Tech Report: Nvidia, Asus put the clamps on GTX 590 voltage

[SirPauly]

I think what some may be doing is trying to force over-volting as over-clocking. One can over-clock and probably garner 10-15 percent OC's with their GTX-590's with default volts. Curious to know more.

 

[nanaki333]

6990 is already faster at stock vs. a stock 590. But people don't overclock high end cards, remember? ^_^

i don't

 

[f1sherman]

Is this how O/C'ing is supposed to work?

Exactly like that.

Nvidia is stomping OC-ing similarly as the closed window stands in your way to beocme an eagle when jumping from a seven story building

 

[railven]

I think what some may be doing is trying to force over-volting as over-clocking. One can over-clock and probably garner 10-15 percent OC's with their GTX-590's with default volts. Curious to know more.

I thought they all had to raise their volts, not insane amounts, but closer to 1V to get those increases.

At stock volts wasn't it 4-6% increase? Just curious.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Exactly.

Not everyone plans on running their new $700 toy outside of warranty by adding voltage. And the people that actually do would be smart to spend the extra money on a water block anyway.

But I've seen it time and time again. When AMD had DX10.1 and nV didnt bother, you could swear that 10.1 was the most amazing thing ever, even though it did absolutely nothing.

When AMD was out first with DX11 and tesselation (even though it was one crappy game, Dirt2), they acted like DX11 was the end-all-be-all. Then once nV had much better tesselation, it wasn't important any more.

Now we are pretending that over-volting cards is standard practice. In fact, I was told that if you dont OV, you aren't an enthusiast, and it's the same as owning a Mac.

Most of the people in these 590 threads will probably never own, let alone over-volt a $700 GPU in their entire life.

For only $199 more than a 580, it is a great performance jump, period.

nV has benefited from cards that can be over-volted...(GTX460), that obviously is not the case with 590 though.

Show me where over-volting either new card makes a difference in a game. 100FPS --> 115 FPS is a joke.

This sounds like spin or selective memory to me.

I doubt anyone would have bought a 3870 over an 8800GT at or very near the same price. DX10.1 was not much of a feather in AMD's cap in the 3870 days. But when comparing two very like-performing cards, such as the GTX260 and 4870, it was worth pointing out. It's kind of like how Physx is pointed out when comparing a 6970 to a GTX570 today. Many will say one or the other or both are worthless, but when comparing two cards that perform near each other and cost near each other, it is worth mentioning.

I think AMD's advantage of ofering a DX11 card and tessellation half a year before you could get an Nvidia card that offered the same was far more significant (at the time) than Nvidia's advantage in tesselation today. The difference is one could run DX11 and tessellation, one could not at all back between the 5870 launch and GTX480/470 launch. Today both can run DX11 and tessellation, one just scores more in a synthetic bench and, from what I have seen, a game that already runs well over 60FPS on either camp's higher end cards. I honestly do not think I have seen a single post here where anyone has said tessellation is or will not be important... that's not to say there aren't any, but they must be few and far between.

Overclocking and overvolting will differ from user to user. But one company offers their cards and practically tells you to overvolt and overclock (if it's covered by the board partner's warranty) and one clamps down on any overvolting because the cards literally burn up. I still say enthusiast level parts should allow the option to tweak the parts. Not everyone will overvolt or overclock. But many will want to, as you mentioned a lot of these will find use under water after all.

And yes, you are absolutely correct. The GTX590 offers a nice performance bump over the GTX580, and they are priced accordingly. But the problem is that Nvidia is not competing with itself here. The 6990 is priced the same and plainly the better card.

And for the record, if my non-reference 5870's had reference VRM's I would be overvolted and gaming on dual 1GHz GPU's if they would swing it. I've already tried with one card, and after some research found out that my cards do not adjust voltage. These two cards cost me well over $700 combined.

(But upgrading to faster cards that I can overvolt and overclock is hardly an issue at this point, but my Phenom 2 on the other hand...)

 

[formulav8]

If you say so. In your honest opinion, who do you think is more likely to overclock? The person who can afford only a mid range card and want's to get as much as they can out of it for the money? Or the person who can afford to buy the highest end so they don't have to?

Now, you don't have to answer this question in it's exact form of course. Feel free to reform it to suit your answer as you see fit.

OK i'll bite. Which person is most likely to oc? A tweaker. Tweakers are at all price levels/ranges. Tweakers don't care if they have a 430 or a 590. If they're up to it, they will tweak it. I've never heard of an excuse that its price/model that says when ocing should be considered or when its ok to oc? I guess tweakers should only buy mid cards...

