Super Street Fighter IV Official Thread

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purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
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Originally posted by: lopri
I think they're trying to lay a framework for a long term, which they have failed at miserably when SF4 launched. The on-line match making system is pretty terrible and features like replay save are broken as well. Plus, of course, the balance between characters. Overall the game heavily favors characters with good reversal (*cough* dragon punch *cough*) and charge characters are somewhat disadvantaged, IMO.

If they fix things such that the gaming experience gets better and they'll build a framework to fix any future issues, I'd say it's worth it.

about the online syste, you MUST be playing on PS3.

replays and online works fine on 360 (i have it on PS3 too so I know how poor it is on PS3).

and if you are getting hit by reversal dragon punches constantly, then you my friend just are not good at sf4.

and if you think charge characters at a disadvantage, i'd gladly play you with my balrog and show you how wrong you are :)
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,631
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Originally posted by: I4AT
If this is about viability rather than money, what's their excuse for not patching all of this into the PC version? The standard edition of the Witcher can be patched to the Enhanced Edition for free. The Enhanced Edition can then be patched to the Director's Cut version, also free. Blizzard has been updating Diablo 2 and Starcraft for the past 10 years, D2 is getting the 1.13 patch soon even though D3 has been announced and in development for quite some time. Some companies reward customer loyalty, others are only about the dollars.

New characters and stages or not, the added content is not going to be too large to simply patch in, and anyone who believes that is fucking delusional. This is a fighting game, it's simply a few new models fighting on static backgrounds. Look at Fable II, it's being broken up into 5 episodes and released over XBL. The first episode is 2GB in size, there are several multi gig demos available for download. Whatever Capcom has planned for Super SF4 it can be distributed digitally, I guarantee it.

Street Fighter 4 never even got lobbies, something that should have been in the game from the start. They had plenty of on the clock time to whip up alternate outfits for each character and charge for those though. But I understand, those take a lot of time, money, and man hours to develop, otherwise there'd be hundreds of freely available community made ones.

They're bringing back Dee Jay and T. Hawk for fucks sake. How many people asked for them, like 12? I was surprised that Fei Long, Gen, and Rose even made their way in. And I'm sure Rolento will be one of the add ons, because 15 people asked for him on the Cap boards. These characters were hardly ever played in their original games and now all of a sudden "the fans" are asking for their return? gtfoh. New characters I don't mind at all, when SF4 was announced I hoped it'd be an entirely fresh roster, but I didn't mind that it ended up SF2+ because it was something new to play. Now they're shattering the community a year after its release.

I didn't wanna get involved in this debate at first, but I see all you guys jumping on people who said they aren't happy with a new release when nobody is trying to convince you not to buy it. We simply said we weren't interested, we'll be voting with our wallets, and those of you who support it will be voting with yours. I think it's fine that some people don't mind, but you all seem so butt hurt that we don't share the same view. One thing I don't believe is opinion however, is that this can be done via DLC.

This isn't 1993 and we aren't playing on 16-bit consoles running cartridges. Most people didn't go out and buy every revision of SF2 like you guys are claiming either, by the way. Back then arcades were still the most popular format, and it wasn't a big deal when a new edition of SF came out cause the investment in new machines lied with the arcades, not the players. This is the online age, I don't own 7 different Guilty Gear games, I own one, X2 #Reload because it had online play.

The update can be done via DLC, and it can be done free of charge. Capcom is a very large company, one of the biggest in the industy, SF is one of the most popular franchises in the world, and obviously SF4 was very successful or they wouldn't even be thinking of another. You say they're doing us a favor, I say they're doing us a disservice and fingering the asshole of everyone who paid for the original. They'd be doing us a favor by patching the game for free with things that matter like improving netcode, adding lobbies, and new characters if any. They'd still be doing us a favor by charging for new content as DLC so the rest of us have the option of not having to pay for returning characters that nobody ever bothered to play in the first place, and the community wouldn't have to be split. Some of us don't care about the stages we play on, the outfit our character is wearing, or the music that plays in the background and we shouldn't have to pay for that shit.

