Super Street Fighter IV Official Thread

[erwos]

When SF4 went to $30 not too long ago, I think most people started suspecting something like this was in the cards. I think it's one of the things that kinda drove me from SF as a series - WAY too much cash-in on the variants.

 

[jman19]

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: oznerol

Originally posted by: purbeast0
I don't see why this would all of a sudden anger you with Capcom, they have been doing this since SNES days, again, it is nothing new.

These rebalancing has happened in every interation of Street Fighter to date, and they have never been free upgrades.

In the SNES days, DLC was not an option.

It is no longer the SNES days. The industry has evolved, Capcom has not.

and in SNES days, games were $70, which with inflation today, would probably be close to $100.

and in SNES days games were made with like 5 people, not 100+ that are involved in making games today.

What does that have to do with other devs moving on and going the DLC route while Capcom isn't?

 

[purbeast0]

Originally posted by: jman19

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: oznerol

Originally posted by: purbeast0
I don't see why this would all of a sudden anger you with Capcom, they have been doing this since SNES days, again, it is nothing new.

These rebalancing has happened in every interation of Street Fighter to date, and they have never been free upgrades.

In the SNES days, DLC was not an option.

It is no longer the SNES days. The industry has evolved, Capcom has not.

and in SNES days, games were $70, which with inflation today, would probably be close to $100.

and in SNES days games were made with like 5 people, not 100+ that are involved in making games today.

What does that have to do with other devs moving on and going the DLC route while Capcom isn't?

he was spewing stuff out about the past so i did the same.

if he had read anything about SSF4, he would know that in this present day, DLC is not an option for Capcom to make the changes they want to.

SF4 was not built with "holes" to add in new characters, change gameplay mechanics, add new moves, etc. It is an arcade game that was ported over to consoles.

Super SF4 and SF4 are two different games, just as Street Fighter 2, Street Fighter 2 Championship Edition, and Street Fighter 2 Turbo are 3 different games.

I'm sure each will have it's own following, just as the different versions of SF2 do.

 

[Krazy4Real]

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: oznerol

Originally posted by: purbeast0
I don't see why this would all of a sudden anger you with Capcom, they have been doing this since SNES days, again, it is nothing new.

These rebalancing has happened in every interation of Street Fighter to date, and they have never been free upgrades.

In the SNES days, DLC was not an option.

It is no longer the SNES days. The industry has evolved, Capcom has not.

and in SNES days, games were $70, which with inflation today, would probably be close to $100.

and in SNES days games were made with like 5 people, not 100+ that are involved in making games today.

I seriously don't remember paying $70 for SNES games.

This is perfect for me though. I'll pick up a used copy of SFIV dirt cheap once this comes out.

 

[xboxist]

Originally posted by: Krazy4Real

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: oznerol

Originally posted by: purbeast0
I don't see why this would all of a sudden anger you with Capcom, they have been doing this since SNES days, again, it is nothing new.

These rebalancing has happened in every interation of Street Fighter to date, and they have never been free upgrades.

In the SNES days, DLC was not an option.

It is no longer the SNES days. The industry has evolved, Capcom has not.

and in SNES days, games were $70, which with inflation today, would probably be close to $100.

and in SNES days games were made with like 5 people, not 100+ that are involved in making games today.

I seriously don't remember paying $70 for SNES games.

This is mine (still have the game too!) SNES game receipt

 

[WraithETC]

I'll wait for the review on the netcode.

 

[PhatoseAlpha]

Played this one once before. Bought SF2, then SF2T, the SSF2. No thanks Capcom - I didn't actually like SF4 all that much.

 

[jman19]

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: jman19

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: oznerol

Originally posted by: purbeast0
I don't see why this would all of a sudden anger you with Capcom, they have been doing this since SNES days, again, it is nothing new.

These rebalancing has happened in every interation of Street Fighter to date, and they have never been free upgrades.

In the SNES days, DLC was not an option.

It is no longer the SNES days. The industry has evolved, Capcom has not.

and in SNES days, games were $70, which with inflation today, would probably be close to $100.

and in SNES days games were made with like 5 people, not 100+ that are involved in making games today.

What does that have to do with other devs moving on and going the DLC route while Capcom isn't?

he was spewing stuff out about the past so i did the same.

if he had read anything about SSF4, he would know that in this present day, DLC is not an option for Capcom to make the changes they want to.

SF4 was not built with "holes" to add in new characters, change gameplay mechanics, add new moves, etc. It is an arcade game that was ported over to consoles.

Super SF4 and SF4 are two different games, just as Street Fighter 2, Street Fighter 2 Championship Edition, and Street Fighter 2 Turbo are 3 different games.

