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Student shot with Taser by UCPD officers (Multiple times)
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bamacre
Lifer
I do as well. The bottom line is the cops could have easily handled this situation more quickly and without using the taser, and at the very least, without using the taser more than once.
And I also agree that the taser seems to only do the opposite of what it is used to do. Like Zebo said, it either prevents the perp from being able to physically do what the cops need for him/her to do, or upsets the perp even more (and I'd be pissed, too, if I thought I didn't deserve it), making him/her even more uncooperative.
The ended up picking the guy up and dragging him out anyway, and that should have been done 3-4 tasers before. Not only would that have prevented the need for tasing him, but it would have ended the conflict more quickly.
bamacre
Lifer
I can agree with you there as well. Some people call it ass-kissing, I call it getting the heck out of a bad situation.
I don't think there is any disagreement in regards to what the kid did, of course he made this situation worse for himself. I think the disagreement is with the cops and how they reacted to the situation.
Both screwed up here, that's for sure. But the cops are getting paid for what they do, and they are the ones that are supposed to be professional. Should they be fired, no I don't think so, not if this is a first-offense kind of situation. But if they continue to show that they cannot handle situations like this in an effective, and professional manner, then yes, they don't deserve to be cops. Their actions only make other cops, who do their jobs correctly, look bad.
What if the other kids had decided to come to this guy's assistance and got physical with the cops? Someone probably would have been killed, and at the very least, the situation would have been 100 times worse.
The cops let this sitiation drag on, and I certainly believe they used too much force, and also took a risk of the situation getting further out of hand than it needed to be.
Tase him once, cuff his ass, and get him out of there.
imported_Aelius
Golden Member
If you make a statement then expect to be called on it. Sometimes its obvious that people are purposefully bloating a point to make a point in itself and that's fine, but your comment was unrecognizable as such. Especially since it fell in step with all the other naive comments in this thread.
imported_Aelius
Golden Member
Just because the act of pressing a button/trigger without a noticable reaction, besides the perp, is rather underwhelming compared to taking swings at him or kicking him to comply doesn't suddenly make it OK to use whenever you please. Cops seem to think so because its easier to get away with tazing someone vs putting a boot in a perp's gut. In society we tend to have a negative view of someone punching, kicking or forcing a person's body parts in ways they aren't meant to go. It's physical and people understand and can relate to what that's like. Very few people can relate to being tazed or sprayed with pepper spray.
I think some people here need to take a few swings from a 200lb guy and then follow that up with being sprayed and then tazed so they can have an appreciation of what the difference is. Which is none.
Why is it so hard to realize this I don't know. Police Chiefs in Canada realized this over a decade ago and it has become policy even if only passively enforced. I'm not pulling this out of my ass.
KAZANI
Senior member
You make it sound as if a cop's word is God-sent.
By all means this was a case of police brutality. And it's really sickening that it happened inside a university library where so many educated individuals were witnesses and yet did not stop it. This failure to raise a civil liberties alarm on their part is a clear indicator that the USA has turned into a paragon of modern fascism.
Land of the free...BOLLOX!
Darkhawk28
Diamond Member
It's not surprising that our local Bushbots just love someone being tasered unneccesarily.
Sometimes I really do think that you all are little nazis.
Sometimes I really do think that you all are little nazis.
There's a chance they have been tasered. Several law orgs in Arizona, including the Maricopa County Corrections Dept, taser people who will use the tasers. I've been tasered... but the two welts on my back from the hooks bothered me more than the electric current.
Bad move by the cops, but it's certainly not brutality.
Bad move by the cops, but it's certainly not brutality.
JD50
Lifer
Its always fun to throw insults at those sworn to protect you isnt it? Stop arm chair quarterbacking what happened. Until you have been in a situation like that you have no idea what its like.
Even though you might enjoy mocking those that deal with the stuff everyday that you would run and hide from, they will still be there to protect you in your time of need.
MisterDucky
Junior Member
To be honest, I think UCLA and/or the Powell library administration are mostly at fault.
From what I can gather, UCLA has some policy where they randomly check library patrons working on computers to see if they have a student ID. This student was randomly asked if he had a student ID, and asked to leave when he couldn't produce one. When he refused (which seems reasonable--is it reasonable for a college to deny someone services they are entitled to, and have payed for?), the police were called, and then hell broke loose.
This seems ridiculous; why not use the highly evolved authentication that almost all major operating systems currently provide? My college does this exact thing; to use a computer on campus, one must first enter their student ID and password.
Instead, they decide to implement a policy that requires them to literally confront people (in the library no less, where people may be doing research and not appreciate the interruption) and verify if they are allowed to be using the computer. That is absurd. For starters, this sort of policy is simply begging for the aforementioned confrontation. Second, it requires someone to physically ask people; surely that person could be doing something more productive while UNIX or Windows is tasked with handling user authentication.
blahblah99
Platinum Member
I find it funny how a lot of you are just talking out of your ass without knowing the policies that UCLA implemented for after-hour access to buildings.
