/...aptured-on-high-speed-video/350#post_18836692

Ok. So keyboard incompatibility, borked driver installation in not only Windows 8 tests, but Windows 7 as well. Boy, those dopes can't even install a driver correctly.

 

[Final8ty]

Ok. So keyboard incompatibility, borked driver installation in not only Windows 8 tests, but Windows 7 as well. Boy, those dopes can't even install a driver correctly.

Well if others are not having the same issue then maybe something maybe wrong at there end.

 

[Keysplayr]

Well if others are not having the same issue then maybe something maybe wrong at there end.

Others who? Other major review sites? Or other AMD fans posts in forums? I'm sure you see the conundrum.

 

[Final8ty]

Others who? Other major review sites? Or other AMD fans posts in forums? I'm sure you see the conundrum.

Yeah again you ignore what you don't want to see when even some of the users posting own both NV and AMD recent cards.
If your saying that no user can be trusted then there is no point in you even being on user forum and as what you represent you should be trusted the least.

 

[Vesku]

Others who? Other major review sites? Or other AMD fans posts in forums? I'm sure you see the conundrum.

You think regular posters are faking frame time logs? Some games I can replicate similar FRAPs results as Techreport such as Sleeping Dogs but in other games I get different results such as Skyrim (outdoors with combat).

The amount of time and effort it would take to fake would make it quite unlikely, imo.

 

[Will Robinson]

Keysplayr
Elite Member



Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,895

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leadbox
Slightly off topic here and I apologize for that, but does anyone else notice just how much sharper and crisper it all looks on the radeon? Better AF and AA maybe?

Kind of looks the same to me.
__________________
Member of Nvidia Focus Group
NVIDIA Focus Group Members receive free software and/or hardware from NVIDIA from time to time
to facilitate the evaluation of NVIDIA products. However, the opinions expressed are solely those of the Members.
Intel i5 2500K @ 4.2, ASUS P8Z68-V/Gen3, 8GB DDR3, 2x GTX680s in SLI
Heat 72-0-0



Look again,the 7950's image quality is actually sharper and better in the video,no question.

 

[Keysplayr]

Keysplayr
Elite Member



Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,895

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leadbox
Slightly off topic here and I apologize for that, but does anyone else notice just how much sharper and crisper it all looks on the radeon? Better AF and AA maybe?

Kind of looks the same to me.
__________________
Member of Nvidia Focus Group
NVIDIA Focus Group Members receive free software and/or hardware from NVIDIA from time to time
to facilitate the evaluation of NVIDIA products. However, the opinions expressed are solely those of the Members.
Intel i5 2500K @ 4.2, ASUS P8Z68-V/Gen3, 8GB DDR3, 2x GTX680s in SLI
Heat 72-0-0



Look again,the 7950's image quality is actually sharper and better in the video,no question.

Like I said. Looks the same to me.

 

[Keysplayr]

Yeah again you ignore what you don't want to see when even some of the users posting own both NV and AMD recent cards.
If your saying that no user can be trusted then there is no point in you even being on user forum and as what you represent you should be trusted the least.

What you fail to understand is, I don't care what you, or I, or anyone in a forum posts regarding frametimes. Times are different now, forums are corrupt and stealth marketing is rampant, sooooooo, at this point, I'll only "hear" accredited review sites on this issue. Sorry man, just the way it is. For me anyway. Not speaking for everyone of course.

 

[Keysplayr]

You think regular posters are faking frame time logs? Some games I can replicate similar FRAPs results as Techreport such as Sleeping Dogs but in other games I get different results such as Skyrim (outdoors with combat).

The amount of time and effort it would take to fake would make it quite unlikely, imo.

Vesku, you did notice that I didn't start a thread to ask for forum participation in trying to replicate or disprove TR and H's findings, yes? That's because there is FAAAAAR too much bias here. That is why I started a thread asking Ryan Smith to investigate. Not forum members, nor my own findings. It's not personal. It's common sense. I do hope you appreciate my honesty in this matter. I'm not pulling punches, things are what they are. It's why I've emailed several major review sites asking for investigation. Not us.

 

[Final8ty]

Keysplayr
Elite Member



Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,895

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leadbox
Slightly off topic here and I apologize for that, but does anyone else notice just how much sharper and crisper it all looks on the radeon? Better AF and AA maybe?

Kind of looks the same to me.
__________________
Member of Nvidia Focus Group
NVIDIA Focus Group Members receive free software and/or hardware from NVIDIA from time to time
to facilitate the evaluation of NVIDIA products. However, the opinions expressed are solely those of the Members.
Intel i5 2500K @ 4.2, ASUS P8Z68-V/Gen3, 8GB DDR3, 2x GTX680s in SLI
Heat 72-0-0



Look again,the 7950's image quality is actually sharper and better in the video,no question.

I could not see the difference in either the 120fps vid or the 240, but what i did notice on the 240 is that the NV cards have a more red hue and that at 1:40 there is a clear difference in vegetation.

 

[Final8ty]

What you fail to understand is, I don't care what you, or I, or anyone in a forum posts regarding frametimes. Times are different now, forums are corrupt and stealth marketing is rampant, sooooooo, at this point, I'll only "hear" accredited review sites on this issue. Sorry man, just the way it is. For me anyway. Not speaking for everyone of course.

So then send mails to them and not post in forums if your not interested, because users experience is what forums are all about.
Forums are not here to just post what AMD,NV and review sites claim and we should all just swallow it.
And at least yours is not stealth its blatant.