I'm sure each will have it's own following, just as the different versions of SF2 do.

They re-write the code for each "version" of the arcade games?

 

[Dangerer]

Day 1 purchase for me even if at $60. Capcom is doing everyone who loves fighting games a huge fucking favor by continuing the series with SSF4.

The only thing I wish they would confirm is a complete arcade release to accompany the console release.

 

[Injury]

Originally posted by: purbeast0
you guys claiming stuff "should be" DLC or whatever really need to get off your high horse. who are you to tell a company what theys hould and shouldn't do?

hell i remember buying street fighter 2 3x on SNES, for a grand total of $200.

Street Fighter 2 = $60
Street Fighter 2 Turbo = $70
Super Street Fighter 2 Turbo = $70

This is nothing new. if you don't want to pay for it, don't, simple as that.

While I don't give a crap because I played SFIV for all of a few days and thought it was too fucking hard to enjoy... I totally have to point out a few things here.

Back in the days of cartridges you couldn't do an update for it. You didn't have to worry about what copy your friends had because you still had to go over to their house to play it. You didn't have this whole "online play" thing and there was no little to no internet presence with consoles by which someone could update the game even if the cartridge and system were designed for it.

That said, if the rehash of the game is changed enough that it would totally screw things up, then I can understand a new one being released, but it's entirely reasonable for people who haven't owned the game for very long to feel a bit cheated here.

 

[Dangerer]

People who haven't owned the game very long probably didn't pay anywhere near full price. Plus given capcoms track record, people will have until Summer of 2010 to play the hell out of SF4. It's not like SF4 is not fun anymore now that they annouced SSF4.

 

[pwnagesarus]

Awesome, I guess Capcom still thinks this is the 90s. >_<; They pulled a L4D with this one.

 

[purbeast0]

very relevant to this thread

 

[oznerol]

Originally posted by: purbeast0
very relevant to this thread

Problem: We live in the digital age, this should have been DLC

Solution: Maybe you missed the last few paragraphs, but in case you haven't heard, there's a lot of stuff being changed, retuned, updated and expanded, and at least eight new characters being added. For one, that would be a bigass download for people who don't have a lot of space left on their hard drive. Secondly, you're talking about tinkering with a huge portion of the game's code, and that's a Pandora's box full of potential for fuckuppery.

Originally posted by: purbeast0
if he had read anything about SSF4, he would know that in this present day, DLC is not an option for Capcom to make the changes they want to.

SF4 was not built with "holes" to add in new characters, change gameplay mechanics, add new moves, etc. It is an arcade game that was ported over to consoles.

How do either of you have any idea whatsoever what Capcom's SF4 code is like, how large an update this will be, or how much effort is required to "change, retune, update, and expand" SF4?

The fact that you mention "holes" in code to add in new characters is reason enough to assume you know nothing.

I am not "spewing stuff out about the past". I simply claimed that Capcom is a dinosaur in the video game industry. They are not evolving. They are not pushing the industry forward. They are largely set in their ways and are failing at adapting to new technology.

This spans all of their games, really.

I'm not complaining about whatever price this might be.

 

[purbeast0]

Originally posted by: oznerol

Originally posted by: purbeast0
very relevant to this thread

Problem: We live in the digital age, this should have been DLC

Solution: Maybe you missed the last few paragraphs, but in case you haven't heard, there's a lot of stuff being changed, retuned, updated and expanded, and at least eight new characters being added. For one, that would be a bigass download for people who don't have a lot of space left on their hard drive. Secondly, you're talking about tinkering with a huge portion of the game's code, and that's a Pandora's box full of potential for fuckuppery.

Originally posted by: purbeast0
if he had read anything about SSF4, he would know that in this present day, DLC is not an option for Capcom to make the changes they want to.

SF4 was not built with "holes" to add in new characters, change gameplay mechanics, add new moves, etc. It is an arcade game that was ported over to consoles.

How do either of you have any idea whatsoever what Capcom's SF4 code is like, how large an update this will be, or how much effort is required to "change, retune, update, and expand" SF4?

The fact that you mention "holes" in code to add in new characters is reason enough to assume you know nothing.

I am not "spewing stuff out about the past". I simply claimed that Capcom is a dinosaur in the video game industry. They are not evolving. They are not pushing the industry forward. They are largely set in their ways and are failing at adapting to new technology.

This spans all of their games, really.

I'm not complaining about whatever price this might be.

uh, because capcom flat out said that making this DLC is not a viable option?