UCLA has an after-hours policy of ID requirement for any building on campus, and that policy is in place for obvious reasons. Some buildings are open late past 10pm on campus, and since it is a public university, anybody who has no reason to be on campus can walk right in without ID.
In order to enforce the building policies, there are CTO officers (students working as security guards) regularly checking and enforcing policies. That is STANDARD PROCEDURE and is done regularly after hours, at least that was how it was when I was in school. To say that he was singled out because of his race is purely absurd. ID checking is done on everyone in the building for security reasons above.
UCPD is only involved when the CTO radios in for help since they do not have any equipment on them nor are they allowed any powers to arrest/charge/ticket people. The kid was knowingly drawing attention when he was asked to leave due to lack of ID. Every student at UCLA knows this policy - it is posted visibly as you walk in the building/lab/room.
I just love how everyone leaves out the details or jump to conclusions without knowing why this have occured in the first place.
UCLA has an after-hours policy of ID requirement for any building on campus, and that policy is in place for obvious reasons. Some buildings are open late past 10pm on campus, and since it is a public university, anybody who has no reason to be on campus can walk right in without ID.
In order to enforce the building policies, there are CTO officers (students working as security guards) regularly checking and enforcing policies. That is STANDARD PROCEDURE and is done regularly after hours, at least that was how it was when I was in school. To say that he was singled out because of his race is purely absurd. ID checking is done on everyone in the building for security reasons above.
UCPD is only involved when the CTO radios in for help since they do not have any equipment on them nor are they allowed any powers to arrest/charge/ticket people. The kid was knowingly drawing attention when he was asked to leave due to lack of ID. Every student at UCLA knows this policy - it is posted visibly as you walk in the building/lab/room.
I just love how everyone leaves out the details or jump to conclusions without knowing why this have occured in the first place.
Been there, done that.
It was back in the 60's and an aquaintence of mine and myself got stopped by the cops (for nothing) and were told to get out of the car. He had long hair and I'm sure had been smoking some of that demon weed. Anyway the guy I was with apparently got out too fast and he got shot him in the arm, luckily it didn't hit the bone, just a "flesh wound". Oh, we did have any grass either, so apprantley we just looked so different we were "threatening". So I have been in a similar situation, but before they had tazers. I'm sure it's much easier now for a cop to justify unecessary force now that it isn't so lethal.
So continue to blindly support the police as people who can do no wrong. That's just naive, they aren't infallable and every now and then they need to be reminded of that fact.
imported_dna
Golden Member
Agreed.
This was really lame, with all that reptition of "STAND UP".
I remember seeing on that show -- Cops, I believe -- where a single officer confronted a guy who had a bit to drink.
The guy was standing there, with his hands in his pocket, and would not take them out; then the cop rushed him, hit him in the face or neck, the guy ended up on his stomach, and the cop had his shin on his throat, and holding one of his arms -- all of this in two seconds. He then handcuffed him, and had got him to stand up, and then they went through the usual steps.
On the other hand, these guys could've smacked him once, cuffed him, and then drag him away. All that tazing seemed very much like abuse of power, no matter how loud the guy was yelling.
Cops show flashback: I remeber one part where three cops were struggling with this huge guy; they had him down, and were on top of him, but he was too strong to be handcuffed (obviously, he was resisiting), so one of them hooked up the wires, gave him a warning, and then tazed him; after that, he was cooperative. Compared to that, tazing the student seems like an overkill, and bordering on sadism.
This was really lame, with all that reptition of "STAND UP".
I remember seeing on that show -- Cops, I believe -- where a single officer confronted a guy who had a bit to drink.
The guy was standing there, with his hands in his pocket, and would not take them out; then the cop rushed him, hit him in the face or neck, the guy ended up on his stomach, and the cop had his shin on his throat, and holding one of his arms -- all of this in two seconds. He then handcuffed him, and had got him to stand up, and then they went through the usual steps.
On the other hand, these guys could've smacked him once, cuffed him, and then drag him away. All that tazing seemed very much like abuse of power, no matter how loud the guy was yelling.
Cops show flashback: I remeber one part where three cops were struggling with this huge guy; they had him down, and were on top of him, but he was too strong to be handcuffed (obviously, he was resisiting), so one of them hooked up the wires, gave him a warning, and then tazed him; after that, he was cooperative. Compared to that, tazing the student seems like an overkill, and bordering on sadism.
Specop 007
Diamond Member
Just because your in college I would hardly make the assumption their "highly educated". In fact, some of the dumbest ideas seem to come from these college kids who have very little real world understanding of what they want to implement will really do.