1. the entitlement in this post is amazing.

2. since you apparently work for capcom, since you know what should have been put in the game, and that the update can be done for free and as DLC, can you please tell us who the other 5-7 characters that are in super SF4 are?

3. dee jay is one of the better characters in competitive ssf2t play (dont know why thawk is in there though).

4. you don't HAVE to pay for any of the new stages, outfits, or music
 

I4AT

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2006
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3
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Originally posted by: purbeast0

1. the entitlement in this post is amazing.

2. since you apparently work for capcom, since you know what should have been put in the game, and that the update can be done for free and as DLC, can you please tell us who the other 5-7 characters that are in super SF4 are?

3. dee jay is one of the better characters in competitive ssf2t play (dont know why thawk is in there though).

4. you don't HAVE to pay for any of the new stages, outfits, or music

1. Your lack of it is what amazes me, apparently a lot of people like burning money.

2. If I worked for Capcom you'd all be wiping my ass right now, probably with your dollar bills. Frankly I don't care what characters make their way into the update, because if it's put on another disk and sold in stores it won't have any impact on me. Name one reason why the update can't be done as DLC or for free, at least I cited examples. Seriously, one reason besides money, just one.

3. That doesn't make him a popular character of the franchise.

4. Of course, not if I don't buy the game. But that results in two separate player bases which is what I have the biggest problem with. If you do want the new game however, Capcom is stating that the new stages and music are a large part of why they won't release a DLC update.
 

bl4ckfl4g

Diamond Member
Feb 13, 2007
3,669
0
0
Originally posted by: I4AT
Originally posted by: purbeast0

1. the entitlement in this post is amazing.

2. since you apparently work for capcom, since you know what should have been put in the game, and that the update can be done for free and as DLC, can you please tell us who the other 5-7 characters that are in super SF4 are?

3. dee jay is one of the better characters in competitive ssf2t play (dont know why thawk is in there though).

4. you don't HAVE to pay for any of the new stages, outfits, or music

1. Your lack of it is what amazes me, apparently a lot of people like burning money.

2. If I worked for Capcom you'd all be wiping my ass right now, probably with your dollar bills. Frankly I don't care what characters make their way into the update, because if it's put on another disk and sold in stores it won't have any impact on me. Name one reason why the update can't be done as DLC or for free, at least I cited examples. Seriously, one reason besides money, just one.

3. That doesn't make him a popular character of the franchise.

4. Of course, not if I don't buy the game. But that results in two separate player bases which is what I have the biggest problem with. If you do want the new game however, Capcom is stating that the new stages and music are a large part of why they won't release a DLC update.


Wait wtf why would they do all that work for free?
 

Thraxen

Diamond Member
Dec 3, 2001
4,683
1
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Capcom didn't help themselves any when they sold overpriced costumes that were already on the discs we paid for. That plus the fact that I'm sure many people were expecting DLC characters at some point and you get this reaction from all but the hardcore fighter fans that would buy anything they crapped out.
 

I4AT

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2006
2,631
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Possibly because they sold millions of copies and made a shit ton of money on a game they're about to bury? The guys doing the real work are on salary, the revenue generated from the game will pay them 10 times over, who's working for free? Executives smell $$$ and that's the only reason for this rehash. Nobody was begging for more characters or stages, we were all asking for lobbies and that never happened, even when the Power Pack DLC was released. We all wanted backwards compatibility or an XBLA release of CVS2 and we never got that. There are things far more in demand that we never got, but now all of a sudden they wanna make changes to SF4 that warrants a new release? If we felt we needed more characters and ultras we wouldn't have bought the game to begin with.