 

[formulav8]

Exactly like that.

Nvidia is stomping OC-ing similarly as the closed window stands in your way to beocme an eagle when jumping from a seven story building

Yuk Yuk Yuk :biggrin:

 

[ZimZum]

But it appears Nvidia used cheap components or cut corners on their flagship top priced enthusiast card.

This is the point many are completely missing. Forget about over-clocking or over-volting. If you're buying a $700 piece of equipment. Would you rather spend your money on the one that is over-engineered? Or the one that is barely able to operate at its factory specs? Who's to say that 6 months or a year from now were not going to have another bumpgate where these cards begin failing?

And the "well if it fails you have a warranty" argument shouldn't be used to excuse a shoddy product.

 

[formulav8]

And the "well if it fails you have a warranty" argument shouldn't be used to excuse a shoddy product.

That part is true.

 

[OCGuy]

This is the point many are completely missing. Forget about over-clocking or over-volting. If you're buying a $700 piece of equipment. Would you rather spend your money on the one that is over-engineered? Or the one that is barely able to operate at its factory specs? Who's to say that 6 months or a year from now were not going to have another bumpgate where these cards begin failing?

And the "well if it fails you have a warranty" argument shouldn't be used to excuse a shoddy product.

Who is to say that 6990s that have been running the performance BIOS drawing 450w won't start failing 6 months from now?


It is hard to argue against "what if" scenarios

 

[thilanliyan]

I myself have watercooled cards for quite a while now and I appreciate being able to change the voltage and up the clocks after taking care of the cooling. It's nice to know that all the cards I have watercooled/overvolted/overclocked have been able to handle the increased stress I have put on them (6950 and GTX 460 being the most recent ones). If I bought a 590, watercooled it, then found I couldn't increase the voltage because nV locked it down (presumably because the power delivery system can't handle it), I'd be pissed...but that's just me. However, I do check which cards are overclockable and which are not so in this case I would have avoided the 590 if I were in the market for such a card.

 

[badb0y]

Who is to say that 6990s that have been running the performance BIOS drawing 450w won't start failing 6 months from now?


It is hard to argue against "what if" scenarios

It's hard to argue "what if" scenarios, I agree but one of those companies has already been proven to be unreliable in terms of longevity(sp?).

I also agree that many people flip-flop a lot. Remember when the GTX 460 came out, everyone and their mother was OCing that card but now suddenly OCing is considered a niche.

 

[OCGuy]

It's hard to argue "what if" scenarios, I agree but one of those companies has already been proven to be unreliable in terms of longevity(sp?).

Keys has one, apoppin has one, and I have seen I think 3 different quad-SLI setups posted on the forum, and none of them have reported any failing when running within specification.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Who is to say that 6990s that have been running the performance BIOS drawing 450w won't start failing 6 months from now?


It is hard to argue against "what if" scenarios

Well, one camp has had trouble making it out of the first week without issues... that doesn't exactly inspire a ton of confidence. While, on the whole, I don't think the 6990 has shown any indication that it won't work and last like any other overclocked and overvolted model video card.

 

[AtenRa]

This is the point many are completely missing. Forget about over-clocking or over-volting. If you're buying a $700 piece of equipment. Would you rather spend your money on the one that is over-engineered? Or the one that is barely able to operate at its factory specs? Who's to say that 6 months or a year from now were not going to have another bumpgate where these cards begin failing?

And the "well if it fails you have a warranty" argument shouldn't be used to excuse a shoddy product.

Warranties are made for that reason, you never know if there will be a design or manufacturing flaw and your product will fail and that is why most of the manufacturers have a 3 year warranty.

Even nature don't always do it the right way and people die younger than others and unfortunately we don't have a 100 years life span warranty (not yet)

Edit: If you operate your hardware within the manufacturers operating guide lines then your warranty is valid and the manufacturer has the obligation to enforce it.

 

[Seero]

I think people, generally speaking, mis-understood the difference between current and voltage, and believed that Over Current Protection will control the amount of electricity going into the card regardless of voltage and it will safe guard against BBQ due to extreme voltages.

 

[badb0y]

Keys has one, apoppin has one, and I have seen I think 3 different quad-SLI setups posted on the forum, and none of them have reported any failing when running within specification.

I was referring more to the 8800 series dying off and bumpgate but sure the GTX 590 itself is quite sketchy at this point.

 

[PingviN]

This is the point many are completely missing. Forget about over-clocking or over-volting. If you're buying a $700 piece of equipment. Would you rather spend your money on the one that is over-engineered? Or the one that is barely able to operate at its factory specs? Who's to say that 6 months or a year from now were not going to have another bumpgate where these cards begin failing?