 

[RyanPaulShaffer]

I, for one, would rather have this be released on disc instead of DLC.

This whole situation reminds me of the "RE5 VS Mode whinefest" a few months back.

 

[purbeast0]

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
I, for one, would rather have this be released on disc instead of DLC.

This whole situation reminds me of the "RE5 VS Mode whinefest" a few months back.

it's going to be cheap too, Ono stated that it is going to be "the price of a DLC upgrade but will come on a disc".

so we'll have to see what that means $$ wise.

 

[zerocool84]

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: oznerol

Originally posted by: purbeast0
very relevant to this thread

Problem: We live in the digital age, this should have been DLC

Solution: Maybe you missed the last few paragraphs, but in case you haven't heard, there's a lot of stuff being changed, retuned, updated and expanded, and at least eight new characters being added. For one, that would be a bigass download for people who don't have a lot of space left on their hard drive. Secondly, you're talking about tinkering with a huge portion of the game's code, and that's a Pandora's box full of potential for fuckuppery.

Originally posted by: purbeast0
if he had read anything about SSF4, he would know that in this present day, DLC is not an option for Capcom to make the changes they want to.

SF4 was not built with "holes" to add in new characters, change gameplay mechanics, add new moves, etc. It is an arcade game that was ported over to consoles.

How do either of you have any idea whatsoever what Capcom's SF4 code is like, how large an update this will be, or how much effort is required to "change, retune, update, and expand" SF4?

The fact that you mention "holes" in code to add in new characters is reason enough to assume you know nothing.

I am not "spewing stuff out about the past". I simply claimed that Capcom is a dinosaur in the video game industry. They are not evolving. They are not pushing the industry forward. They are largely set in their ways and are failing at adapting to new technology.

This spans all of their games, really.

I'm not complaining about whatever price this might be.

uh, because capcom flat out said that making this DLC is not a viable option?

Well duh of course they'd say that.

 

[Dumac]

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
I, for one, would rather have this be released on disc instead of DLC.

This whole situation reminds me of the "RE5 VS Mode whinefest" a few months back.

it's going to be cheap too, Ono stated that it is going to be "the price of a DLC upgrade but will come on a disc".

so we'll have to see what that means $$ wise.

Considering the costumes alone are $15 alone, I would expect this to be at least 40.

 

[Queasy]

Originally posted by: Dumac

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
I, for one, would rather have this be released on disc instead of DLC.

This whole situation reminds me of the "RE5 VS Mode whinefest" a few months back.

it's going to be cheap too, Ono stated that it is going to be "the price of a DLC upgrade but will come on a disc".

so we'll have to see what that means $$ wise.

Considering the costumes alone are $15 alone, I would expect this to be at least 40.

I think the $29.99 to $39.99 range is a safe bet. Anymore than that and it will be too high and they are adding too much for anything less than $29.99 IMHO. But, we'll just have to wait and see what they announce.

 

[Dangerer]

Originally posted by: pwnagesarus
Awesome, I guess Capcom still thinks this is the 90s. >_<; They pulled a L4D with this one.

Capcom made no promise to make any free DLC updates to SF4 and much unlike the work-in-progress L4D was, SF4 was a COMPLETE game at the time of it's release.

Funny how no one would complain if Capcom said "see ya'll in 10 years with SF5." Instead doing something for the fighting community by releasing an updated version with 8 brand new characters and an overhaul of the system mechanics is making people rage on Capcom?

 

[pennylane]

Originally posted by: Queasy

Originally posted by: Dumac

Originally posted by: purbeast0

Originally posted by: RyanPaulShaffer
I, for one, would rather have this be released on disc instead of DLC.

This whole situation reminds me of the "RE5 VS Mode whinefest" a few months back.

it's going to be cheap too, Ono stated that it is going to be "the price of a DLC upgrade but will come on a disc".

so we'll have to see what that means $$ wise.

Considering the costumes alone are $15 alone, I would expect this to be at least 40.

I think the $29.99 to $39.99 range is a safe bet. Anymore than that and it will be too high and they are adding too much for anything less than $29.99 IMHO. But, we'll just have to wait and see what they announce.

I'd guess $40. I still wonder what people wanted it to cost if it were DLC. Because even if it were DLC, there's no way it would have been free. 8ish new characters, new/adjusted mechanics, game re-balancing, better online play. That's a lot of stuff for $20 or less (the $20 is my guess for how much people think all of this is worth)...

 

[lopri]

I think they're trying to lay a framework for a long term, which they have failed at miserably when SF4 launched. The on-line match making system is pretty terrible and features like replay save are broken as well. Plus, of course, the balance between characters. Overall the game heavily favors characters with good reversal (*cough* dragon punch *cough*) and charge characters are somewhat disadvantaged, IMO.