But you guys are missing the fucking point, I'm not expecting anything to be handed out for free. You guys are saying they're doing us a favor by making an entirely new game, I said releasing the extra content for free would be them doing you a favor. That's a fucking favor, smaller companies do it all the time to reward customers. Releasing it as pay-for-DLC without breaking up the playerbase is doing everyone who bought the first game a favor. Updating the netcode and adding lobbies is doing their job.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,631
6,508
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Originally posted by: Thraxen
Capcom didn't help themselves any when they sold overpriced costumes that were already on the discs we paid for. That plus the fact that I'm sure many people were expecting DLC characters at some point and you get this reaction from all but the hardcore fighter fans that would buy anything they crapped out.

they weren't on the disc...

but they WERE in that update you were forced to download the first time you took it online heh.

and seriously, do you think SSF4 is for the "casual" fighting fans out there? of course not, it is to satisfy the hardcore fighting audience.
 

lopri

Elite Member
Jul 27, 2002
13,314
690
126
Some posts here reminds me of those @SRK.com. I'd have expected posts to be a bit more.. mature here @AT.

I play SF4 on PS3 and PC and know about the replay save system on 360. What I was thinking of is being able to save any replay of my own, plus whatever is uploaded. Being able to copy over replay files to a different system would be nice as well.

Online match-making isn't that great, to my eyes. Repeated searches result in same players who I can't play against, and despite seemingly good connections (green bars) the game can get very laggy sometimes. Lack of lobby is also something fans have been complaining about for some time. And even without obvious lags, input lags are still there so that you can never pull off 'link combos' online - I am not sure whether this is something that can be addressed by Capcom or not, but I'm mentioning it regardless since it's there.

As for balance - I never claimed I'm good at this game or not. It is my own experience plus watching other players games that left me the impression of it. I know Barlog is a powerful character, but so are Ryu, Sagat, Rufus, Zangief. Hell even Ken is a very powerful character online. Unless a character possesses a powerful enough 'punish' to discourage the dragon punch spam (Barlog certainly excels at this), the 50/50 risk of dragon punch becomes worth taking because dragon punch will do more damage and get you out of trouble. If not, you take damage but the reward is certainly higher than risk (which is usually just eating a throw or a crouching hard kick) against a lot of characters. And no, I don't play strictly charge characters. Only character I play w/ charge moves is Chun Li, and for the most part I play fireball characters and Cammy. :D

Oh and you really don't need to bring "I'll beat you up with my xxxx" arguments to prove yourself. I believe you. ;) But you're not the center of the world.

Now, fixing all these plus adding a few extra characters are worth a new purchase? Hard to say until I see the finished product. I certainly understand others who are not happy about the news, but I'm going to reserve my judgment until the game is actually released.
 

lopri

Elite Member
Jul 27, 2002
13,314
690
126
Originally posted by: purbeast0
and seriously, do you think SSF4 is for the "casual" fighting fans out there? of course not, it is to satisfy the hardcore fighting audience.
Any publisher would like to reach bigger audience possible. And had it not been the case, Capcom wouldn't have brought back characters of 15 years ago. I myself hadn't played fighting games since SF2/Super/Turbo and came back to SF4. Capcom did a wonderful job with SF4 bringing old fans back and I think that was one of the biggest reasons of its success.
 

Thraxen

Diamond Member
Dec 3, 2001
4,683
1
81
Originally posted by: purbeast0
Originally posted by: Thraxen
Capcom didn't help themselves any when they sold overpriced costumes that were already on the discs we paid for. That plus the fact that I'm sure many people were expecting DLC characters at some point and you get this reaction from all but the hardcore fighter fans that would buy anything they crapped out.

they weren't on the disc...

but they WERE in that update you were forced to download the first time you took it online heh.

and seriously, do you think SSF4 is for the "casual" fighting fans out there? of course not, it is to satisfy the hardcore fighting audience.

According to this they are: Link

Either way, they wanted too much for them and never used DLC in the manner many people had hoped. And maybe you're right about the casual fight fans, but this is the reaction you get.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,631
6,508
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Originally posted by: lopri
Originally posted by: purbeast0
and seriously, do you think SSF4 is for the "casual" fighting fans out there? of course not, it is to satisfy the hardcore fighting audience.
Any publisher would like to reach bigger audience possible. And had it not been the case, Capcom wouldn't have brought back characters of 15 years ago. I myself hadn't played fighting games since SF2/Super/Turbo and came back to SF4. Capcom did a wonderful job with SF4 bringing old fans back and I think that was one of the biggest reasons of its success.