I'd rather have a card that's engineered enough to overclock and overvolt, because overclocking and overvolting is what I do to computer hardware.

In other words: I would spend my money on a card that's properly engineered.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Warranties are made for that reason, you never know if there will be a design or manufacturing flaw and your product will fail and that is why most of the manufacturers have a 3 year warranty.

Even nature don't always do it the right way and people die younger than others and unfortunately we don't have a 100 years life span warranty (not yet)

Sure, warranties are nice to have, but how much time do you want to spend gaming with your ubber card in the shop for repair or replacement? I know that failures, to some extent, are just part of consumer life. But when two products are priced very similarly, offer similar performance, but one is more flexible and allows you to easily add more performance and work reliably while the other would melt down, I know where my money is going. That would make me feel that, even if I have no desire to tweak the part, I will have a better quality part that should keep me up and running longer. And then you factor in both manufacturers past record regarding quality and engineering...

I guess I see no reason to pass up the 6990 for a GTX590.

 

[formulav8]

I'd rather have a card that's engineered enough to overclock and overvolt, because overclocking and overvolting is what I do to computer hardware.

In other words: I would spend my money on a card that's properly engineered.

Even if you had a 590 you still think you should/would or want to be able to?

 

[railven]

I doubt anyone would have bought a 3870 over an 8800GT at or very near the same price. DX10.1 was not much of a feather in AMD's cap in the 3870 days. But when comparing two very like-performing cards, such as the GTX260 and 4870, it was worth pointing out. It's kind of like how Physx is pointed out when comparing a 6970 to a GTX570 today. Many will say one or the other or both are worthless, but when comparing two cards that perform near each other and cost near each other, it is worth mentioning.

I just wanted to toss in that I agree with that. I'm open about my preference to ATI (if you check the thread about our buying history you'd see what I mean) and even I couldn't bring myself around to buying a 3870. I got a 8800 and later a second for SLI.

But once the 4870 was announced I jumped back and even got myself a 4870x2 to boot.

 

[Keysplayr]

6990 is already faster at stock vs. a stock 590. But people don't overclock high end cards, remember? ^_^

i don't

Neither do I. Or at least for everyday usage. I might try to o/c just for some testing.. maybe or if my curiousity is peaked. Other than that, I really can't be bothered.

 

[badb0y]

Neither do I. Or at least for everyday usage. I might try to o/c just for some testing.. maybe or if my curiousity is peaked. Other than that, I really can't be bothered.

Different strokes for different folks, you don't like to overclock and I love to overclock . It's like I said at stock these cards a damn close, pick your color and go with it but if you have a more curious imagination/ambition you should probably buy the HD 6990. At least we have a choice.

 

[AtenRa]

Sure, warranties are nice to have, but how much time do you want to spend gaming with your ubber card in the shop for repair or replacement? I know that failures, to some extent, are just part of consumer life. But when two products are priced very similarly, offer similar performance, but one is more flexible and allows you to easily add more performance and work reliably while the other would melt down, I know where my money is going. That would make me feel that, even if I have no desire to tweak the part, I will have a better quality part that should keep me up and running longer. And then you factor in both manufacturers past record regarding quality and engineering...

I guess I see no reason to pass up the 6990 for a GTX590.

I'd rather have a card that's engineered enough to overclock and overvolt, because overclocking and overvolting is what I do to computer hardware.

In other words: I would spend my money on a card that's properly engineered.

I don't disagree and, im one like many here that OC/OV there hardware and i have said it many times now that REFERENCE GTX590 is not for the big boys.

But we are not the only customers of cards like HD6990 and GTX590, there are people who don’t OC/OV and still get the high end products.

Just because a product don’t OC or OV like we wanted it doesn’t make it of a lower quality or not properly engineered. If it doesn’t pass your standards then don’t buy it, move on and get the best you thing it suits your needs.

 

[Skurge]

Well, one camp has had trouble making it out of the first week without issues... that doesn't exactly inspire a ton of confidence. While, on the whole, I don't think the 6990 has shown any indication that it won't work and last like any other overclocked and overvolted model video card.

Your arguing with someone who has his i7 clocked at nearly 4ghz and his arguing that its not a con for a card to have extremely limited overclocking and no overvolting.

BTW OCguy, is that i7 overvolted?

And would you have still bought it if a Phenom2 X4 performed the same, cost the same, but overclocked a lot better and didn't fail if you did overclock it?