If they fix things such that the gaming experience gets better and they'll build a framework to fix any future issues, I'd say it's worth it.

 

[Dangerer]

Originally posted by: lopri
I think they're trying to lay a framework for a long term, which they have failed at miserably when SF4 launched. The on-line match making system is pretty terrible and features like replay save are broken as well. Plus, of course, the balance between characters. Overall the game heavily favors characters with good reversal (*cough* dragon punch *cough*) and charge characters are somewhat disadvantaged, IMO.

If they fix things such that the gaming experience gets better and they'll build a framework to fix any future issues, I'd say it's worth it.

Match making system is fine for hoping on and playing randoms, but the lack of features you stated are definitely things to be looked at. It would be nice if they could promote a better online community so we can develop cross country comp.

As for character balanced, Sagat is really the only one to have a dominant presence over a majority of the cast. He's definitely newb friendly, but you WILL hit a brick wall and unless you develop the godlike execution it takes to play him at the highest level you'll be punished easily for throwing your "cheap" tiger shots all day. It's true some characters have to work too hard to win (guile, vega) but overall SF4 ranks up as one of the most balanced fighting games of all time.

Also, balrog, one of the charge characters is one of the most beastly characters in the game and eats dragon punch shotos for free.

 

[I4AT]

If this is about viability rather than money, what's their excuse for not patching all of this into the PC version? The standard edition of the Witcher can be patched to the Enhanced Edition for free. The Enhanced Edition can then be patched to the Director's Cut version, also free. Blizzard has been updating Diablo 2 and Starcraft for the past 10 years, D2 is getting the 1.13 patch soon even though D3 has been announced and in development for quite some time. Some companies reward customer loyalty, others are only about the dollars.

New characters and stages or not, the added content is not going to be too large to simply patch in, and anyone who believes that is fucking delusional. This is a fighting game, it's simply a few new models fighting on static backgrounds. Look at Fable II, it's being broken up into 5 episodes and released over XBL. The first episode is 2GB in size, there are several multi gig demos available for download. Whatever Capcom has planned for Super SF4 it can be distributed digitally, I guarantee it.

Street Fighter 4 never even got lobbies, something that should have been in the game from the start. They had plenty of on the clock time to whip up alternate outfits for each character and charge for those though. But I understand, those take a lot of time, money, and man hours to develop, otherwise there'd be hundreds of freely available community made ones.

They're bringing back Dee Jay and T. Hawk for fucks sake. How many people asked for them, like 12? I was surprised that Fei Long, Gen, and Rose even made their way in. And I'm sure Rolento will be one of the add ons, because 15 people asked for him on the Cap boards. These characters were hardly ever played in their original games and now all of a sudden "the fans" are asking for their return? gtfoh. New characters I don't mind at all, when SF4 was announced I hoped it'd be an entirely fresh roster, but I didn't mind that it ended up SF2+ because it was something new to play. Now they're shattering the community a year after its release.

I didn't wanna get involved in this debate at first, but I see all you guys jumping on people who said they aren't happy with a new release when nobody is trying to convince you not to buy it. We simply said we weren't interested, we'll be voting with our wallets, and those of you who support it will be voting with yours. I think it's fine that some people don't mind, but you all seem so butt hurt that we don't share the same view. One thing I don't believe is opinion however, is that this can be done via DLC.

This isn't 1993 and we aren't playing on 16-bit consoles running cartridges. Most people didn't go out and buy every revision of SF2 like you guys are claiming either, by the way. Back then arcades were still the most popular format, and it wasn't a big deal when a new edition of SF came out cause the investment in new machines lied with the arcades, not the players. This is the online age, I don't own 7 different Guilty Gear games, I own one, X2 #Reload because it had online play.

The update can be done via DLC, and it can be done free of charge. Capcom is a very large company, one of the biggest in the industy, SF is one of the most popular franchises in the world, and obviously SF4 was very successful or they wouldn't even be thinking of another. You say they're doing us a favor, I say they're doing us a disservice and fingering the asshole of everyone who paid for the original. They'd be doing us a favor by patching the game for free with things that matter like improving netcode, adding lobbies, and new characters if any. They'd still be doing us a favor by charging for new content as DLC so the rest of us have the option of not having to pay for returning characters that nobody ever bothered to play in the first place, and the community wouldn't have to be split. Some of us don't care about the stages we play on, the outfit our character is wearing, or the music that plays in the background and we shouldn't have to pay for that shit.