i didn't say SF4, i said SSF4 (the new Super edition coming out).
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,631
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Originally posted by: Thraxen
Originally posted by: purbeast0
Originally posted by: Thraxen
Capcom didn't help themselves any when they sold overpriced costumes that were already on the discs we paid for. That plus the fact that I'm sure many people were expecting DLC characters at some point and you get this reaction from all but the hardcore fighter fans that would buy anything they crapped out.

they weren't on the disc...

but they WERE in that update you were forced to download the first time you took it online heh.

and seriously, do you think SSF4 is for the "casual" fighting fans out there? of course not, it is to satisfy the hardcore fighting audience.

According to this they are: Link

Either way, they wanted too much for them and never used DLC in the manner many people had hoped. And maybe you're right about the casual fight fans, but this is the reaction you get.

Ah I stand corrected, always heard the forced update was to grab em and enforce that everyone online has the same game. that is also how hot shots golf on PS3 is.

EDIT: and i'm an SF4 fanboy, won't even lie about that, but i did not buy any of the costume packs because i too think it is not worth it.

(and balrogs alt is probably the best in the game too)
 

I4AT

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2006
2,631
3
81
Originally posted by: Thraxen
According to this they are: Link

Either way, they wanted too much for them and never used DLC in the manner many people had hoped. And maybe you're right about the casual fight fans, but this is the reaction you get.


lol comment #15 is pretty ironic. And yeah Balrog's alt the is only one I thought was decent, well actually Dan's was pretty damn funny. It made for an awesome Evo 09 Final with a stars and stripes Rog against the Japanese Ryu, tense down to the wire matches.

 

pennylane

Diamond Member
Apr 28, 2002
6,077
1
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AT is more mature than SRK, but not that much more mature :p


I don't understand how DLC would not break up the player base while a disc would. If it costs money, it's not going to be mandatory. Is the idea that a Vanilla SFIV character ought to be able to fight a Super SFIV character? What if there are gameplay mechanics alterations? Should there be 2 different versions of the same character in the same game? While it's happened before, if it's relatively subtle (ie, not like A-ISM versus V-ISM or the Super Turbo versus "old"), it would be confusing and complicated to deal with. I just don't see how DLC would be any different than a disc.

It seems like the only valid argument for dissenters is that the game itself shouldn't exist yet. It'll break up the player base in any form (at least I don't see how it couldn't) since it's too much stuff to be free. The new content that it offers does not outweigh the splitting of the community, and the best thing Capcom should have done was just to add lobbies, better match-making, and updated netcode. The game does not need gameplay updates or new characters, so they can be sacrificed. The community is fine the way it is and a new release would not increase interest. Any kind of pricetag will split up the online community, so better to have no pricetag at all and not get any icing.

I suppose I could see that. However, I would welcome gameplay updates and new characters. I feel many of the console characters were under-developed (possibly on-purpose) and more depth to them would be nice. Plus, Dee Jay is awesome and has always been a favorite.

Of course nobody knows how split the community will actually be. Maybe the game will be cheap enough for most people with reasonable interest will want the game. SFIV will have been out for at least 13 months when Super comes out, so I wouldn't be surprised if many casual players stop playing it by then anyway. For me, the updated gameplay is worth whatever happens to the online community, because I'd guess the online community of whichever game turns out to be the superior one will be fine.
 

I4AT

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2006
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Because with a mandatory DLC patch everyone gets the same changes and content, but only the people who buy the unlocks would be able to use the newer characters or play on the new stages etc. It's basically the same principle from the post above where the alternate outfits were put on the disc so everyone has the assets. Or comparatively with games like Guild Wars and World of Warcraft everyone downloads all content but only owners of the expansions can play with newer classes and skills, while PVP remains balanced and playable between owners of all games from the series.
 

pennylane

Diamond Member
Apr 28, 2002
6,077
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Originally posted by: I4AT
Because with a mandatory DLC patch everyone gets the same changes and content, but only the people who buy the unlocks would be able to use the newer characters or play on the new stages etc. It's basically the same principle from the post above where the alternate outfits were put on the disc so everyone has the assets. Or comparatively with games like Guild Wars and World of Warcraft everyone downloads all content but only owners of the expansions can play with newer classes and skills, while PVP remains balanced and playable between owners of all games from the series.