Additionally, on the street the cops word IS God-sent. As I said previously, I dont give as damn what the cop is telling you to do. You dont argue or disagree or refuse, you take it to court.
Again, the kid refused multiple requests from multiple people. He escalated the situation, and he found out what the costs of that was. What he SHOULD have done is got up, been polite and respectful and left. If he felt there was a problem he should have found legal representation. What he should NOT have done was fly off the handle like a damn spoiled brat. Which is what he most likely is.
imported_dna
Golden Member
It's not about sympathy for the guy. Would you find it acceptable that, instead of tasing, they would've smacked him with the batons several times, then asked him to get up, and when he didn't -- repeat the process again?
Sure, it's pretty easy to dismiss tasing as no big deal, just because you don't see blood, and the cops aren't using any physical force.
I think it boils down to this: just because they could have, doesn't mean they should have. I refer you to my previous post with examples from the Cops show, where tasing was not the first option.
These cops just didn't want their uniforms ruffled.
Sure, it's pretty easy to dismiss tasing as no big deal, just because you don't see blood, and the cops aren't using any physical force.
I think it boils down to this: just because they could have, doesn't mean they should have. I refer you to my previous post with examples from the Cops show, where tasing was not the first option.
These cops just didn't want their uniforms ruffled.
glutenberg
Golden Member
As in all things, the situation is not black and white. We could make up numerous examples of "what would we have done," but in all honesty, you weren't there. Generally, I doubt most of the posters here have ever been officers, you are keyboard crusaders. It's true that police are just as flawed as normal people but it is also true that they are generally able to remain composed during extreme stress situations.
As blahblah99 pointed out, he was first asked to leave by the CSO (these are current students at UCLA which leads me to believe that they are not out and about looking to racially profile people. Also, many are using their jobs as CSOs to pay for tuition so it's also doubtful that they would risk their education for the sake of picking on people of a certain race) but he decided that today would be the day that he makes a stand. The CSO then had to call in the UCPD (which are LAPD officers and not just rent-a-cops like everyone likes to convenientyly believe), which the article said took a few minutes to arrive, and the student remained uncooperative. Ensuing events occurred and it seems that both parties were in the wrong.
As a personal sidenote, if I were an officer and had to make an arrest in a heavily populated area late at night with a crowd of people encroaching from behind me, I would tell them to stay back too. You don't ask for badge numbers when the event is occurring, you ask for it afterwards. That's like me strolling up to a police officer trying to make an arrest and badgering him. It's just not a bright thing to do.
As a graduate of UCLA last year, I will say that the students there strive to be liberal in their views and are oftens swept up by the bandwagon. You're in a liberal college to allow free thought, debate, and discussion but they are so easily absorbed by emotional arguments that many times they disillusion themselves. I will reserve my judgement of either parties as we really don't know that much about the case and the events that occurred prior to the UCPD's arrival. I suggest others do the same and stop spouting nonsense like the kid deserved it or that the police are abusing their power. You really have no idea and crusading on the internet doesn't help your case.
As blahblah99 pointed out, he was first asked to leave by the CSO (these are current students at UCLA which leads me to believe that they are not out and about looking to racially profile people. Also, many are using their jobs as CSOs to pay for tuition so it's also doubtful that they would risk their education for the sake of picking on people of a certain race) but he decided that today would be the day that he makes a stand. The CSO then had to call in the UCPD (which are LAPD officers and not just rent-a-cops like everyone likes to convenientyly believe), which the article said took a few minutes to arrive, and the student remained uncooperative. Ensuing events occurred and it seems that both parties were in the wrong.
As a personal sidenote, if I were an officer and had to make an arrest in a heavily populated area late at night with a crowd of people encroaching from behind me, I would tell them to stay back too. You don't ask for badge numbers when the event is occurring, you ask for it afterwards. That's like me strolling up to a police officer trying to make an arrest and badgering him. It's just not a bright thing to do.
As a graduate of UCLA last year, I will say that the students there strive to be liberal in their views and are oftens swept up by the bandwagon. You're in a liberal college to allow free thought, debate, and discussion but they are so easily absorbed by emotional arguments that many times they disillusion themselves. I will reserve my judgement of either parties as we really don't know that much about the case and the events that occurred prior to the UCPD's arrival. I suggest others do the same and stop spouting nonsense like the kid deserved it or that the police are abusing their power. You really have no idea and crusading on the internet doesn't help your case.
Really if you think my statements reflect your little statement there then you have some serious issues. This guy was asked to produce his school ID on a private campus and did not do so. He started shouting and screaming and inciting others to join him as he refused to leave. After being warned by the cops that they would taser him several he still did not get up from the ground.
You people forget that the tasering on this video started after he was on the ground and was refusing to get up. He was warned that this would happen if he continued with his actions and he refused to heed those warnings. He brought this onto himself.
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