Oh okay. I don't think it's ever been reasonable to hope for this. Capcom has stated before that they don't want to make gameplay changes via an online update because they don't want people to be playing both patched and un-patched versions of the game (ie, different versions of the game under the same title). Of course, they could just release the DLC with the "Super" title except then not everybody will have all of the actual "Super" features (new characters or whatever), which might be confusing. But I suppose Capcom could have figured something out, assuming they were lying when they said they couldn't make it DLC for technical reasons. But that ventures into speculation.
 

I4AT

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2006
2,631
3
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Yeah but with LIVE all patches would be applied before anyone ever got online, so the only people that would actually go unpatched would be people who are never connected anyways. I agree with you that not releasing any new stuff and just focusing on more necessary changes is the way to go, but a DLC approach would be the best compromise. That way Capcom still gets their payday, owners of the original stay happy, and people that actually want the new shit can pay for it; rather than the rift they're about to open with this new title.
 

buzzsaw13

Diamond Member
Apr 30, 2004
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Originally posted by: purbeast0
and seriously, do you think SSF4 is for the "casual" fighting fans out there? of course not, it is to satisfy the hardcore fighting audience.

I think it's aimed at the casual fighting game fan since there isn't an arcade release. No arcade release means it's not going to be at Tougeki next year. So that means that all the serious american players will continue to play the original because that's what Tougeki will have.
 

luv2liv

Diamond Member
Dec 27, 2001
3,502
94
91
Originally posted by: GundamSonicZeroX
I think I'll wait for Super Street Fighter IV Turbo Championship Edition Reloaded Resurrection. ;)

THIS.
 

bl4ckfl4g

Diamond Member
Feb 13, 2007
3,669
0
0
Originally posted by: buzzsaw13
Originally posted by: purbeast0
and seriously, do you think SSF4 is for the "casual" fighting fans out there? of course not, it is to satisfy the hardcore fighting audience.

I think it's aimed at the casual fighting game fan since there isn't an arcade release. No arcade release means it's not going to be at Tougeki next year. So that means that all the serious american players will continue to play the original because that's what Tougeki will have.

? EVO is pretty damn popular and it uses console and will surely use SST4. Americans will care more about Tougeki when they can finally win their own major tournament.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,631
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Originally posted by: bl4ckfl4g
Originally posted by: buzzsaw13
Originally posted by: purbeast0
and seriously, do you think SSF4 is for the "casual" fighting fans out there? of course not, it is to satisfy the hardcore fighting audience.

I think it's aimed at the casual fighting game fan since there isn't an arcade release. No arcade release means it's not going to be at Tougeki next year. So that means that all the serious american players will continue to play the original because that's what Tougeki will have.

? EVO is pretty damn popular and it uses console and will surely use SST4. Americans will care more about Tougeki when they can finally win their own major tournament.

i dunno, most of the american players are hugging the japanese nuts, so maybe they won't like it if the japanese dont heh.
 

xCxStylex

Senior member
Apr 6, 2003
710
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Only thing I'm concerned about is that a lot of the people playing SF4 will migrate to SF4Super and there won't be many people on SF4 to play anymore. Lacking an expansion pack will leave people behind, kind of like in an mmo. Granted, they want to do that so people buy the expansion :[
 

Spicedaddy

Platinum Member
Apr 18, 2002
2,305
77
91
People are surprised that a Street Fighter game is getting a rehash? You must not have been around in the SF2 days, they released about 83 different versions of that game...
 

zerocool84

Lifer
Nov 11, 2004
36,041
472
126
Originally posted by: Spicedaddy
People are surprised that a Street Fighter game is getting a rehash? You must not have been around in the SF2 days, they released about 83 different versions of that game...

Yes but like said many times before that was before you could add content to games.